PJ fans in 12 step Recovery

Thanks, kce!  That song always hits me - humbling river indeed.

Have you ever seen Maynard's Ciquenta performance of this with his son on cello?  Just beautiful.

hedonist said:

Last night, I dreamed I had a drink.  I could see it, feel the heft of the glass, the amber liquid, putting it to my lips.  The warmth of the swallow...not the taste, though.

And then right after, becoming so angry and cursing myself for going back.  "How could you do this?  After all you've gone through, are still going through?  Fucking idiot!"

And on.  Like my world had fallen apart in disappointing myself.

It's the third or so time this has happened and I understand these dreams are "normal" / usually part of the process - even a lifelong one - but man...it was frightening in so many ways.  In the light of morning, not so much.

One of those cases where I'd rather dream than do.

My wife is Five Years , Two Months and 3 days sober from opioids.  She had been on them for over 10 years.

She says she has dreams like this still about once a month or so and same reaction every time that she is so upset with herself in the dream.

I tell her the same thing I say to you , the regret is something that I think you should be really proud of , it shows how much you are committed to being sober.

Keep fighting the good fight my friend.

hedonist said:

Matts3221 said:

hedonist said:

Last night, I dreamed I had a drink.  I could see it, feel the heft of the glass, the amber liquid, putting it to my lips.  The warmth of the swallow...not the taste, though.

And then right after, becoming so angry and cursing myself for going back.  "How could you do this?  After all you've gone through, are still going through?  Fucking idiot!"

And on.  Like my world had fallen apart in disappointing myself.

It's the third or so time this has happened and I understand these dreams are "normal" / usually part of the process - even a lifelong one - but man...it was frightening in so many ways.  In the light of morning, not so much.

One of those cases where I'd rather dream than do.

My wife is Five Years , Two Months and 3 days sober from opioids.  She had been on them for over 10 years.

She says she has dreams like this still about once a month or so and same reaction every time that she is so upset with herself in the dream.

I tell her the same thing I say to you , the regret is something that I think you should be really proud of , it shows how much you are committed to being sober.

Keep fighting the good fight my friend.

Thank you so much.  It's funny, my therapist said the same thing about the dreams and ultimate pledge to myself.

Good on your wife - such a powerful struggle.  I'm sure your journeying with her through this helped in her process.

Often overlooked are the partners such as yourself or my husband or countless others, who suffer from the addiction via a different path and perspective altogether.  

I will never pretend to know what it is like , she still has days were she says it is all she thinks about. She finds going to NA meetings very helpful , hearing someone who is on their first week clean and is counting hours she talks about how she was there and it gives her good feeling to inspire others.

I really feel for people whom don't have a large support group , first and foremost my wife gets all the credit for beating something that is so hard to overcome ( it is a life long struggle but we do celebrate all the time ) however there was a group of 10 or so friends/family whom all came and did whatever had to be done to help her thru it for the first six months.  Those that don't have anyone to rely on for support I cant even imaging how hard it is.

In the end she is fighting the good fight every day and it makes me so happy , there were times it was difficult but I found a group for men that had a spouse or partner whom is going through getting sober , it felt good to talk to other people going thru the same things as me. There was a lot of guilt I felt for having feelings of mistrust or angry , knowing everything she was going thru but I always so support groups are good for everyone.

Thank you for the message back , made my day.

hedonist said:

Matts3221 said:

hedonist said:

Last night, I dreamed I had a drink.  I could see it, feel the heft of the glass, the amber liquid, putting it to my lips.  The warmth of the swallow...not the taste, though.

And then right after, becoming so angry and cursing myself for going back.  "How could you do this?  After all you've gone through, are still going through?  Fucking idiot!"

And on.  Like my world had fallen apart in disappointing myself.

It's the third or so time this has happened and I understand these dreams are "normal" / usually part of the process - even a lifelong one - but man...it was frightening in so many ways.  In the light of morning, not so much.

One of those cases where I'd rather dream than do.

My wife is Five Years , Two Months and 3 days sober from opioids.  She had been on them for over 10 years.

She says she has dreams like this still about once a month or so and same reaction every time that she is so upset with herself in the dream.

I tell her the same thing I say to you , the regret is something that I think you should be really proud of , it shows how much you are committed to being sober.

Keep fighting the good fight my friend.

Thank you so much.  It's funny, my therapist said the same thing about the dreams and ultimate pledge to myself.

Good on your wife - such a powerful struggle.  I'm sure your journeying with her through this helped in her process.

Often overlooked are the partners such as yourself or my husband or countless others, who suffer from the addiction via a different path and perspective altogether.  

There are some great family members and spouses/partners who are going through their own hell and continue to support us addicts which I always admire. My husband (not my son's father) left me when I didn't get sober after a year. We were drinking buddies throughout our relationship but he claimed he went through extreme mental cruelty due to my alcoholism. Love those wedding vows - through sickness and health. That messed me up even more for a bit but when I let it go, I finally got sober. So there, ex-husband.

When I have dreams, there is always a guilt aspect to it - I'm getting caught drinking or I'm at a meeting and someone says they saw me drinking - always that theme. I haven't had a dream in awhile, but they pop up unexpectedly. I have never had a dream where I actually drank and enjoyed it or even was drinking and someone caught me but I had been enjoying it. I'm always interrupted. And I always feel an intense loss for the time I have just lost, in the dream. When I wake up, I am so relieved. 

mickeyrat said:

hedonist said:

Congrats, mickey!

