Auto-Save Draft feature temporarily disabled. Please be sure you manually save your post by selecting "Save Draft" if you have that need.

Nate Silver 538

14445464850

Comments

  • curmudgeonesscurmudgeoness Brigadoon, foodie capitalPosts: 2,847
    I doubt it will be anywhere near a 16 point margin, but still should be a safe win for Newsom tonight...and then the republicans will continue their Big Lie (which they started once they started getting polling numbers a couple weeks ago)



    A shame it's even that close. I saw a pretty good quote somewhere - forget where now, parahrasing here, too - but people lean towards conspiracy theories in times of uncertainty/trauma/major global incidents.

    And what's a shame is this is the gameplan for every Republican in elections going forward - especially high profile elections: when you lose cry RIGGED. Saw this coming before November, and it's never going away. Goddamn shame.

    We could clear this all up with rank choice voting, approval voting, etc. Any kind of voting that isn't based on the plurality of a minority.


    I'm not the only person espousing that viewpoint, but I did make a comment to that effect the other day. Those of us of a certain age who were in the Soviet Union soon before it collapsed saw a lot of rejection of science and embracing of superstition, folk remedies, quackery and conspiracies. So to me it's a sign of fraying social fabric.

    Fragmenting society and leaving people unsure of whom they can trust and/or believe also makes it much easier to seize power -- just saying.

    As for today's recall election (I'm in California): I read the 538 article this morning, and after the 2016 and 2020 elections, nothing leaves a knot in my stomach like the phrase "barring a polling error of historical proportions." Gah!

    I'm agnostic on Newsom but I feel that he has done a pretty good job wrt the pandemic (French Laundry being VERY poor optics, I grant). I think a lot of people were agnostic on Newsom, but taking a hard look at the alternatives was pretty motivating for me.

    The "rigged election" bs is just that --- bullshit. California is a solidly blue state, everyone knows full well that registered Dems outnumber GOP by a LOT, state legislature has Dem supermajority. Nobody should be surprised if Newsom stays in office.

    But it's not really about reality. It's about money -- fundraising, grifting, whatever. "STOP THE STEAL! Send $100 now to keep our elections safe!"

    And yes, the California recall process is seriously effed up. I think ranked choice voting is interesting, would not work in this case. I don't have the stamina to research and rank 45 candidates, and I doubt anyone else does, either.
    All those who seek to destroy the liberties of a democratic nation ought to know that war is the surest and shortest means to accomplish it.
  • curmudgeonesscurmudgeoness Brigadoon, foodie capitalPosts: 2,847
    mrussel1 said:
    Trump's nothing more than a figurehead. To ponder the idea that he's actively involved with any grand plan that doesn't directly benefit him today is to give him too much credit. He's a dunce. The well's poisoned already. The only reason anyone still clings to him at all is due to the threat of another 4 years, other than that, at this point, he's the architect of the playbook going forward for the rest of that trash party.
    He's not and never has been a leader.  He is the voice, the person willing to say what the deplorables think.  He gets his feed from the grass roots and parrots it.  

    I've long thought of him as Eric Cartman in the flesh.
    All those who seek to destroy the liberties of a democratic nation ought to know that war is the surest and shortest means to accomplish it.
  • Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South PhillyPosts: 14,096
    I doubt it will be anywhere near a 16 point margin, but still should be a safe win for Newsom tonight...and then the republicans will continue their Big Lie (which they started once they started getting polling numbers a couple weeks ago)



    A shame it's even that close. I saw a pretty good quote somewhere - forget where now, parahrasing here, too - but people lean towards conspiracy theories in times of uncertainty/trauma/major global incidents.

    And what's a shame is this is the gameplan for every Republican in elections going forward - especially high profile elections: when you lose cry RIGGED. Saw this coming before November, and it's never going away. Goddamn shame.

    We could clear this all up with rank choice voting, approval voting, etc. Any kind of voting that isn't based on the plurality of a minority.


    I'm not the only person espousing that viewpoint, but I did make a comment to that effect the other day. Those of us of a certain age who were in the Soviet Union soon before it collapsed saw a lot of rejection of science and embracing of superstition, folk remedies, quackery and conspiracies. So to me it's a sign of fraying social fabric.

    Fragmenting society and leaving people unsure of whom they can trust and/or believe also makes it much easier to seize power -- just saying.

