Obama on race and his pastor

Quak

just some comment from outside US.. ( sorry my english )

wau, very impressive speech, almost cried watching it. Hope you guys make him your president. Nice to see some truth and honesty in politics, really hope the best for your country because I love so many things about it. Wish my politicians could speek like that.

anyway, the reason I write is about Pastor Jeremiah Wright, what has he said that upset you so? Because what he says pretty much is the truth, at least from what it look like.


Pastor: “We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye.”

Isn't that the truth?
http://www.prosebeforehos.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/deathsinmiddleeast.gif

Pastor: “We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America’s chickens are coming home to roost.” (Sep 2001)

truth as well.. With my little info you helped the Afghanistan people against the russians, you put saddam hussain in charge.. and so on

and so on.

I am not trying to judge USA. You guys have done so much good, but are you so blind that you dont see what terrible things you also have done?

my2hands

Quak wrote:

just some comment from outside US.. ( sorry my english )

wau, very impressive speech, almost cried watching it. Hope you guys make him your president. Nice to see some truth and honesty in politics, really hope the best for your country because I love so many things about it. Wish my politicians could speek like that.

anyway, the reason I write is about Pastor Jeremiah Wright, what has he said that upset you so? Because what he says pretty much is the truth, at least from what it look like.


Pastor: “We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye.”

Isn't that the truth?
http://www.prosebeforehos.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2008/03/deathsinmiddleeast.gif

Pastor: “We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America’s chickens are coming home to roost.” (Sep 2001)

truth as well.. With my little info you helped the Afghanistan people against the russians, you put saddam hussain in charge.. and so on

and so on.

I am not trying to judge USA. You guys have done so much good, but are you so blind that you dont see what terrible things you also have done?

great post...

where are you from?

my2hands

RainDog wrote:

Exactly. Seventeen years, right? So after seventeen years, we have, what - a few clips?

I think I'm going to stop listening to Pearl Jam because of the sexist thing Eddie said about that one woman with the small breasts back in '03.

good call!

Quak

my2hands wrote:

great post...

where are you from?

thx,

I am just a silly dane from Denmark, living in London ( UK ).

jeffbr

cornnifer wrote:

Do you regularly attend church, jeff. i do. i've regularly attended the same church for about 15 years and i've already addressed this foolishness. Go back and find i won't retype it here.

I don't. I don't even irregularly attend church.

You didn't explain what you'd do if your pastor started preaching hate. Would you sit there and try to look past it because you disagreed with him about that but liked eveything else? Would you continue to do that for 15 years? Would you just sit there and be part of the congregation if everyone around you was giving their "amens" to the lunacy? Not me. I'd get up and walk out. The first time.

jeffbr

Quak wrote:

Because what he says pretty much is the truth, at least from what it look like.

So you belive that the white man introduced HIV into the black population to commit genocide against blacks? You believe that the white man introduced drugs to the black communities so the white man could put the black man in jail?

OK.

mca47

RainDog wrote:

Personally, I can't wait for the day when religion doesn't have the kind of clout in elections that it has today. Not politics, mind you - as I don't think religion has shit to do with politics. But elections.

Agreed.
I don't think it will ever happen, but would in an ideal world.

Character Zero

jeffbr wrote:

So you belive that the white man introduced HIV into the black population to commit genocide against blacks? You believe that the white man introduced drugs to the black communities so the white man could put the black man in jail?

OK.

I think the point he was trying to make was that those things are the byproduct of centuries of racial injustice in this country. We have only seen a few clips out of long sermons, I'm sure when they are put in context there is a lot we are missing. I think the guy has a horrible delivery and is extremely angry and I dont necessarily think that church is the place for it. I do however agree with a lot of what he said, just not how he said it.

Drew263

my2hands wrote:

After hearing him today i have no clue why everyone is not supporting this guy

uhh..b/c he's a socialist??

I'm confident enough in myself that I can choose how to live my own life. I don't need him and all the other socialists to tell me how to get by.

inmytree

RainDog wrote:

Personally, I can't wait for the day when religion doesn't have the kind of clout in elections that it has today. Not politics, mind you - as I don't think religion has shit to do with politics. But elections.

