why is it . . .

Heineken Helen

Just as when people presume to know somebody and what experiences they've had based on the facts they choose to reveal about themselves, which is all we can do online, but don't assume that because somebody has not experienced something, they know nothing about it or have an invalid opinion.

Anyway I've made my points... think what you like

Heineken Helen

comebackgirl wrote:

I think it's possible to relate to someone else's experience even if you haven't experienced something similar yourself, as long as you give the other person the the opportunity to tell you what the experience was like for them...and then you can pull upon similar emotions/reactions/etc that you have had in other situations to develop an understanding. You will never really *know* what it was like for them...but you can absolutely relate and empathize.

Likewise, I think 2 people could have very similar experiences (going through a divorce/being an addict/losing a child) and your experience is going to still be very different from the other person's because there are so many other factors that affect these situations and the way they effect us...so again...even if you've gone through it yourself, you'll never really *know* what it was like for someone else, although you certainly may have a bit more insight, etc. My mother and I have both gone through divorces...our experiences of these situations could not be more different...we can both relate to some of the elements, but on others we are worlds apart.

I agree - all opinions are welcome...a lot of times they give me an opportunity to think about something in a way I haven't considered...and I'm always open to hearing other people's perspectives...it helps me understand them and the world better....but yeah...when it comes off as the *only* way or the way it *should* be done then it's really annoying. It's also interesting to note that some people who are the first to come off as an *expert* are also quick to dismiss everyone else's advice and opinions when offered.

well said

comebackwoman

Heineken Helen wrote:

Just as when people presume to know somebody and what experiences they've had based on the facts they choose to reveal about themselves, which is all we can do online, but don't assume that because somebody has not experienced something, they know nothing about it or have an invalid opinion.

Anyway I've made my points... think what you like

I agree with this too...we all choose what we want to reveal about ourselves...both online and in real life...so sometimes people don't have the full picture about us or our experiences...Some people may be comfortable being really open and painting a complete picture...and others may choose just to give little glimpses. Naturally people's perecptions are going to be based on what they DO know about us...but that may not always be accurate.

decides2dream

GreenTeaDisease wrote:

come off f-ing off it, D2D.

You know what really annoys me? People who think that they have the right to determine the validity of another's opinion and think that they have the right to restrict who responds to posts in a public message board. Seeing as how this entire forum has become about marriage and parenting (lame!), under your rules, oh Great Righteous Leader, no one else would ever be allowed to post.

By the way, Your Holiness, I am 30, and I have been in several romantic relationships, probably a lot more than you, and yes, they have been longer than six-months, [insert name calling]. And let's see, hmm, I also LIVE ON THIS PLANET and have the same experiences as anyone else. Furthermore, I have NEVER ONCE purported to be an "expert" on anything. And guess what? NEITHER ARE YOU. Just because one is married does not make them an expert on marriage, sorry to pop your little bubble. In a legal sense, an expert usually has a PhD on the topic and over 10 years experience. Therefore, if we all follow Your Holiness' rules here that only "experts" can post, then we'd have about 2 threads going with no responses. GET OVER IT- my opinion is as valid as your's. And you know what???? It's an f-ing message board. We're killing time here...WHY DO YOU EVEN CARE???

funny you think this thread is dedicated to you. i wonder why? it is in fact not. sure some of your posts may fall under this imo.....but plenty of others do too. believe me, i would NOT start a thread about you. so perhaps you should ge tover yourself there? this was a civil and interesting discussion for many, and it was NEVER *personal* towards anyone.....you chose to make it so. perhaps if you stopped thinking the world is focused on YOU...might serve you well. believe me, i am well aware it 'aint' all about me'...it's a good way to think, or not...all choice eh?

i am discussing a topic of interest to ME.
i have never said i am an *expert* on ANYthing...and i have never told anyone here how to go about living their lives, etc. if someone asks for advice, i may or may not offer it.....based on my personal perspective. and obviously, you've missed my points entirely, so it's a fruitless discussion. i did NOT say only *experts* should post, not at ALL. i just DISLIKE when some come off AS 'experts'...when clearly they are not, most of us are not....but some do not even possess the first-hand perspective of cetain topics.


