Just someone of my race, then yes, you can blame me. If Palestinians were targeting the Israeli government or gov't officials, then I'd pretty much be ok with that... But to say that you really can't blame them for taking out innocent civilians because they've been oppressed by people of the same race or nationality is absurd.
how is it absurd? ... up until the early 90's ... all the palestinians being oppressed were innocent civilians ...
and how do you propose people with nothing - attack the israeli gov't and military? ... do you remember pictures of kids throwing rocks at army soldiers? ... this is what we're dealing with ...
look at all wars - it's always the innocents that die ... who is suffering from the US occupation of Iraq? who is suffering from the genocide in Darfur? name any conflict and ultimately it is the civilians that pay the price ...
do i want to see innocent israeli's die or suffer? ... hell no!! - but there is no way one can equate what the palestinians have been thru as the same as what israelis have gone thru in this conflict ...
I guess well agree to have different viewpoints on this...I'm not sure what else to say...
That's fine if you have a different viewpoint- that's the whole point of a debate... but, no offense, if you don't know what to say to respond then maybe you should look into other viewpoints and consider them?
That's fine if you have a different viewpoint- that's the whole point of a debate... but, no offense, if you don't know what to say to respond then maybe you should look into other viewpoints and consider them?
you see, this is were you lose me...
please understand...I've looked at other viewpoints, I've read links posted, I've watched youtube vids on the subject...and thus, I've come up with my viewpoint...
we can go around and around and around...I get the sense that you feel that you must be "right" and that if I don't think just like you that I must be "wrong" in your view...
I've responded...I've shared my viewpoint....you don't agree...I'm ok with that...are you...?
I guess some think it's ok for less Israelis to die if more Palestinians die...
uh, clearly you miss the entire point. It's not to say it's ok if less Israelis die, it's to show that clearly this isn't a case of "both sides are wrong," it's a case of one side being an occupier and an oppressor and the other side retaliating on a very small scale.
uh, clearly you miss the entire point. It's not to say it's ok if less Israelis die, it's to show that clearly this isn't a case of "both sides are wrong," it's a case of one side being an occupier and an oppressor and the other side retaliating on a very small scale.
if that was not the point, why the need to post body counts...?
Nothing wrong with providing links to support your arguement, but as you can see in this thread alone, everyone understands your opinion as you made it clear and posted some links along with it. But with that said, why continually post more and more links of stories rehashing the same arguement and debate? Doesn't add anything to the discussion.
what? people can still give their takes/opinions on it, but what's wrong with also providing links that support your argument? is that really a wrong thing to do? people can still comment on it.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
uh, clearly you miss the entire point. It's not to say it's ok if less Israelis die, it's to show that clearly this isn't a case of "both sides are wrong," it's a case of one side being an occupier and an oppressor and the other side retaliating on a very small scale.
I think showing deaths on both sides certainly does show that both sides are in the wrong.
Nothing wrong with providing links to support your arguement, but as you can see in this thread alone, everyone understands your opinion as you made it clear and posted some links along with it. But with that said, why continually post more and more links of stories rehashing the same arguement and debate? Doesn't add anything to the discussion.
If you don't like me posting a recent news article of a Palestinian dying, then that's fine, but I disagree with you.
It's got nothing to do with topic or issue. You've made your opinion and point very clear to everyone. So why is it necessary to post a new story every day? People are fully aware as you are of issues, yet have differing opinions. Posting a new article each day isn't gonna change that; all it does it make it look like you're trying to beat a dead horse.
If you don't like me posting a recent news article of a Palestinian dying, then that's fine, but I disagree with you.
CONservative governMENt
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
It's got nothing to do with topic or issue. You've made your opinion and point very clear to everyone. So why is it necessary to post a new story every day? People are fully aware as you are of issues, yet have differing opinions. Posting a new article each day isn't gonna change that; all it does it make it look like you're trying to beat a dead horse.
your dead horse comment is really tired.
this is a thread discussing issues so I posted the story in here rather than make an entire new thread to post that news story. which is something I thought made more sense, but apparently you don't like it. Fine. I really don't care. how about we either get back to discussing the actual TOPIC or nothing at all.
The real reason it doesn't matter if the Palestinians are right or not is because the Israelis are the ones in power. They have no reason to make concessions especially with the US support that they receive.
Is this right? Probably not but its the reality of the situation. The Palestinians don't seem willing to compromise because they feel its there land and they want it back. This is why we have the never ending violence between the two sides.
For Peace to occur the Palestinians will have to compromise some of there positions with Israel and Israel will have to be willing to grant the Palestinians there own state. After that both sides will have to do there best to ignore each other.
A lot of people can get hung up on who's causing what and who is right but that really doesn't accomplish anything. Both sides will need to compromise for a solution and that is a fact.
10/31/2000 (****)
6/7/2003 (***1/2)
7/9/2006 (****1/2)
7/13/2006 (**** )
4/10/2008 EV Solo (****1/2)
6/25/2008 MSG II (*****)
10/1/2009 LA II (****)
10/6/2009 LA III (***** Cornell!!!)
The Palestinians don't seem willing to compromise because they feel its there land and they want it back. This is why we have the never ending violence between the two sides.
No, that's not right.
