these fools are gonna try and take over wall street

rick1zoo2

polaris_x wrote:

rick1zoo2 wrote:

I am with you on this neily. Seems like a protest for no apparent reason. either say something or go home.

dude ... at least neily acknowledges the need for a protest ... he just doesn't agree with the methods ... perhaps you should figure out why there are people protesting!?

that is my point, I can't figure it out, makes no sense to me. I can see no main issue, I don't see what they are trying to accomplish. They haven't given me a reason to want to support them.

rival.

polaris_x wrote:

at the end of the day tho - the question you have to ask yourself is this: are there problems with the current political economic system that need to be changed? ... if yes - how do you propose those changes be made and the problems be heard?

huge problem with the current economic system, i don't think anyone is questioning that around here. i work for a gigantic corporation and if i got called into my boss's office today and was told that my job was being eliminated because of the "system," i would be pissed, but at the end of the day i would dust myself off and actively look for another job, i would not cry foul, pitch a tent in a public park waiting for a handout. i worked too hard and spent too much money on my college degree (that i am still paying for 5 years after i graduated) to sit on my ass and do nothing with it.

if nothing showed up in my field after X-amount of time, i would have to compromise with myself and take a job that i would be way over qualified for and way underpaid for. why? because again, at the end of the day, i am responsible for my own actions and putting food on my plate.

we all make our own fate it seems these protestors are not willing to make certain compromises to better theirs.

polaris_x

rival. wrote:

huge problem with the current economic system, i don't think anyone is questioning that around here. i work for a gigantic corporation and if i got called into my boss's office today and was told that my job was being eliminated because of the "system," i would be pissed, but at the end of the day i would dust myself off and actively look for another job, i would not cry foul, pitch a tent in a public park waiting for a handout. i worked too hard and spent too much money on my college degree (that i am still paying for 5 years after i graduated) to sit on my ass and do nothing with it.

if nothing showed up in my field after X-amount of time, i would have to compromise with myself and take a job that i would be way over qualified for and way underpaid for. why? because again, at the end of the day, i am responsible for my own actions and putting food on my plate.

we all make our own fate it seems these protestors are not willing to make that compromise.

sooo ... basically you are saying the system is flawed but that's just the way it is ... !?? ... don't do anything about it ... just take it!?

neilybabes86

they have some goood points but no organization

as for this zucotti park....it started off normal 2 months ago,but it became 70% convicts and druggies with nowhere to go looking for trouble

girls were being raped and needles were all over the place

again ..imall about freedom of speech...but what they did yesterday did nothing but tie up the city all day

BinauralJam

I think when OWS started, they were just trying to get the ball rolling on discussing the problems in our country but the media for most part of the first month all but ignored them, which pissed them off and it's evolved into a movement generally because of the attitude and contempt they first meet with, Bloomburg galvanized them the other night with his chicken shit 1:am clearing them out, and don't tell me it was a public saftey move, then why not do it at 8 in the morning? Now i don't know where it's going, but atleast it's gotten people talking.

polaris_x

neilybabes86 wrote:

they have some goood points but no organization

as for this zucotti park....it started off normal 2 months ago,but it became 70% convicts and druggies with nowhere to go looking for trouble

girls were being raped and needles were all over the place

again ..imall about freedom of speech...but what they did yesterday did nothing but tie up the city all day

well ... i don't disagree that there are problems with this movement ... the question i posed is - what's a better way? ...

and yes - they tried to "shut down" wall street yesterday and in the process inconvenienced a lot of people but like i keep saying ... this is what protesting is all about ... activists that fought in years past did the exact same thing ...

rival.

polaris_x wrote:

sooo ... basically you are saying the system is flawed but that's just the way it is ... !?? ... don't do anything about it ... just take it!?

yes. the system is fucked, has been fucked, and will be fucked. it's reality.

what would your grand plan be?

wonder how many of these protestors would have gotten jobs in the past 2 months if they put this much effort into you know... FINDING A JOB (what a INSANE thought!).

as i mentioned, i still owe a decent amount in student loans. should i join these fools and EXPECT the president to personally write me a check? please. fantasy la-la land bullshit.

