Jesus and Eddie: someone has to say it

africastickman wrote:

I am not interested in getting involved in an argument about religion. I believe in God, you don't. My prerogative and yours.

I just want to add one thing, use it - don't use it:

On the 22 June 2006 Live at the Gorge disc there is a version of Black in which he sings:
I take a walk outside
I'm surrounded by.....God
I can feel His laughter
so why do I sear?

Co-incidence?

robcascie wrote:

MEGATRON wrote:

Eddie Vedder is perfect in his imperfection

Anyway, I don't believe in God or Jesus or Budda or whatever, and I couldn't care less about the religious inclination of Eddie and the band

africastickman wrote:

walkthehemisphere

God bless you man. I am also a Christian jammer. Whatever Eddie is, he has said himself that he wants the lyrics to mean to you what they mean to you - he doesn't want to prescribe a meaning/s.

I can see Christ in Given to fly too so if the shoe fits, wear it and revel in the feeling it gives your particular foot.

Please bring Pearl Jam to South Africa

satansbed wrote:

its not disturbing at all........ just because the majority believe something doesnt make it right. then it would be okay for the germans to be anti semites in the forties.

Devote Myself wrote:

Gern Blansten wrote:

First, the scientific community (great majority) does not support an intelligent creator. That is a thought that for whatever reason has been accepted by you but it is false.

Second, I'm not sure where you got 8% but it is much higher than that. In the USA it is more like 15% that either claim to be atheist or agnostic. In Europe this % is much higher...

Just want to clarify that:

It is widely believed, even in the scientific community it's gaining ground that there is an intelligent creator of earth and life as we know it.

"Gaining ground" doesn't mean the majority. It means that people in the scientific community are beginning to break out of the macro-evolution box that they've been forced into by others (think wealthy) who benefit financially from the belief (in macro-evolution). If you're here by accident, your life really has no purpose other than to make money to buy things. (all those in the NY stock exchange cheer wildly). So those at the head of the machine force feed this belief to the public, keeping them peacefully in ignorance and "empowered" by an , 'i can do whatever i want' attitude. Thank God some people aren't afraid to stand up to this.

2)Only about 8% of the U.S. claims atheism.

You included agnostics in your argument, but the 8% is in reference to atheists only. Agnostics do believe in something...they just don't know what to call it! :-) And the 8% is generous. Some polls say less than 5%.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_atheism


Thats awesome! Thanks for sharing!

I think God shines through in many many songs.

Devote Myself wrote:

dcfaithful wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds to me like you're saying that only people of a faith are intelligent...

Stand corrected then. " most intelligent thinking people" should be able to read that and surmise that it is a generalization.

satansbed wrote:

just no..... your first point is just plain wrong

Have you ever looked into it? Well, hear is an article you should read:

http://www.poststar.com/articles/2009/0 ... 600610.txt

excerpt from above article:

Ignored in the story is the long list of scientists who hold religious views similar to Dr. Collins. Do the secularists demand an oath of atheism before people are deemed respectable scientists? We have seen the results of non-faith carried to its extreme in the Nazi laboratory of Josef Mengele and other "scientists" unconstrained by a higher authority.

(and)

Dr. Collins sees no conflict between science and faith. In 2007, he said this at the National Prayer Breakfast in Washington: "...in the scientific community there is often an unwritten taboo about discussing one’s spiritual leanings, so many assume that scientists are generally godless materialists. That’s not actually true — a recent survey found that 40 percent of working scientists believe in a God to whom one may pray in expectation of an answer. And that number has changed very little over the past century."

Also, not all people who believe in God are simply afraid of death or how the world will end. I'm sure some do fit this description, but that shouldn't define a believer or their motive. Some people have simply seen the amazing complexity of life around them, realized that it couldn't have happened by chance, and humble themselves to realize there is a higher force at work than random mutation (which is a dead end anyway). Why is that so hard to believe? And why do people always want to fight it?

Devote Myself wrote:

dcfaithful wrote:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds to me like you're saying that only people of a faith are intelligent...

Stand corrected then. " most intelligent thinking people" should be able to read that and surmise that it is a generalization.

satansbed wrote:

just no..... your first point is just plain wrong

Have you ever looked into it? Well, hear is an article you should read:

http://www.poststar.com/articles/2009/0 ... 600610.txt

excerpt from above article:

Ignored in the story is the long list of scientists who hold religious views similar to Dr. Collins. Do the secularists demand an oath of atheism before people are deemed respectable scientists? We have seen the results of non-faith carried to its extreme in the Nazi laboratory of Josef Mengele and other "scientists" unconstrained by a higher authority.