[size=+3]amen!!![/size]

Thecure

what i found to be funny is yesterday i was watching CNN and someone said that she found it very refreshing that Barack was not selling otu his friend like McCain does. it was a hard core Rep.

my question for everyone is do or don't you think that Obama should have sold out his friend?

blackredyellow

Thecure wrote:

what i found to be funny is yesterday i was watching CNN and someone said that she found it very refreshing that Barack was not selling otu his friend like McCain does. it was a hard core Rep.

my question for everyone is do or don't you think that Obama should have sold out his friend?

No, if he's truly a friend, I don't think that he should have sold him out for political gain.

The guy has been his pastor/friend for 20 years, and from what we know, he has made a handful of distasteful remarks in 20 years of sermons... If every week this guy said crap like this, then ya, I can understand the criticism, but if all that the media can come up with is a handful of soundbytes over the years, then I have to take Obama at his word that this guy isn't some evil crackpot.

anotherclone

I agree with Quak TOTALLY.

I think the point is, that most people don't want to believe what Pastor Wright said is true. They would rather get wrapped up in their own emotions about what was said and deny it to themselves. I know initially that was my thought about the whole thing.

9/11 had nothing to do with them "hating our freedom" as GWB would have you believe, and everything to do with our policies in the Middle East. The line Wright mentioned about Hillary Clinton not knowing what is is like to be a black person...well, duh.

About the only thing I have any kind of issue at all with Pastor Wright saying is "God Damn America", and really even that I chalk up to him being passionate about what he is saying. In short, I don't give two shits what his minister said. It is not important to me.

I have a very dear friend that gave me away at my wedding, who I love dearly. Many years ago, he was arrested for a hate crime. That was in his past, but that is a part of him and I love him anyway.

I think Obama would be a total hippocrite to say this man isn't a part of his greater extended family. To do so would be contrary to his philosophy that he listens to everyone with consideration. I think he has greater integrity for acknowledging their differences and loving the man anyway. If we are assuming Obama is a religious man, isn't that truly what religion should be about anyway? Forgivness? Maybe loving someone that you don't agree with?

The point is, that the people that don't like what Wright said, or Obama's speech probably wouldn't like it no matter WHAT Obama said as a reply. They would not be able to see through the bullshit to see the larger picture. That Pastor Wright is right, and Obama hit the nail on the head about racism in this country.

Thecure

blackredyellow wrote:

No, if he's truly a friend, I don't think that he should have sold him out for political gain.

The guy has been his pastor/friend for 20 years, and from what we know, he has made a handful of distasteful remarks in 20 years of sermons... If every week this guy said crap like this, then ya, I can understand the criticism, but if all that the media can come up with is a handful of soundbytes over the years, then I have to take Obama at his word that this guy isn't some evil crackpot.

do you believe that there are only a handful of soundbytes only. i wonder? i don't know i was not there but i doubt that one day the guy just started saying things like this. maybe i am wrong.

blackredyellow

Thecure wrote:

do you believe that there are only a handful of soundbytes only. i wonder? i don't know i was not there but i doubt that one day the guy just started saying things like this. maybe i am wrong.

They might just be the tip of the iceberg, I don't know... But I would have thought by now that if there truly was more to it than this, someone would have found more transcripts or videos.

Obama said that the preacher has always been controversial, and he has been in the church when he has said some things that made him uncomfortable, but I can't imagine that any preacher would go out every week and say the things he did and still have a job.

Thecure

blackredyellow wrote:

They might just be the tip of the iceberg, I don't know... But I would have thought by now that if there truly was more to it than this, someone would have found more transcripts or videos.

Obama said that the preacher has always been controversial, and he has been in the church when he has said some things that made him uncomfortable, but I can't imagine that any preacher would go out every week and say the things he did and still have a job.

well about videos i guess it means that if there were videos or transcripts to dhow. who knows if people did film it. also, if the preacher said things that were viewed upon as positives/truths for the people in the church then i think the pastor would keep his job.

slightofjeff

Well, I'm not surprised the Obama-maniacs on this board would have creamed themselves over this speech. I, for one, thought it sounded like a typical politico fighting for his political life.

My only question: If Obama soooo disagreed with this guy, found his comments to be soooo off base and sooooo divisive ... why did he stay in that church for 20 years?

I've known people who would change churches if their pastor was boring. If your pastor has a habit of spouting rhetoric that you find to be sooooo abominable... you leave the church.

