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***The Official Philadelphia Phillies 2012 Thread***

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    The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,469
    i remember reading werth's career average w/risp is .280 or something. and something like .333 from labor day on, this year, when we steamrolled past the braves. we're gonna miss him.


    if he ends up leaving i have two words for you: cody and ross (the first and third words there).
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,831
    i remember reading werth's career average w/risp is .280 or something. and something like .333 from labor day on, this year, when we steamrolled past the braves. we're gonna miss him.


    if he ends up leaving i have two words for you: cody and ross (the first and third words there).

    I wouldn't mind Ross, but I'd rather have Diaz.

    Actually, like I said, I'd go Cuddyer.
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    The Fixer wrote:
    Best offensive player? That's not saying much for this year. Plus, I'm giving that nod to Chooch.

    Dude, the guy hit 100 something with RISP. The dude padded his stats with what will help him get a contract. Teams can't deny avg., homers, and ribbies when signing a guy - even if they're flawed stats. He one of only a few players to stay healthy all year though. Also, I really wouldn't be surprised if they worked something out to bring him back, but I'm not holding my breath.

    I think Ibanez and Rollins have bounce back years.

    There have been studies on fangraphs.com that show that BA w/RISP is a fluke stat...there's no correlation to a players BA w/RISP from year to year.

    Chooch was good this year, but he hits 8th. If I had to guess, I'd say werth's OPS was higher.

    Rollins can't be any worse. I think ibanez can and will be worse.

    Should be an interesting offseason. I think the chances of werth coming back are less than 5%. Who knows though...amaro has proven he loves overpaying for free agents (and even worse, guys that will be free agents in 2 years. he should be fired for that contract alone)

    Dude, I'm a proponent of stats, but don't nerd it up even further. An ENTIRE season of hitting below the mendoza line with RISP is damn well indicative of something. Do me a favor and look up Werth's numbers from June on. I bet they're uuuuuugly. If it wasn't for his blazing start, his numbers are absolutely hollow. If anything, I'll go out on a limb and say the biggest benefactor of this lineup over the last three years is Werth. If he's depended upon to be the 3 hole or 4 hole hitter in a lineup will be disappointed.

    Hitting 8th in an NL lineup is the most difficult place to hit - you're given nothing but junk to hit. Chooch's on-base was .400 I think and hit around .300. And all I can ever remember of anything this year, is him coming through in the clutch.

    yeah, whatever this is a pretty dumb debate. I know the 8th spot is the most difficult place to hit. You also have to remember that you get walked a lot in the 8th spot, which boosts your OBP. THat said, ruiz did have a good year. I think werth was their best offensive player this year...even with his awful midseason slump.

    Anyway, we can move on and try to guess what this team does to fill their existing holes in the OF and bullpen.
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,831
    Actually, why does Cot's have Cuddyer a free agent this year, but reference has him at 2012. Looks like he's locked up for 2011 at 10.5 mil. I'd go Diaz and Podsednik, I wouldn't mind that.
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    i remember reading werth's career average w/risp is .280 or something. and something like .333 from labor day on, this year, when we steamrolled past the braves. we're gonna miss him.


    if he ends up leaving i have two words for you: cody and ross (the first and third words there).

    I wouldn't mind Ross, but I'd rather have Diaz.

    Actually, like I said, I'd go Cuddyer.

    eh, they're all pretty much the same to me. ross isn't a great OFer, but he can play CF in a pinch. Gotta think the giants are gonna feel some pressure to bring him back. gun to my head I'd probably pick him first. I'd take endy chavez over francoeur

    I just want the WS to end so the hot stove season can get started
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    Actually, why does Cot's have Cuddyer a free agent this year, but reference has him at 2012. Looks like he's locked up for 2011 at 10.5 mil. I'd go Diaz and Podsednik, I wouldn't mind that.

    probably a team option on cuddyer

    you sign 2 OFers and then you've got six guys, including dom brown. victorino, crust, francisco, brown, FA 1, FA 2.