BinauralJam

Banks got a bail out with Tax Payers money and then turned around and handed out Bonuses, i'm not just taking anything, we can change reality.

polaris_x

rival. wrote:

yes. the system is fucked, has been fucked, and will be fucked. it's reality.

what would your grand plan be?

wonder how many of these protestors would have gotten jobs in the past 2 months if they put this much effort into you know... FINDING A JOB (what a INSANE thought!).

as i mentioned, i still owe a decent amount in student loans. should i join these fools and EXPECT the president to personally write me a check? please. fantasy la-la land bullshit.

well ... if i continuously stole your food - would you just resign yourself to it!?? ...

i can't speak for every protestor but i know many and they all have jobs ... having a job doesn't preclude one from recognizing that there are problems and to act on them ... but if you want to stereotype everyone in order to try to discredit them - that's your choice ...

i've got ideas of a grand plan ... some of it is in the AMT threads ... but first and foremost ... people have to recognize there is a problem and actually be willing to do something about it ...

rival.

polaris_x wrote:

i can't speak for every protestor but i know many and they all have jobs ... having a job doesn't preclude one from recognizing that there are problems and to act on them ... but if you want to stereotype everyone in order to try to discredit them - that's your choice ...

if they have jobs, then they are in one way or another working for the evil corporate machine they despise and are trying to stand against are they not (unless of course it's a personal business/family business)?

but it's OK because at the end of the day they are receiving a paycheck and food is getting put on their table, right?

sounds a little misguided if you ask me.

Monster Rain

I hear a lot about banks getting bailouts from protesters and people who agree with the protesters. My question is this: why don't the people mentioning the bailouts ever mention that the banks have all paid back what they received? Another question: If that's one of the main complaints, why are these protests happening after the bailouts have been paid back? I find it ironinc that there are people there protesting banks that have paid back their bailout money while also protesting the fact that they have to pay back their student loans.

BinauralJam wrote:

Banks got a bail out with Tax Payers money and then turned around and handed out Bonuses, i'm not just taking anything, we can change reality.

polaris_x

rival. wrote:

if they have jobs, then they are in one way or another working for the evil corporate machine they despise and are trying to stand against are they not (unless of course it's a personal business/family business)?

but it's OK because at the end of the day they are receiving a paycheck and food is getting put on their table, right?

sounds a little misguided if you ask me.

not every employer is part of the evil corporate machine ... but yes, everything is indeed interconnected ... but that hypocrisy still does not change the fact that there is a problem and there are people willing to do something about it ...

neilybabes86

one thing is for sure....a record doesn't look good on your employment application

BinauralJam

Monster Rain wrote:

I hear a lot about banks getting bailouts from protesters and people who agree with the protesters. My question is this: why don't the people mentioning the bailouts ever mention that the banks have all paid back what they received? Another question: If that's one of the main complaints, why are these protests happening after the bailouts have been paid back? I find it ironinc that there are people there protesting banks that have paid back their bailout money while also protesting the fact that they have to pay back their student loans.

BinauralJam wrote:

Banks got a bail out with Tax Payers money and then turned around and handed out Bonuses, i'm not just taking anything, we can change reality.

How many people lost there houses thanks to those banks, or are underwater because of it, No help coming there way, how many people owe more than there houses are worth? because of the banks. I owe 26 G on my wifes school loan, i owed 37, 6 years ago and i don't have a problem with it taking me 20 years to pay off the rest, but when i hear more money is owed in student loans then the national debt, i think there something wrong.

rival.

rival. wrote:

which could bring up the point of how do these "protestors" justify the fact that it is OK that their musician/actor/artist idol makes millions upon millions upon millions?

still trying to figure out this one. this would be the definition of hypocritical.

polaris_x

rival. wrote:

rival. wrote:

which could bring up the point of how do these "protestors" justify the fact that it is OK that their musician/actor/artist idol makes millions upon millions upon millions?

still trying to figure out this one. this would be the definition of hypocritical.

dude ... everyone's a hypocrite ... it doesn't change the message ... why not focus on the problem instead of looking for reasons to discredit it?

rival.

BinauralJam wrote:

How many people lost there houses thanks to those banks, or are underwater because of it, No help coming there way, how many people owe more than there houses are worth? because of the banks. I owe 26 G on my wifes school loan, i owed 37, 6 years ago and i don't have a problem with it taking me 20 years to pay off the rest, but when i hear more money is owed in student loans then the national debt, i think there something wrong.

it's on the parents to educate a 17/18 year old that is just graduating high school and explain to them the costs of going to a college, and the low down on loans when they complete their four years. student loans should be of no shock to anyone when they receive the first bill in the mail after graduation day.

some kids are fortunate enough to be in a situation where their parents can afford to pay for their entire schooling and not hold the child responsible for a cent after they graduate.

me and my girlfriend? not so much. on top of our 9-5, mon-fri careers were waiting on tables and bartending to pay off this debt. hers are paid off and mine will be paid off this year (5 years after graduation).

again, you choose your own fate. no sympathy for those sitting on their ass waiting for obama to arrive on their doorstep with a big check with a red ribbon tied around it.

