Do you believe in fate?

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  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    Jeanie wrote:
    Well ditto but perhaps it is you that doesn't see what I do?
    I also don't see what you do. Yes.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • Bu2
    Bu2 Posts: 1,693
    angelica wrote:
    I also don't see what you do. Yes.

    Can we then move on to other discussions, knowing that we all don't see what others see?
    Feels Good Inc.
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    Bu2 wrote:
    Can we then move on to other discussions, knowing that we all don't see what others see?
    Yes, everyone is free to move on whenever they like.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    angelica wrote:
    You said illness is bad. What if illness is in you? Does that mean part of you is bad?

    Of course a part of me is bad. There isn't a person alive that doesn't have good and bad in them.

    Illness is in me and I didn't invite and I don't want it here but here it is. I share this space with it, begrudgingly most of the time, like a flatmate that you can't evict. I do my best to get along and be fair and reasonable but I'm tired of it dictating terms to me and no amount of meditation, holistic lifestyle or embracing the f**ker is going to change the fact that sometimes I'm not the boss of me, the illness is. So yeah, that part of me is bad.
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    Jeanie wrote:
    Of course a part of me is bad. There isn't a person alive that doesn't have good and bad in them.

    Illness is in me and I didn't invite and I don't want it here but here it is. I share this space with it, begrudgingly most of the time, like a flatmate that you can't evict. I do my best to get along and be fair and reasonable but I'm tired of it dictating terms to me and no amount of meditation, holistic lifestyle or embracing the f**ker is going to change the fact that sometimes I'm not the boss of me, the illness is. So yeah, that part of me is bad.
    Okay, fair enough.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • angelica
    angelica Posts: 6,038
    For the record, I personally don't believe "bad" is in us even remotely. I believe we've been taught to think that. And then we give life to this idea of "bad" and lose touch with our truth, that is about just being neutral, like animals.

    I believe that everything we do that seems bad is about how we were raised, or about our genetics and when we understand, we recognize there were perfectly understandable reasons for why we did absolutely everything.


    For example, when we reach for the dirt in the plant when we are babies. Our parents scold us and call us bad. And really, we're just exploring--we're only bad based on their judgments. If they understood how natural it was for us to want to dig in the dirt, they'd have recognized our maturity level, and responded age-appropriately and directed us elsewhere without making us wrong.

    When we heal our ideas of "bad", and come to forgive ourselves and understand our mistakes and errors, we come into the freedom of self-acceptance, wholeness and self-Love or Self-esteem. In otherwords, we achieve unity with ourselves.
    "The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr

    http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta

    Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
  • Jeanie
    Jeanie Posts: 9,446
    angelica wrote:
    I didn't say illness is "not good or bad". I fully appreciate that in people's experiences, the experience of illness can range from annoying to devastating or horrific.

    So how then does it advance the situation by saying that people are responsible for getting their illness? Like shit, sometimes illness just happens. And people do what they can and are able to do when they are confronted with it. To say that they are able to magically, mentally "wish" it away, just as they manifested it, really seems like appropriating blame to me, given that sometimes there is no rhyme or reason for things.
    angelica wrote:
    The fact remains that we are fully interconnected with our own bodies at all times. Do you deny that? Do you deny that we are always connected to natural laws?

    I don't know about "natural laws". Any "laws" always give me pause for consideration because I deem them arbitrary and I'm not one for blindly, or unfalteringly following anything. Yes, we are connected to our bodies but that doesn't mean we are always in charge of what they do.
    NOPE!!!

    *~You're IT Bert!~*

    Hold on to the thread
    The currents will shift
  • Bu2
    Bu2 Posts: 1,693
    angelica wrote:
    For the record, I personally don't believe "bad" is in us even remotely. I believe we've been taught to think that. And then we give life to this idea of "bad" and lose touch with our truth, that is about just being neutral, like animals.

    I believe that everything we do that seems bad is about how we were raised, or about our genetics and when we understand, we recognize there were perfectly understandable reasons for why we did absolutely everything.


    For example, when we reach for the dirt in the plant when we are babies. Our parents scold us and call us bad. And really, we're just exploring--we're only bad based on their judgments. If they understood how natural it was for us to want to dig in the dirt, they'd have recognized our maturity level, and responded age-appropriately and directed us elsewhere without making us wrong.

