Message from UPS to our European Super Deluxe Customers

TheSkyEtc

I'm from Greece and after an e-mail I sent to 10C showing complete irritation and fury of what had happened I stated I refuse to pay even a cent more so they either had to had my package at my door with no extra fees or refund me. And santa's little helper informed there's gonna be a refund.
So I'm waiting for the money to go back in my card the next days and then order it through Amazon or sth which is a lot cheaper then the final amount I was supposed to pay with the fees.. Imagine my monthly salary is 750 euros and I was supposed to pay from 65 up to 130 euros more for something I could find in stores in the price of 100 euros or little more. That was a disturbing situtation, for me it ended well but for friends and fellow members it rather did not. When 10C stated 50$ shipping, that should be all. They should've send it as simple mail package and not as merchandise or anything. Anyway, I hope everything will go back to normal but I personally will think about it before renewing my membership.

Peace.

CJMST3K

I just want to make his quote stand out more, as this can positively affect European customers. I don't want it to get overlooked.

TheSkyEtc wrote:

I'm from Greece and after an e-mail I sent to 10C showing complete irritation and fury of what had happened I stated I refuse to pay even a cent more so they either had to had my package at my door with no extra fees or refund me. And santa's little helper informed there's gonna be a refund.
So I'm waiting for the money to go back in my card the next days and then order it through Amazon or sth which is a lot cheaper then the final amount I was supposed to pay with the fees.. Imagine my monthly salary is 750 euros and I was supposed to pay from 65 up to 130 euros more for something I could find in stores in the price of 100 euros or little more. That was a disturbing situtation, for me it ended well but for friends and fellow members it rather did not. When 10C stated 50$ shipping, that should be all. They should've send it as simple mail package and not as merchandise or anything. Anyway, I hope everything will go back to normal but I personally will think about it before renewing my membership.

Peace.

Pegasus

TheSkyEtc wrote:

I'm from Greece and after an e-mail I sent to 10C showing complete irritation and fury of what had happened I stated I refuse to pay even a cent more so they either had to had my package at my door with no extra fees or refund me. And santa's little helper informed there's gonna be a refund.
So I'm waiting for the money to go back in my card the next days and then order it through Amazon or sth which is a lot cheaper then the final amount I was supposed to pay with the fees.. Imagine my monthly salary is 750 euros and I was supposed to pay from 65 up to 130 euros more for something I could find in stores in the price of 100 euros or little more. That was a disturbing situtation, for me it ended well but for friends and fellow members it rather did not. When 10C stated 50$ shipping, that should be all. They should've send it as simple mail package and not as merchandise or anything. Anyway, I hope everything will go back to normal but I personally will think about it before renewing my membership.

Peace.

that's illegal since it IS merchandise, and there ALWAYS has to be a custom form if it cross a border, including within the EU.
And once again, normal post would not guarantee you wouldn't have had to pay customs. by law you're required to, you might be lucky if they don't spot it but it's just that, luck.
The UPS charge in Greece is a problem though, and one I'd would not let go without a fight with UPS.

redeye

as far as im concerned this whole bullshit is ten clubs fault.
i had to pay £30.00 for my box, and before that paid another £30.00 for two hoodies.
why didnt they let customers know about this problem on the website???
they must have known before any copies of sde shipped.
they knew, but there was nothing they could do.
i am not happy, i ordered the set from ten club sue to this whole sined set lottery, which was also bullshit.
i could have bought it from a local record store, and paid no postage,
the whole thing is a farce, sorry

Bryan Seale

Just got mine today, had to pay the UPS guy €45.

To be honest, I don't give a shit. Obviously I would like to still have that €45 but as soon as I opened the package and saw it, all the feelings of anger and injustice just fled in fear at the happiness I was feeling. I'm listening to the Drop In The Park LP right now and I've already listened to the remixed LP and I must say, it's fantastic.

Sure, it sucks that we had to pay more but whats done is done, enjoy the package and stop being bitter

CJMST3K

Bryan Seale wrote:

Just got mine today, had to pay the UPS guy €45.

To be honest, I don't give a shit. Obviously I would like to still have that €45 but as soon as I opened the package and saw it, all the feelings of anger and injustice just fled in fear at the happiness I was feeling. I'm listening to the Drop In The Park LP right now and I've already listened to the remixed LP and I must say, it's fantastic.

Sure, it sucks that we had to pay more but whats done is done, enjoy the package and stop being bitter

Times are financially tough for a lot of people. I'd say they have a 100% right to be upset about this... unless someone else is willing to pay their €€€.

