legalize drugs ?????

Thirty Bills Unpaid

I never said the war on drugs is a failure... I have siad it has been difficult. It has only been in recent years we have seen this fight occur at the point of production- Mexico and Columbia are making concerted efforts for example. Admittedly, it is depressing to watch what is happening in those countries, but this 'concerted effort' to fight drug lords in these countries is relatively new compared to the entrenched institution of illegal drug manufacturers. The jury is still out on this one.

There are definitely costs associated with fighting drugs, but the social cost is vastly less significant compared to treating addicted people.

I'm okay with legalizing prostitution (getting off topic though). There is no reason not to- this is at the core of freedom of choice. Nobody else involved. Two consenting adults in an arrangement that suits them best. No harm done to anyone.

I don't want cougars, cheetahs. or meth labs next to me. That's my point. Just like I don't want drunk drivers. When people make choices that have the potential to affect others- laws and regulations need to be in place to restrict these choices. Can we not agree on this? People are stupid. Left to their own resources... yikes.

Overlying everything... we are fighting evolution. The deranged, the pedophelic, the criminally insane... the better part of society tolerates their existence and because so... we need some form of law. We cannot truly exercise freedom of choice and responsible living because we preserve an element that is incapable of living alongside us, freely, without damaging us in some way. Once we decide enough is enough with our multiple felons and career criminals, society can begin to let its guard down.

mikepegg44

Thirty Bills Unpaid wrote:

I never said the war on drugs is a failure... I have siad it has been difficult. It has only been in recent years we have seen this fight occur at the point of production- Mexico and Columbia are making concerted efforts for example. Admittedly, it is depressing to watch what is happening in those countries, but this 'concerted effort' to fight drug lords in these countries is relatively new compared to the entrenched institution of illegal drug manufacturers. The jury is still out on this one.

There are definitely costs associated with fighting drugs, but the social cost is vastly less significant compared to treating addicted people.

I'm okay with legalizing prostitution (getting off topic though). There is no reason not to- this is at the core of freedom of choice. Nobody else involved. Two consenting adults in an arrangement that suits them best. No harm done to anyone.

I don't want cougars, cheetahs. or meth labs next to me. That's my point. Just like I don't want drunk drivers. When people make choices that have the potential to affect others- laws and regulations need to be in place to restrict these choices. Can we not agree on this? People are stupid. Left to their own resources... yikes.

Overlying everything... we are fighting evolution. The deranged, the pedophelic, the criminally insane... the better part of society tolerates their existence and because so... we need some form of law. We cannot truly exercise freedom of choice and responsible living because we preserve an element that is incapable of living alongside us, freely, without damaging us in some way. Once we decide enough is enough with our multiple felons and career criminals, society can begin to let its guard down.

I know you never said the war on drugs was a failure. I said it. it is. What measure could we take to call it a success? it has been decades. what do we have to show for it? people still getting high all over the place, people od'ing on unregulated hot shots, people getting hep C, HIV, and other diseases from using dirty needles, people able to get drugs just about anywhere any time...and thousands of non-violent drug offenders in prisons splitting up families that could have otherwise possibly been together...That is just a few examples of the failure of the war on drugs in the US alone. Now take into account what happens along the border, in other countries around the world...by what measure can we call our current policy even remotely successful? We shouldn't stick with something simply out of stubbornness and a false sense of moral superiority some have over those who would choose to shoot up...
I certainly agree with the need for laws. Laws are there to protect you from me and vice versa. I think there should and would still be DUI laws, why would that change?...I am fine with regulation, but prohibition isn't the path we should be on.
laws don't restrict choices in a true sense, they may make them a little tougher by placing sanctions on an action. but the choice can still be made. They really should be in place to punish the choices that affect others. I guess it is just a different way of looking at the purpose of laws...should they be thought of as a deterrent first or a punishment that may deter?..
I firmly believe that more harm is caused world wide from the US drug war than it is saving people from. I am all for the regulation of the drug markets...but illegal just doesn't seem to be the right strategy... There are statistics from other nations that have tried decriminalization, and I think they show that good things can come out of it...and I am certain there will be negatives that come out as well.
There is no good solution...Mankind has always looked for ways to alter their consciousness, that will never cease... but I always lean towards personal freedom rather than restriction.

