Science Without a Soul

MahoganySouls

angelica wrote:

I just explained one--the song inspiration.

I find it highly questionable that a doctor who in your own admission was very good, to take reference to musical inspiration and say "you are unbalanced take more meds". It seems something is missing.

Please share the whole store. What were your higher experiences?

angelica

MahoganySouls wrote:

I find it highly questionable that a doctor who in your own admission was very good, to take reference to musical inspiration and say "you are unbalanced take more meds". It seems something is missing.

Please share the whole store. What were your higher experiences?

That's literally what happened. He did not say I was imbalanced.

He was quite good as a psychiatrist, and had a good reputation in this area compared to others, but still he minimized my subjective experience and was mostly focussed on "symptoms", such as eating/sleeping, etc., which is seemingly the role of psychiatrists. To treat symptoms with medication.

Unfortunately, in Canada, psychiatric help is covered as health care, and psychiatric patients who often live in poverty do not have the balance of access to sociological help or psychological help.

soulsinging

Ahnimus wrote:

While your brain is busting, I'm readjusting
My synaptic weights, to represent, the best hypothesis, to date


Sorry, just a little neurophilosophical rap. It's a work in progress.

when's the record drop?

soulsinging

angelica wrote:

I did not "accuse" anything, and was clear that it's not about blame. As I said it's the dark side or the underbelly of the profession, and of people. On the conscious surface of awareness, people believe they are doing others a favour. We cannot see where we can use growth until it is presented to us. I'm well aware professionals are not deliberately doing this. Throughout this thread, on any point I've made, rather than consider error on behalf of the professional, you've pointed to the problem existing in the patient. Even though you admit psychiatry is in it's infancy, it seems you cannot acknowledge how it falters and errs. Psychiatry has inherent to it's system the existence of a convenient scapegoat in the mentally ill.

I will give another example of how psychiatry falters due to it's limitations that are not inherent to the individual. And my psychiatrist was a pretty good one. We are on a band message board, and I can't imagine that there is one person on here that hasn't been quite influenced by Pearl Jam's music and some of the profound messages they've shared with us. During one period of addressing the numerous life abuses I'd endured, by talking them out with my boyfriend, I found that at the time, I was also being inspired by some songs and the powerful messages in them (not Pearl Jam at the time, however). I told this to my psychiatrist. He looked disturbed, and prescribed me more meds. Because psychiatry cannot fathom issues of inspiration, it was assumed that my higher experiences of the human condition was pathological, and could be medicated away.

psychiatry -> mentally ill
justice system -> criminals
schools -> students

there is potential for abuse in all of these systems. nobody would deny that and mahogany has not. but that does not mean these are not necessary.

so what exactly are you advocating here? the abolishment of forced committal? closing down all mental hospitals? stripping psychiatrists of credentials and title? overhauling the practice of psychiatry? a social campaign to educate about mental illness? a total societal ban that equates calling someone mentally ill with other words of negative connotation like faggot, cunt, or nigger? a social utopia where nobody ever treats another person bad?

i'm just not sure what you're looking for here... what admission you're after from her. what point you're trying to make. it started with a video and a few links to psychiatrists who have disowned their own discipline. now you've moved to acknowledging the occasional need for medication and forced commission to asylums. i dont get it.

angelica

soulsinging wrote:

psychiatry -> mentally ill
justice system -> criminals
schools -> students

there is potential for abuse in all of these systems. nobody would deny that and mahogany has not. but that does not mean these are not necessary.

so what exactly are you advocating here? the abolishment of forced committal? closing down all mental hospitals? stripping psychiatrists of credentials and title? overhauling the practice of psychiatry? a social campaign to educate about mental illness? a total societal ban that equates calling someone mentally ill with other words of negative connotation like faggot, cunt, or nigger? a social utopia where nobody ever treats another person bad?

i'm just not sure what you're looking for here... what admission you're after from her. what point you're trying to make. it started with a video and a few links to psychiatrists who have disowned their own discipline. now you've moved to acknowledging the occasional need for medication and forced commission to asylums. i dont get it.

I'm just living my purpose. All is in it's perfect place. What will be will be. For me it's about awareness.

I can see the day when humans no longer need psychiatry. It's evolution.

soulsinging

angelica wrote:

I'm just living my purpose. All is in it's perfect place. What will be will be. For me it's about awareness.

I can see the day when humans no longer need psychiatry. It's evolution.

it is much easier to raise people's awareness by having a clear and coherent message so that people know what they are supposed to be aware of

angelica

soulsinging wrote:

it is much easier to raise people's awareness by having a clear and coherent message so that people know what they are supposed to be aware of

I'm not foolish enough to believe I control what people perceive. All I can do is be myself.

soulsinging

angelica wrote:

I'm not foolish enough to believe I control what people perceive. All I can do is be myself.

yet you just spent all day and 8 pages arguing with us about the evils of psychiatry.

angelica

soulsinging wrote:

yet you just spent all day and 8 pages arguing with us about the evils of psychiatry.