MB74233

I refused delivery of the boxset yesterday. Was told I would have to pay over 40 euro extra.
It is a complete disaster imo. How this situation arose is beyond me and completely unacceptable. :roll:

jmk

I received my package today and didn't have to pay a cent,... yet. I talked to UPS earlier and they told me they will send the bill by mail later on, so we'll see what they're going to charge. They told me earlier that the "UPS fee" for customs clearance and paperwork or whatever they charge us for is 11,50 € here. Then I calculated two possible VAT's depending on what they use as the items value. Our VAT is 22%

1) 17,70€ if they use the $100

2) 33,60€ if they use the $190

I got a little suspicious when I received the box and there was no value printed on it. Was this value of $100 going electronically from Ten Club to UPS? Has the Ten Club / UPS conversations led to the value of $190, being used by UPS for the customs in Europe?

They already called me yesterday at 11.35 from UPS telling me it will be delivered between 15.00 and 18.00. Then when it didn't come I checked the tracking page on UPS website and it said it has been stopped at 12.00 for reasons UPS can't do anything about. They didn't see it necessary to call me and say that it won't be delivered today, so I waited anxiously in vain :( . So the box spent the night at the customs in Helsinki and today in the morning I called UPS and they didn't know why it was still at the customs. Then I finally got the call that they have my package in their delivery car and yes, I received it today although one day late!

If I get the bill of VAT according to the $190, I'm going to object and take it up with UPS, so that they'll use the price I actually paid in December when I ordered the box, when the USD was much weaker compared to the euro. This price I paid was 133,25 € so that would make 29,30€ in VAT. This way I'll save 4,30 € ! Yeeah

That said, the box is absolutely phenomenal! I listened to the Ten Redux on vinyl and it sounded absolutely amazing!

Only negative thing (if not counting that I didn't either get a signed one) was that the inside paper sheet that the LP was in had made some ugly white paper marks on the surface of the vinyl and they were glued to the surface so they didn't come of with the carbon fibre brush. This was on the beginning of the B-side so the beginning of Oceans had some nasty and loud sounding crackles and pops on every round the stylus touched that spot :( . I wonder if they go away with some vinyl washing liquids that there is available on the net?

Could Ten Club possible send me a new LP or is this something I can have a full full refund on if the whole package would be returned?

Jennytree

You all know that 10c can't do a thing about customs charges and VAT, right? I realise that UPS are asking for extra money for delivery, but don't go shouting at 10c for stuff beyond their control.

dimitrispearljam

Jennytree wrote:

You all know that 10c can't do a thing about customs charges and VAT, right? I realise that UPS are asking for extra money for delivery, but don't go shouting at 10c for stuff beyond their control.

ofcourse not they cant about vat,,but to make a deal with a company that ask for paper,store,custom employ 130 euros more is my fault?,,,and i buy something from 10c,,ups is just for the deliver,,for exable ,if it was not 10c and u buy from sony a tv and its cost 200 euros and the delivery ask 200 more,,u will buy from sony again?

Jennytree

dimitrispearljam wrote:

Jennytree wrote:

You all know that 10c can't do a thing about customs charges and VAT, right? I realise that UPS are asking for extra money for delivery, but don't go shouting at 10c for stuff beyond their control.

ofcourse not they cant about vat,,but to make a deal with a company that ask for paper,store,custom employ 130 euros more is my fault?,,,and i buy something from 10c,,ups is just for the deliver,,for exable ,if it was not 10c and u buy from sony a tv and its cost 200 euros and the delivery ask 200 more,,u will buy from sony again?

I would buy from them again, I would just try to ensure that they don't use the same delivery company again. If they refuse to use another, then there would be no way I'd wanna be ripped off. UPS screwed the 10c, they've admitted that, they're at fault.

dimitrispearljam

Jennytree wrote:

dimitrispearljam wrote:

Jennytree wrote:

You all know that 10c can't do a thing about customs charges and VAT, right? I realise that UPS are asking for extra money for delivery, but don't go shouting at 10c for stuff beyond their control.

ofcourse not they cant about vat,,but to make a deal with a company that ask for paper,store,custom employ 130 euros more is my fault?,,,and i buy something from 10c,,ups is just for the deliver,,for exable ,if it was not 10c and u buy from sony a tv and its cost 200 euros and the delivery ask 200 more,,u will buy from sony again?

