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And the Violence Continues
NCfan
Posts: 945
Any guesses what will happen when Hezbollah refuses to disarm? They are currently under a UN mandate to disarm, but it is quite obvious that they have no intentions of doing so. Armies don't disband after they win a war... duh!
So in essence, Israel will theoretically have the support of the UN if they decide to try and disarm Hezbollah themselves. Furthermore, if the UN proves that it cannot fullfill its own mandate, I doubt Israel will care either way if the UN supports them or condems them.
Plus, throw in the fact that Netanyahoo will likely take office by the end of the year - and the probablility for another war is very likely.
What do you guys think?
So in essence, Israel will theoretically have the support of the UN if they decide to try and disarm Hezbollah themselves. Furthermore, if the UN proves that it cannot fullfill its own mandate, I doubt Israel will care either way if the UN supports them or condems them.
Plus, throw in the fact that Netanyahoo will likely take office by the end of the year - and the probablility for another war is very likely.
What do you guys think?
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What are you so afraid of?
I think, and this is coming on top of your comments regarding Europe's lack of religious belief and their liberal attitude to this disease (based on what?) of "Islamic" extremism, that you are a Christian Fundamentalist who is only concerned with "wiping out" (as you said) any opposing religion.
You asked.
Would it surprise you that I am in fact struggling to hold on to my Christain faith? I am about the furthest thing from a religious fundamentalist you will find. Maybe that is why I have such a problem with these fanatical Muslims...
At any rate, got any guesses???
WHAT FANATICAL MUSLIMS !!!!
Man, you really have fallen hook line and sinker!
No fanatical muslims have thousands of nuclear weapons, no muslims have aircraft carriers and guided missiles and smart bombs and cluster bombs and depleted uranium.!!
Who does? Worry about them!
Do you know how to apologize, or do you still think I'm a Christian fundamentalist?
Someone suggested that this was all a build up to a U.S. invasion of Iran, and I subscribe to that suggestion. That's what I think.
Weapons are a tool. What matters is how they are used. As of right now what I have seen is that I am not being attacked by the people with aircraft carriers. I am being attacked by the people with wacked out religious beliefs, who are granted more low-tech, but no less deadly. I think I'll worry about the guy with the knife itching to cut my head off rather than the guy with f-16s standing up to protect me.
What's even more upsetting is that Olmert was presented with a war plan that would have destroyed/disarmed Hezbollah within 2 weeks, but he didn't have the stomach to do it. The plan was apparently to hit the Beirut strongholds first and cut Hezbollah off from the north, effectively isolating them to the southern area where they would have had no place to go.
Israel, as you say, is always damned if they do, damned if they don't. If it sits back and does nothing, its terrorist enemies perceive it as a sign of weakness, so they will keep on attacking. If it fights the terrorist enemies, the world cries about civilian casualties, expecting Israel to fight a perfect war, which no other country could possibly do. It is sickening.
What's funny is that people such as silverstain either fail to realize or choose to ignore the fact that Katyusha rockets armed with ball bearings and other shrapnel are not fired to destroy military installations or buildings - ball bearings have almost no effect whatsoever on a building - they are fired to kill civilians, as ball bearings are placed in the rockets to tear through flesh.
Agreeing with you will probably get me flamed by all the lefties, but screw 'em. I agree. What the hell are they supposed to do in this type of situation? Obviously war is not considered an acceptable option, but any sane person wil hopefully admit that Israel cannot afford to simply ignore threats to its security.
I agree. The tragedy is really what will now happen to Lebanon. A "victorious" Hezbollah is basically going to take over the country. They don't even have to win an election or conduct a coup. They can just dictate policy because everyone knows that they have the only credible military force in the country backing them up. Problems with Israel's conducting of the war aside, a continued Israeli offensive that resulted in the disarming of Hezbollah, or at least a situation where they could not credibly claim victory, would have been much better for Lebanon.
Bravo
A plan is only a plan...remember Rumsfled said Iraq would be something like 6 months...now what is it...maybe they took a timeout to re-evaluate their strategy to not repeat the mistakes of their best friends...only an idea though....
I don't know. This country is treated like absolute shit by the rest of the world's ignorant populace. They launch a war, and its "holy shit, look at these bloodthristy Jewish monsters!". They choose to end a war, and its "oh yeah, Israel LOST!" ... The Independent ran a feature yesterday, the title of which was something like "Israel's Assessment: They LOST THE WAR". And then, when one reads the (short) piece, there's actually no indication of ANY such admission. In fact, the article talks about Olmert's assertion that Isreal made mistakes let still accomplished some of its objectives. Crappy journalism at its finest, and let another example of Europe's hidden (or not so hidden) glee whenever Israel suffers a setback.
I do agree with you that they had to respond in some way, whether their response was appropriate or not, welll..... Also, would Hizbollah even have existed if not for Israeli aggresssion in 1982? I'm not condoning Hizbollah or their actions which were also barbaric and evil, but I don't see Israel as the good guy. The kidnappings (technically they are "captured" as soldiers and not "kidnapped" were in response to the actual kidnapping of lebonese civilians which are being held in Israel without charges or trial. Who is going to respond to Israel or hold them responsibel over that?
Well, they pulled out a clear official message via Lebanon's parlament: they have NO intentions to disarm, nor moving out of southern Lebanon despite the UN resolution (again, these were Hizbullah's words, not mine). They've already broke the cease-fire a few times: fired at withdrawing-IDF forces, preventing from the Lebanese army from spreading out in southern Lebanon & keeping their current weapons via hiding it in all kind of new places/methods.
And Israel? we are not occuping Lebanon for more than 6 years, the IDF is withdrawing according the schedules, no violation of the latest UN resolution.
Sure, Isreal is always the "bad guy". We planed the whole thing with the US. Right. Just don't let the FACTS confuse you.
This plan was never put into effect. While I can only speculate as to its effectiveness, it is troubling, at least to me, that Olmert didn't elect to use it.
Maybe there was something that was not going to work...take this way they lead a major offensive that turns into a nightmare of epic proportions like Iraq....you would therfore be even more critized than you already are with no plan out....like I said it could very much be a possibility that the risk of this occuring was too much....I know we are speaking hypotheticals but I see it like that.....
I'm honestly not completely versed in the logistics of it, but from what I read, the plan didn't involve an extended occupation. It was apparently a bombing campaign on the Beirut strongholds first, instead of bombing the southern region first.
So I know you are disappointed in the outcome do you now blame Olmert or are there are parties at play that deserve blame for this....
shiraz addressed the Lebanese prisoner issue in a post a while back, and I got the sense that the three people in prison have all been convicted, at least one murdered Israeli civilians. Sorry, but these prisoners belong where they are, based on what I know about the situation.
And you are correct about the captured soldiers. However, the attack and subsequent capture was an act of war by any measure.
I blame Olmert first - he is the prime minister. The other parties at play for me are basically every country besides the US and, maybe, Canada, that exerted pressure on Israel and attacked it for conducting a war that it did not want any part of. The UN and Kofi Annan too.
Well it is the choice of countries to denounce the actions that they do not seem fit....not everyone is going to agree with you....regardless of who you are.....unless you decide to start going 100% unilaterally but I dont think that will help the cause to much.....
So how many Lebonese civilians are in Israeli prisons? I was under the impression that there were possibly hundreds.
shiraz, can you help out?
I'm pretty sure the number is 3. Maybe 4.
talk about extremist, he is the hawk of hawks