    As for today's recall election (I'm in California): I read the 538 article this morning, and after the 2016 and 2020 elections, nothing leaves a knot in my stomach like the phrase "barring a polling error of historical proportions." Gah!

    I'm agnostic on Newsom but I feel that he has done a pretty good job wrt the pandemic (French Laundry being VERY poor optics, I grant). I think a lot of people were agnostic on Newsom, but taking a hard look at the alternatives was pretty motivating for me.

    The "rigged election" bs is just that --- bullshit. California is a solidly blue state, everyone knows full well that registered Dems outnumber GOP by a LOT, state legislature has Dem supermajority. Nobody should be surprised if Newsom stays in office.

    But it's not really about reality. It's about money -- fundraising, grifting, whatever. "STOP THE STEAL! Send $100 now to keep our elections safe!"

    And yes, the California recall process is seriously effed up. I think ranked choice voting is interesting, would not work in this case. I don't have the stamina to research and rank 45 candidates, and I doubt anyone else does, either.
    RCV doesn't have to be 45 candidates, nor should the reason for not using it be an extreme example that someone always comes up with. There are other approaches, too, like approval voting. My point being is the way elections are currently structured (dominated 2-party system, driven by a primary system, the winner is a result of a plurality in a minority, where the extreme voices/views have wayyy too much sway, is certainly not the way. That's on top of using a separate system for the Executive branch). 

    I really don't give a shit about Newsom, since I'm not in California. I just know there's a 100% chance he's better than what the GOP could come up with.

    Also saw a good point somewhere re: the idea of the GOP taking over California. First, HA. HA. not happening anytime soon. Two, if the super wealthy of CA are serious about leaving CA for TX, MT, UT, whatever, PLEASE DO IT. Great way to turn one blue state into possibly many. Or certainly more to the left.
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 40,789
    mrussel1 said:
    Trump's nothing more than a figurehead. To ponder the idea that he's actively involved with any grand plan that doesn't directly benefit him today is to give him too much credit. He's a dunce. The well's poisoned already. The only reason anyone still clings to him at all is due to the threat of another 4 years, other than that, at this point, he's the architect of the playbook going forward for the rest of that trash party.
    He's not and never has been a leader.  He is the voice, the person willing to say what the deplorables think.  He gets his feed from the grass roots and parrots it.  
    Also not smart!
    I am not saying he is the master planner of all this. I am saying I wouldn't be surprised that the same people who may have been pulling his strings (blackmailing him, perhaps) for the last 5 or 6 years are still doing it.


    The fact that it helps his ego to never admit defeat is also, obviously, fueling this nonsense. 
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin LouisPosts: 19,046
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom'sPosts: 12,200
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Remember the Thomas Nine!! (10/02/2018)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley #1, Wrigley #2, Boston #1, Boston #2
    2020: Oakland1, Oakland2:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 40,789
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 22,755
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon HeadstoniaPosts: 28,102
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    If you have enough people losing their jobs/livelihoods and they see that as a direct result of government action, I see a very different set of circumstances leading to something awful. 
    (Track 10 of The Headstones' Nickels For Your Nightmares)


  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 22,755
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    If you have enough people losing their jobs/livelihoods and they see that as a direct result of government action, I see a very different set of circumstances leading to something awful. 
    It's only companies of 100 or more people.  You can also test every week.  
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 40,789
    The problem is it is not a small percentage of the population anymore. Sure they are still a very vocal minority but the percentage of republicans who believe Trump actually won an election he lost is staggering. These same people also think January 6th was not a big deal.



  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon HeadstoniaPosts: 28,102
    The problem is it is not a small percentage of the population anymore. Sure they are still a very vocal minority but the percentage of republicans who believe Trump actually won an election he lost is staggering. These same people also think January 6th was not a big deal.



    they would have had it been democrats protesting a "stolen election" with a republican winning. it would be the lead story on fox for months. 
    (Track 10 of The Headstones' Nickels For Your Nightmares)


  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom'sPosts: 12,200
    The GOP has done a great job of being an opposition party but the party itself needs to die and be broken up into smaller pieces.