I would buy from them again, I would just try to ensure that they don't use the same delivery company again. If they refuse to use another, then there would be no way I'd wanna be ripped off. UPS screwed the 10c, they've admitted that, they're at fault.

any courier they use the result will be the same,,with post office no,,thats the whole story,,but when u want to deliver for examble 10,000 boxes for save money u go to the courier for better price,,,to post office they dont do that,u will pay the same price anyway u send 1 or 10,000,,and thats why the people here say that the put in the box that cost 100 and not for 190 we pay for not pay the fans extra,,but somehow the customs learn about it,,

jeremy

well i'm from greece and i still haven't got Ten Re-Issue Super DeLuxe Edition package..not even a ups code has been sent to me..and what about these bullshit about paying 130 euros more than the 10c price..?this is is supposed to be a pj fan club and the whole package is already cheaper at other sites..(e.g.amazon)..and what about telling lies to us..?When 10C stated 50$ shipping, that should be all. They should've send it as simple mail package and not as merchandise or anything.....i've already sent 5 emails to 10 club with my order details and questions about my order and NO ANSWER..!!
i don't know what is going to happen but i've already regret ordering this package from 10c..and i'm really not bitter here but the worst of all is having thoughts about 10c..is this a fan club or just a company..?let me know...

Pegasus

scared_alive wrote:

as far as im concerned this whole bullshit is ten clubs fault.
i had to pay £30.00 for my box, and before that paid another £30.00 for two hoodies.
why didnt they let customers know about this problem on the website???
they must have known before any copies of sde shipped.
they knew, but there was nothing they could do.
i am not happy, i ordered the set from ten club sue to this whole sined set lottery, which was also bullshit.
i could have bought it from a local record store, and paid no postage,
the whole thing is a farce, sorry

so YOU knew about it before you ordered since you'd already been hit by customs once!
yet you have the nerves to complain they didn't warn you? (about something that has nothing to do with them and might not even have realised since it happens in another country)
..the M word comes to mind .. :roll:

jmk wrote:

I received my package today and didn't have to pay a cent,... yet. I talked to UPS earlier and they told me they will send the bill by mail later on, so we'll see what they're going to charge. They told me earlier that the "UPS fee" for customs clearance and paperwork or whatever they charge us for is 11,50 € here. Then I calculated two possible VAT's depending on what they use as the items value. Our VAT is 22%

1) 17,70€ if they use the $100

2) 33,60€ if they use the $190

I got a little suspicious when I received the box and there was no value printed on it. Was this value of $100 going electronically from Ten Club to UPS? Has the Ten Club / UPS conversations led to the value of $190, being used by UPS for the customs in Europe?

They already called me yesterday at 11.35 from UPS telling me it will be delivered between 15.00 and 18.00. Then when it didn't come I checked the tracking page on UPS website and it said it has been stopped at 12.00 for reasons UPS can't do anything about. They didn't see it necessary to call me and say that it won't be delivered today, so I waited anxiously in vain :( . So the box spent the night at the customs in Helsinki and today in the morning I called UPS and they didn't know why it was still at the customs. Then I finally got the call that they have my package in their delivery car and yes, I received it today although one day late!

If I get the bill of VAT according to the $190, I'm going to object and take it up with UPS, so that they'll use the price I actually paid in December when I ordered the box, when the USD was much weaker compared to the euro. This price I paid was 133,25 € so that would make 29,30€ in VAT. This way I'll save 4,30 € ! Yeeah

for the 10 billionth time :roll: : the VAT is calculated upon item + shipping.
So it'll NEVER be only on $100...at BEST it'll be on $150...but you can't prove the $50 (which is a brokered rate, not the full one you'd pay yourself and why they might estimate higher postage) without showing them the $140.
And the fact the exchange rate changed between time of purchase and delivery is also irrelevant to customs (UPS doesn't decide it, the rate is fixed by customs, for whole weeks or even month at a time)

dimitrispearljam

jeremy wrote:

well i'm from greece and i still haven't got Ten Re-Issue Super DeLuxe Edition package..not even a ups code has been sent to me..and what about these bullshit about paying 130 euros more than the 10c price..?this is is supposed to be a pj fan club and the whole package is already cheaper at other sites..(e.g.amazon)..and what about telling lies to us..?When 10C stated 50$ shipping, that should be all. They should've send it as simple mail package and not as merchandise or anything.....i've already sent 5 emails to 10 club with my order details and questions about my order and NO ANSWER..!!
i don't know what is going to happen but i've already regret ordering this package from 10c..and i'm really not bitter here but the worst of all is having thoughts about 10c..is this a fan club or just a company..?let me know...

to xasane to kouti patrioti,,,,

jmk

Pegasus wrote:

for the 10 billionth time :roll: : the VAT is calculated upon item + shipping.
So it'll NEVER be only on $100...at BEST it'll be on $150...but you can't prove the $50 (which is a brokered rate, not the full one you'd pay yourself and why they might estimate higher postage) without showing them the $140.
And the fact the exchange rate changed between time of purchase and delivery is also irrelevant to customs (UPS doesn't decide it, the rate is fixed by customs, for whole weeks or even month at a time)

I do know that according to law the VAT is calculated upon item+sipping, but has anyone officially (like Santos L Halper) said that we can forget about the $100 and use the $190 instead? And didn't Surfanddestroy write that "According to customs they can only calculate the charge by what has been declared $100."