BinauralJam

rival. wrote:

it's on the parents to educate a 17/18 year old that is just graduating high school and explain to them the costs of going to a college, and the low down on loans when they complete their four years. student loans should be of no shock to anyone when they receive the first bill in the mail after graduation day.

some kids are fortunate enough to be in a situation where their parents can afford to pay for their entire schooling and not hold the child responsible for a cent after they graduate.

me and my girlfriend? not so much. on top of our 9-5, mon-fri careers were waiting on tables and bartending to pay off this debt. hers are paid off and mine will be paid off this year (5 years after graduation).

again, you choose your own fate. no sympathy for those sitting on their ass waiting for obama to arrive on their doorstep with a big check with a red ribbon tied around it.

Yeesh, you are good man, i worked a second job at Mc'ds(and that shit aint easy)for 7 months in wife's 3rd year in collage, i was like zombie, i value my weekends more than my future

Monster Rain

Banks don't force people to take out student loans. People choose to take them out. Yes, college is expensive but there are cheaper options available to people, it's jsut that most people ignore them. For example, how many kids decide to attend a private college/university or go to a school out of state when there are cheaper state schools they can attend? I would have loved to attend a big school in another state but that would have cost way more than I'd be able to afford, so I went with an in-state school. People can save money by going to community college for a couple years and transferring to an in-state school for the last 2. It's amazing how much cheaper that is. I can't think of a reason why someone who voluntarily applies for and receives a student loan shouldn't have to pay it back. It's not like you don't find out how much school costs until you finish. You know going in how much it costs and how much you're borrowing. Someone attending college should be smart enough to figure out at an expensive school is going to result in large monthly loan payments if they need loans to attend.

As for people losing their homes, I don't think too many people have lost their homes because banks received bailouts. It's the other way around. Banks gave out loans to people who couldn't afford the mortgages and there were so many bad loans that the banks were in serious trouble. Part of the reason for those bad loans was the fact that the government encouraged them to lend in those types of situations and they were dumb enough to do it. That's why some banks had problems and other banks with stricter lending practices not only avoided those problems but actually became stronger due to their responsibility and risk management. There were certainly some banks that were worse than others and there were likely some smaller mortgage brokers that were offering mortgages they shouldn't have approved and selling them off to larger banks. Instead of focusing on those specific companies, though, the protesters are yelling about "the banks" as if every bank in the country was intentionally trying to ruin people's lives. Instead of generalizing about "the banks" and "Wall Street" why not do something that will actually make a real difference like boycott banks like Bank of America that were the worst offenders and still treat customers like dirt? That will actually affect the company. These protests aren't having any impact on them right now because standing in a park, sleeping in a tent, forming drum circles, and blocking commuters doesn't change their profits one way or the other.

BinauralJam wrote:

Monster Rain wrote:

I hear a lot about banks getting bailouts from protesters and people who agree with the protesters. My question is this: why don't the people mentioning the bailouts ever mention that the banks have all paid back what they received? Another question: If that's one of the main complaints, why are these protests happening after the bailouts have been paid back? I find it ironinc that there are people there protesting banks that have paid back their bailout money while also protesting the fact that they have to pay back their student loans.

BinauralJam wrote:

Banks got a bail out with Tax Payers money and then turned around and handed out Bonuses, i'm not just taking anything, we can change reality.

How many people lost there houses thanks to those banks, or are underwater because of it, No help coming there way, how many people owe more than there houses are worth? because of the banks. I owe 26 G on my wifes school loan, i owed 37, 6 years ago and i don't have a problem with it taking me 20 years to pay off the rest, but when i hear more money is owed in student loans then the national debt, i think there something wrong.

xavier mcdaniel

You're right. I went to St. John's when it was about $11,000 per year in 1997. My financial aid consisted of a few small loans, which I pay back every month. It also consisted of a few academic scholarships, grants-in-aid and work study aid.

Now that same school which was a commuter school when I started, is a school that costs over $30,000 a year likely because of the construction costs of building new dorms and other buildings. Unless I'm getting a full academic, athletic or any kind of scholarship, there's no chance in hell I'd go there or any private school if I was a senior in high school.