Whats going wrong with the world? More shootings

redrock · August 2012

pandora wrote:

From the one you dismissed you didn't read it did you? caught ya!

http://www.varioustopics.com/anthropolo ... -guns.html

Umm... caught me?

Lorne Gunter
Columnist, Edmonton Journal
Editorial Board Member, National Post

You caught me at what? A columnist giving her opinion? Yeah... I stopped reading halfway down when I noticed it was rubbish. So you like to requote this but only partially. Good on you.

I have you the Home Office official statistics.

Columnist.... Home Office official stats... .Hmmmm.... which is opinion (which a poster would like to present as fact) and which is validated? No brainer here again.

pandora · August 2012

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

pandora wrote:

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

Pandora: what makes your miss ruby more important or have more rights than Matthew Leach?

Miss Ruby was protecting her life and in the process stopped and sent to prison two thugs
you go Miss Ruby!

The Police Officer clearly was not behaving responsibly and is even presumed to be drunk
as was presumed of the victim :wtf: I would say both tragic and irresponsible.

How can you even compare the two?

You would have poor Miss Ruby dead at the hands of two strong young men
because someone behaves irresponsibly? Why? Why should she lose her life
because of someone else's horrible and foolish mistake?

Do you value her life? cause your comments lead some to believe maybe not so much...
calling her ordeal nonsense...
funny to me being drunk with a gun is nonsense as is comparing the two incidents.

We can not take rights away from the thoughtful because of the thoughtless.

how can you say the police officer was not behaving responsibly? were you there? he behaved the exact same way as Ruby did! he was protecting himself! had he been drunk and killed an actual intruder and not his son, you would be applauding this guy!

I value all human life, which I have stated time and time again. Death penalty thread, this thread. I value human life more than you do, which actually is a FACT, because you stated ad nauseum that anyone who tries to victimize another derserves to be killed. I personally do not believe this. So don't question my valuation life.

Why don't YOU value the human lives of those killed by what you call irresponsible gun owners? you mentioned nothing of Matthew Leach. You just chastized his father. You think those lives are just collateral damage as long as people get to keep their guns???

has a responsible gun owner NEVER had an accident?

no I don't applaud drunk people with guns... do you?

I believe one has the right to save their own life when their life is threatened.
Do you?

I am against the death penalty.

I think thoughtful people who are responsible should be allowed to own a gun
to protect their lives and that of their loved ones.

I think in this case thoughtless people who are irresponsible
made their own destiny with their actions
and thoughtful people should not be punished for that.

Have responsible drivers ever had an accident?
Or were they texting, drunk, speeding, changing the radio? etc ...
That is debatable also isn't it?
Accidents the word itself is debatable.

Hugh Freaking Dillon · August 2012

pandora wrote:

Have responsible drivers ever had an accident?
Or were they texting, drunk, speeding, changing the radio? etc ...
That is debatable also isn't it?
Accidents the word itself is debatable.

um, of course responsible drivers get into accidents. that's why they are called ACCIDENTS. how can you say that word itself is debatable? what does that even mean?

so what you are saying is everyone is responsible until they have an accident, which then classifies them irresponsible. which we could then surmise that everyone is potentially irresponsible.

Hugh Freaking Dillon · August 2012

pandora wrote:

You would have poor Miss Ruby dead at the hands of two strong young men
because someone behaves irresponsibly? Why? Why should she lose her life
because of someone else's horrible and foolish mistake?

I thought you admonished others for making what-if statements in this thread. you presume time and again that ruby would have died. you don't know that anymore than anyone else does.

Snakeduck · August 2012

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

pandora wrote:

We need guns to protect life
guns to take lives,
guns save lives.

the contradiction here is staggering.

Aren't jesus loving gun nuts the epitome of a walking contradiction?

pandora · August 2012

redrock wrote:

pandora wrote:

From the one you dismissed you didn't read it did you? caught ya!

http://www.varioustopics.com/anthropolo ... -guns.html

Umm... caught me?

Lorne Gunter
Columnist, Edmonton Journal
Editorial Board Member, National Post

You caught me at what? A columnist giving her opinion? Yeah... I stopped reading halfway down when I noticed it was rubbish. So you like to requote this. Good on you.

I have you the Home Office official statistics.

Columnist.... Home Office official stats... .Hmmmm.... which is opinion (which a poster would like to present as fact) and which is validated? No brainer here again.

Ok so you asked for the link but you had it already commented on it and dismissed it ...
who's on first :?

oh rubbish?

really why cause it doesn't agree with your opinion?

Is that good debate form?

