well put, d2d. i personally have no issue with what they're doing & don't understand why everyone is freaking out. as a musician myself, when my old band recorded/produced/distributed our 6 song EP, it was a bitch to do it ourselves. and we're not even close to PJ. PJ=big leagues, US=Tee Ball.
it was hard work and we only had 3500 copies to distribute. self-promotion/distribution is tough. i'd rather them work with a company like target that does give back a bit. just my $0.02!
I think that this Target deal is a pathetic attempt to sell more records. Radiohead they are not.
But hey, it's smart business to do this. Avocado, Riot Act, Binaural, Yield, and No Code COMBINED have sold less than VS. I want to believe that this Target deal is an attempt to get the music to the masses.....but I think it's a ploy to make more money.
Or maybe it's just because they "love and adore" Target as Kelly Curtis has put it.
How is it pathetic?
Because it comes off (to me) as a "desperate times call for desperate measures" technique.
Why do you think the times are desperate? Pearl Jam still seems pretty viable to me. Anytime you can sell out MSG two straight nights, you're probably doing OK for yourself.
I don't think you really have a clear picture regarding the ins and outs of this thing.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
Because it comes off (to me) as a "desperate times call for desperate measures" technique. [/quote]
Why do you think the times are desperate? Pearl Jam still seems pretty viable to me. Anytime you can sell out MSG two straight nights, you're probably doing OK for yourself.[/quote]
when people get mad they grind their teeth...wow....ass fuck never in a million years came to mind...you don't live down south in the woods do you?
Oh, i see. Not much of a southern boy. Damn SEC.
Chicago 6/29/98 - Nashville 8/17/00 - Cleveland 4/25/03- Chicago 6/18/03
Chicago 5/16/06 - Milwaukee 6/30/06 - Bonnaroo 6/14/08 - Milwaukee (EV)8/19/08
Chicago 8/23/09 - St. Louis 5/4/10 - East Troy 9/3/11 - East Troy 9/4/11
Minor League Park 7/19/13 - Milwaukee 10-20-14 - Bonnaroo 6/11/16
Minor League Park 8/20/16 - Minor League Park 8/22/16 Minor League Park 8/18/18 - Minor League Park 8/20/18 - Los Angeles 4/16/20
To help distribute their music, that's how I see it. It's not greed. They tried a one-off with J records & decided that they wanted to do something different. Do you think that J Records didn't pay the band for those distribution rights?
Because it comes off (to me) as a "desperate times call for desperate measures" technique.
Why do you think the times are desperate? Pearl Jam still seems pretty viable to me. Anytime you can sell out MSG two straight nights, you're probably doing OK for yourself.[/quote]
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So why the Target deal? Green Disease?[/quote]
Apparently, you don't understand the song Green Disease, either. Excellent.
Why Target? Do I really have to regurgitate this whole thread? You're a big boy (I assume). You can handle some light reading.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
I think that this Target deal is a pathetic attempt to sell more records. Radiohead they are not.
But hey, it's smart business to do this. Avocado, Riot Act, Binaural, Yield, and No Code COMBINED have sold less than VS. I want to believe that this Target deal is an attempt to get the music to the masses.....but I think it's a ploy to make more money.
Or maybe it's just because they "love and adore" Target as Kelly Curtis has put it.
How is it pathetic?
Because it comes off (to me) as a "desperate times call for desperate measures" technique.
I dunno, Kelly Curtis saying "they love and adore Target" struck me the wrong way. Like he's towing the company line as they say.
Of course the band is now in bed with Target, might as well show the love...if you want to really call it "love".
Man it sucks when you become the "bad guy" in a some Pearl Jam thread as I have here.
It's not just this Target thing. It's the ticket prices. It's the huge Verizon text message screen at MSG last year. It's a dozen songs being used on a prime-time TV drama. It's the Rock Band game.
But whatever, let them do whatever they want. I'm always gonna buy their albums and go to their shows because I love their music. But unlike 10 years ago, the music is all like about them anymore.
Why do you think the times are desperate? Pearl Jam still seems pretty viable to me. Anytime you can sell out MSG two straight nights, you're probably doing OK for yourself.
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So why the Target deal? Green Disease?
Bingo!! This band doesn't even need to produce another album to make money, all they have to do is tour ala the Grateful Dead way of making money. This is all about the money. If this was truly about the music, they wouldn't care about marketing strategies.
Man it sucks when you become the "bad guy" in a some Pearl Jam thread as I have here.
It's not just this Target thing. It's the ticket prices. It's the huge Verizon text message screen at MSG last year. It's a dozen songs being used on a prime-time TV drama. It's the Rock Band game.