    Otherwise we are all fucked.
    Remember the Thomas Nine!! (10/02/2018)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley #1, Wrigley #2, Boston #1, Boston #2
    2020: Oakland1, Oakland2:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin LouisPosts: 19,046
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 22,755
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin LouisPosts: 19,046
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 22,755
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Not all the ones with real jobs and families.  That's my point.  There are way,  way more of us than them. 
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 40,789
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Not all the ones with real jobs and families.  That's my point.  There are way,  way more of us than them. 
    I underestimated the amount of republicans who have been hoodwinked by Trumpism. I used to share your optimism but I seriously did not think we would be 9 months after an insurrection which was built up by Trump lying about losing an election and have so many of these people still put the guy up on a pedestal. It's not just that 30% deplorable base anymore. It is vast majority of republicans now, even the ones who used to be considered reasonable. I thought they'd recognize that he lost them the house, congress, and white house and realize how toxic he was....but nope. They literally all believe he won the election and that it was stolen from him. A large portion of those people also don't believe in vaccines and masks. There is literally nothing you can say to these people to change their minds. They are too far gone.

    I don't even think the economy matters as much because they have shown that they will believe one plus one equals three if the right people tell them so over and over and over again. Look at all the numbskulls who pop in here every now and then who were convinced things started getting better in January of 2017 and then in January of 2021 things all of sudden turned to shit again. I think there area whole more of these people than we originally thought. 
  • HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon HeadstoniaPosts: 28,102
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Not all the ones with real jobs and families.  That's my point.  There are way,  way more of us than them. 
    I underestimated the amount of republicans who have been hoodwinked by Trumpism. I used to share your optimism but I seriously did not think we would be 9 months after an insurrection which was built up by Trump lying about losing an election and have so many of these people still put the guy up on a pedestal. It's not just that 30% deplorable base anymore. It is vast majority of republicans now, even the ones who used to be considered reasonable. I thought they'd recognize that he lost them the house, congress, and white house and realize how toxic he was....but nope. They literally all believe he won the election and that it was stolen from him. A large portion of those people also don't believe in vaccines and masks. There is literally nothing you can say to these people to change their minds. They are too far gone.

    I don't even think the economy matters as much because they have shown that they will believe one plus one equals three if the right people tell them so over and over and over again. Look at all the numbskulls who pop in here every now and then who were convinced things started getting better in January of 2017 and then in January of 2021 things all of sudden turned to shit again. I think there area whole more of these people than we originally thought. 
    one of them a business owner, no less. 
    (Track 10 of The Headstones' Nickels For Your Nightmares)


  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 22,755
    edited September 14
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Not all the ones with real jobs and families.  That's my point.  There are way,  way more of us than them. 
    I underestimated the amount of republicans who have been hoodwinked by Trumpism. I used to share your optimism but I seriously did not think we would be 9 months after an insurrection which was built up by Trump lying about losing an election and have so many of these people still put the guy up on a pedestal. It's not just that 30% deplorable base anymore. It is vast majority of republicans now, even the ones who used to be considered reasonable. I thought they'd recognize that he lost them the house, congress, and white house and realize how toxic he was....but nope. They literally all believe he won the election and that it was stolen from him. A large portion of those people also don't believe in vaccines and masks. There is literally nothing you can say to these people to change their minds. They are too far gone.

    I don't even think the economy matters as much because they have shown that they will believe one plus one equals three if the right people tell them so over and over and over again. Look at all the numbskulls who pop in here every now and then who were convinced things started getting better in January of 2017 and then in January of 2021 things all of sudden turned to shit again. I think there area whole more of these people than we originally thought. 
    All this may be true,  but do you think they will really throw it all away? What they believe or say and what they're willing to do are very different.  There's been no unrest since that day. 
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 40,789
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Not all the ones with real jobs and families.  That's my point.  There are way,  way more of us than them. 
    I underestimated the amount of republicans who have been hoodwinked by Trumpism. I used to share your optimism but I seriously did not think we would be 9 months after an insurrection which was built up by Trump lying about losing an election and have so many of these people still put the guy up on a pedestal. It's not just that 30% deplorable base anymore. It is vast majority of republicans now, even the ones who used to be considered reasonable. I thought they'd recognize that he lost them the house, congress, and white house and realize how toxic he was....but nope. They literally all believe he won the election and that it was stolen from him. A large portion of those people also don't believe in vaccines and masks. There is literally nothing you can say to these people to change their minds. They are too far gone.

