Donald Trump

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  • oftenreading
    oftenreading Victoria, BC Posts: 12,856
    BS44325 said:
    my2hands said:
    When you kill people... especially in this fashion... something tells me they are crazy... unstable... sick... mentally ill... whatever you want to call it... just like the whacks that kill abortion doctors... they are crazy... plenty of pro lifers out there not killing anybody bro... 

    You don't see me shooting anybody do you?  I doubt you're going to shoot Nancy Pelosi anytime soon? 

    When a guy gets fired and goes back and kills someone... do you think it's simply because he was fired? Or just maybe there are underlying causes... Stop being so simplistic brother... you're borderline trolling at this point
    Oh really. You are practicing complete avoidance of some of the rhetoric that appears on this forum every single day. When Dylan Roof murdered a bunch of people his mental illness was the least of anybody's concerns...it was all about the confederate flag and generally the conservatives of South Carolina agreed. Sorry for making you uncomfortable.

    Does Dylan Roof have any significant mental illness that would be a contributing factor to his shootings?

    I disagree with throwing around terms like mental illness to explain any violent event. Often plain old anger and hate suffices.
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  • Gtilley8
    Gtilley8 Detroit Posts: 985
    cincybearcat said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    Please show me the liberal version of the truthers and the birthers claiming the Scalise shooting was a right wing false flag event to take the news cycle off of Trump and/or get the repubs to finally go along with the Dems to seize your guns. The shooter? He doesn't exist as he's not in the phone book.
    N
    The point I made is that the left is becoming intolerant too. You've made this about the leaders and elected officials and your arguments center around it.   That's not what I said.  For the left, the intolerance starts at the grass roots and it is starting to impose its own purity tests.  You saw it here for yourself with the intolerance of Free before he got banned.  That mindset is growing and it risks alienating the moderates in the party. Go to Huffington and read the article entitled "Bill Maher is s dangerous white man". 
    The left has been intolerant.  Both fringes have been for a while and continue to get worse.
    The left is intolerant of going back to 1950's social values. Intolerant of making or enforcing laws regarding religions except for the freedom one gets to worship whatever they please, or nothing at all - and you don't get to impose your views based on those religions in the form of law no matter how much you hate abortion or LGBTs or whatever. And pretty damn intolerant of people who spew hatred or advocate for the two things listed. Riots, and violence aren't OK. To say there's an inherent issue with the left because of what happened at Berkley, as someone mentioned before, is absolutely ridiculous. Coulter and Milo can speak whatever they want, wherever they want, but nowhere does it state they have the right to do it on a college campus. They don't have a right to not get protested against (peacefully). To say there's an inherent issue with the left because of yesterday's shooting is also stupid. That guy was a sick individual and should never have been able to own a gun given his prior record. To say there's an inherent issue with gun laws, on the other hand, is an argument worth having.
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,644
    BS44325 said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    mrussel1 said:
    dignin said:
    Alex Jones is entering the mainstream on the right. The man has the ear of the President, who is also a nutter. The President still has the support of the vast majority of republicans....both the leaders and voters.

    It's a non-contest. The right has gone mainstream crazy. The left has nothing comparable.
     yet that doesn't make the left blameless nor does it mean that it isn't entering a dangerous period.  Just because the left has nothing comparable doesn't mean it doesn't have issues.  It does and we can't be blind to those issues.   The Berkeley situation is a perfect example.  You don't riot because you don't likeAnne Coulters message. 
    Is any talking head on the left still talking about Berkeley? It's the right that won't let it go and if the roles were reversed would be using it as a battle cry. Nothing wrong with being intolerant of intolerance, which is what Anne coulter and her ilk are about, "whites only" should be okay. Fuck that. And her.
    They aren't talking about Berkeley because they have moved on to Evergreen College.
    Please let me know when Liberty University invites the President of Planned Parenthood or a pro-choice advocate to campus and speak.
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,644
    benjs said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    mrussel1 said:
    It happened. I don't care who talks about it and who doesn't.  Think of this as your family and whether you're okay with it or not.  Is it okay jyst because your neighbor is worse? Not in my book.  I don't want my party to just not be as bad as the other one. 
    They're not even close in comparison. Gee, I haven't heard any of the right's condemnation of those idiotic anti-sharia protests that happened. Like sharia law is going to subvert the constitution in this country. WTO, yea that has real world consequences for people and the environment.
    Why do you insist on arguing about everything? All mrussel is stating is that the extreme left should be seen as an entity which needs work, alongside the extreme right. What's so harmful about that? Are the two mutually exclusive, regardless of the magnitude of the work needed on each side?