When I spoke to UPS last Friday they told me that the value reported from Ten Club was $100 (as SLH did in the beginning of this thread), but has the "UPS/Ten Club mail exchange" led to the fact that UPS will now adjust all taxes according to the value of $190 and we will all have bills in our mail with the adjusted VATs?

As there was no value written on the box and no paper inside stating the real value, the only way is that UPS has changed the value they tell the customs/(or if they do the paperwork themselves at the customs) from $100 to $190.

With this big mess we can start speculating on the consequences of this what comes to Ten Clubs future deliveries of Pearl Jam goods.

a) I believe they might consider another partner than UPS

b) We can speculate what they do with the value printed on the box (if printed at all) or declared to the delivery firm. If UPS handles the customs clearance how was it possible that this real value came to their knowledge. I believe it's more a thing that the people at the customs would be interested in.

Why don't we ask Ten Club to next time declare a value of say $55 for a super deluxe set and we all keep quiet about it, so that we Europeans can have it a bit cheaper and won't have to pay VAT .

Yes and we do want the box and the shipping much cheaper next time, so we all don't go and by it somewhere else...

CharlieP

Just received my charge today...fuck UPS!

jmk

CharlieP wrote:

Just received my charge today...fuck UPS!

What value was the VAT was it based on?

Pegasus

jmk wrote:

Pegasus wrote:

for the 10 billionth time :roll: : the VAT is calculated upon item + shipping.
So it'll NEVER be only on $100...at BEST it'll be on $150...but you can't prove the $50 (which is a brokered rate, not the full one you'd pay yourself and why they might estimate higher postage) without showing them the $140.
And the fact the exchange rate changed between time of purchase and delivery is also irrelevant to customs (UPS doesn't decide it, the rate is fixed by customs, for whole weeks or even month at a time)

I do know that according to law the VAT is calculated upon item+sipping, but has anyone officially (like Santos L Halper) said that we can forget about the $100 and use the $190 instead? And didn't Surfanddestroy write that "According to customs they can only calculate the charge by what has been declared $100."

When I spoke to UPS last Friday they told me that the value reported from Ten Club was $100 (as SLH did in the beginning of this thread), but has the "UPS/Ten Club mail exchange" led to the fact that UPS will now adjust all taxes according to the value of $190 and we will all have bills in our mail with the adjusted VATs?

As there was no value written on the box and no paper inside stating the real value, the only way is that UPS has changed the value they tell the customs/(or if they do the paperwork themselves at the customs) from $100 to $190.

With this big mess we can start speculating on the consequences of this what comes to Ten Clubs future deliveries of Pearl Jam goods.

a) I believe they might consider another partner than UPS

b) We can speculate what they do with the value printed on the box (if printed at all) or declared to the delivery firm. If UPS handles the customs clearance how was it possible that this real value came to their knowledge. I believe it's more a thing that the people at the customs would be interested in.

Why don't we ask Ten Club to next time declare a value of say $55 for a super deluxe set and we all keep quiet about it, so that we Europeans can have it a bit cheaper and won't have to pay VAT .

Yes and we do want the box and the shipping much cheaper next time, so we all don't go and by it somewhere else...

the postage won't be cheaper for something this size. point. there's actually a possibility that 10c is subsidising it at $50. And you'd have the exact same problem with any of the courier (and no courier is a very risky proposition for 10c re insurance for something this expensive, plus most countries would have fees on regular mail anyway, as I showed you).
You're asking 10c to lie (technically they're probably not exactly lying with $100 as it's likely the cost of the boxset TO THEM and could plead ignorance on that basis, though it's meant to be the amount paid by the customer, but anything low enough to not get taxed would be a blatant lie and one very likely to get spotted..) which could lend them, or you, in trouble.

for those reasons I have and will buy that type of items from somewhere else.

CR65191

Refused the package and got a full refund. Thanks 10c.
Gonna buy it in local store. End of story for me.