The Israelis are not willing to compromise at all. They have never offered to compromise at all... which is why they are currently occupying stolen land, and causing humanitarian crises all over the country. The violence is instigated by Israel much of the time as well.
Blaming the Palestinians for not "willing to compromise", thus blaming the violence on them is not right. The Israelis have been incredibly violent over the past 70 years atleast. These Palestinian "terror attacks" that you see on TV did not really begin until 30 years after the occupation.
The real reason it doesn't matter if the Palestinians are right or not is because the Israelis are the ones in power. They have no reason to make concessions especially with the US support that they receive.
Is this right? Probably not but its the reality of the situation. The Palestinians don't seem willing to compromise because they feel its there land and they want it back. This is why we have the never ending violence between the two sides.
For Peace to occur the Palestinians will have to compromise some of there positions with Israel and Israel will have to be willing to grant the Palestinians there own state. After that both sides will have to do there best to ignore each other.
A lot of people can get hung up on who's causing what and who is right but that really doesn't accomplish anything. Both sides will need to compromise for a solution and that is a fact.
you've got the "I'm right and since you don't think just like me, you're wrong" thing going...
breathe...
again, you're ignoring the point of my post and just accusing me of having a big ego. I could care less about petty insults, atleast address the topic. why do you think both sides are equal, or close to being equal?
I simply stated that it showed both sides were in the wrong...I'm not passing out judgements in how wrong...you are.
saying "both sides are wrong" and leaving it at that.. like I said before (this happens way too often)... is the same as comparing the sides. like it or not, that's how the context of the sentence is.
you can't waste your time trying to blame both sides. I don't even care about blaming Israel for anything else, but not agreeing that they're currently illegally occupying land, and must withdraw in order for peace to occur, is ridiculous.
Comments
how is it absurd? ... up until the early 90's ... all the palestinians being oppressed were innocent civilians ...
and how do you propose people with nothing - attack the israeli gov't and military? ... do you remember pictures of kids throwing rocks at army soldiers? ... this is what we're dealing with ...
look at all wars - it's always the innocents that die ... who is suffering from the US occupation of Iraq? who is suffering from the genocide in Darfur? name any conflict and ultimately it is the civilians that pay the price ...
do i want to see innocent israeli's die or suffer? ... hell no!! - but there is no way one can equate what the palestinians have been thru as the same as what israelis have gone thru in this conflict ...
source...?
if one is provided - would it change your opinion?
you see, this is were you lose me...
please understand...I've looked at other viewpoints, I've read links posted, I've watched youtube vids on the subject...and thus, I've come up with my viewpoint...
we can go around and around and around...I get the sense that you feel that you must be "right" and that if I don't think just like you that I must be "wrong" in your view...
I've responded...I've shared my viewpoint....you don't agree...I'm ok with that...are you...?
not sure...
I guess I'd have to look it over...
I guess some think it's ok for less Israelis to die if more Palestinians die...
if that was not the point, why the need to post body counts...?
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
I think showing deaths on both sides certainly does show that both sides are in the wrong.
Yeah I read that post already, and it's not worth a 2nd read really.
Our government is the potent, the omnipresent teacher. For good or for ill, it teaches the whole people by its example. Crime is contagious. If the government becomes a law-breaker, it breeds contempt for law; it invites every man to become a law unto himself; it invites anarchy. - Louis Brandeis
no you posted this:
thus leading to my questioning of your numbers...
this is a thread discussing issues so I posted the story in here rather than make an entire new thread to post that news story. which is something I thought made more sense, but apparently you don't like it. Fine. I really don't care. how about we either get back to discussing the actual TOPIC or nothing at all.
jesus christ, do I have to say it again??
to you....
you're getting green and vigorous again....
breathe.....:)
Is this right? Probably not but its the reality of the situation. The Palestinians don't seem willing to compromise because they feel its there land and they want it back. This is why we have the never ending violence between the two sides.
For Peace to occur the Palestinians will have to compromise some of there positions with Israel and Israel will have to be willing to grant the Palestinians there own state. After that both sides will have to do there best to ignore each other.
A lot of people can get hung up on who's causing what and who is right but that really doesn't accomplish anything. Both sides will need to compromise for a solution and that is a fact.
6/7/2003 (***1/2)
7/9/2006 (****1/2)
7/13/2006 (**** )
4/10/2008 EV Solo (****1/2)
6/25/2008 MSG II (*****)
10/1/2009 LA II (****)
10/6/2009 LA III (***** Cornell!!!)
again...
you've got the "I'm right and since you don't think just like me, you're wrong" thing going...
breathe...
Where did I ever say anything about equal?
I simply stated that it showed both sides were in the wrong...I'm not passing out judgements in how wrong...you are.
The Israelis are not willing to compromise at all. They have never offered to compromise at all... which is why they are currently occupying stolen land, and causing humanitarian crises all over the country. The violence is instigated by Israel much of the time as well.
Blaming the Palestinians for not "willing to compromise", thus blaming the violence on them is not right. The Israelis have been incredibly violent over the past 70 years atleast. These Palestinian "terror attacks" that you see on TV did not really begin until 30 years after the occupation.
Stop the Nonsense!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
you can't waste your time trying to blame both sides. I don't even care about blaming Israel for anything else, but not agreeing that they're currently illegally occupying land, and must withdraw in order for peace to occur, is ridiculous.