Out of wedlock births hit new high in US

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Comments

  • Staceb10
    Staceb10 Posts: 675
    dunkman1974 wrote:
    you think people having kids out of wedlock makes them pathetic..

    i think you should let people live as they want... ergo i'm going to argue with you as you arent allowing them, by your comments, to live as they want! its not that i'm not letting you live as you want, its that you are hindering my ideal of everyone living as they choose!


    His opinion on how they live their life isn't telling them how they should actually live. Its like the people that think the guy Bush just appointed as family planning chief is ignorant or pathetic based on his views of birth control. Are they telling him how to live his life by not agreeing with him?
  • Staceb10
    Staceb10 Posts: 675
    dunkman1974 wrote:
    then they wouldnt have a beautiful child... a child who appears to be getting lots of love and nurture...

    what you should 'probably' do is save the preaching for http://www.convertordie.org


    I can say from experience that we never regret having the child..just having them at that timeframe.
  • redrock
    redrock Posts: 18,341
    know1 wrote:
    Marriage is not a guarantee, but most people agree the chances are that the kids will have two parents at home is just a bit higher at least.

    A few statistics...
    The average 1st marriage lasts just under 8 years. The average 2nd marriage not even 7 years. 50% of marriages end in divorce, 60% of second marriages end in divorce.

    Number of unmarried couples living together: 5.5 million. Of these 70% are still a family unit after 5 years (sorry no longer stats available)..

    So.... half the marriages will end within 8 years.... not very good odds....
  • inmytree
    inmytree Posts: 4,741
    know1 wrote:
    Sex isn't necessarily bad, but getting pregnant (or getting someone pregnant) when you're not ready for it is bad.

    I don't know how to stop it or even slow it down. I do have some ideas that involve welfare and other enabling or even encouraging of this behavior, but I'm sure those would get blasted as being uncaring.

    as for the not getting knocked-up thing, you seem to imply on those on welfare and the poor are having children out of wedlock, that's not always the case..

    my ideas of how to fix welfare: have a better system of checks and balances, monitor cases and recipients more closely...

    have "works" programs for those who are receiveing welfare benefits, such as street cleaning, upkeep of roads, and perhaps even civil services whereas people receive on the job training and education...

    and if a person is able to particapate, and they don't, welfare money stopped...if you don't have a place to live, so what, bu-bye...if you have kids, sorry, they go to the state, to a family who is payed nicely to take care of them....

    my program will be run by the Gov't and it will cost no more that what we are paying now, simply because costs will be saved by weeding out those who don't "need" welfare, as well as the possibility of creating programs that may even make money....

    just a thought...

    .
  • redrock
    redrock Posts: 18,341
    know1 wrote:
    I think that for THEIR SAKE people of other faiths should convert,

    :eek: Their sake? Other faiths? Convert?? :eek:

    What faiths? Convert to which other faith??? What happens if they don't (for their sake!!!) :eek:
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    redrock wrote:
    A few statistics...
    The average 1st marriage lasts just under 8 years. The average 2nd marriage not even 7 years. 50% of marriages end in divorce, 60% of second marriages end in divorce.

    Number of unmarried couples living together: 5.5 million. Of these 70% are still a family unit after 5 years (sorry no longer stats available)..

    So.... half the marriages will end within 8 years.... not very good odds....

    So half of marriages do not end until the death of a spouse (and those figures are in with your numbers about the length of time marriages last and there's nothing people can do about death).

    Even if the numbers showed that only 1% of marriages did not end in divorce, I would still maintain that I feel that the odds are that it's better for a child to be raised in a married household than not.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    redrock wrote:
    :eek: Their sake? Other faiths? Convert?? :eek:

    What faiths? Convert to which other faith??? What happens if they don't (for their sake!!!) :eek:

    If I believe that the only people going to heaven are those with a belief system like mine, then why wouldn't I want all people to go to heaven? I could be selfish and let them suffer for eternity, but that just doesn't feel right to me.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • dunkman
    dunkman Posts: 19,646
    know1 wrote:

    1. Nope you can't read or comprehend. I didn't say the people were pathetic, I said the action was pathetic. And I stand by that.