The only conclusion I can draw is that Obama believes some of this garbage, too. Otherwise, why would he continue to get his spiritual advice from this guy? Why would he consider him a mentor?

I know hating America might not be cause for concern on this board. Many of you seem to hate America, too.

But it is a problem for me.

There was a time when I could have swallowed hard and accepted an Obama presidency, even if we didn't agree on this issues. Now, I'm starting to believe an Obama presidency would be a disaster for this country.

slightofjeff

Well, I'm not surprised the Obama-maniacs on this board would have creamed themselves over this speech. I, for one, thought it sounded like a typical politico fighting for his political life.

My only question: If Obama soooo disagreed with this guy, found his comments to be soooo off base and sooooo divisive ... why did he stay in that church for 20 years?

I've known people who would change churches if their pastor was boring. If your pastor has a habit of spouting rhetoric that you find to be sooooo abominable ... you leave the church.

The only conclusion I can draw is that Obama believes some of this garbage, too. Otherwise, why would he continue to get his spiritual advice from this guy? Why would he consider him a mentor?

I know hating America might not be cause for concern on this board. Many of you seem to hate America, too.

But it is a problem for me.

There was a time when I could have swallowed hard and accepted an Obama presidency, even if we didn't agree on this issues. Now, I'm starting to believe an Obama presidency would be a disaster for this country.

inmytree

slightofjeff wrote:

Well, I'm not surprised the Obama-maniacs on this board would have creamed themselves over this speech. I, for one, thought it sounded like a typical politico fighting for his political life.

My only question: If Obama soooo disagreed with this guy, found his comments to be soooo off base and sooooo divisive ... why did he stay in that church for 20 years?

I've known people who would change churches if their pastor was boring. If your pastor has a habit of spouting rhetoric that you find to be sooooo terrible ... you leave the church.

The only conclusion I can draw is that Obama believes some of this garbage, too. Otherwise, why would he continue to get his spiritual advice from this guy? Why would he consider him a mentor?

I know hating America might not be cause for concern on this board. Many of you see to hate America, too.

But it is a problem for me.

There was a time when I could have swallowed hard and accepted an Obama presidency, even if we didn't agree on this issues. Now, I'm starting to believe an Obama presidency would be a disaster for this country.

he he...hate America...

you and the rev. have some things in common...you both like to paint with a broad brush...

jwillmo

slightofjeff wrote:

Well, I'm not surprised the Obama-maniacs on this board would have creamed themselves over this speech. I, for one, thought it sounded like a typical politico fighting for his political life.

My only question: If Obama soooo disagreed with this guy, found his comments to be soooo off base and sooooo divisive ... why did he stay in that church for 20 years?

I've known people who would change churches if their pastor was boring. If your pastor has a habit of spouting rhetoric that you find to be sooooo abominable ... you leave the church.

The only conclusion I can draw is that Obama believes some of this garbage, too. Otherwise, why would he continue to get his spiritual advice from this guy? Why would he consider him a mentor?

I know hating America might not be cause for concern on this board. Many of you seem to hate America, too.

But it is a problem for me.

There was a time when I could have swallowed hard and accepted an Obama presidency, even if we didn't agree on this issues. Now, I'm starting to believe an Obama presidency would be a disaster for this country.

Ugh. Thanks doing your part in making us Texans look like simpletons.

I certainly don't consider myself an Obama-maniac, I voted for him in the primary only because I considered him to be slightly less full of shit than the alternative, and McCain had the Republican nomination locked and a vote for him would be pointless. However, his speech yesterday was by far the best political speech I've heard in my adult lifetime (which admittedly, is only really the past three election cycles). A speech by "a typical politico fighting for his political life" would have done exactly what you would have wanted, to simply denounce the guy and have nothing to do with him ever again. Instead, he used it as a springboard to say a bunch of other things about race that are true that no one has the balls to say these days. As was said before, I doubt this preacher has been getting up and giving a "God damn America" speech every Sunday for the past 20 years. To simply throw his life-long preacher out of his life for saying things that could cost him a presidency would be a pretty cowardly way out. Instead he chose to tackle what the preacher was trying to say, though of course about 10000000% more eloquently. Which is why I'm voting for Obama, not his fucking preacher.