    If you don't fix the party which would hold substantial power if Trump fails, then this cycle of rising dissent and susceptibility to a person who claims to hold the keys to 100% success will come yet again, and so far the trend isn't ideal. Nixon, Bush, Trump... who comes next if the DNC doesn't have their shit together and seize control?

    Bipartisan demands for accountability must exist for a sustainable system in America. Ego shouldn't come into the picture, and if it means criticizing your own party so the other party can learn how to hold your own accountable, why not?
    When Louis Farrakhan, for lack of a better comparison to Trump or maybe Anothny Weiner, becomes the Dems' presidential nominee, then your argument would hold water. I'm insisting the parties and their respective apparatuses are not comparable, not even close. I'm sick of tired of it always being the libs that have to move more toward the middle as the right continues, as evidenced by the last 40 years resulting Trump continues to move further right. Fuck that and its time they start singing a different tune. I'm sorry you don't see that. And there you go with your holier than thou why are you arguing statement. I'm disagreeing with mRussell vociferously. If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen or stop reading the forum. Get over yourself.
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  • dignin
    dignin Posts: 9,478
    BS44325 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    BS44325 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    BS44325 said:
    Kat said:
    Evil is not too strong a word any longer.

    Yes it is. As a moderator you should at a minimum know that.
    Oh please. What, is it beyond your scope of perception to understand that the POTUS could be evil?? It's not like it's beyond the realm of reason, and all evidence points towards it. Also, I'm pretty sure moderators are allowed to have opinions too.
    After today of all days are you still ok with using the term "evil"? It is that kind of talk that leads stupid people to do violent things in the name of justice. 
    Yes, I'm still okay with calling evil people evil. Nothing will ever change that. So I gather from your question that you think people should ignore evil or pretend it isn't there in order to pander to insane people so that they don't go on a shooting rampage? You act as though I (and Kat I suppose) are using the word evil as hyperbole. I don't know about Kat, but I wasn't. I think it is fucking ludicrous that you think people calling a spade a spade is to blame for a terrorist attack, lol.
    At least you're honest about it...but sorry...that line of speaking is responsible and you are a contributor to the cesspool that radicalized this man. When someone is "evil" or "parallel hitler" then it becomes very easy for a normal person to act violently to stop that "evil".
    That is ridiculous.
  • MayDay10
    MayDay10 Posts: 11,862
    There is certainly way too much division, and it goes both ways....  I will say though that the "Right" started it and also are the ones who have taken it too far, which is why we are here in the first place with a reality star sitting as POTUS.

    There was your typical back and forth fights in the Reagan and Clinton administrations, but for the most part people worked together and so did politicians.

    Bush was in office and had like an 85% approval rate on the heels of 911.  The handling of the military action, and some other gaffes such as Katrina and tanking the economy on the back of deregulation brought on a lot of justified criticism.  The Republicans couldnt even bring him out on the campaign trail.

    Then Obama takes over, and Republicans felt the need to 'get even' and the criticism was there from day 1, even though, most of the time, there was nothing to criticize.  He did a pretty good job and was dignified as President, even navigating an extremely partisan and venomous Republican congress.  