If someone did that to your contributions would you consider that characteristic of a narrow mind?
Not listening to the other opinions?

redrock · August 2012

Snakeduck wrote:

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

pandora wrote:

We need guns to protect life
guns to take lives,
guns save lives.

the contradiction here is staggering.

Aren't jesus loving gun nuts the epitome of a walking contradiction?

Snakeduck...you're a nutter (in a nice way!)

Cosmo · August 2012

pandora wrote:

redrock wrote:

As said many times before, opinions are absolutely fine but please do not present them as non-biaised and facts.

And yes... anyone can wiki stuff, but where does that come in with my links? My stats come from 'the horse's mouth'. I haven't posted anything from Wiki - or are you getting me confused with someone else again? I seem to remember you like to use Wiki.

When my links were not neutral, I have stated it, when they were valid, I have also stated it. As it should be.

And when it comes to stats and studies - of course one manipulates data. That's why it is known that one needs to look at the source data and not 'reported' data. Therefore validity of sources is important if one is to quote those kind of things. Unless, obviously, one presents these 'reported' studies or blogs or columns as opinions, which they are. Then they are read as such. Analysis and critical thinking. No problems there.

So... where does this last 'thought' come from? Maybe we could have a link so we can get the whole picture?

The land of the free.... yes.... of course. Kid yourself.

From the one you dismissed you didn't read it did you? caught ya!

http://www.varioustopics.com/anthropolo ... -guns.html

...
I read the article... it said this:
"It is entirely likely that some of the increase in the past five years has stemmed from an increased confidence among criminals that ordinary citizens almost certainly have no guns in their homes.

But it is unlikely the handgun ban accounts for all or even most of the increase. France has had a similar upward spike in robberies over the past five years without banning guns. France, too, now has a violent crime rate at or above the Americans', with the exception of murder. "

pandora · August 2012

Snakeduck wrote:

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

pandora wrote:

We need guns to protect life
guns to take lives,
guns save lives.

the contradiction here is staggering.

Aren't jesus loving gun nuts the epitome of a walking contradiction?

Not for me I guess, not a Christian ...

eMMI · August 2012

pandora wrote:

Oh please not another sympathizer with the victimizers really?

They are two young thugs entering an 89 year old women's house, breaking in the door as she slept...
Do you know how easy it is to hurt a little old lady?
I guess we could take the gun away and see what shape was in in the end...
I think not! In fact there was another local lady no way to protect herself,
both little arms broken, blackened eyes, she got off easy huh? :fp:

What is of value is life and why we must protect it. It is criminals who do not value life
they are parasites to life itself.

We need guns to protect life because criminals have guns to take lives,
guns save lives.

I was just wondering why you seemed so quick to assume the very worst.

They did knock first you know, only broke down the door when there was no answer, seems to me they were wanting Ruby's stuff more than her life. Not all criminals are murderers. I know we'll never know, just wondering.

I know the value of life and I cannot believe people truly believe that the way to protect it is to introduce more and more means to take it away (in this case, guns) to more and more people.

Cosmo · August 2012

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

pandora wrote:

You would have poor Miss Ruby dead at the hands of two strong young men
because someone behaves irresponsibly? Why? Why should she lose her life
because of someone else's horrible and foolish mistake?

I thought you admonished others for making what-if statements in this thread. you presume time and again that ruby would have died. you don't know that anymore than anyone else does.

...
Miss Ruby has become the Snooki of this thread. Her 15 minutes were over about a week ago.

Hugh Freaking Dillon · August 2012

pandora wrote:

I believe one has the right to save their own life when their life is threatened.
Do you?

I have no issue with someone having a gun in their HOUSE for their protection. this does not affect me in the least. I have an issue with the lax gun laws that allow ANY human, good guy or bad guy, to be able to get guns, as many guns as they want, at any calibre they want, and go unnoticed.

Yes, I have stated I do not like guns. I think in a perfect world there would be no guns. Guns make absolutely no sense to me. It's another retarded human invention. Like anything that is built for the sole purpose of harming another human for personal gain. If someone wants to shoot themself or their loved ones in the privacy of their own home, by all means, go nuts. But don't bring your gun where I might be or my children might be and put me in potentially harm's way.

if someone were to open fire on me and my kids in a mall or a movie theatre, there is ZERO chance that some vigilante packing heat getting coffee would save the day.

pandora · August 2012

Cosmo wrote:

pandora wrote:

redrock wrote:

As said many times before, opinions are absolutely fine but please do not present them as non-biaised and facts.

And yes... anyone can wiki stuff, but where does that come in with my links? My stats come from 'the horse's mouth'. I haven't posted anything from Wiki - or are you getting me confused with someone else again? I seem to remember you like to use Wiki.

