Why do we need to "believe" in God?

Hugh Freaking Dillon

Cosmo wrote:

...
I agree. That is what is trying to be expressed.
And I said, over and over and over again... I think that is GREAT. That the relationship with God should be personal.
But, her way is not for me.
I have heard the 'I Know God' path, literally, a hundred times. And from some pretty unsavory characters (previously listed). Which leads me to having doubts about that doctrine. Most religions will have knowing God as one of their own... whether it is a million followers or a single follower. Christianity and Islam both 'Know' God... the same as Pandora.
Now, not all those I've talked to were the bin Laden or Koresh types... I have had serious religious discussions with friends, one of them being an Air Force Chaplin, another was a professor of Theology at Fresno State. I've spoken with priests and ministers and many Christians, Catholics, Muslims, Jews and Atheists about religion. Not in debate, but in the spirit of discovery. I'm told... it's pretty much, a leap of faith. So, i have heard Pandora's story many times... by many different people.
My problem is... if all of these people 'Know' God... then why is everything so fucked up? Shouldn't people who 'Know' God... act in a manner that is worthy of Him? I mean, certainly people are nice... I'm certain Pandora is a very nice person... but, for example, her view on Illegal Immigrants falls in line with right-wing Nationalistic exclusion. Aren't most of these people... People who just want to make a better living for themselves and their families? Was it God's plan to have them born dirt poor where the nearest chance for a better life is 500 miles and 2 border crossings away?
The leap of faith is just too easy of a path... for me to take. I choose to take the tougher road. I know... it is on me and I'm doing fine. Somehow, I believe my journey does me good. I have no ill will towards religion... which make me tolerant towards all religion... even if no religion is for me.

I agree with all of this. I think you're the kind of person I'd like to sit on a beach with by a fire and have a 5 hour conversation about the universe.

Even if he were to exist, people are human, flawed, after all. I'm sure 98% of people who believe, TRY their best to act in a manner that is their interpretation of how their god would want them to. Problem is, there's too much open for interpretation, hence why we have wars and conflict. Humans are greedy.

I'm not trying to put words into Pandora's or anyone else's mouths, but consider this: some people believe there is a god, and claim to know him, yet they also know that he doesn't control everything, or maybe even he didn't create everything, he's just there for you when you need him to talk to, to lift your spirits, etc. It doesn't all have to be "well if there is a god why does life suck?".

Life is beautiful, humanity sucks. 99% of humans are awesome. but it's the 1% that control everything. And I personally believe those 1% at one point were part of the 99%.

JonnyPistachio

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

It doesn't all have to be "well if there is a god why does life suck?".

Life is beautiful, humanity sucks. 99% of humans are awesome. but it's the 1% that control everything. And I personally believe those 1% at one point were part of the 99%.

The only reaction I ever hear to this that makes sense is (not that crap about "God works in mysterious ways"), but that God must have a weird sense of humor.

Hugh Freaking Dillon

JonnyPistachio wrote:

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

It doesn't all have to be "well if there is a god why does life suck?".

Life is beautiful, humanity sucks. 99% of humans are awesome. but it's the 1% that control everything. And I personally believe those 1% at one point were part of the 99%.

The only reaction I ever hear to this that makes sense is (not that crap about "God works in mysterious ways"), but that God must have a weird sense of humor.

I believe the Lisa Simpson version of events. The Genesis Tub. Something created us, but doesn't control a damn thing.

Cosmo

Well... the thing I have come to know.. is when someone tells me they 'know'... and cannot explain it to me... I know they don't know. Because if they did know... they'd be able to explain it. I've talked to many people about religion and faith... yet, the one explanation I get is the leap of faith deal. That I won't know until I take that leap. Well, if they've already taken that leap... and they now know... why can't they explain it to me? Knowing is understanding and understanding means you can convey it... right?
...
One thing I will never understand is the term, 'God Fearing'... like, when someone says, 'as a God-Fearing Christian...'. God is to be feared? We should be afraid of Him? If He is all love... what's to fear? The explanation being His judgement upon us. Well, if He loves us... why does He judge us? Does that mean we should do as He says? If so, then, He needs to tells us what He wants. Then... it goes into that whole 'The Bible tells us what God wants us to do' bit... and it all goes into the discussion about the Bible and the control of the church over the Bible for all of those centuries and so on.
So... not being one to fear God... I move on. I believe He knows how fucked up I am and how little I know and accepts me at face value... for what I am, with all of my flaws. When I die, I do KNOW one of my questions will be answered. As I pass through death's portal, I will know if there is another level of being... or if I pass into a void. So, death is not such a frieghtening spectre.
Until then, the only truth I know... I'm only here in this existance, on this Earth until I die. I appreciate life and living and I do my best to share what I have with others... all others, not just the ones I love... and expect nothing in return.

