***The Official Philadelphia Phillies 2012 Thread***

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  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,527
    And not for one player. And to think the pressure on Brown to step right in and compete was bad? If Olt's not hitting 30/90-ish by next year then everyone is demanding Amaro's head on a stake. You don't move Lee for one player.
  • jamminpearls
    jamminpearls Posts: 7,078
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    And not for one player. And to think the pressure on Brown to step right in and compete was bad? If Olt's not hitting 30/90-ish by next year then everyone is demanding Amaro's head on a stake. You don't move Lee for one player.
    Im sure it depends on how much $ we eat. There's no way any team will take on his deal without us paying some of it.
    Go Birds!!!!
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,527
    That's not true if it's someone like Texas or New York.

    But while we're at it - I think it's incredibly stupid to deal Lee right now, especially when you don't know what's up with Doc. So you deal Lee for whatever package of prospects, improve your offense...and now you've got who at the helm of your rotation - Hamels, a hobbled Halladay whom we don't know is still injured or declining, Worley, Kendrick, ? I don't know about all that.

    But whatever happens, I'm looking forward to it because this team needs to prepare to reload for next year.
  • jamminpearls
    jamminpearls Posts: 7,078
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    That's not true if it's someone like Texas or New York.

    But while we're at it - I think it's incredibly stupid to deal Lee right now, especially when you don't know what's up with Doc. So you deal Lee for whatever package of prospects, improve your offense...and now you've got who at the helm of your rotation - Hamels, a hobbled Halladay whom we don't know is still injured or declining, Worley, Kendrick, ? I don't know about all that.

    But whatever happens, I'm looking forward to it because this team needs to prepare to reload for next year.
    Time will tell. I agree that something needs to happen asap. I don't think either team would pick up his full salary especially texas. I could see NY because there Ny,but deff not Texas,even if they lose Hamilton.
    Go Birds!!!!
  • JK_Livin
    JK_Livin South Jersey Posts: 7,365
    Shit's a brewing!
    Alright, alright, alright!
    Tom O.
    "I never had any friends later on like the ones I had when I was twelve. Jesus, does anyone?"
    -The Writer
  • Johnny Abruzzo
    Johnny Abruzzo Philly Posts: 12,358
    It's ridiculous that everyone wants to trade Lee. Look, the guy hasn't been that great this season (but also not nearly as bad as his record would indicate), but this team is not going to win anything in 2013 without 3 top starters. There's nothing wrong with him, except maybe a lack of concentration, and maybe motivation (yeah he ought to be motivated by his $24M salary, but what're you gonna do?). If Doc (who's only signed thru next year, right?) isn't himself again you've got to build the roster around Hamels & Lee.

    2013 is likely this team's last chance at a title, and dealing Lee away loses you even that chance.

    The rest of 'em - Pence, Victorino, Pierre, Blanton - get rid of 'em.
    Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; Phila, PA 10/21/13; Phila,  PA 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24; Pittsburgh 5/16/25; Pittsburgh 5/18/25

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  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,527
    Johnny Abruzzo wrote:
    It's ridiculous that everyone wants to trade Lee. Look, the guy hasn't been that great this season (but also not nearly as bad as his record would indicate), but this team is not going to win anything in 2013 without 3 top starters. There's nothing wrong with him, except maybe a lack of concentration, and maybe motivation (yeah he ought to be motivated by his $24M salary, but what're you gonna do?). If Doc (who's only signed thru next year, right?) isn't himself again you've got to build the roster around Hamels & Lee.

    2013 is likely this team's last chance at a title, and dealing Lee away loses you even that chance.

    The rest of 'em - Pence, Victorino, Pierre, Blanton - get rid of 'em.

    Exactly.
  • jamminpearls
    jamminpearls Posts: 7,078
    Johnny Abruzzo wrote:
    It's ridiculous that everyone wants to trade Lee. Look, the guy hasn't been that great this season (but also not nearly as bad as his record would indicate), but this team is not going to win anything in 2013 without 3 top starters. There's nothing wrong with him, except maybe a lack of concentration, and maybe motivation (yeah he ought to be motivated by his $24M salary, but what're you gonna do?). If Doc (who's only signed thru next year, right?) isn't himself again you've got to build the roster around Hamels & Lee.

    2013 is likely this team's last chance at a title, and dealing Lee away loses you even that chance.

    The rest of 'em - Pence, Victorino, Pierre, Blanton - get rid of 'em.
    I don't disagree,I just think Olt's gonna be the real deal. And if we don't get him now, then we won't get him at all.
    Go Birds!!!!
  • jamminpearls
    jamminpearls Posts: 7,078
    The Fixer is Mr minor leaguer,I'd like to see what he thinks of Olt.
    Go Birds!!!!
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,527
    jamminpearls wrote:
    Johnny Abruzzo wrote:
    It's ridiculous that everyone wants to trade Lee. Look, the guy hasn't been that great this season (but also not nearly as bad as his record would indicate), but this team is not going to win anything in 2013 without 3 top starters. There's nothing wrong with him, except maybe a lack of concentration, and maybe motivation (yeah he ought to be motivated by his $24M salary, but what're you gonna do?). If Doc (who's only signed thru next year, right?) isn't himself again you've got to build the roster around Hamels & Lee.

    2013 is likely this team's last chance at a title, and dealing Lee away loses you even that chance.

    The rest of 'em - Pence, Victorino, Pierre, Blanton - get rid of 'em.
    I don't disagree,I just think Olt's gonna be the real deal. And if we don't get him now, then we won't get him at all.