    Now we have Donald fucking Trump in there.  He deserves criticism.  People I know who are Republicans hated him until he got the nomination, and suddenly support him because he is on 'their team'.  I also know R's who still are true and cant stand him.  They have invented something called "fake news", which gives them license to deny any fact they please, and people buy in.  That is scary.  They deny science and progress.  They are pushing an extreme-right agenda, in the face of a "mandate" of not even winning the popular vote.  It is safe to say, most people do not want this swing in climate change, health care, planned parenthood, de-regulation, etc...  Just show a little bit of moderation.  His inauguration speech basically amounted to "neener-neener I won".  He appears to have mental illness, which is also scary.

    If this were John Kasich in there, Rubio, Jeb Bush, Romney.... and people and media were acting this way, sure... it is not good.  Donald Trump is president though.  It makes our country an international disgrace.  
  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    mrussel1 said:
    The far left is just as dangerous as the far right.  I know that's trite but it plays out over and over.  The left is trying to eat its own with Bill Maher as we speak.  It's intolerant in its demand for tolerance.  Something has to change and we need to own it on both sides. 
    Give me the left's equivalent of Reagan's location of an announcement to run for president location, please?
    We're not talking about 1979 and Selma.  
    No, but we are talking about Philadelphia, Mississippi and how one side since 1980 has used divisiveness and dog whistles, particularly the demonization of the other side to whip up fear and anger in their base with sometimes violent rhetoric.
    Whipping up fear and anger?

    https://youtu.be/5IuJGHuIkzY

    How soon we forget. This behaviour is party sanctioned.
  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,644
    BS44325 said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    mrussel1 said:
    The far left is just as dangerous as the far right.  I know that's trite but it plays out over and over.  The left is trying to eat its own with Bill Maher as we speak.  It's intolerant in its demand for tolerance.  Something has to change and we need to own it on both sides. 
    Give me the left's equivalent of Reagan's location of an announcement to run for president location, please?
    We're not talking about 1979 and Selma.  
    No, but we are talking about Philadelphia, Mississippi and how one side since 1980 has used divisiveness and dog whistles, particularly the demonization of the other side to whip up fear and anger in their base with sometimes violent rhetoric.
    Whipping up fear and anger?

    https://youtu.be/5IuJGHuIkzY

    How soon we forget. This behaviour is party sanctioned.
    Unsung, was that your post?
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,644
    dignin said:
    BS44325 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    BS44325 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    BS44325 said:
    Kat said:
    Evil is not too strong a word any longer.

    Yes it is. As a moderator you should at a minimum know that.
    Oh please. What, is it beyond your scope of perception to understand that the POTUS could be evil?? It's not like it's beyond the realm of reason, and all evidence points towards it. Also, I'm pretty sure moderators are allowed to have opinions too.
    After today of all days are you still ok with using the term "evil"? It is that kind of talk that leads stupid people to do violent things in the name of justice. 
    Yes, I'm still okay with calling evil people evil. Nothing will ever change that. So I gather from your question that you think people should ignore evil or pretend it isn't there in order to pander to insane people so that they don't go on a shooting rampage? You act as though I (and Kat I suppose) are using the word evil as hyperbole. I don't know about Kat, but I wasn't. I think it is fucking ludicrous that you think people calling a spade a spade is to blame for a terrorist attack, lol.
    At least you're honest about it...but sorry...that line of speaking is responsible and you are a contributor to the cesspool that radicalized this man. When someone is "evil" or "parallel hitler" then it becomes very easy for a normal person to act violently to stop that "evil".
    That is ridiculous.
    What was his 10C #? Did I move up in the lottery?
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  • Halifax2TheMax
    Halifax2TheMax Posts: 42,644
    GWB, "if you're not with us, you're with the terrorists." Please show me the liberal equivalent.
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  • dignin
    dignin Posts: 9,478
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    dignin said:
    BS44325 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    BS44325 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    BS44325 said:
    Kat said:
    Evil is not too strong a word any longer.