(and)

Dr. Collins sees no conflict between science and faith. In 2007, he said this at the National Prayer Breakfast in Washington: "...in the scientific community there is often an unwritten taboo about discussing one’s spiritual leanings, so many assume that scientists are generally godless materialists. That’s not actually true — a recent survey found that 40 percent of working scientists believe in a God to whom one may pray in expectation of an answer. And that number has changed very little over the past century."

Also, not all people who believe in God are simply afraid of death or how the world will end. I'm sure some do fit this description, but that shouldn't define a believer or their motive. Some people have simply seen the amazing complexity of life around them, realized that it couldn't have happened by chance, and humble themselves to realize there is a higher force at work than random mutation (which is a dead end anyway). Why is that so hard to believe? And why do people always want to fight it?

Devote Myself wrote:

"I'm not saying that believing in God makes you dumber. My hypothesis is that people with a low intelligence are more easily drawn toward religions, which give answers that are certain, while people with a high intelligence are more skeptical," says the professor. [5]

I pulled this from the article given : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religiosit ... telligence

And sadly enough, I find it true these days. I used to be a part of that crowd. I believed that I was too smart to believe in a myth. After all, I was valedictorian of my high school class and a biology major. (raised catholic, too, which really destroyed any notions I had of a real God.) I figured Mary probably got knocked up by Joseph and made up the whole angel visiting story to avoid certain death for premarital sex. I believed that a series of random genetic mutations caused bacterium to grow into plants and animals; first reptiles, then amphibians, then birds, then mammals. (although there is some confusion regarding birds descending from reptiles, too). I ate all it up and regurgitated it with straight A's. I could do whatever I wanted, not to be tied down by dogmatic morals. I ended up dropping out of college the first time around, so I could party full time. Spent almost 3 years drunk and high. And unfortunately empty. Nothing filled the emptiness.

Not until I faced my own pride and admitted defeat. Saw through the lies. Saw the world I had bought into and tried to create for myself.

They say christianity is the easiest religion to belong to. All you have to do is believe in your heart that Jesus was the son of God, died to make you right with God, and rose from the dead. And invite him to live through you and change you from the inside out.

In this intellectually driven world, this is one of the HARDEST things to do!
People assume you're unintelligent and simpleminded. (wrong) They think you blindly accept whatever the religious community tells you. (Which is also wrong) And they think that christians never question anything, which is also ridiculous. There are plenty of things in the Bible that I don't agree with. But I talk about it with God and ask him to show me why. There are plenty of things that I still haven't heard back about!


But I can accept that He/She is there. And if anything, my intelligence has improved without the beer and pot!

No one will know who was right and who was wrong until we die or the end comes, so there really isn't anymore I can say. I just encourage anyone who reads this to not be afraid to go against the grain. Search for truth. It has a way of revealing itself to those who aren't afraid to lay down their self images and start anew.

Devote Myself wrote:

"I'm not saying that believing in God makes you dumber. My hypothesis is that people with a low intelligence are more easily drawn toward religions, which give answers that are certain, while people with a high intelligence are more skeptical," says the professor. [5]

I pulled this from the article given : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religiosit ... telligence

And sadly enough, I find it true these days. I used to be a part of that crowd. I believed that I was too smart to believe in a myth. After all, I was valedictorian of my high school class and a biology major. (raised catholic, too, which really destroyed any notions I had of a real God.) I figured Mary probably got knocked up by Joseph and made up the whole angel visiting story to avoid certain death for premarital sex. I believed that a series of random genetic mutations caused bacterium to grow into plants and animals; first reptiles, then amphibians, then birds, then mammals. (although there is some confusion regarding birds descending from reptiles, too). I ate all it up and regurgitated it with straight A's. I could do whatever I wanted, not to be tied down by dogmatic morals. I ended up dropping out of college the first time around, so I could party full time. Spent almost 3 years drunk and high. And unfortunately empty. Nothing filled the emptiness.

Not until I faced my own pride and admitted defeat. Saw through the lies. Saw the world I had bought into and tried to create for myself.

They say christianity is the easiest religion to belong to. All you have to do is believe in your heart that Jesus was the son of God, died to make you right with God, and rose from the dead. And invite him to live through you and change you from the inside out.

In this intellectually driven world, this is one of the HARDEST things to do!
People assume you're unintelligent and simpleminded. (wrong) They think you blindly accept whatever the religious community tells you. (Which is also wrong) And they think that christians never question anything, which is also ridiculous. There are plenty of things in the Bible that I don't agree with. But I talk about it with God and ask him to show me why. There are plenty of things that I still haven't heard back about!


But I can accept that He/She is there. And if anything, my intelligence has improved without the beer and pot!

No one will know who was right and who was wrong until we die or the end comes, so there really isn't anymore I can say. I just encourage anyone who reads this to not be afraid to go against the grain. Search for truth. It has a way of revealing itself to those who aren't afraid to lay down their self images and start anew.