    don't see that happening unless they trade someone
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    neilybabes86neilybabes86 Posts: 16,057
    how bout jeter for you guys ?
    i post on the board of a band that doesn't exsist anymore .......i need my head examined.......
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,831
    The Fixer wrote:
    Actually, why does Cot's have Cuddyer a free agent this year, but reference has him at 2012. Looks like he's locked up for 2011 at 10.5 mil. I'd go Diaz and Podsednik, I wouldn't mind that.

    probably a team option on cuddyer

    you sign 2 OFers and then you've got six guys, including dom brown. victorino, crust, francisco, brown, FA 1, FA 2.

    don't see that happening unless they trade someone

    Thing is I don't see Brown coming up until June 1st.
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    The Fixer wrote:
    Actually, why does Cot's have Cuddyer a free agent this year, but reference has him at 2012. Looks like he's locked up for 2011 at 10.5 mil. I'd go Diaz and Podsednik, I wouldn't mind that.

    probably a team option on cuddyer

    you sign 2 OFers and then you've got six guys, including dom brown. victorino, crust, francisco, brown, FA 1, FA 2.

    don't see that happening unless they trade someone

    Thing is I don't see Brown coming up until June 1st.

    then you've still got 6 OFs. Ibanez and brown aren't going anywhere, so you'd be looking at a victorino or francisco trade. possible I guess. I just don't see them going into the season with 5 OFs (assuming brown does start at LHV, which I agree with)
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    how bout jeter for you guys ?

    that's the kind of player amaro targets. an aging player that will give the team diminishing returns on his investment. 4 years, 70 million and a no trade clause. I can see amaro making this happen.
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    keith law chat today

    Dan (Atlantic City)Have you seen Justin DeFratus pitch yet? Can he contribute in the Phils' bullpen in 2011?

    KlawYes, good arm, should help in the next 18 months.

    Dave (San Diego)Can you think of a more bone-headed contract extension in recent memory than Amaro's decision to extend Howard 2 years before he had to at a ridiculously overvalued price? Howards walk % is even declining already....this is going to look even more awful in 3 years and hell still have three years left on the deal.

    KlawIf only someone had said that at the time...
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    Johnny AbruzzoJohnny Abruzzo Philly Posts: 10,742
    The Fixer wrote:
    Dave (San Diego)Can you think of a more bone-headed contract extension in recent memory than Amaro's decision to extend Howard 2 years before he had to at a ridiculously overvalued price? Howards walk % is even declining already....this is going to look even more awful in 3 years and hell still have three years left on the deal.

    KlawIf only someone had said that at the time...

    The endless debate...

    Seriously, Howard was having a really good year before the ankle injury. He was never the same after that. That said, it's no excuse for him not coming back to form - he had enough time.

    Re: Cody Ross... You don't want to overpay for guys who just had a great postseason. See Dave Roberts. That's a classic trap.
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    The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,469
    The Fixer wrote:
    Dave (San Diego)Can you think of a more bone-headed contract extension in recent memory than Amaro's decision to extend Howard 2 years before he had to at a ridiculously overvalued price? Howards walk % is even declining already....this is going to look even more awful in 3 years and hell still have three years left on the deal.

    KlawIf only someone had said that at the time...

    The endless debate...

    Seriously, Howard was having a really good year before the ankle injury. He was never the same after that. That said, it's no excuse for him not coming back to form - he had enough time.

    Re: Cody Ross... You don't want to overpay for guys who just had a great postseason. See Dave Roberts. That's a classic trap.

    very true.

    and dave roberts....the weather guy? i heard he retired...
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    Gary CarterGary Carter Shea Stadium Posts: 14,002
    The Fixer wrote:
    Dave (San Diego)Can you think of a more bone-headed contract extension in recent memory than Amaro's decision to extend Howard 2 years before he had to at a ridiculously overvalued price? Howards walk % is even declining already....this is going to look even more awful in 3 years and hell still have three years left on the deal.

    KlawIf only someone had said that at the time...

    The endless debate...