mikepegg44

Thirty Bills Unpaid wrote:

Can we not agree on this? People are stupid.

oh and yes.

a person is usually intelligent in some way...but people are stupid as hell

SweetChildofMine

its easy to say people are stupid

its easy to say people are stupid and use your intelligence as a way of bullying

in my opinion ...smartest and brightest people do neither

smart people will try to educate

smart people will try to use terms other less mentally fortunate as themselves understand



of which I havent seen from either one of you.

In conclusion... you can figure it our because your so smart.

mikepegg44

SweetChildofMine wrote:

its easy to say people are stupid

its easy to say people are stupid and use your intelligence as a way of bullying

in my opinion ...smartest and brightest people do neither

smart people will try to educate

smart people will try to use terms other less mentally fortunate as themselves understand



of which I havent seen from either one of you.

Inconclusion... you cant figure it our because your so smart.

you couldn't have missed the point of my comment more.

honestly. you couldn't have missed it more than you did which makes me think you did it on purpose.

I'd ask for an example of intelligent bullying but we know how that goes...

here is one for you

SweetChildofMine wrote:

People? People are bullshit...all worthless fodder also there is no meaning anymore for them too...

after a long winded post about all things human being bullshit you concluded by writing

SweetChildofMine wrote:

... That's how I feel about this world and its inhabitants. Nothing supernatural about that.

Thirty Bills Unpaid

SweetChildofMine wrote:

its easy to say people are stupid

its easy to say people are stupid and use your intelligence as a way of bullying

in my opinion ...smartest and brightest people do neither

smart people will try to educate

smart people will try to use terms other less mentally fortunate as themselves understand



of which I havent seen from either one of you.

Inconclusion... you cant figure it our because your so smart.

People do dumb things- including myself. We never actually excluded ourselves if you had bothered to read the posts. You didn't though. You made inferences from skimming the last brief one. Consequently, you took things out of context. Ironic, huh? You know, that you suggested we were being arrogant and judgemental... and then you made your judgements without even bothering to understand the context from which things were said?

lukin2006

U.S. officials warn against mandatory minimum sentences

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Canada/201202 ... es-120222/

Here in Canada our Prime Minister seems to want to take a step backwards...very sad.

Whats most disturbing is that many of today's politicians grew up in the 60's and later when so many people were doing pot...I would have thought they would have a different view and be pro legalization.

It's to bad...

but meanwhile here in Ontario we are legalizing sanctioned MMA for events for 10-19 year old...no risk of brain injury from that...governments are such hypocritical bullshitters.

http://www.windsorstar.com/news/kids+bo ... story.html

USARAY

it's no wonder with the far left trying to legalize all drugs that now those in power
will step back and put a hold on cannabis ... good going

JonnyPistachio

Kinda an interesting article:

http://us.cnn.com/2012/05/17/health/col ... ?hpt=hp_c3

"There are short-term and long-term primarily pulmonary problems associated with marijuana (and) excessive alcohol use is long-term correlated with GI (gastrointestinal) and neurologic problems."

Also debatable is whether the money generated by legalizing and regulating marijuana through taxes will outweigh the costs of creating government-run marijuana distribution centers. Tvert says the Campaign to Regulate Marijuana Like Alcohol estimates that legalizing and regulating marijuana could generate $50 million a year in saved expenses and revenue.

"We've been pushing very hard in Colorado and people agree, it's not worth the law enforcement resources being used (to crack down on marijuana users) and it's not worth losing out on the tax dollars," he said.

Tvert said he was not aware of any criticism for the advertisement, noting that legalizing marijuana is "one of the biggest issues in our state legislature in the last few years."