    Yes it is. As a moderator you should at a minimum know that.
    Oh please. What, is it beyond your scope of perception to understand that the POTUS could be evil?? It's not like it's beyond the realm of reason, and all evidence points towards it. Also, I'm pretty sure moderators are allowed to have opinions too.
    After today of all days are you still ok with using the term "evil"? It is that kind of talk that leads stupid people to do violent things in the name of justice. 
    Yes, I'm still okay with calling evil people evil. Nothing will ever change that. So I gather from your question that you think people should ignore evil or pretend it isn't there in order to pander to insane people so that they don't go on a shooting rampage? You act as though I (and Kat I suppose) are using the word evil as hyperbole. I don't know about Kat, but I wasn't. I think it is fucking ludicrous that you think people calling a spade a spade is to blame for a terrorist attack, lol.
    At least you're honest about it...but sorry...that line of speaking is responsible and you are a contributor to the cesspool that radicalized this man. When someone is "evil" or "parallel hitler" then it becomes very easy for a normal person to act violently to stop that "evil".
    That is ridiculous.
    What was his 10C #? Did I move up in the lottery?
    Haha, post of the day.
  • Smellyman
    Smellyman Asia Posts: 4,528
    Reminds me of the left vs. right in the media.  Yes Rachel Maddow is left, but uses facts and reason in her discourse.  The right has pick your nut.  Jones?  Hannity?  Beck?  Breitbart? etc.  They use neither facts or reason and their lapdogs suck it up.  Yet right thinks that makes it equal...


    They are not comparable. 
  • Kat
    Kat Posts: 4,973
    edited June 2017
    PJ_Soul said:
    BS44325 said:
    PJ_Soul said:
    BS44325 said:
    Kat said:
    Evil is not too strong a word any longer.

    Yes it is. As a moderator you should at a minimum know that.
    Oh please. What, is it beyond your scope of perception to understand that the POTUS could be evil?? It's not like it's beyond the realm of reason, and all evidence points towards it. Also, I'm pretty sure moderators are allowed to have opinions too.
    After today of all days are you still ok with using the term "evil"? It is that kind of talk that leads stupid people to do violent things in the name of justice. 
    Yes, I'm still okay with calling evil people evil. Nothing will ever change that. So I gather from your question that you think people should ignore evil or pretend it isn't there in order to pander to insane people so that they don't go on a shooting rampage? You act as though I (and Kat I suppose) are using the word evil as hyperbole. I don't know about Kat, but I wasn't. I think it is fucking ludicrous that you think people calling a spade a spade is to blame for a terrorist attack, lol.
    It wasn't hyperbole with me either. I was very specific about the straw that made me decide he was evil. Anyone who victimizes children is nothing less in my humble opinion. This is my previous post on the topic and I'll repost it anytime it's necessary because it says it all. Oh, and anyone who thinks it's ok to take a gun after people who are evil has mental health issues, another reason for the government to stop screwing with health care so people can get the help they need. 

    Previous post from page 115: Repeating the above: Donald Trump cut off medical funds to nephew's sick baby because he was 'angry' over family feud

    Let's get the context in here on why I think our president is evil. This isn't the only reason but it was the straw for me. Anyone who victimizes children is EVIL....completely freaking evil -- and that's how I feel and will always feel. 