    Seriously, Howard was having a really good year before the ankle injury. He was never the same after that. That said, it's no excuse for him not coming back to form - he had enough time.

    Re: Cody Ross... You don't want to overpay for guys who just had a great postseason. See Dave Roberts. That's a classic trap.

    I'd call it the carlos beltran trap

    U guys are seriously talking bout endy chavez in the of, that's funny. Guys done shit cept make one of the greatest catches in mets franchise history.
    Ron: I just don't feel like going out tonight
    Sammi: Wanna just break up?

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    neilybabes86neilybabes86 Posts: 16,057
    metsfan wrote:
    The Fixer wrote:
    Dave (San Diego)Can you think of a more bone-headed contract extension in recent memory than Amaro's decision to extend Howard 2 years before he had to at a ridiculously overvalued price? Howards walk % is even declining already....this is going to look even more awful in 3 years and hell still have three years left on the deal.

    KlawIf only someone had said that at the time...

    The endless debate...

    Seriously, Howard was having a really good year before the ankle injury. He was never the same after that. That said, it's no excuse for him not coming back to form - he had enough time.

    Re: Cody Ross... You don't want to overpay for guys who just had a great postseason. See Dave Roberts. That's a classic trap.

    I'd call it the carlos beltran trap

    U guys are seriously talking bout endy chavez in the of, that's funny. Guys done shit cept make one of the greatest catches in mets franchise history.


    big day for the mets...new gm press conference :lol:
    i post on the board of a band that doesn't exsist anymore .......i need my head examined.......
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    Johnny AbruzzoJohnny Abruzzo Philly Posts: 10,742
    metsfan wrote:
    I'd call it the carlos beltran trap

    U guys are seriously talking bout endy chavez in the of, that's funny. Guys done shit cept make one of the greatest catches in mets franchise history.

    I think Chavez was here and was terrible. Then he went to, what Montreal or the Mets or something, and absolutely killed us. At the time I don't think I ever hated a ballplayer that much before.
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    The JugglerThe Juggler Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,469
    metsfan wrote:
    I'd call it the carlos beltran trap

    U guys are seriously talking bout endy chavez in the of, that's funny. Guys done shit cept make one of the greatest catches in mets franchise history.

    I think Chavez was here and was terrible. Then he went to, what Montreal or the Mets or something, and absolutely killed us. At the time I don't think I ever hated a ballplayer that much before.

    i miss the expos
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837

    big day for the mets...new gm press conference :lol:

    alderson is the best signing they've had this decade. I miss omar already
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    reports from the Arizona Fall League. One good, one not so good. Looking forward to seeing these guys in clearwater in a few months. Phils need some cheap arms in the pen


    Justin De Fratus, Philadelphia Phillies: De Fratus absolutely looks like a big league bullpen arm, with a 92-95 mph fastball that has touched 96 once when I've seen him, and good tilt on an 83-85 mph slider that can get strikeouts. A strong pitcher with a good frame who uses his lower half well, De Fratus does a good job finishing his pitches. De Fratus isn't far away from a call-up and looks like he could fill a seventh- or eighth-inning role at the big league level, and from there anything can happen. Then again, he's also in an organization that left Scott Mathieson behind to dominate Triple-A hitters all year.

    B.J. Rosenberg, Phillies: Rosenberg appeared in only 20 games this season due to a lat strain, so we can give him a bit of a pass if he's still getting up to speed. In one of his outings I saw, he gave up three homers in four batters, all on poorly located fastballs. He has been working in the 91-92 mph range and occasionally touching 93, but with not a lot of movement on it. His low-80s slider projects to "solid average," and his 80-81 mph changeup has been below average. I'm just not seeing good stuff or command right now.
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,831
    The Fixer wrote:
    reports from the Arizona Fall League. One good, one not so good. Looking forward to seeing these guys in clearwater in a few months. Phils need some cheap arms in the pen


    Justin De Fratus, Philadelphia Phillies: De Fratus absolutely looks like a big league bullpen arm, with a 92-95 mph fastball that has touched 96 once when I've seen him, and good tilt on an 83-85 mph slider that can get strikeouts. A strong pitcher with a good frame who uses his lower half well, De Fratus does a good job finishing his pitches. De Fratus isn't far away from a call-up and looks like he could fill a seventh- or eighth-inning role at the big league level, and from there anything can happen. Then again, he's also in an organization that left Scott Mathieson behind to dominate Triple-A hitters all year.