agree, disagree.....it's all good.


do not mistake interest for 'caring'...tis not the same.
this place interests me, how and why people chose to post and share what they do, interests me. i also find it VERy interesting when threads are directed at a specific demographic and more outside that demographic chime in than not. *I* find it interesting.




helen, i agree with you. however, for certain things....doesn't matter WHAt one may choose to share or not, b/c unless they are outright LYING....as i said, for certain things, one just can't *know* without firsthand knowledge. we all can have opinions, even WELL informed opinions...but we cannot 100% fully know something we hav never fully experienced, such as what it's like to lose your spouse after 30 years, what it's like to lose a child, what it feels like to use heroin, what it's like to BE an addict, what it's like to be rped, etc, etc. yes...we all can know lots and lots.....but for somethings, 'knowing' and experiencing...not the same.

GreenTeaDisease

Heineken Helen wrote:

Just as when people presume to know somebody and what experiences they've had based on the facts they choose to reveal about themselves, which is all we can do online, but don't assume that because somebody has not experienced something, they know nothing about it or have an invalid opinion.

Anyway I've made my points... think what you like

spot on.

and conversely, just because someone HAS experienced something, you can't assume they know all about it.

Jeanie

decides2dream wrote:

jeanie...thank you.


i LOVE this post.



and it ain't just 'young and bulletproff'...hahaha......but sure, i think that does come into play. haha.


and the young
they cannot see beyond...today
the wisdom the old can't give away


again tho, don't want to make this 'ageist'...b/c really that is NOT what it's about. there could be a 50 year old on here, no long-term relationships...no kids....no experience with LOTs of things, and still be the personality to *lecture* us/others on HOW 'things should be'...how to live our lives, conduct our relationships, raise children, etc. and sure...well within their 'rights' to say as they please. i just also reserve the right to find it annoying.


just like i take no issue with those who find my long posts annoying. it's all good.






obviously, i can't know for EVERYthing, but for certain subjects...it's kinda obvious. if a person asks 'who has been divorced'....and then a bunch of 22 year olds, never married all post...kinda know they're not *experts* eh? even if they are children of divorce, they do not have first-hand knowledge of what it is like to BE divorced. it's a different perspective. just one example. dunky's example of people looking for advice from PARENTS, and then those who are NOT parents, even with LOTS of life experience with children....still not quite the same as BEING a parent. also, usually, if someone DOES possess some expertise, they usually will say something like....oh i have studied X for X amount of years......or i have lived like that, etc, etc. again, dosn't make them *expert* necessarily......but it does give em a bit *more*...than someone who admits they have no experience at all, no? sorry, i just don't think a single 20 year old can really be an *expert* on what it's LIKE to be married for 20 years. EVEN if said 20 year old is in the midst of psych study of such a topic....just sayin'. i cannot know what it's like to lose a child, to give birth, to be an alcoholic, etc, etc...i have NO life experience. do i know people who have lost a child, given birth, are alcoholics, lost spouses, etc? sure. but that doesn't make me an *expert*...that's all.

Well expertise is subjective anyway. Even the experts don't agree.

Good, bad or just plain annoying I reckon we can all learn something from everyone because we're all unique. Like you said it's all good.

And if I'm annoyed or irritated I just say so, but only with what is said and not with the person so much. Granted some folk annoy me more than others, but I find that a bit of a challenge anyway. Forces me to try to think outside the box, try to see where someone is coming from and that's not a bad thing. Of course I figure I'm old enough now to be cranky when I damn well feel like and folks should be able to accept it for what it is and not get all caught up in a feud mentality but that's for them to decide. There will be people in this life of mine that get me, that challenge me to think and that understand that I may not always like what they've got to say and there are those who won't. Most days I just let it wash over me but I don't mind debating when I'm in the mood. I guess bottom line nobody likes a know it all, constantly lecturing but one would have to wonder what's missing in their life that they feel the need anyway.

westsidepie

comebackgirl wrote:

I agree with this too...we all choose what we want to reveal about ourselves...both online and in real life...so sometimes people don't have the full picture about us or our experiences...Some people may be comfortable being really open and painting a complete picture...and others may choose just to give little glimpses. Naturally people's perecptions are going to be based on what they DO know about us...but that may not always be accurate.