    But what makes you think he's the real deal, other than looking up his stats on baseball reference or reading what some twit online says? Have you ever seen him play?


    Maybe he is, maybe he isn't, but giving up Lee for him alone is not worth it.
  • jamminpearls
    jamminpearls Posts: 7,078
    Not for Lee alone. But if they eat the whole deal then maybe. Olney said that not even NY could take on Lee's whole contrat. If we had to throw in 10-15 million then i'd think we would get another prospect or so.
    Never seen him play,but everything i read is that the dude's a beast.
    Go Birds!!!!
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,527
    Medical records for Blanton sent to Baltimore. So it looks like that's happening...
  • eeriepadave
    eeriepadave West Chester, PA Posts: 43,179
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    Medical records for Blanton sent to Baltimore. So it looks like that's happening...

    :|

    Who else is moving? Shane? Hunter? We all know Cliff is staying
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  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,527
    edited July 2012
    And looks like Victorino is on his way to the Dodgers for Josh Lindblom and a second player. I'd hope they could squeeze one more fringe prospect in there.
    Post edited by Jearlpam0925 on
  • MayDay10
    MayDay10 Posts: 11,852
    I wouldnt trade anyone.

    Just shut some guys down for the year if they want/necessary.
  • Johnny Abruzzo
    Johnny Abruzzo Philly Posts: 12,358
    Interesting stats on Lee in here:
    http://mlb.si.com/2012/07/30/cliff-lee-philadelphia-phillies-trade-deadline/?sct=hp_t13_a0&eref=sihp

    4.9 K's per BB is really good. (2nd in league)
    1.1 homers per 9 innings is lousy.
    .321 BABIP is just unlucky. That won't happen again in 2013. (well as long as we don't have Ty Wigginton at 3B)

    It's definitely been a mixed bag, but I would bank on a big rebound next year. Definitely not the time to trade him.
    Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; Phila, PA 10/21/13; Phila,  PA 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24; Pittsburgh 5/16/25; Pittsburgh 5/18/25

    Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,527
    MayDay10 wrote:
    I wouldnt trade anyone.

    Just shut some guys down for the year if they want/necessary.

    Eh, depends on the player. This team has neglected to address getting younger for a bit now, and rightfully they should - when they're in a pennant race. But now they're not, so it's the perfect time to improve areas that were absolutely awful this season(bullpen), restock the farm system, and let guys play who you need to see play without the pressure of a pennant race (shove Mayberry out there everyday, stick Brown in center and right, bring Cloyd up to pitch, continue to let the bullpen to implode - or shine, who knows?).

    Victorino I would actually look to keep over Pence, but that's just me. I figure the haul you get back for Pence will never live up to what they gave up, but he's not worth that coin. And I wouldn't mind keeping Shane on an arbitration deal for one year at about 12.5 mil OR letting him turn it down and take the draft picks.

    But you're right with guys like Halladay - rest him or pitch him every 6 days. But guys like Blanton and Pierre are definitely gone after this year, so it makes no sense to keep them.
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,527
    Johnny Abruzzo wrote:
    Interesting stats on Lee in here:
    http://mlb.si.com/2012/07/30/cliff-lee-philadelphia-phillies-trade-deadline/?sct=hp_t13_a0&eref=sihp

    4.9 K's per BB is really good. (2nd in league)
    1.1 homers per 9 innings is lousy.
    .321 BABIP is just unlucky. That won't happen again in 2013. (well as long as we don't have Ty Wigginton at 3B)

    It's definitely been a mixed bag, but I would bank on a big rebound next year. Definitely not the time to trade him.

    I think it's insane for them to trade Lee. It sends the wrong message within the organization, and with Halladay totally up in the air, you HAVE to have Lee on this roster.
  • Jearlpam0925
    Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 17,527
    But scratch my sentiment for just one exception - and just one: Justin Upton. I think Arizona is insane to want to trade this guy. But that's exactly the kind of player the Phils would love to have and that would be about the only deal I'd be on board with, yet it probably won't happen.

    In a weird way, I'm looking forward to the next two months and seeing guys like Brown and Cloyd come up to play everyday/pitch every 5th day.
  • Johnny Abruzzo
    Johnny Abruzzo Philly Posts: 12,358
    Jearlpam0925 wrote:
    But scratch my sentiment for just one exception - and just one: Justin Upton. I think Arizona is insane to want to trade this guy. But that's exactly the kind of player the Phils would love to have and that would be about the only deal I'd be on board with, yet it probably won't happen.

    In a weird way, I'm looking forward to the next two months and seeing guys like Brown and Cloyd come up to play everyday/pitch every 5th day.

    This is the problem with becoming the Yankees Of The National League. We never get to see any young & exciting players anymore.

    Of course, the actual Yankees never seem to drop off quite the way this team has. :roll:
    Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; Phila, PA 10/21/13; Phila,  PA 10/22/13; Baltimore Arena 10/27/13; Phila, PA 4/28/16; Phila, PA 4/29/16; Fenway Park 8/7/16; Fenway Park 9/2/18; Asbury Park 9/18/21; Camden 9/14/22; Las Vegas 5/16/24; Las Vegas 5/18/24; Phila, PA 9/7/24; Phila, PA 9/9/24; Baltimore Arena 9/12/24; Pittsburgh 5/16/25; Pittsburgh 5/18/25

    Tres Mtns - TLA 3/23/11; EV - Tower Theatre 6/25/11; Temple of the Dog - Tower Theatre 11/5/16
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