But whatever, let them do whatever they want. I'm always gonna buy their albums and go to their shows because I love their music. But unlike 10 years ago, the music is all like about them anymore.
If someone could explain to me how it is harmful that they teamed up with Target, or Verizon or that stupid Cold Case show, maybe I'd change my mind. But mostly, the answer is, "Pearl Jam never would have done this in 1995."
And you're right. They wouldn't have. But this isn't 1995 anymore. So what?
I kind of addressed this on another thread. I think, if people were being honest with themselves, the reason they have these knee-jerk reaction against these changes in Pearl Jam because it reminds us that it is not 1995 anymore. It reminds us that we are getting older.
And people don't like to get older.
I'm wondering if Ed had the same identity crisis when The Who liscensed like every single song in their catalogue to CSI. It's just what older bands do.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
Why do you think the times are desperate? Pearl Jam still seems pretty viable to me. Anytime you can sell out MSG two straight nights, you're probably doing OK for yourself.
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So why the Target deal? Green Disease?
Bingo!! This band doesn't even need to produce another album to make money, all they have to do is tour ala the Grateful Dead way of making money. This is all about the money.
Ok. And, so?
Why is there such this huge backlash among some people in this country against making money? Like it's a sin to be rich?
Contrary to popular belief the song Green Disease is NOT against making money.
"There's nothing wrong with what you say ..."
It's against how SOME PEOPLE choose to make money ... by trampling on the backs of the poor ... weeds with big leaves stealing light from what's beneath.
Someone will have to explain to me how this TArget deal hurts anyone ... except for maybe Wal-Mart, which is something I thought the hemp-underwear wearing crowd would appreciate.
Anybody notice how the band explicity went out of its way to ensure the little guys -- ie independent record stores -- would still be able to sell the album?
Anyway ... some people just believe any store or company they've heard of just has to be evil ... some people want to believe the worst about everything ... some people just like to find reasons to bitch ... there's no arguing with some people.
Post edited by slightofjeff on
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
bring back SUP-POP RECORDS... every 1's gotta make a BUCK.. YIELD as eddie told u too do!!!!
if pearl jam continued to fight TICKETMASTER most of us would not be able to see them LIVE!!!
let target spend $cash$ it'll save us money on TICKETS TO PEARL JAM SHOWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
donald pastreck
Sub Pop is still around
Chicago 6/29/98 - Nashville 8/17/00 - Cleveland 4/25/03- Chicago 6/18/03
Chicago 5/16/06 - Milwaukee 6/30/06 - Bonnaroo 6/14/08 - Milwaukee (EV)8/19/08
Chicago 8/23/09 - St. Louis 5/4/10 - East Troy 9/3/11 - East Troy 9/4/11
Minor League Park 7/19/13 - Milwaukee 10-20-14 - Bonnaroo 6/11/16
Minor League Park 8/20/16 - Minor League Park 8/22/16 Minor League Park 8/18/18 - Minor League Park 8/20/18 - Los Angeles 4/16/20
This band doesn't even need to produce another album to make money, all they have to do is tour ala the Grateful Dead way of making money. This is all about the money.
That implies to me that the only reason they record new music is to make money, which I disagree with. Pearl Jam are talented guys that create quality music. Each of them individually have had creative projects in between Pearl Jam releases. Clearly they want to keep creating new music.
This band doesn't even need to produce another album to make money, all they have to do is tour ala the Grateful Dead way of making money. This is all about the money.
That implies to me that the only reason they record new music is to make money, which I disagree with. Pearl Jam are talented guys that create quality music. Each of them individually have had creative projects in between Pearl Jam releases. Clearly they want to keep creating new music.
They created new music with Binaural, Riot Act, and Avocado without any corporate sponsorship.
This band doesn't even need to produce another album to make money, all they have to do is tour ala the Grateful Dead way of making money. This is all about the money.
That implies to me that the only reason they record new music is to make money, which I disagree with. Pearl Jam are talented guys that create quality music. Each of them individually have had creative projects in between Pearl Jam releases. Clearly they want to keep creating new music.
Not what I meant. I meant that they are partnering with Target to make money. Making music is artistic in itself, but when you go the extra mile to partner with a big-box corporate retailer, it's not about the music.
This band doesn't even need to produce another album to make money, all they have to do is tour ala the Grateful Dead way of making money. This is all about the money.
That implies to me that the only reason they record new music is to make money, which I disagree with. Pearl Jam are talented guys that create quality music. Each of them individually have had creative projects in between Pearl Jam releases. Clearly they want to keep creating new music.
Yes, but they should travel from town to town via U-Haul to sell that new music, but not for cash, which is an instrument of the evil U.S. government. You should be able to barter for it, possibly using your hemp underwear.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
This band doesn't even need to produce another album to make money, all they have to do is tour ala the Grateful Dead way of making money. This is all about the money.