    Feel free to defend what you like...discussion is a good thing but I find this indefensible...imho. Now have a beautiful day.
    Post edited by Kat on
    Falling down,...not staying down
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,880
    Gtilley8 said:
    cincybearcat said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    Please show me the liberal version of the truthers and the birthers claiming the Scalise shooting was a right wing false flag event to take the news cycle off of Trump and/or get the repubs to finally go along with the Dems to seize your guns. The shooter? He doesn't exist as he's not in the phone book.
    N
    The point I made is that the left is becoming intolerant too. You've made this about the leaders and elected officials and your arguments center around it.   That's not what I said.  For the left, the intolerance starts at the grass roots and it is starting to impose its own purity tests.  You saw it here for yourself with the intolerance of Free before he got banned.  That mindset is growing and it risks alienating the moderates in the party. Go to Huffington and read the article entitled "Bill Maher is s dangerous white man". 
    The left has been intolerant.  Both fringes have been for a while and continue to get worse.
    The left is intolerant of going back to 1950's social values. Intolerant of making or enforcing laws regarding religions except for the freedom one gets to worship whatever they please, or nothing at all - and you don't get to impose your views based on those religions in the form of law no matter how much you hate abortion or LGBTs or whatever. And pretty damn intolerant of people who spew hatred or advocate for the two things listed. Riots, and violence aren't OK. To say there's an inherent issue with the left because of what happened at Berkley, as someone mentioned before, is absolutely ridiculous. Coulter and Milo can speak whatever they want, wherever they want, but nowhere does it state they have the right to do it on a college campus. They don't have a right to not get protested against (peacefully). To say there's an inherent issue with the left because of yesterday's shooting is also stupid. That guy was a sick individual and should never have been able to own a gun given his prior record. To say there's an inherent issue with gun laws, on the other hand, is an argument worth having.
    I should have clarified. I'm taking about the extreme left and the extreme right.  And I don't include all protestors in the "extreme" category.

    but the reality is that the vocal fringes of each party haven't been tolerant for a long time. 
    hippiemom = goodness
  • cincybearcat
    cincybearcat Posts: 16,880
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    BS44325 said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    mrussel1 said:
    dignin said:
    Alex Jones is entering the mainstream on the right. The man has the ear of the President, who is also a nutter. The President still has the support of the vast majority of republicans....both the leaders and voters.

    It's a non-contest. The right has gone mainstream crazy. The left has nothing comparable.
     yet that doesn't make the left blameless nor does it mean that it isn't entering a dangerous period.  Just because the left has nothing comparable doesn't mean it doesn't have issues.  It does and we can't be blind to those issues.   The Berkeley situation is a perfect example.  You don't riot because you don't likeAnne Coulters message. 
    Is any talking head on the left still talking about Berkeley? It's the right that won't let it go and if the roles were reversed would be using it as a battle cry. Nothing wrong with being intolerant of intolerance, which is what Anne coulter and her ilk are about, "whites only" should be okay. Fuck that. And her.
    They aren't talking about Berkeley because they have moved on to Evergreen College.
    Please let me know when Liberty University invites the President of Planned Parenthood or a pro-choice advocate to campus and speak.
    So that's who you want to be? Like Liberty u?  AIm higher.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Kat
    Kat Posts: 4,973
    REMINDER: Do not talk about other members...stick to the discussion. Post has been removed.


    Falling down,...not staying down
  • Gern Blansten
    Gern Blansten Mar-A-Lago Posts: 22,460
    Smellyman said:
    Reminds me of the left vs. right in the media.  Yes Rachel Maddow is left, but uses facts and reason in her discourse.  The right has pick your nut.  Jones?  Hannity?  Beck?  Breitbart? etc.  They use neither facts or reason and their lapdogs suck it up.  Yet right thinks that makes it equal...


    They are not comparable. 
    Exactly.  Fox News has probably been the worst thing to happen to this country.
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
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  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    BS44325 said:
    Halifax2TheMax said:
    mrussel1 said:
    dignin said:
    Alex Jones is entering the mainstream on the right. The man has the ear of the President, who is also a nutter. The President still has the support of the vast majority of republicans....both the leaders and voters.