    I don't even think the economy matters as much because they have shown that they will believe one plus one equals three if the right people tell them so over and over and over again. Look at all the numbskulls who pop in here every now and then who were convinced things started getting better in January of 2017 and then in January of 2021 things all of sudden turned to shit again. I think there area whole more of these people than we originally thought. 
    All this may be true,  but do you think they will really throw it all away? What they believe or say and what they're willing to do are very different.  There's been no unrest since that day. 
    I'm not sure what you mean exactly by "throw it all away." I'm more talking about how they're too far gone to think critically and vote for candidates who are not right wing Trumpian extremists. And I'm not saying these people will all turn violent and shit but I am saying they've already proven they will look the other way and pretend the real ugliness either doesn't exist or that it was really antifa and not Trump supporters. 

    The videos I see on a daily basis of school board meetings and these people yesterday at the Biden/Newsome rally. Things seem to be getting worse pretty quickly and I would not be surprised if more unrest happens sooner than later. There is this dumb thing scheduled for Saturday too...
  • JB16057JB16057 Posts: 387
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Hatred goes both ways though. Take this site for example. There is so much hatred towards the GOP, Conservatives and Republicans and most of it is the same hysterics as what you see on FOX just in reverse. Sure this site doesn't get near the amount of attention but CNN, MSNBC and plenty of other major news outlets spew hatred all day long.

    Something needs to change with the economy. Inflation is out of control right now and I don't see either side of the aisle doing anything about it.

  • gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin LouisPosts: 19,046
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Not all the ones with real jobs and families.  That's my point.  There are way,  way more of us than them. 
    I underestimated the amount of republicans who have been hoodwinked by Trumpism. I used to share your optimism but I seriously did not think we would be 9 months after an insurrection which was built up by Trump lying about losing an election and have so many of these people still put the guy up on a pedestal. It's not just that 30% deplorable base anymore. It is vast majority of republicans now, even the ones who used to be considered reasonable. I thought they'd recognize that he lost them the house, congress, and white house and realize how toxic he was....but nope. They literally all believe he won the election and that it was stolen from him. A large portion of those people also don't believe in vaccines and masks. There is literally nothing you can say to these people to change their minds. They are too far gone.

    I don't even think the economy matters as much because they have shown that they will believe one plus one equals three if the right people tell them so over and over and over again. Look at all the numbskulls who pop in here every now and then who were convinced things started getting better in January of 2017 and then in January of 2021 things all of sudden turned to shit again. I think there area whole more of these people than we originally thought. 
    All this may be true,  but do you think they will really throw it all away? What they believe or say and what they're willing to do are very different.  There's been no unrest since that day. 
    didn't that guy that was brainwashed by q just throw it all away by killing his kids with a speargun?

    there are more people out there like that than you think.

    we are going to start seeing more of it. 

    all i know is they better call the damn army reserve in for the rally for the "political prisoners" this weekend.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Still waiting for Bull Durham’s indictments?

    Here’s the thing. Barry McCaffery had some extremely scathing words for POOTWH, the history, his enablers, the voting public in response to Woodward’s new book, Peril, and how JCOS Milley had to run interference to avoid a potential conflict with China, so unhinged POOTWH was. Now, imagine how that’s being reported on Faux News, if at all, or how it’s being spun in Kelly Ann CONway’s alternative reality. The concern then, in that moment, is more than likely well documented via private emails and conversations. And still, it’ll all be considered a government conspiracy because POOTWH was going to dismantle the child sex trafficking ring. They are all in and in deep. We’re fucked. Totally.

    Brilliant, brilliance in all its brilliancy as we march slowly but deliberately toward fascism.
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

    "If you're looking down on someone, it better be to extend them a hand to lift them up."

    Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.

    Brilliantati©
  • See the POOTWH thread.
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

    "If you're looking down on someone, it better be to extend them a hand to lift them up."

    Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.

    Brilliantati©
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 22,755
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Not all the ones with real jobs and families.  That's my point.  There are way,  way more of us than them. 
    I underestimated the amount of republicans who have been hoodwinked by Trumpism. I used to share your optimism but I seriously did not think we would be 9 months after an insurrection which was built up by Trump lying about losing an election and have so many of these people still put the guy up on a pedestal. It's not just that 30% deplorable base anymore. It is vast majority of republicans now, even the ones who used to be considered reasonable. I thought they'd recognize that he lost them the house, congress, and white house and realize how toxic he was....but nope. They literally all believe he won the election and that it was stolen from him. A large portion of those people also don't believe in vaccines and masks. There is literally nothing you can say to these people to change their minds. They are too far gone.