Jeanwah

Maybe you should look into Eastern religions Cosmo. Perhaps you need a break from looking for God, so you can find Buddha, instead.
Look into Paganism too, since it sounds like you love nature. It couldn't hurt.

pandora

I know God and can explain my experiences and how knowing God has changed my life
just like I can do the same for knowing Pearl Jam

Interaction with many here has proven to me they do not care to know God
this is more than obvious in their words
besides if they did they would already know God it is that simple ...
they want proof from me or others which is damn silly in fact makes
no sense at all...
only God can prove God exists

God could perform a miracle in their lives and they would not be able to see it
it would be explained away and not absorbed with the
revelation and enlightenment that was intended

Life is a journey .. in my opinion and experience towards God

For others it is not,
they will not ask for that on this journey here in this life
although they claim to search and will move onto another journey
still searching for completeness

if you were lost would you not ask for directions...
I guess some would not

I asked for direction and got it, it was not only life changing
it was me changing

For me the leap of faith was one question one request

As far as needing God, why we need to believe, we do not need to believe
this is proof by the abundance here who do not...
they are surviving just fine
most are kind loving open minded beautiful souls accepting of others
and at peace within their own beliefs

but I have found God needs me and knows me and I do need that

that completes me ... just me no one else

because God is loving and taught me to each their own

Cosmo

pandora wrote:

I know God and can explain my experiences and how knowing God has changed my life
just like I can do the same for knowing Pearl Jam

Interaction with many here has proven to me they do not care to know God
this is more than obvious in their words
besides if they did they would already know God it is that simple ...
they want proof from me or others which is damn silly in fact makes
no sense at all...
only God can prove God exists

God could perform a miracle in their lives and they would not be able to see it
it would be explained away and not absorbed with the
revelation and enlightenment that was intended

Life is a journey .. in my opinion and experience towards God

For others it is not,
they will not ask for that on this journey here in this life
although they claim to search and will move onto another journey
still searching for completeness

if you were lost would you not ask for directions...
I guess some would not

I asked for direction and got it, it was not only life changing
it was me changing

For me the leap of faith was one question one request

As far as needing God, why we need to believe, we do not need to believe
this is proof by the abundance here who do not...
they are surviving just fine
most are kind loving open minded beautiful souls accepting of others
and at peace within their own beliefs

but I have found God needs me and knows me and I do need that

that completes me ... just me no one else

because God is loving and taught me to each their own

...
Sounds more like a critcism of others, than a confirmation of truth.
I don't want nor need proof from you or anyone else because I KNOW you, or anyone else, cannot provide proof. It is belief... and belief is beyond explanation.
And I'm completely okay with anyone's.

Byrnzie

pandora wrote:

I know God

pandora wrote:

I have found God needs me and knows me and I do need that

that completes me ... just me no one else

:problem:

Byrnzie

'God' is no different from 'Obi Wan Kenobi'.

He was created by us to fulfill an illusion of superior wisdom and eternal life in human form.

Not sure why we created Yoda though :think:


Discuss...

Cosmo

Byrnzie wrote:

'God' is no different from 'Obi Wan Kenobi'.
He was created by us to fulfill an illusion of superior wisdom and eternal life in human form.
Not sure why we created Yoda though :think:

Discuss...

...
Yoda was created to remind me that I either do... or I don't. There is no 'trying'.

Byrnzie

Cosmo wrote:

Byrnzie wrote:

'God' is no different from 'Obi Wan Kenobi'.
He was created by us to fulfill an illusion of superior wisdom and eternal life in human form.
Not sure why we created Yoda though :think:

Discuss...

...
Yoda was created to remind me that I either do... or I don't. There is no 'trying'.

Or maybe George Lucas once had a special relationship with a chihuahua?

BinauralJam

Yoda was created because Lucas learned and listen to people's responses from around the world to Star Wars and for the first time got a taste of Asian Philosophy and it registered.

Byrnzie

BinauralJam wrote:

Yoda was created because Lucas learned and listen to people's responses from around the world to Star Wars and for the first time got a taste of Asian Philosophy and it registered.

Come to think of it, Yoda does sound a bit like Lao Tzu:


To the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders.
Lao Tzu

He who knows does not speak. He who speaks does not know.
Lao Tzu

To know you have enough is to be rich.
Lao Tzu

Hugh Freaking Dillon

pandora wrote:

but I have found God needs me

yikes.

pandora

God needs 'you' as do we need each other

BinauralJam

BinauralJam wrote:

Yoda was created because Lucas learned and listen to people's responses from around the world to Star Wars and for the first time got a taste of Asian Philosophy and it registered.

i was drinking when i wrote this, but it's possible

markin ball

Would god exist without humans?

Jeanwah

markin ball wrote:

Would god exist without humans?

Since we created God, I'd say no.
You don't see other animals worshipping a higher power..

brianlux

Jeanwah wrote:

markin ball wrote:

Would god exist without humans?

Since we created God, I'd say no.
You don't see other animals worshipping a higher power..

Now that you mention it, Jeanwah, a friend told me that dogs see us as Gods and cats demand that we see them as God!

chadwick

wherever everything came from is god

the universe is god
what circumferences the universe? in fact, all universes combined
all darkness and all light
stars no stars including all planets
nothing and zero mass as of yet

god is the universe

this makes more sense to me than anything else