That implies to me that the only reason they record new music is to make money, which I disagree with. Pearl Jam are talented guys that create quality music. Each of them individually have had creative projects in between Pearl Jam releases. Clearly they want to keep creating new music.
They created new music with Binaural, Riot Act, and Avocado without any corporate sponsorship.
Really??? Who put out that album?? Pearl Jam themselves? No, it was *gasp* a record label called Sony, who happens to be *gasp* a corporation.
This band doesn't even need to produce another album to make money, all they have to do is tour ala the Grateful Dead way of making money. This is all about the money.
That implies to me that the only reason they record new music is to make money, which I disagree with. Pearl Jam are talented guys that create quality music. Each of them individually have had creative projects in between Pearl Jam releases. Clearly they want to keep creating new music.
Not what I meant. I meant that they are partnering with Target to make money. Making music is artistic in itself, but when you go the extra mile to partner with a big-box corporate retailer, it's not about the music.
I don't know if you know this ... but you could buy Ten in Target too. And Wal-Mart. And Best Buy. You know why?
Because Sony had a deal with all those people.
All this does is cut out the middle man ... as well as cut out other evil big box retailers ... which I figured you'd be all for.
Let me ask you this: If Pearl Jam did not have a deal to sell its upcoming self-produced CD at Target, how do you reckon we'd buy it? It would be in zero stores near you.
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
All I know is if Green Day or Coldplay or whoever teamed up with Target.....you'd all be calling them corporate sell-outs.
Nah. I genuinely wouldn't have a problem with it. Especially if neither of those bands had record companies.
I think Green Day might be sell-outs for other reasons.
All this Target deal does for Pearl Jam is replace Sony in the equation. Target is their de facto record company. Somebody has to be in charge of distribution.
Post edited by slightofjeff on
everybody wants the most they can possibly get
for the least they could possibly do
All I know is if Green Day or Coldplay or whoever teamed up with Target.....you'd all be calling them corporate sell-outs.
Nah. I genuinely wouldn't have a problem with it. Especially if neither of those bands had record companies.
I think Green Day might be sell-outs for other reasons.
How can you say Green Day might be sell-outs and defend PJ at the same time? That Verizon text message screen at MSG last year was one of the biggest sell-out moves I've ever seen.
And I'm fine with the fact that they're sell-outs. Who cares? the music is still awesome. But don't deny that that's what they are.
Comments
it was hard work and we only had 3500 copies to distribute. self-promotion/distribution is tough. i'd rather them work with a company like target that does give back a bit. just my $0.02!
www.cluthelee.com
www.cluthe.com
Why do you think the times are desperate? Pearl Jam still seems pretty viable to me. Anytime you can sell out MSG two straight nights, you're probably doing OK for yourself.
I don't think you really have a clear picture regarding the ins and outs of this thing.
for the least they could possibly do
Because it comes off (to me) as a "desperate times call for desperate measures" technique. [/quote]
Why do you think the times are desperate? Pearl Jam still seems pretty viable to me. Anytime you can sell out MSG two straight nights, you're probably doing OK for yourself.[/quote]
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So why the Target deal? Green Disease?
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
Oh, i see. Not much of a southern boy. Damn SEC.
Chicago 5/16/06 - Milwaukee 6/30/06 - Bonnaroo 6/14/08 - Milwaukee (EV)8/19/08
Chicago 8/23/09 - St. Louis 5/4/10 - East Troy 9/3/11 - East Troy 9/4/11
Minor League Park 7/19/13 - Milwaukee 10-20-14 - Bonnaroo 6/11/16
Minor League Park 8/20/16 - Minor League Park 8/22/16
Minor League Park 8/18/18 - Minor League Park 8/20/18 - Los Angeles 4/16/20
To help distribute their music, that's how I see it. It's not greed. They tried a one-off with J records & decided that they wanted to do something different. Do you think that J Records didn't pay the band for those distribution rights?
www.cluthelee.com
www.cluthe.com
Why do you think the times are desperate? Pearl Jam still seems pretty viable to me. Anytime you can sell out MSG two straight nights, you're probably doing OK for yourself.[/quote]
EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
So why the Target deal? Green Disease?[/quote]
Apparently, you don't understand the song Green Disease, either. Excellent.
Why Target? Do I really have to regurgitate this whole thread? You're a big boy (I assume). You can handle some light reading.
for the least they could possibly do
It's not just this Target thing. It's the ticket prices. It's the huge Verizon text message screen at MSG last year. It's a dozen songs being used on a prime-time TV drama. It's the Rock Band game.