    I don't even think the economy matters as much because they have shown that they will believe one plus one equals three if the right people tell them so over and over and over again. Look at all the numbskulls who pop in here every now and then who were convinced things started getting better in January of 2017 and then in January of 2021 things all of sudden turned to shit again. I think there area whole more of these people than we originally thought. 
    All this may be true,  but do you think they will really throw it all away? What they believe or say and what they're willing to do are very different.  There's been no unrest since that day. 
    I'm not sure what you mean exactly by "throw it all away." I'm more talking about how they're too far gone to think critically and vote for candidates who are not right wing Trumpian extremists. And I'm not saying these people will all turn violent and shit but I am saying they've already proven they will look the other way and pretend the real ugliness either doesn't exist or that it was really antifa and not Trump supporters. 

    The videos I see on a daily basis of school board meetings and these people yesterday at the Biden/Newsome rally. Things seem to be getting worse pretty quickly and I would not be surprised if more unrest happens sooner than later. There is this dumb thing scheduled for Saturday too...
    I'm talking specifically about revolution, true blood in the street revolution with an overthrow.  A small minority of people causing a ruckus is very different than popular revolution.  That's where this conversation stemmed. 
  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 22,755
    JB16057 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Hatred goes both ways though. Take this site for example. There is so much hatred towards the GOP, Conservatives and Republicans and most of it is the same hysterics as what you see on FOX just in reverse. Sure this site doesn't get near the amount of attention but CNN, MSNBC and plenty of other major news outlets spew hatred all day long.

    Something needs to change with the economy. Inflation is out of control right now and I don't see either side of the aisle doing anything about it.

    OH please.  Inflation actually slowed last month and almost all professional economists predicted short term inflation into early next year because of the massive supply chain issues.  But all teh other fundamentals of the economy are perfectly healthy.  Tell me what indicators are you watching that make you say the economy needs to change?  GDP?  Looks great.  Credit quality?  Best in a generation.  Market indexes?  I think you know the answer to that.  And the forecasts for next year look solid too. 
  • Dear lord, both sides are the same. See?
    09/15/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/29/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield, MA; 08/18/08, O2 London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA;

    "If you're looking down on someone, it better be to extend them a hand to lift them up."

    Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.

    Brilliantati©
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there.Posts: 40,789
    edited September 14
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Not all the ones with real jobs and families.  That's my point.  There are way,  way more of us than them. 
    I underestimated the amount of republicans who have been hoodwinked by Trumpism. I used to share your optimism but I seriously did not think we would be 9 months after an insurrection which was built up by Trump lying about losing an election and have so many of these people still put the guy up on a pedestal. It's not just that 30% deplorable base anymore. It is vast majority of republicans now, even the ones who used to be considered reasonable. I thought they'd recognize that he lost them the house, congress, and white house and realize how toxic he was....but nope. They literally all believe he won the election and that it was stolen from him. A large portion of those people also don't believe in vaccines and masks. There is literally nothing you can say to these people to change their minds. They are too far gone.

    I don't even think the economy matters as much because they have shown that they will believe one plus one equals three if the right people tell them so over and over and over again. Look at all the numbskulls who pop in here every now and then who were convinced things started getting better in January of 2017 and then in January of 2021 things all of sudden turned to shit again. I think there area whole more of these people than we originally thought. 
    All this may be true,  but do you think they will really throw it all away? What they believe or say and what they're willing to do are very different.  There's been no unrest since that day. 
    I'm not sure what you mean exactly by "throw it all away." I'm more talking about how they're too far gone to think critically and vote for candidates who are not right wing Trumpian extremists. And I'm not saying these people will all turn violent and shit but I am saying they've already proven they will look the other way and pretend the real ugliness either doesn't exist or that it was really antifa and not Trump supporters. 