    It's a non-contest. The right has gone mainstream crazy. The left has nothing comparable.
     yet that doesn't make the left blameless nor does it mean that it isn't entering a dangerous period.  Just because the left has nothing comparable doesn't mean it doesn't have issues.  It does and we can't be blind to those issues.   The Berkeley situation is a perfect example.  You don't riot because you don't likeAnne Coulters message. 
    Is any talking head on the left still talking about Berkeley? It's the right that won't let it go and if the roles were reversed would be using it as a battle cry. Nothing wrong with being intolerant of intolerance, which is what Anne coulter and her ilk are about, "whites only" should be okay. Fuck that. And her.
    They aren't talking about Berkeley because they have moved on to Evergreen College.
    Please let me know when Liberty University invites the President of Planned Parenthood or a pro-choice advocate to campus and speak.
    I assume you mean other then Trump?
  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124

    MayDay10 said:
    There is certainly way too much division, and it goes both ways....  I will say though that the "Right" started it and also are the ones who have taken it too far, which is why we are here in the first place with a reality star sitting as POTUS.

    There was your typical back and forth fights in the Reagan and Clinton administrations, but for the most part people worked together and so did politicians.

    Bush was in office and had like an 85% approval rate on the heels of 911.  The handling of the military action, and some other gaffes such as Katrina and tanking the economy on the back of deregulation brought on a lot of justified criticism.  The Republicans couldnt even bring him out on the campaign trail.

    Then Obama takes over, and Republicans felt the need to 'get even' and the criticism was there from day 1, even though, most of the time, there was nothing to criticize.  He did a pretty good job and was dignified as President, even navigating an extremely partisan and venomous Republican congress.  

    Now we have Donald fucking Trump in there.  He deserves criticism.  People I know who are Republicans hated him until he got the nomination, and suddenly support him because he is on 'their team'.  I also know R's who still are true and cant stand him.  They have invented something called "fake news", which gives them license to deny any fact they please, and people buy in.  That is scary.  They deny science and progress.  They are pushing an extreme-right agenda, in the face of a "mandate" of not even winning the popular vote.  It is safe to say, most people do not want this swing in climate change, health care, planned parenthood, de-regulation, etc...  Just show a little bit of moderation.  His inauguration speech basically amounted to "neener-neener I won".  He appears to have mental illness, which is also scary.

    If this were John Kasich in there, Rubio, Jeb Bush, Romney.... and people and media were acting this way, sure... it is not good.  Donald Trump is president though.  It makes our country an international disgrace.  
    I love how you gloss over Bush and Cheney being compared to Hitler...followed by McCain/Palin...followed by Romney/Ryan. Every conservative candidate since 2000 has been compared to hitler at some point, has been called a racist, has been accused of pushing granny over a cliff. This rhetoric extends down to the republican voter as well...the tea-party is labelled racist, the deplorable are labelled racist. This is done over and over again and not once do any of you demonstrate the self-awareness in realizing how destructive it is. Repealing and replacing Obamacare is not seen as an attempt to improve the system but is seen as stripping health care away and the literal killing of people. People who want to debate science are accused of "denying science"...the word denier is specifically chosen to compare it to holocaust denial which is understood to be an ultimate evil. Everything you have written is absolute nonsense and you really need to look in the mirror. No previous education secretary needed a 1 million dollar per month security detail but Betsy DeVos for some reason does.

    https://youtu.be/ci5kBbxthtg

    But who cares..."The right started it".


  • BS44325
    BS44325 Posts: 6,124
    Gern Blansten said:
    Smellyman said:
    Reminds me of the left vs. right in the media.  Yes Rachel Maddow is left, but uses facts and reason in her discourse.  The right has pick your nut.  Jones?  Hannity?  Beck?  Breitbart? etc.  They use neither facts or reason and their lapdogs suck it up.  Yet right thinks that makes it equal...


    They are not comparable. 
    Exactly.  Fox News has probably been the worst thing to happen to this country.
    Yes. Alternative view points must not be tolerated. Life would be so much better with only one approved news source. Just like in Russia...wait...what are we talking about?
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