"We live in a state that has made a lot of progress on the issue," he said. "It's not as controversial as many other issues."

That's partly because of the prevalence of medical marijuana dispensaries across the state. State-sanctioned marijuana dispensaries now outnumber Starbucks in Colorado and there are well over 100,000 people on the medical marijuana registry."

READ more at the link at the top

pandora

That is a good article,
the most surprising, it said 22 million people use illegal drugs.

The link from your article
http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/0 ... l-drugs-3/

Says 9% of the population, I would think it would be way more than that.
I guess not counting the legal medical marijuana.

JonnyPistachio

pandora wrote:

That is a good article,
the most surprising, it said 22 million people use illegal drugs.

The link from your article
http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/0 ... l-drugs-3/

Says 9% of the population, I would think it would be way more than that.
I guess not counting the legal medical marijuana.

I agree, that was a surprising number. But then again, from my own experience, I would've thought the % of population using was higher. I suppose I'm maybe hanging around the wrong folks! lol

mikepegg44

JonnyPistachio wrote:

pandora wrote:

That is a good article,
the most surprising, it said 22 million people use illegal drugs.

The link from your article
http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/09/0 ... l-drugs-3/

Says 9% of the population, I would think it would be way more than that.
I guess not counting the legal medical marijuana.

I agree, that was a surprising number. But then again, from my own experience, I would've thought the % of population using was higher. I suppose I'm maybe hanging around the wrong folks! lol

I often fall into that trap as well. It is so hard to imagine 300 million people. What amount that really is...we have our experiences and we use them to generalize, by saying things like most, all, a lot...when we say most we are actually talking about 150+ million people...kind of overwhelming when you think about it....

chadwick

pharmaceuticals are the most abused drug on the planet. that right there tells us something.

marijuana smoking is equivalent to stroking one's ace. it aint no thing, man. yet million declare it to be the work of the devil.

these folks against weed might should be hit with a frozen solid bison shit patty as if a frisbee to the head like in the howard stern flick

peacefrompaul

chadwick wrote:

pharmaceuticals are the most abused drug on the planet. that right there tells us something.

marijuana smoking is equivalent to stroking one's ace. it aint no thing, man. yet million declare it to be the work of the devil.

these folks against weed might should be hit with a frozen solid bison shit patty as if a frisbee to the head like in the howard stern flick

Yeah, they're abused and can be very addictive too... They have some fun side effects too... Makes me sick

brianlux

chadwick wrote:

pharmaceuticals are the most abused drug on the planet. that right there tells us something.

marijuana smoking is equivalent to stroking one's ace. it aint no thing, man. yet million declare it to be the work of the devil.

these folks against weed might should be hit with a frozen solid bison shit patty as if a frisbee to the head like in the howard stern flick

Or just have a few hits and learn to chill out!

hedonist

brianlux wrote:

Or just have a few hits and learn to chill out!

It's the way we decompress after work! Plus it really helps my back pain (among other things).

Speaking of pharmaceuticals and my back, it amazed me - still does - how quick that shit is prescribed. Yes, the muscle relaxers I use from time to time are now considered a controlled substance but a refill is completed within a day. They wanted to give me Vicodin too but I told them no...that shit is big-time bad. Tolerance for it is built up so fast it becomes addictive, not to mention the nasty side-effects. I hate it.

And yet, between Danny's health and my current issues, we have a virtual pharmacy within a kitchen cabinet.

Crazy - as is the fact that pot is lumped in with all the other stuff.

I still think all the shit should be legalized and let folks be responsible for their own (in)actions.

pandora

I'll fall into the trap .. and I agree too

the people who don't want pot legalized some have agendas, probably money the root,
some think it would send the wrong message, some don't understand or know it,
some believe wacky bad propaganda about it
and some just don't care cause it does not effect their lives, it is a non issue.

Perhaps I have missed some.

The fact that a doctor can control it now may be the way it stays as far as legality.
And for some, especially non smokers, they are perfectly fine with that.