When my links were not neutral, I have stated it, when they were valid, I have also stated it. As it should be.

And when it comes to stats and studies - of course one manipulates data. That's why it is known that one needs to look at the source data and not 'reported' data. Therefore validity of sources is important if one is to quote those kind of things. Unless, obviously, one presents these 'reported' studies or blogs or columns as opinions, which they are. Then they are read as such. Analysis and critical thinking. No problems there.

So... where does this last 'thought' come from? Maybe we could have a link so we can get the whole picture?

The land of the free.... yes.... of course. Kid yourself.

From the one you dismissed you didn't read it did you? caught ya!

http://www.varioustopics.com/anthropolo ... -guns.html

...
I read the article... it said this:
"It is entirely likely that some of the increase in the past five years has stemmed from an increased confidence among criminals that ordinary citizens almost certainly have no guns in their homes.

But it is unlikely the handgun ban accounts for all or even most of the increase. France has had a similar upward spike in robberies over the past five years without banning guns. France, too, now has a violent crime rate at or above the Americans', with the exception of murder. "

Why I called it unbiased ...

but that was dismissed also because somebody wouldn't read an article
from an opposite opinion :fp:

I thought it was a pretty good one for everybody ...

redrock · August 2012

pandora wrote:

Ok so you asked for the link but you had it already commented on it and dismissed it ...
who's on first :?

oh rubbish?

really why cause it doesn't agree with your opinion?

Is that good debate form?

If someone did that to your contributions would you consider that characteristic of a narrow mind?
Not listening to the other opinions?

No.... the post was discussing sources. When one quotes, one sources.

Rubbish because incorrect, non referenced facts. I gave the facts - compare the two. Then debate. But I think your meaning of debate is not the same as most here.

Narrow mind.. ooOOoo... I do admire your way of twisting things

OK... enough of this. I (and others) have explained in so many ways the difference between facts and presenting opinion as facts. Until one understands that....

pandora · August 2012

Cosmo wrote:

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

pandora wrote:

You would have poor Miss Ruby dead at the hands of two strong young men
because someone behaves irresponsibly? Why? Why should she lose her life
because of someone else's horrible and foolish mistake?

I thought you admonished others for making what-if statements in this thread. you presume time and again that ruby would have died. you don't know that anymore than anyone else does.

...
Miss Ruby has become the Snooki of this thread. Her 15 minutes were over about a week ago.

Hey I didn't mention her until others brought her back up...

wonder why they keep doing that

Hugh Freaking Dillon · August 2012

pandora wrote:

Snakeduck wrote:

Aren't jesus loving gun nuts the epitome of a walking contradiction?

Not for me I guess, not a Christian ...

:fp:

Snakeduck · August 2012

redrock wrote:

Snakeduck...you're a nutter (in a nice way!)

I'm probably wrong about things seeing as how I just discovered the long lost 11th commandment. It reads - Thou Shall Not Take Any Shit Off Anyone Lest Though Whip Out Thine AR-15 And Smoke Some Fools

norm · August 2012

Snakeduck wrote:

redrock wrote:

Snakeduck...you're a nutter (in a nice way!)

I'm probably wrong about things seeing as how I just discovered the long lost 11th commandment. It reads - Thou Shall Not Take Any Shit Off Anyone Lest Though Whip Out Thine AR-15 And Smoke Some Fools

didn't hancock add that?

just wanted to post hancock

JonnyPistachio · August 2012

Hugh Freaking Dillon wrote:

pandora wrote:

We need guns to protect life
guns to take lives,
guns save lives.

the contradiction here is staggering.

You know what? I keep hearing all this more guns will help bonanza insanity, and It occurred to me suddenly why I am interested in this topic. As much as I think we could prevent certain gun mishaps, I also think at the root of the problem is that the first instant people feel uneasy, they arm themselves to the teeth. I was there once myself. I contemplated for years about getting a gun. I've lived in terrible places and been robbed with guns. But im alive and well and I feel much better knowing I didnt give into that American way. In the times i've been threatened, a gun wouldve never been useful as I never wouldve had an opportunity to use it without creating a disaster. It might have given me a piece of mind to sleep at night, but that's it really. I had friends offer me guns for free on several occasions. It was a tough decision, but I feel much better without it now.

Also, as far as big cities with high crime like DC, I saw this:
Many criminologists say cultural, economic and demographic factors play a big role in murder rates, and some say the number of guns and the number of murders may well be uncorrelated.

Hugh Freaking Dillon · August 2012

pandora wrote:

Hey I didn't mention her until others brought her back up...

wonder why they keep doing that

when did you stop mentioning her????

Whats going wrong with the world? More shootings

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