    B.J. Rosenberg, Phillies: Rosenberg appeared in only 20 games this season due to a lat strain, so we can give him a bit of a pass if he's still getting up to speed. In one of his outings I saw, he gave up three homers in four batters, all on poorly located fastballs. He has been working in the 91-92 mph range and occasionally touching 93, but with not a lot of movement on it. His low-80s slider projects to "solid average," and his 80-81 mph changeup has been below average. I'm just not seeing good stuff or command right now.

    Didn't I read somewhere that they're most likely going to have De Fratus in the pen next season?

    Fixer, you wouldn't happen to frequent Barnaby's? We usually end up there late night after putting on a load and heading back to my buddy's house. Anyway, my point is if you want to get away with anything barring murder that is the place to be.
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    The Fixer wrote:
    reports from the Arizona Fall League. One good, one not so good. Looking forward to seeing these guys in clearwater in a few months. Phils need some cheap arms in the pen


    Justin De Fratus, Philadelphia Phillies: De Fratus absolutely looks like a big league bullpen arm, with a 92-95 mph fastball that has touched 96 once when I've seen him, and good tilt on an 83-85 mph slider that can get strikeouts. A strong pitcher with a good frame who uses his lower half well, De Fratus does a good job finishing his pitches. De Fratus isn't far away from a call-up and looks like he could fill a seventh- or eighth-inning role at the big league level, and from there anything can happen. Then again, he's also in an organization that left Scott Mathieson behind to dominate Triple-A hitters all year.

    B.J. Rosenberg, Phillies: Rosenberg appeared in only 20 games this season due to a lat strain, so we can give him a bit of a pass if he's still getting up to speed. In one of his outings I saw, he gave up three homers in four batters, all on poorly located fastballs. He has been working in the 91-92 mph range and occasionally touching 93, but with not a lot of movement on it. His low-80s slider projects to "solid average," and his 80-81 mph changeup has been below average. I'm just not seeing good stuff or command right now.

    Didn't I read somewhere that they're most likely going to have De Fratus in the pen next season?

    Fixer, you wouldn't happen to frequent Barnaby's? We usually end up there late night after putting on a load and heading back to my buddy's house. Anyway, my point is if you want to get away with anything barring murder that is the place to be.

    DeFratus has really been gaining traction as a bullpen prospect. He'll be a candidate for a spot in spring training.

    I can walk to barnaby's from my house. I wouldn't say I go there a lot, but I've been there a few times. Not a big fan of that place, but it's convenient for me.

    Me, my brother, and a buddy went there one night to pre-game. Forget where we were going, but we were only there for an hour to hour and half. They had coronas on special so we were all drinking them. Right as we were walked out the door my brother got sick in the parking lot. Me and my boy were busting his balls since we had only had a few beers (ie nowhere near enough to get sick off of). Long story short, by the end of the night we all got violently ill. I was laid up on my couch until 10:00 the next night. so now if I go there I stick to miller lite bottles.

    If you're ever going there, give me a head's up
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,831
    The Fixer wrote:
    DeFratus has really been gaining traction as a bullpen prospect. He'll be a candidate for a spot in spring training.

    I can walk to barnaby's from my house. I wouldn't say I go there a lot, but I've been there a few times. Not a big fan of that place, but it's convenient for me.

    Me, my brother, and a buddy went there one night to pre-game. Forget where we were going, but we were only there for an hour to hour and half. They had coronas on special so we were all drinking them. Right as we were walked out the door my brother got sick in the parking lot. Me and my boy were busting his balls since we had only had a few beers (ie nowhere near enough to get sick off of). Long story short, by the end of the night we all got violently ill. I was laid up on my couch until 10:00 the next night. so now if I go there I stick to miller lite bottles.