But whatever, let them do whatever they want. I'm always gonna buy their albums and go to their shows because I love their music. But unlike 10 years ago, the music is all like about them anymore.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
you're not the bad guy. i was just trying to get another perspective out there.
www.cluthelee.com
www.cluthe.com
if pearl jam continued to fight TICKETMASTER most of us would not be able to see them LIVE!!!
let target spend $cash$ it'll save us money on TICKETS TO PEARL JAM SHOWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
donald pastreck
If someone could explain to me how it is harmful that they teamed up with Target, or Verizon or that stupid Cold Case show, maybe I'd change my mind. But mostly, the answer is, "Pearl Jam never would have done this in 1995."
And you're right. They wouldn't have. But this isn't 1995 anymore. So what?
I kind of addressed this on another thread. I think, if people were being honest with themselves, the reason they have these knee-jerk reaction against these changes in Pearl Jam because it reminds us that it is not 1995 anymore. It reminds us that we are getting older.
And people don't like to get older.
I'm wondering if Ed had the same identity crisis when The Who liscensed like every single song in their catalogue to CSI. It's just what older bands do.
for the least they could possibly do
Ok. And, so?
Why is there such this huge backlash among some people in this country against making money? Like it's a sin to be rich?
Contrary to popular belief the song Green Disease is NOT against making money.
"There's nothing wrong with what you say ..."
It's against how SOME PEOPLE choose to make money ... by trampling on the backs of the poor ... weeds with big leaves stealing light from what's beneath.
Someone will have to explain to me how this TArget deal hurts anyone ... except for maybe Wal-Mart, which is something I thought the hemp-underwear wearing crowd would appreciate.
Anybody notice how the band explicity went out of its way to ensure the little guys -- ie independent record stores -- would still be able to sell the album?
Anyway ... some people just believe any store or company they've heard of just has to be evil ... some people want to believe the worst about everything ... some people just like to find reasons to bitch ... there's no arguing with some people.
for the least they could possibly do
Sub Pop is still around
Chicago 5/16/06 - Milwaukee 6/30/06 - Bonnaroo 6/14/08 - Milwaukee (EV)8/19/08
Chicago 8/23/09 - St. Louis 5/4/10 - East Troy 9/3/11 - East Troy 9/4/11
Minor League Park 7/19/13 - Milwaukee 10-20-14 - Bonnaroo 6/11/16
Minor League Park 8/20/16 - Minor League Park 8/22/16
Minor League Park 8/18/18 - Minor League Park 8/20/18 - Los Angeles 4/16/20
That implies to me that the only reason they record new music is to make money, which I disagree with. Pearl Jam are talented guys that create quality music. Each of them individually have had creative projects in between Pearl Jam releases. Clearly they want to keep creating new music.
They created new music with Binaural, Riot Act, and Avocado without any corporate sponsorship.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
Yes, but they should travel from town to town via U-Haul to sell that new music, but not for cash, which is an instrument of the evil U.S. government. You should be able to barter for it, possibly using your hemp underwear.
for the least they could possibly do
Really??? Who put out that album?? Pearl Jam themselves? No, it was *gasp* a record label called Sony, who happens to be *gasp* a corporation.
I don't know if you know this ... but you could buy Ten in Target too. And Wal-Mart. And Best Buy. You know why?
Because Sony had a deal with all those people.
All this does is cut out the middle man ... as well as cut out other evil big box retailers ... which I figured you'd be all for.
Let me ask you this: If Pearl Jam did not have a deal to sell its upcoming self-produced CD at Target, how do you reckon we'd buy it? It would be in zero stores near you.
for the least they could possibly do
Um ... yes they did. They sold them to Target. And Best Buy. And (horror of horrors!) Wal-Mart.
for the least they could possibly do
Riot Act-Sony
Pearl Jam-J Records (sub of Sony)
www.cluthelee.com
www.cluthe.com
So.....Pearl Jam shipped them directly to the stores to sell??
No, Sony manufactured the album and then sold it to the stores.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
well said.
www.cluthelee.com
www.cluthe.com
Nah. I genuinely wouldn't have a problem with it. Especially if neither of those bands had record companies.
I think Green Day might be sell-outs for other reasons.
All this Target deal does for Pearl Jam is replace Sony in the equation. Target is their de facto record company. Somebody has to be in charge of distribution.
for the least they could possibly do
That is the fucking bingo post of all bingo posts my man. Well done.
for the least they could possibly do
How can you say Green Day might be sell-outs and defend PJ at the same time? That Verizon text message screen at MSG last year was one of the biggest sell-out moves I've ever seen.
And I'm fine with the fact that they're sell-outs. Who cares? the music is still awesome. But don't deny that that's what they are.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com