I recently caught two things on TV that really hit home with me, drinking-wise, and the mindset - my mindset - that went with it.  It all stays with you for life, doesn't it?

meaning?

If I understand the question, being an alcoholic I think as an alcoholic. removing the drink doesnt make me a nonalcoholic.

case in point. I live pretty close to a anheuser busch brewery. One day driving to work I had the thought that I wished I was Homer Simpson, in that episode where he fell in to a vat of beer and drank it all in order to escape.  One , Homer is a fucking cartoon. Two, a vat of beer is an awful lot of beer to drink. Three, I identified with an arguably alcoholic CARTOON CHARACTER!!!!!!!  This was somewhere close to 3 years sober.

To this day I express far too much interest in booze. My eye is drawn to it. All the new shit thats been released. flavored whiskey etc..... Being honest, I have been a little wistful about not being able to try it. 
to me this is alcoholic thinking....... as for staying for life? Let you know at my end.....

Yes, to not ever not being an alcoholic, but more how it permeates our (my) thoughts, whether consciously or not.

One of the things I saw on TV was someone who was just getting started drinking for the evening - that happy tipsy feeling.

The other was a woman talking about how when she wasn't sober, her thoughts were consumed by when she could have that first drink.

I could relate to them both...and I can relate to that twinge you mention.  I won't succumb to it - I can't - but I sure do miss it.

hedonist said:

mickeyrat said:

hedonist said:

Congrats, mickey!

I recently caught two things on TV that really hit home with me, drinking-wise, and the mindset - my mindset - that went with it.  It all stays with you for life, doesn't it?

meaning?

If I understand the question, being an alcoholic I think as an alcoholic. removing the drink doesnt make me a nonalcoholic.

case in point. I live pretty close to a anheuser busch brewery. One day driving to work I had the thought that I wished I was Homer Simpson, in that episode where he fell in to a vat of beer and drank it all in order to escape.  One , Homer is a fucking cartoon. Two, a vat of beer is an awful lot of beer to drink. Three, I identified with an arguably alcoholic CARTOON CHARACTER!!!!!!!  This was somewhere close to 3 years sober.

To this day I express far too much interest in booze. My eye is drawn to it. All the new shit thats been released. flavored whiskey etc..... Being honest, I have been a little wistful about not being able to try it. 
to me this is alcoholic thinking....... as for staying for life? Let you know at my end.....

Yes, to not ever not being an alcoholic, but more how it permeates our (my) thoughts, whether consciously or not.

One of the things I saw on TV was someone who was just getting started drinking for the evening - that happy tipsy feeling.

The other was a woman talking about how when she wasn't sober, her thoughts were consumed by when she could have that first drink.

I could relate to them both...and I can relate to that twinge you mention.  I won't succumb to it - I can't - but I sure do miss it.

I remember watching 'The Lost Weekend' early in my sobriety - it's the movie where Jimmy Stewart is an alcoholic - and he has all of his hiding places for his booze, of course, but at one point he is so drunk that he can't find the bottle he had hid earlier in a light fixture. He is freaking out and I could completely relate to him and I found myself actually routing for him to find the bottle. That is the alcoholic in me, and it came out at that moment.  Any time I am watching a TV show or movie and there is an alcoholic as a character, I can completely relate to them.

And @mickeyrat - whenever  I walk into a house, restaurant, etc. I immediately find where the booze is, without thinking about it - it's just a natural reaction for my eyes to search it out and find it.  It's so weird that we all share these behaviors.  But comforting too.

I don't want to drink, which is completely against the alcoholic in me, but I just don't. I did for a long time and was not able to stay sober for any length of time. The pull of alcohol was just too strong.I loved to drink, even when it was obvious it was ruining my life.  But when I finally got sober, the craving went away and I hope to never feel it again. But I know I could wake up one day and it would be there. 

I can never be complacent because that is when the alcoholic in me will start to work on me. I consider being an alcoholic as part of who I am, just like we consider our professions or marital status or nationalities as part of who we are. I am a recovering alcoholic and, hopefully, always will be. But I can fall into unhealthy alcoholic thinking, especially when I am really stressed or overwhelmed and have no way to 'take the edge off', I have to deal with reality all the time and that can be hard sometimes. I usually take a nap when I'm in a bad mind set but sometimes I just have to go through it and find ways to deal with the uncomfortable feelings. 

That is the one thing though that I miss, being able to just kick back and forget my problems for awhile. Unfortunately, most of the time I was incapable of just taking the edge off, once I started drinking, I would just keep drinking till I'd sleep and then deal with hangovers at work. At the very end when I had a breakdown, I just drank all the time, I couldn't deal with life at all. And it took me 3 years to get sober, it was hard.  

It runs in my family and watching your siblings/parent struggle and get sicker is really difficult. Now I worry about my son.  I've lost many friends to this horrible disease. Why I am sober today and someone else isn't or has died from it is something that bothers me. I'm grateful, but it is so hard when you hit that point where you know that nothing you do is going to help. So stay strong my sober friends, I need you guys.

Congrats, Mick, on XIII.