For those who want nothing to do with the docs or can't find the right one
they are up shit creek and gamble with the legal system, a gamble
that most citizens are not comfortable with.

It would be nice to see medical marijuana be more available to all who
need and want it.

In my opinion all drugs legal sends the wrong message in our society,
a caring society cares enough to watch out for each other.

And yes prescription drugs have taken over our society ...
big pharmie big bucks big trouble for us.

Got something the least bit annoying going on with you?
they got a pill for that! :wtf:

chadwick

hedonist wrote:

brianlux wrote:

Or just have a few hits and learn to chill out!

It's the way we decompress after work! Plus it really helps my back pain (among other things).

Speaking of pharmaceuticals and my back, it amazed me - still does - how quick that shit is prescribed. Yes, the muscle relaxers I use from time to time are now considered a controlled substance but a refill is completed within a day. They wanted to give me Vicodin too but I told them no...that shit is big-time bad. Tolerance for it is built up so fast it becomes addictive, not to mention the nasty side-effects. I hate it.And yet, between Danny's health and my current issues, we have a virtual pharmacy within a kitchen cabinet.

Crazy - as is the fact that pot is lumped in with all the other stuff.

I still think all the shit should be legalized and let folks be responsible for their own (in)actions.

i eat percocets & methadones like some people eat m&ms. i am so used to them that i don't feel a damn thing as far as the "buzz" or "high" goes. there is no "buzz" or "high" im used to them. however, i can quit methadone cold turkey and be perfectly fine, i have done it before on my own free will.

but i do suffer hugely with a lot of pain throughout my body, mostly knee pain. like dr. house in that house television program, i also took vicodins (in the beginning) and walk with the cane and am a surly old bastard but i think i am funny.

marijuana is the final answer to great overall health, not just for me but for 147 million people, yourself included. yes i did add you and your man into my math equation

hedonist

chadwick wrote:

i eat percocets & methadones like some people eat m&ms. i am so used to them that i don't feel a damn thing as far as the "buzz" or "high" goes. there is no "buzz" or "high" im used to them. however, i can quit methadone cold turkey and be perfectly fine, i have done it before on my own free will.

but i do suffer hugely with a lot of pain throughout my body, mostly knee pain. like dr. house in that house television program, i also took vicodins (in the beginning) and walk with the cane and am a surly old bastard but i think i am funny.

marijuana is the final answer to great overall health, not just for me but for 147 million people, yourself included. yes i did add you and your man into my math equation

I wouldn't call you a surly OLD bastard, and yes, you are funny

After Danny's first lung surgery, he was taking Vicodin, got sick of it (literally and figuratively) and quit cold-turkey. The withdrawal (coupled with a record heatwave and our AC being out) sent him back to the hospital.

I'm glad you can manage your meds and not the other way around! And thanks for our inclusion in your equation

chadwick

hedonist wrote:

chadwick wrote:

i eat percocets & methadones like some people eat m&ms. i am so used to them that i don't feel a damn thing as far as the "buzz" or "high" goes. there is no "buzz" or "high" im used to them. however, i can quit methadone cold turkey and be perfectly fine, i have done it before on my own free will.

but i do suffer hugely with a lot of pain throughout my body, mostly knee pain. like dr. house in that house television program, i also took vicodins (in the beginning) and walk with the cane and am a surly old bastard but i think i am funny.

marijuana is the final answer to great overall health, not just for me but for 147 million people, yourself included. yes i did add you and your man into my math equation

I wouldn't call you a surly OLD bastard, and yes, you are funny

After Danny's first lung surgery, he was taking Vicodin, got sick of it (literally and figuratively) and quit cold-turkey. The withdrawal (coupled with a record heatwave and our AC being out) sent him back to the hospital.

I'm glad you can manage your meds and not the other way around! And thanks for our inclusion in your equation

but wait. i fuckered up
that number should read... 147,000,002


sorry to hear about Danny's health issues. i hope all is well and he gets and remains stronger everyday