Like I said, I'm not responsible for what people perceive.

soulsinging

angelica wrote:

Like I said, I'm not responsible for what people perceive.

are you saying that i imagined you were arguing and you really weren't? that it is only my perception that you were trying to sway our opinions?

angelica

soulsinging wrote:

are you saying that i imagined you were arguing and you really weren't? that it is only my perception that you were trying to sway our opinions?

Oh, I'm pretty argumentative.

soulsinging

angelica wrote:

Oh, I'm pretty argumentative.

so you're just saying you're aware it's probly a futile effort with most people?

angelica

soulsinging wrote:

so you're just saying you're aware it's probly a futile effort with most people?

Not at all. I know that if people are open and growing, they cannot keep their minds closed. People move at their own pace, so there's no judging these processes. I trust life and life's processes. It looks like numerous people are well aware of this subject, even if they believe it's only from a perspective of disagreement. Awareness is awareness and ultimately only the truth stands. All else falls away.

Those who participated in this thread are obviously all intelligent individuals.

I wasn't presenting the evils of psychiatry, though. It's more about lack, potential and evolution, as always.

MahoganySouls

Angelica, I'm up late tonite due to a stomach ailment so I decided to read through some of your other posts to get a better feel for who you are as a person.

I'm noticing a trend of contradiction with you. In one breath you say nothing is perfect, then you make comments like "all in it's perfect place".

In other threads you comment how there is no bad or good no right or wrong there "just is", yet here you condemn physicians.

You claim to be about raising awareness on an issue very close to you, yet you flip flop on your stand.

When others don't understand you, or your comments fail to make a point in a coherent sense, you remove yourself from culpability.

When challenged for details, you skirt the issue and provide only a small vague response.

You intrigue me.

I would like to get a better perception, from your own point of view, as to how your self treatment has improved your life. So if you are willing to support your claims, I have several questions.

What is your quality of life? What are your hobbies and interests? Do you hold down a job? What is your relationship with others like? Do you hear voices? When you speak of spirituality what are your beliefs? Do you continue to go to therapy? How did your "very good psychiatrist" respond to your choices regarding treatment? What does your family think? You mentioned that your daughter was also suffering from mental dysfunction at one point. Is she also cured? How did this come about? Do you believe that mental illness tends to run in families? What are your thoughts on this subject?

soulsinging

angelica wrote:

Not at all. I know that if people are open and growing, they cannot keep their minds closed. People move at their own pace, so there's no judging these processes. I trust life and life's processes. It looks like numerous people are well aware of this subject, even if they believe it's only from a perspective of disagreement. Awareness is awareness and ultimately only the truth stands. All else falls away.

Those who participated in this thread are obviously all intelligent individuals.

I wasn't presenting the evils of psychiatry, though. It's more about lack, potential and evolution, as always.

yeah, you an ahnimus are like opposite sides of the same coin. both with serious one-track mind problems and both on a mission to enlighten the rest of us to the wisdom of your respective ways

MahoganySouls

soulsinging wrote:

yeah, you an ahnimus are like opposite sides of the same coin. both with serious one-track mind problems and both on a mission to enlighten the rest of us to the wisdom of your respective ways

To be fair, it is human nature to share thoughts in a more aggressive manner when we truly believe in an idea. Enlightenment is relative to the individual.

soulsinging

MahoganySouls wrote:

To be fair, it is human nature to share thoughts in a more aggressive manner when we truly believe in an idea. Enlightenment is relative to the individual.

im ok with aggressive belief sharing. but there are a lot of topics on here and the second ahnimus or angelica steps into any of them it becomes either a debate about how there is no free will and determinism rules all or how we are all emotionally and mentally stunted and need to grow and be open-minded, respectively. they each seem incapable of discussing anything else.

angelica

soulsinging wrote:

yeah, you an ahnimus are like opposite sides of the same coin. both with serious one-track mind problems and both on a mission to enlighten the rest of us to the wisdom of your respective ways

It's life that enlightens us. Ahnimus and I are just being who we are.

MahoganySouls

angelica wrote:

It's life that enlightens us. Ahnimus and I are just being who we are.

Do you not think that life enlightens everyone?

Please help me understand who you are by answering my questions.

MahoganySouls

soulsinging wrote:

im ok with aggressive belief sharing. but there are a lot of topics on here and the second ahnimus or angelica steps into any of them it becomes either a debate about how there is no free will and determinism rules all or how we are all emotionally and mentally stunted and need to grow and be open-minded, respectively. they each seem incapable of discussing anything else.

This is an odd concept since Angelica feels there are no "flaws" in people. Therefore how can anyone be stunted or closed minded when everyone is perfect in their own way?