    If you're ever going there, give me a head's up

    Word. Yeah, we were there Saturday night after coming back from the city for a Halloween party. And, well, let's just say, things got outta hand.
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    The Fixer wrote:
    DeFratus has really been gaining traction as a bullpen prospect. He'll be a candidate for a spot in spring training.

    I can walk to barnaby's from my house. I wouldn't say I go there a lot, but I've been there a few times. Not a big fan of that place, but it's convenient for me.

    Me, my brother, and a buddy went there one night to pre-game. Forget where we were going, but we were only there for an hour to hour and half. They had coronas on special so we were all drinking them. Right as we were walked out the door my brother got sick in the parking lot. Me and my boy were busting his balls since we had only had a few beers (ie nowhere near enough to get sick off of). Long story short, by the end of the night we all got violently ill. I was laid up on my couch until 10:00 the next night. so now if I go there I stick to miller lite bottles.

    If you're ever going there, give me a head's up

    Word. Yeah, we were there Saturday night after coming back from the city for a Halloween party. And, well, let's just say, things got outta hand.

    haha, sounds like my kind of time. you should have seen me at Penn St this weekend. I bought a 2 foot top hat off some kid for 10 bucks because I thought it looked cool. this was at around 5:00, so I wore the thing for the entire night. damn, I miss college
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    Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 33,659
    Davey Lopes is gone
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    Cliffy6745Cliffy6745 Posts: 33,659
    We just had a difference of opinion on what I felt my worth was. That’s all. It was a really tough decision because I loved my time in Philadelphia, I loved working for Charlie Manuel, and I have the utmost respect for everyone in that organization. I can’t say enough about how much I enjoyed my time in Philadelphia. I am really going to miss the atmosphere and the passion.

    Believe me, I wasn’t looking to break the bank. I just think sometimes you get pigeonholed as a first-base coach, and I think I had a lot more responsibility than that. I guess you could say it’s a principle type thing. But I move on without hard feelings. I mean that. My time in Philadelphia was great.
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,831
    Well, that sucks. Integral to the running game. I figure he might want another shot at managing.

    Might be an opportune time to bring Bo back. Put Perlozzo at 1st and put ol' Lar back at 3rd.
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    Johnny AbruzzoJohnny Abruzzo Philly Posts: 10,742
    The Fixer wrote:
    reports from the Arizona Fall League. One good, one not so good. Looking forward to seeing these guys in clearwater in a few months. Phils need some cheap arms in the pen


    Justin De Fratus, Philadelphia Phillies: De Fratus absolutely looks like a big league bullpen arm, with a 92-95 mph fastball that has touched 96 once when I've seen him, and good tilt on an 83-85 mph slider that can get strikeouts. A strong pitcher with a good frame who uses his lower half well, De Fratus does a good job finishing his pitches. De Fratus isn't far away from a call-up and looks like he could fill a seventh- or eighth-inning role at the big league level, and from there anything can happen. Then again, he's also in an organization that left Scott Mathieson behind to dominate Triple-A hitters all year.

    B.J. Rosenberg, Phillies: Rosenberg appeared in only 20 games this season due to a lat strain, so we can give him a bit of a pass if he's still getting up to speed. In one of his outings I saw, he gave up three homers in four batters, all on poorly located fastballs. He has been working in the 91-92 mph range and occasionally touching 93, but with not a lot of movement on it. His low-80s slider projects to "solid average," and his 80-81 mph changeup has been below average. I'm just not seeing good stuff or command right now.

    This team needs some fresh blood, everwhere but especially in the bullpen. As Fixer likes to note, big contracts will both keep that from happening and force it to happen. I hope we don't see anymore silly signings like Danys Baez this offseason. Declining the Romero option was a good start. Bastardo should be a solid LOOGY.
    Well, that sucks. Integral to the running game. I figure he might want another shot at managing.