In the japanese tradition of Bushido, it is said that a person has seven faces and three hearts. The heart they show to the world, the heart they show to their family, and the heart that is shared with no one.

PJaddicted

I'm one of the oldest people on the Board...and I can honestly tell you the older I get....the less I know! I only know what I'm living and have lived...that is it. Until I walk in someone elses shoes....I will never judge another human being.

Luv you D2D, you always have interesting takes on life.

oxc

Heineken Helen

comebackgirl wrote:

I agree with this too...we all choose what we want to reveal about ourselves...both online and in real life...so sometimes people don't have the full picture about us or our experiences...Some people may be comfortable being really open and painting a complete picture...and others may choose just to give little glimpses. Naturally people's perecptions are going to be based on what they DO know about us...but that may not always be accurate.

Exactly! I'm pretty open about talking about myself and my experiences here... but I will not mention any experiences that may put a loved one in a bad light or simply reveal something about somebody else. For this reason, you may not always have the full picture. And yes, all we CAN do is judge somebody on the information they share with us... and I'm as guilty of that as anyone... but it's not necessarily the right thing to do.

Heineken Helen

decides2dream wrote:

helen, i agree with you. however, for certain things....doesn't matter WHAt one may choose to share or not, b/c unless they are outright LYING....as i said, for certain things, one just can't *know* without firsthand knowledge. we all can have opinions, even WELL informed opinions...but we cannot 100% fully know something we hav never fully experienced, such as what it's like to lose your spouse after 30 years, what it's like to lose a child, what it feels like to use heroin, what it's like to BE an addict, what it's like to be rped, etc, etc. yes...we all can know lots and lots.....but for somethings, 'knowing' and experiencing...not the same.

I can tell you I have never lied here... I just haven't revealed the FULL truth about many things, which I'm sure is true of most people here! Most of it I would tell you if we were face to face... but certainly not online... and not when it reveals stuff about other people who may not want it to be revealed.

comebackwoman

westsidepie wrote:

In the japanese tradition of Bushido, it is said that a person has seven faces and three hearts. The heart they show to the world, the heart they show to their family, and the heart that is shared with no one.

I like that - I think that's pretty accurate.

Heineken Helen wrote:

Exactly! I'm pretty open about talking about myself and my experiences here... but I will not mention any experiences that may put a loved one in a bad light or simply reveal something about somebody else. For this reason, you may not always have the full picture. And yes, all we CAN do is judge somebody on the information they share with us... and I'm as guilty of that as anyone... but it's not necessarily the right thing to do.

I'm really open about some things...and really closed about others...I know I don't always give people a full picture...but sometimes that's just good judgment.

Heineken Helen

comebackgirl wrote:

I like that - I think that's pretty accurate.


I'm really open about some things...and really closed about others...I know I don't always give people a full picture...but sometimes that's just good judgment.

Exactly! You never know who's reading this... there are some things best not said on an internet message board read by thousands of people :eek:

comebackwoman

GreenTeaDisease wrote:

spot on.

and conversely, just because someone HAS experienced something, you can't assume they know all about it.

I agree. No 2 people's experiences are ever the same...no matter how similar...there are so many details that make them different...and while you may be able to relate on some levels you can't really *know* what it was like for someone else.

GreenTeaDisease

Heineken Helen wrote:

Exactly! I'm pretty open about talking about myself and my experiences here... but I will not mention any experiences that may put a loved one in a bad light or simply reveal something about somebody else.

me too. I have mentioned a few nameless friends, but I feel pretty bad that when it slips out- I enjoy telling stories and sometimes that gets the better of me. However I draw the line at discussing anything important about my close family and friends- I NEVER will discuss things like illness or death...it just doesn't seem right to me to put things as serious as that down on a place like this, and to discuss other people that far in depth. Other people are fine with that, so that's fine. Most of us have a line we draw.

decides2dream

PJaddicted wrote:

I'm one of the oldest people on the Board...and I can honestly tell you the older I get....the less I know! I only know what I'm living and have lived...that is it. Until I walk in someone elses shoes....I will never judge another human being.