    2. How is you not agreeing with me any different than me not agreeing with their actions?

    3. You know nothing of my beliefs regarding religion. I think that for THEIR SAKE people of other faiths should convert, but that doesn't mean that I want them to live my way for any personal reason on my part.


    1. "I think this is pathetic. Are people really this self-centered?" the structure of this sentence makes me think you believe the people to be pathetic... surely to be pathetic in an action you need to be pathetic as a person..

    2. because in this instance i believe these people should be left to live the life they choose.. you wish to interfere in some way and call their actions "pathetic" whereas i have passed no judgement on them as i dont know their circumstances... you then went on to suggest they were single parents as "statistics show this" but this specific set of stats in the report you posted didnt suggest this... you've just stereotyped these people.. i didnt... i couldnt give a fuck... they can have babies out of wedlock for all i care as in this instance i want people to live their lives as they wish. As for me not agreeing with you... i answered that! i believe the people, the subjects of this report should be allowed to live as they wish... its their choice... you are against them being allowed to live their lives as they wish.. therefore i'm going to argue with you

    3. fair enough.... but i like to be open minded.. you dont as it appears that you want people to convert for their sakes.. only thing i want to convert is water into wine!
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • dunkman
    dunkman Posts: 19,646
    Staceb10 wrote:
    I can say from experience that we never regret having the child..just having them at that timeframe.

    exactly... how can you regret having a child... unless you're Jeffrey Dahmers mother :o
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    dunkman1974 wrote:
    1. "I think this is pathetic. Are people really this self-centered?" the structure of this sentence makes me think you believe the people to be pathetic... surely to be pathetic in an action you need to be pathetic as a person..

    2. because in this instance i believe these people should be left to live the life they choose.. you wish to interfere in some way and call their actions "pathetic" whereas i have passed no judgement on them as i dont know their circumstances... you then went on to suggest they were single parents as "statistics show this" but this specific set of stats in the report you posted didnt suggest this... you've just stereotyped these people.. i didnt... i couldnt give a fuck... they can have babies out of wedlock for all i care as in this instance i want people to live their lives as they wish. As for me not agreeing with you... i answered that! i believe the people, the subjects of this report should be allowed to live as they wish... its their choice... you are against them being allowed to live their lives as they wish.. therefore i'm going to argue with you

    3. fair enough.... but i like to be open minded.. you dont as it appears that you want people to convert for their sakes.. only thing i want to convert is water into wine!

    1. This proves my point. I called them self-centered but not pathetic

    2. Again, you are passing judgment on me so you're really not that different from me passing judgment on them. Furthermore, you stereotype me and jump to conclusions all the time.
    Additionally, I would have no problem with them living as they wish if it didn't involve screwing up the life of a child. That's where it's not as black and white as you'd like to think with your head in the sand.

    3. I am open minded, but I have my beliefs (and you have yours) and my beliefs say that people are going to hell if they aren't Christians. I don't want them to go to hell. Maybe you don't care.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • nick1977
    nick1977 Posts: 327
    Yeah, this is a bad trend. A good home life is undoubtedly better for children. It is hard for them to be passed back and forth. It can be done, and kids can get through it, but it is tough.

    What is amazing is that this is the statistic in the age of birth control. It is really quite unbelievable. Use birth control people! Don't have kids until you are in a long term, committed relationship.
  • dunkman
    dunkman Posts: 19,646
    know1 wrote:
    Maybe you don't care.


    actually i dont... thanks :)
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    Staceb10 wrote:
    Wait a second.. that's such a double standard.. Should the men be obligated to pay for a child they didn't want to have in the first place? What if the man wants the child and the woman has an abortion? What if the woman decides to have the kid and he wants her to have an abortion?