    The videos I see on a daily basis of school board meetings and these people yesterday at the Biden/Newsome rally. Things seem to be getting worse pretty quickly and I would not be surprised if more unrest happens sooner than later. There is this dumb thing scheduled for Saturday too...
    I'm talking specifically about revolution, true blood in the street revolution with an overthrow.  A small minority of people causing a ruckus is very different than popular revolution.  That's where this conversation stemmed. 
    I am not sure that will happen per say, at least in terms of huge amounts of people participating. But I do think you are likely to see stuff similar to 1/6 again though. And, just like then, you will see 55% of the country up in arms while the other 45% look the other way...meanwhile you have, what, 15 states quickly trying to change their voting laws to "legally" subvert the will of their voters? 

    The outlook does not look good to me at the moment.




    And to the guy trying to "both sides" this: LOL. As a former republican, I can safely say that is garbage. And it is precisely that kind of behavior that emboldens the wackier extremists of his party to eventually act out like we're talking about here. 

    Notice how he is proving my point about believing one plus one equals three regarding the economy though?
  • Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South PhillyPosts: 14,096
    mrussel1 said:
    JB16057 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    what is fueling it is the fact that nobody, NOBODY has been held accountable. not trump, not gaetz, not gosar, not maggie 3 names, not boebert. none of the people that led the insurrection. also, the insurrectionists that did face justice got slaps on the wrist.

    i heard someone say something like nazism was defeated in ww2. 

    well i guess hitler dying is similar to trump being voted out of office. but the way nazism was defeated was nazi leadership were held accountable, or they committed suicide.

    maga has ashli babbitt now, who is the maga equivalent of horst wessel.

    maga is festering and growing because nobody has been held to account, and it is much of a failure of the doj as it is the fault of trump, flynn, the my pillow guy, fox news, oann, and the people that encouraged the insurrection that i listed earlier.

    with no accountability this is going to get worse.
    I'm with you.  But imagine if they were to be held accountable. I can't imagine the violence and stupidity that would emerge from that.
    Well something's gotta be done. I agree with gimmie, we are cruising straight towards a really bad place.

    I don't know the answer. 
    I see no scenario of some right wing uprising while the economy stays strong.  When you look at popular revolutions, it's all about the economic situation.  Today, too many people have too much to lose.  I don't see that as a risk.  The right wing outrage machine just continues to monetize and milk the anger of a small percentage of the population.  And when a few of them do stupid things, they weep and cry and plead guilty because they realize everything they have lost. 
    the gop is using covid to try to crash the economy. it has maintained itself under biden to this point, but you keep prolonging a pandemic and the economy is going to suffer. that is the gop plan. keep the pandemic going to slow down business through the 2022 election. then blame biden to make the dems lose in 2024.
    I think the fed does too good of a job manipulating the money supply through quantitative easing and other monetary policy that it can effectively cushion falls and juice starts with cheap, plentiful money.  Maybe you all see me as too much of an optimist, but we have too many tools to manage the economy.  Many of the pitfalls in 2008 have been closed.  They are not all gone and certainly there will be bear markets, but not compared to the runaway inflation and unemployment ala Germany in the 20's or the brutal and archaic peasant economy of Russia in the early 20th century. I just don't see it. 
    this is all true, but you are forgetting one thing. hatred goes a long way.

    these people hate liberals more than they love their own family and their country. 

    you keep telling someone how bad things are, ie fox news to their viewers every night, sooner or later more and more and more will believe that message, and the more who believe, the more will act on it. see jan 6.
    Hatred goes both ways though. Take this site for example. There is so much hatred towards the GOP, Conservatives and Republicans and most of it is the same hysterics as what you see on FOX just in reverse. Sure this site doesn't get near the amount of attention but CNN, MSNBC and plenty of other major news outlets spew hatred all day long.

    Something needs to change with the economy. Inflation is out of control right now and I don't see either side of the aisle doing anything about it.

    OH please.  Inflation actually slowed last month and almost all professional economists predicted short term inflation into early next year because of the massive supply chain issues.  But all teh other fundamentals of the economy are perfectly healthy.  Tell me what indicators are you watching that make you say the economy needs to change?  GDP?  Looks great.  Credit quality?  Best in a generation.  Market indexes?  I think you know the answer to that.  And the forecasts for next year look solid too. 
    I love it when people try to apply false equivalencies, both sides-isms, and what-about everything to death.

    That's to the guy you were responding to. As to your point s, I overall agree with you albeit our issues with our country are not in regards to financial markets. Our biggest issues are housing, healthcare, and other social welfare net systems. But that's for another thread.
Sign In or Register to comment.