Luv you D2D, you always have interesting takes on life.

oxc

thanks pj.
i don't know how 'interesting' my thought process is, it's just *is* my thought process, and i can't help but wonder about a lot of things. i actualy really ENJOY my wonderment...and sure...this board is GREAT for sharing/discussing such eh? for better or for worse.....haha.

and i agree! the older i get, the less i feel 'certain' about things. i think jeanie touched upon that as well. tis so true. i have found i am a lot more 'open' to different ways of thought, living, choices, etc.


luv ya too!

GreenTeaDisease

decides2dream wrote:

funny you think this thread is dedicated to you. i wonder why? it is in fact not. sure some of your posts may fall under this imo.....but plenty of others do too. believe me, i would NOT start a thread about you. so perhaps you should ge tover yourself there?

yeah right, how stupid do you think I am? I saw exactly when this thread appeared yesterday. and a bunch of people responded by referring directly to me. You're just covering your ass so you don't get banned. I love when people start threads for the purpose of bashing someone else in the third person. It's so mature and sophisticated. takes me right back to the fourth grade school yard.

decides2dream

Jeanie wrote:

Well expertise is subjective anyway. Even the experts don't agree.

Good, bad or just plain annoying I reckon we can all learn something from everyone because we're all unique. Like you said it's all good.

And if I'm annoyed or irritated I just say so, but only with what is said and not with the person so much. Granted some folk annoy me more than others, but I find that a bit of a challenge anyway. Forces me to try to think outside the box, try to see where someone is coming from and that's not a bad thing. Of course I figure I'm old enough now to be cranky when I damn well feel like and folks should be able to accept it for what it is and not get all caught up in a feud mentality but that's for them to decide. There will be people in this life of mine that get me, that challenge me to think and that understand that I may not always like what they've got to say and there are those who won't. Most days I just let it wash over me but I don't mind debating when I'm in the mood. I guess bottom line nobody likes a know it all, constantly lecturing but one would have to wonder what's missing in their life that they feel the need anyway.

absolutely.


i think because this 'place' is read...it's all typed out...we read, can refer back, etc. and also b/c there is some degree of anonimity for many here....it IS just a fascinating thing! i truly DO find it bizarre in many ways...but obviously, for the internet it is NOT bizarre, at all.


i've said it numerous times, some psych major should do their dissertation on board dynamics, b/c they seem to be eerily similar from one community to the next.....different personalities and how they interact, and it is *different* from the real world, for lack of a better term....b/c it is NOT face to face, many don't know each other, etc. it really is amazing........or maybe it just is to me. haha. dunno.


but man, from the FIRST post onwards, NOT once did i EVEr say people should be experts...or who should/shouldn't post. damn, i was really careful with the wording! beyond all that, i ALSO made it VERY clear, it's JUST MY OPINION! people can and should feel free to disagree, agree and anything inbetween. that's the whole POINT!





btw - i am not 'covering my ass'.....there is nothing to 'cover' in here. there is no name-calling, rudeness, disrespect, etc here. open to ALL. one can believe what they want.....but my reasons for starting this thread, yesterday, exactly when i did, were NUMEROUS...and not just ANY ONE poster or thread. it was cumulative, after reading quite a few things on the board...got the idea in my head, and i felt like 'putting it out there'...how anyone ELSe perceives it, is their OWN.

GraySaturday

I think if this thread was truly malicious and dedicated to one person then it would have been closed or deleted already.

GreenTeaDisease

GraySaturday wrote:

I think if this thread was truly malicious and dedicated to one person then it would have been closed or deleted already.

really? I don't think so. D2d posted it, and she would NEVER do that. Plus, it's all so well covered up in the wording...for example, she uses the word "people" instead of "person." You can't crack code like that.

Brain of J.Lo

GreenTeaDisease wrote:

really? I don't think so. D2d posted it, and she would NEVER do that. Plus, it's all so well covered up in the wording...for example, she uses the word "people" instead of "person." You can't crack code like that.

There is a huge list of people that do exactly what the OP described.