    Maybe women should stop spreading their legs for men if they don't want a child.

    you see my point then. it IS a double standard. and the anti-abortion crowd focuses solely on how slutty women are and turns a blind eye to men with several kids by multiple mothers, blaming the mother for being a slut and irresponsible and not giving a damn what the man did.
  • redrock
    redrock Posts: 18,341
    know1 wrote:
    So half of marriages do not end until the death of a spouse (and those figures are in with your numbers about the length of time marriages last and there's nothing people can do about death).

    Even if the numbers showed that only 1% of marriages did not end in divorce, I would still maintain that I feel that the odds are that it's better for a child to be raised in a married household than not.

    Nope... these are official divorce statistics. Not separation. Some people are separated but do not officially divorce. The average length of the marriage of 8 years is for the first marriage ending in divorce. Doesn't mean that half the marriages are ''til death do us part'....


    Don't know how you think that 99% of marriages ending in divorce (married couples) could be better than a potential 70% non married couple household staying together. Numbers don't add up!

    You're just putting in moral values into the equation which makes you lose your grip on reality.
  • redrock
    redrock Posts: 18,341
    know1 wrote:
    If I believe that the only people going to heaven are those with a belief system like mine, then why wouldn't I want all people to go to heaven? I could be selfish and let them suffer for eternity, but that just doesn't feel right to me.


    Heaven????
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    cornnifer wrote:
    Careful, this kind of common sense will get you blasted around these parts.

    seeing as how you yourself couldnt wait for your wedding night to start sticking it in, you're in no position to talk. people have sex. it's ridiculous to say "women should stop spreading their legs" and then at the same tacitly condone men doing whatever it takes to get laid... ghb, pressure, intoxication, harassment, or whatever else. in the eyes of many like you, guys are supposed to have sex as much as possible, and women are supposed to not like it and only put up with it cos they want a baby from their husband.

    i notice that neither you or stace is capable or willing to admit that maybe guys shouldn't be fucking everyone they can or should be held accountable for it. you both respond to my point with snide, sarcastic remarks about how WOMEN are the ones who should be responsible. guys... well, we wouldnt want to cut into their fun now would we?
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    soulsinging wrote:
    seeing as how you yourself couldnt wait for your wedding night to start sticking it in, you're in no position to talk. people have sex. it's ridiculous to say "women should stop spreading their legs" and then at the same tacitly condone men doing whatever it takes to get laid... ghb, pressure, intoxication, harassment, or whatever else. in the eyes of many like you, guys are supposed to have sex as much as possible, and women are supposed to not like it and only put up with it cos they want a baby from their husband.

    i notice that neither you or stace is capable or willing to admit that maybe guys shouldn't be fucking everyone they can or should be held accountable for it. you both respond to my point with snide, sarcastic remarks about how WOMEN are the ones who should be responsible. guys... well, we wouldnt want to cut into their fun now would we?

    I know you're speaking to them, but I definitely hold the men just as accountable.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    redrock wrote:
    Nope... these are official divorce statistics. Not separation. Some people are separated but do not officially divorce. The average length of the marriage of 8 years is for the first marriage ending in divorce. Doesn't mean that half the marriages are ''til death do us part'....


    Don't know how you think that 99% of marriages ending in divorce (married couples) could be better than a potential 70% non married couple household staying together. Numbers don't add up!

    You're just putting in moral values into the equation which makes you lose your grip on reality.

    You're so lost with those statistics that I can't straighten you out.

    My point is not to know how often divorces occur, but just that I believe that it's best for kids to be raised in households with 2 committed, stable parents.
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • know1
    know1 Posts: 6,801
    dunkman1974 wrote:
    actually i dont... thanks :)

    So if you knew people were going to suffer, are you admitting that you would do nothing to help them avoid it?

    After all, it's their life, who are you to interfere...
    The only people we should try to get even with...
    ...are those who've helped us.

    Right 'round the corner could be bigger than ourselves.
  • soulsinging
    soulsinging Posts: 13,202
    know1 wrote:
    I know you're speaking to them, but I definitely hold the men just as accountable.

    i know you're at least consistent and uniform in your views. i respect that. these two refuse to admit to playing a double standard however.

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