    Might be an opportune time to bring Bo back. Put Perlozzo at 1st and put ol' Lar back at 3rd.

    Phils continued to have a great stolen base percentage this year, but at times in the playoffs baserunners inexplicably stayed anchored to first base against pitchers who couldn't hold anybody on, in a series where every run was precious. I thought Lopes was in full control, and they were not aggressive enough this year at baserunning. So maybe it's not that tough of a loss. If we steal 70% next year, we know it was a big loss.
    Spectrum 10/27/09; New Orleans JazzFest 5/1/10; Made in America 9/2/12; WF Center 10/21/13; WF Center 10/22/13;
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    Well, that sucks. Integral to the running game. I figure he might want another shot at managing.

    Might be an opportune time to bring Bo back. Put Perlozzo at 1st and put ol' Lar back at 3rd.

    that would be awesome. they should bring him back to manage the team
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    Jearlpam0925Jearlpam0925 Deep South Philly Posts: 16,831
    The Fixer wrote:
    Well, that sucks. Integral to the running game. I figure he might want another shot at managing.

    Might be an opportune time to bring Bo back. Put Perlozzo at 1st and put ol' Lar back at 3rd.

    that would be awesome. they should bring him back to manage the team

    Eh. Never too big of a fan when he was the manager, but he was exactly what they needed at the time. I read that he didn't want to manage again, but boy, him being 3rd base coach again would be pretty awesome.

    Saw that there's interest in Juan Samuel and Mariano Duncan too. I'm cool with those as well.
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    The FixerThe Fixer Posts: 12,837
    The Fixer wrote:
    reports from the Arizona Fall League. One good, one not so good. Looking forward to seeing these guys in clearwater in a few months. Phils need some cheap arms in the pen


    Justin De Fratus, Philadelphia Phillies: De Fratus absolutely looks like a big league bullpen arm, with a 92-95 mph fastball that has touched 96 once when I've seen him, and good tilt on an 83-85 mph slider that can get strikeouts. A strong pitcher with a good frame who uses his lower half well, De Fratus does a good job finishing his pitches. De Fratus isn't far away from a call-up and looks like he could fill a seventh- or eighth-inning role at the big league level, and from there anything can happen. Then again, he's also in an organization that left Scott Mathieson behind to dominate Triple-A hitters all year.

    B.J. Rosenberg, Phillies: Rosenberg appeared in only 20 games this season due to a lat strain, so we can give him a bit of a pass if he's still getting up to speed. In one of his outings I saw, he gave up three homers in four batters, all on poorly located fastballs. He has been working in the 91-92 mph range and occasionally touching 93, but with not a lot of movement on it. His low-80s slider projects to "solid average," and his 80-81 mph changeup has been below average. I'm just not seeing good stuff or command right now.

    This team needs some fresh blood, everwhere but especially in the bullpen. As Fixer likes to note, big contracts will both keep that from happening and force it to happen. I hope we don't see anymore silly signings like Danys Baez this offseason. Declining the Romero option was a good start. Bastardo should be a solid LOOGY.
    Well, that sucks. Integral to the running game. I figure he might want another shot at managing.

    Might be an opportune time to bring Bo back. Put Perlozzo at 1st and put ol' Lar back at 3rd.

    Phils continued to have a great stolen base percentage this year, but at times in the playoffs baserunners inexplicably stayed anchored to first base against pitchers who couldn't hold anybody on, in a series where every run was precious. I thought Lopes was in full control, and they were not aggressive enough this year at baserunning. So maybe it's not that tough of a loss. If we steal 70% next year, we know it was a big loss.

    well victorino and rollins weren't on base to steal this postseason.

    I'm not sold on bastardo. He has potential because he throws hard, but his offspeed stuff is below average. Apparently there are a bunch of free agent LOOGYs available. Hopefully they can find a relatively cheap one.

    I wouldn't mind seeing contreras back on another one year deal as long as he doesn't expect much of a raise.
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