    When we heal our ideas of "bad", and come to forgive ourselves and understand our mistakes and errors, we come into the freedom of self-acceptance, wholeness and self-Love or Self-esteem. In otherwords, we achieve unity with ourselves.

    I'd like to know whether you have kids or not. Whether a loved one close to you suffers from cancer or emphysema. Because I usually can read posts from holier-than-thou folks and either respond once with a pissed off statement, and then let it go, or not respond at all and then let it go. But something about your posts just gets under my skin, Angelica, and you're starting to piss me off.

    Your posts come off as coming from that kid in the playground who says, "I know you are, but what am I?"

    Your posts are getting added to threads that should've and could've stopped days ago, yet you increase the broadband width by giving us empty spaces of quotes and bold letters and yet you have nothing new to say. You just smugly sit back as if you have all the answers and you calmly bait one person after another, all the while having nothing new to say.

    Tell you what? Why don't you respond to my new post here in the Train tonight rather than add a 12th page to a topic that has been completely mangled and misled by you when it should've and could've died a natural death with some dignity days ago?

    Meantime, I'll go to bed. Because I'm sure your smarmy responses will be there in the morning.

    *Note to everyone else -- forgive me for getting my back up. But....really!*
    Feels Good Inc.
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    You're still missing the point.
    what point?
    What triggered you to leave home?
    plans and ambitions i set out for myself in the future.
    Why do you not eat breakfast now then? Can you put your finger on it directly?
    yes, i can. cause i don't know how to cook. i can learn though....
    Did you not like your mothers cooking?
    yes, i did. well, some, not all.
    If it's your conscious choice then you won't even have to think more that 1/2 a second to answer that.
    what do you mean? that i didn't choose to like or dislike my mother's cooking?
    Breakfast is the most important meal of the day...it affects your longevity...your life directly. If you don't know why exactly then why wouldn't you?
    i got no idea what you're talking about here...
    99.9% of the time people will answer "I'm not sure why".
    i'm not even sure what you're talking about anymore
    Some say they don't have time....why don't they? Waking up 30 mins earlier is not an option?...or is it that they do not desire to do that for some unexplainable reason? Too tired? Why? Get more sleep. Don't want to go to bed earlier? Why? What causes that? ...and so on. So many things people have no idea why...but they just "do" habitually.
    my answer is cause i don't know how to cook.... but i could learn. which actually to be quite honest, i've bought myself a cook book. ;)
    See what I'm saying.
    you might want to go over it with me again.... i'm a slow learner :(
    There is a reason for that.
    reasons that haven't been made clear to me
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    what point? plans and ambitions i set out for myself in the future. yes, i can. cause i don't know how to cook. i can learn though....

    yes, i did. well, some, not all.what do you mean? that i didn't choose to like or dislike my mother's cooking? i got no idea what you're talking about here... i'm not even sure what you're talking about anymore

    my answer is cause i don't know how to cook.... but i could learn. which actually to be quite honest, i've bought myself a cook book. ;)

    you might want to go over it with me again.... i'm a slow learner :(

    reasons that haven't been made clear to me


    So you are saying you have an answer and explanation for everything that has happened in your life so far, and everything that has resulted from it was/is from a conscious decision? You can explain it all.

    Either you have a crystal ball, are God himself, or are perhaps not correct with that line of thought.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    So you are saying you have an answer and explanation for everything that has happened in your life so far, and everything that has resulted from it was/is from a conscious decision? You can explain it all.

    Either you have a crystal ball, are God himself, or are perhaps not correct with that line of thought.
    well, as you might know, i have my own faith. And from experiences that i've had, within my family, and as an individual i see things that have resulted because of certain circumstances which could have been avoided. Because of my faith and for what I believe I'm able to discern things in certain ways and understand that certain things are at my grasp and fully accessible to my knowledge. It doesn't mean that I know everything though. It simply means that everything that surrounds me, tangible or intangible, are completely at my hand for the taking.

    I'm not saying everything has resulted from a conscious decision but I am saying that I had the ability to be fully aware of the circumstances and thus completely avoiding them. I don't have a crystal ball, I'm not God and neither am I incorrect at what I am saying. Cause all I'm saying is that everything that is at reach is completely at my risk. Heck, even the entire world is at my risk. Even the weather changes because of choices that I've made.

