Trouble With Atheism

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  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    The Doc wrote:
    Ancient scripts are no more proof of God than the existence of the universe itself. Ancient scripts were made by men. This is fallacious slippery-slope argument.

    Hence the theory of the Illuminati, being based in texts from ancient Sumer.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • Destined to Remember
    Destined to Remember Posts: 5
    Ahnimus wrote:
    The internal reality, but not the external reality. The earth has always revolved around the sun in the external reality, hence why copernicus was able to see it as such. Two different things though, internal and external realities.

    The fact that the earth does (and always has) revolved around the sun represents the best scientific knowledge that we have access to at this time. I believe it to be true, but new scientific knowledge could disprove it at any point in time, just as Copernicus did with teh geocentric theory. To say what external knowledge is with any kind of certainty is impossible, which was the point I was attempting to make.
  • The Doc
    The Doc Posts: 14
    Ahnimus wrote:
    One of the points I was trying to make is that many atheists simply don't care about the cause of their own existence.

    A true atheist would say that by discounting divine providence and faith, and placing the consequences of their life in only their own hands, they are more careful about the causes and effects of their lives than anyone else.
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Titan has methane lakes and rain.

    What rules did God give to mice?

    there's more to life than methane and rain.

    find a talking mouse and i'll ask him. until then i'll go with instinct; ie: reproduction; eating; and defending itself.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    "They will both aim to identify the elusive Higgs boson (known as the "God particle" because of its importance to the Standard Model), look for so-called supersymmetric particles and seek out the existence of extra dimensions."

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4524132.stm

    That may be one goal, but they are also interested in the discovery of Gravitrons and the further analysis of quarks and gluons. What they've seen at Fermilab is black-hole type stuff. When they smash the particles together they don't seperate into pieces as one would expect, they stick to each other and stretch like a glue, hence the name gluons. The whole process lasts a fraction of a second, it's believed that some black-hole type effect consumes the entire reaction.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • onelongsong
    onelongsong Posts: 3,517
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Hence the theory of the Illuminati, being based in texts from ancient Sumer.

    science is based on man and mans conclusions. man is flawed therefore science must be flawed.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    onelongsong wrote:
    there's more to life than methane and rain.

    find a talking mouse and i'll ask him. until then i'll go with instinct; ie: reproduction; eating; and defending itself.

    According to astrophysicists and cosmologists the entire universe is made from hydrogen alone.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    onelongsong wrote:
    there's more to life than methane and rain.

    find a talking mouse and i'll ask him. until then i'll go with instinct; ie: reproduction; eating; and defending itself.

    Depends what you put merit to as being alive or existing. It doesn't change the fact that we aren't the only thing alive and interacting directly with this universe.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • hippiemom
    hippiemom Posts: 3,326
    onelongsong wrote:
    science is based on man and mans conclusions. man is flawed therefore science must be flawed.
    So who wrote those ancient documents?
    "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
  • Dustin51
    Dustin51 Posts: 222
    Ahnimus wrote:
    If you do that then it gives some creedance to what the anti-atheists are trying to convince people of. Besides I guarantee there is already a "Church of Atheism" much as there is a "Church of the Universe" for people that like to smoke pot.

    Church of the Universe sounds intriguing.
    Be excellent to each other
  • hippiemom
    hippiemom Posts: 3,326
    Ahnimus wrote:
    That may be one goal, but they are also interested in the discovery of Gravitrons and the further analysis of quarks and gluons. What they've seen at Fermilab is black-hole type stuff. When they smash the particles together they don't seperate into pieces as one would expect, they stick to each other and stretch like a glue, hence the name gluons. The whole process lasts a fraction of a second, it's believed that some black-hole type effect consumes the entire reaction.
    This is all way over my head. I heard something about devouring the solar system, and I just wanted to know if I should cancel my chemo and get a bunch of new credit cards.
    "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
  • The Doc
    The Doc Posts: 14
    onelongsong wrote:
    science is based on man and mans conclusions. man is flawed therefore science must be flawed.
    But by this same logic:

    Faith is a machination of mankind.
    Mankind is flawed.
    /.: Faith is flawed.
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    Ahnimus wrote:
    But you didn't offer further explanation...

    It's a lot more simple than you make it out to be.
    all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
    except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    onelongsong wrote:
    there's more to life than methane and rain.

    find a talking mouse and i'll ask him. until then i'll go with instinct; ie: reproduction; eating; and defending itself.

    Damn, what was that organism that consumes methane and excretes oxygen. I know there is a name for the type of organism.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • gue_barium
    gue_barium Posts: 5,515
    hippiemom wrote:
    This is all way over my head. I heard something about devouring the solar system, and I just wanted to know if I should cancel my chemo and get a bunch of new credit cards.

    I wish you could cancel your chemo and get that treatment in Germany.
    all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
    except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    onelongsong wrote:
    science is based on man and mans conclusions. man is flawed therefore science must be flawed.

    Umm, the ancient texts from Sumer are just like the ancient hebrew texts you base your faith on. It's not science, but an example of another human creation.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    Ahnimus wrote:
    That may be one goal, but they are also interested in the discovery of Gravitrons and the further analysis of quarks and gluons. What they've seen at Fermilab is black-hole type stuff. When they smash the particles together they don't seperate into pieces as one would expect, they stick to each other and stretch like a glue, hence the name gluons. The whole process lasts a fraction of a second, it's believed that some black-hole type effect consumes the entire reaction.

    It will be very interesting to discover a more complete picture on the origins of mass. Does mass indicate existence? and at what point does something not exist, also where does it "go" (or does it).

    All interesting things to find out.

    If our bodies lose no mass at death then could a spirit even exist? A spirit would need some mass right? We are a medley of the periodic scale. Even a magic spiritual force, to exist or interact, or affect us, would require some form of mass.

    could be very interesting indeed.
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    Destined to Remember wrote:
    The fact that the earth does (and always has) revolved around the sun represents the best scientific knowledge that we have access to at this time. I believe it to be true, but new scientific knowledge could disprove it at any point in time, just as Copernicus did with teh geocentric theory. To say what external knowledge is with any kind of certainty is impossible, which was the point I was attempting to make.

    Fair enough, but operationally the current knowledge stands as fact and for all intents and purposes it is right.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • Destined to Remember
    Destined to Remember Posts: 5
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Fair enough, but operationally the current knowledge stands as fact and for all intents and purposes it is right.

    Agreed, at least in the sense that it is accurate enough to allow us to explore further.
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    It will be very interesting to discover a more complete picture on the origins of mass. Does mass indicate existence? and at what point does something not exist, also where does it "go" (or does it).

    All interesting things to find out.

    If our bodies lose no mass at death then could a spirit even exist? A spirit would need some mass right? We are a medley of the periodic scale. Even a magic spiritual force, to exist or interact, or affect us, would require some form of mass.

    could be very interesting indeed.

    Well light is apparently massless. But I have a problem with that theory. It contradicts with black-hole theory that suggests the gravitational force of a black-hole is great enough to asborb light, and we know gravity is based on mass. So in order for a black-hole to absorb light, the light must have a mass.

    This is all unkowns though. It's all speculation.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire

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