    Well, I'm open to different ideas... so let's not conclude anything here. This is simply what I believe. If you have anything otherwise to show me then I'll change my mind.... or how does it go? Nature changes it for me? I don't know... help me out. :D
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • prism
    prism Posts: 2,440
    Bu2 wrote:
    I'd like to know whether you have kids or not. Whether a loved one close to you suffers from cancer or emphysema. Because I usually can read posts from holier-than-thou folks and either respond once with a pissed off statement, and then let it go, or not respond at all and then let it go. But something about your posts just gets under my skin, Angelica, and you're starting to piss me off.

    Your posts come off as coming from that kid in the playground who says, "I know you are, but what am I?"

    Your posts are getting added to threads that should've and could've stopped days ago, yet you increase the broadband width by giving us empty spaces of quotes and bold letters and yet you have nothing new to say. You just smugly sit back as if you have all the answers and you calmly bait one person after another, all the while having nothing new to say.

    Tell you what? Why don't you respond to my new post here in the Train tonight rather than add a 12th page to a topic that has been completely mangled and misled by you when it should've and could've died a natural death with some dignity days ago?

    Meantime, I'll go to bed. Because I'm sure your smarmy responses will be there in the morning.

    *Note to everyone else -- forgive me for getting my back up. But....really!*

    ooh Bubu...I adore you :)
    *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
    angels share laughter
    *~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    well, as you might know, i have my own faith. And from experiences that i've had, within my family, and as an individual i see things that have resulted because of certain circumstances which could have been avoided. Because of my faith and for what I believe I'm able to discern things in certain ways and understand that certain things are at my grasp and fully accessible to my knowledge. It doesn't mean that I know everything though. It simply means that everything that surrounds me, tangible or intangible, are completely at my hand for the taking.

    I'm not saying everything has resulted from a conscious decision but I am saying that I had the ability to be fully aware of the circumstances and thus completely avoiding them. I don't have a crystal ball, I'm not God and neither am I incorrect at what I am saying. Cause all I'm saying is that everything that is at reach is completely at my risk. Heck, even the entire world is at my risk. Even the weather changes because of choices that I've made.

    Well, I'm open to different ideas... so let's not conclude anything here. This is simply what I believe. If you have anything otherwise to show me then I'll change my mind.... or how does it go? Nature changes it for me? I don't know... help me out. :D

    so you speak to god and he tells you... ok
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    so you speak to god and he tells you... ok
    did i say that? i didn't say that. i said that everything i've gone through, with or without my family, now that i see things, were completely avoidable. Like for instance, a dumb little kid in mid-teens that takes his dad's car out for a drive. Becuase of his immaturity he "unconsciously" speeds and drives wrecklessly... but now that the kid has grown and matured, he can see the mistakes he'd done as a kid and avoid them. Sure, you can say that his past experience influenced his choices... so therefore he really has no choice. Not really. Cause there are still horrible drivers out there who like to speed just for the hell of it. Like my brother-in-law... he drives 90 mph everytime we're on the highway. is it his choice to speed? or is the universe fixing this?

    you haven't shown to me or even explained how is it that I don't have choice. You keep asking rhetorical questions that don't even make sense.
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    did i say that? i didn't say that. i said that everything i've gone through, with or without my family, now that i see things, were completely avoidable. Like for instance, a dumb little kid in mid-teens that takes his dad's car out for a drive. Becuase of his immaturity he "unconsciously" speeds and drives wrecklessly... but now that the kid has grown and matured, he can see the mistakes he'd done as a kid and avoid them. Sure, you can say that his past experience influenced his choices... so therefore he really has no choice. Not really. Cause there are still horrible drivers out there who like to speed just for the hell of it. Like my brother-in-law... he drives 90 mph everytime we're on the highway. is it his choice to speed? or is the universe fixing this?

    you haven't shown to me or even explained how is it that I don't have choice. You keep asking rhetorical questions that don't even make sense.


    Do you pose questions to god and does he answer them?
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Do you pose questions to god and does he answer them?
    why?
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    why?


    simple question...
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    simple question...
    yes, i know. but answer mine and i'll answer yours. hehe
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    deadnothingbetter wrote:
    yes, i know. but answer mine and i'll answer yours. hehe

    That's ok, you just answered mine. :p
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • deadnothingbetter
    deadnothingbetter Posts: 2,202
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    That's ok, you just answered mine. :p
    wow... awesome.... so you knew i was gonna say, "yes and no"?

    so now answer mine.... why do you ask?
    This isn't the land of opportunity, it's the land of competition.

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