but i had such a strong identification with my own personal gender at such a young age, i don't think those rules applied to me much.
gue, do you think that identification is specific to you or possibly because you are a man? I'm just wondering.
I don't recall being so strongly identifying with my gender until just before puberty when other people, specifically men/boys, seemed to suddenly become aware of me being a girl.
Yes, having read all those descriptions I can safely say that I am NOT your cousin gue!!
It's sad when people can't go to something because they are attracted for the right reasons.
But then I probably shouldn't judge, I am also attracted to weird and wonderful things because of my self interpretation.
She's a strange one. An education to me, really. Cousins...your mom and dad's sib's, and their kids provide a lot of insight, if your particular family turns away from tradition, as mine did. I haven't spoken with her in 20 years. I looked up her number about 7 years ago, found it, left a message on her machine. She never called back.
gue, do you think that identification is specific to you or possibly because you are a man? I'm just wondering.
I don't recall being so strongly identifying with my gender until just before puberty when other people, specifically men/boys, seemed to suddenly become aware of me being a girl.
Penises are more obvious than clitorises, so maybe/probably.
She's a strange one. An education to me, really. Cousins...your mom and dad's sib's, and their kids provide a lot of insight, if your particular family turns away from tradition, as mine did. I haven't spoken with her in 20 years. I looked up her number about 7 years ago, found it, left a message on her machine. She never called back.
I think your aunts and uncles and cousins play quite a pivotal role in your early life, regardless of whether you turn away from tradition or not gue.
It makes sense that siblings would want to spend time together and that their children would spend time together too. But I think as time progresses everybody heads off in their own direction. It is certainly the case in my family. We seem to only see each other now in times of illness or at funerals.
I still don't speak to some of my cousins. Think that's just life maybe?
gue, do you think that identification is specific to you or possibly because you are a man? I'm just wondering.
I don't recall being so strongly identifying with my gender until just before puberty when other people, specifically men/boys, seemed to suddenly become aware of me being a girl.
On the other hand, I remember being in 3rd grade and telling my classmates what the function of a penis was, in regards to the female vagina. They wouldn't believe me.
Well I can agree with that too cate. But I do believe that small children have an understanding of their gender from an early age. Of course societal influences come along and mess with that, but I do recall very vaguely before then.
you can't imagine how hurt i was when i discovered that girls aren't allowed to play footy. i was consoled with the notion that i could always be a cheerleader. i said screw that you can shove that up your bum. if i cant play footy im not gonna compromise and stand on the sidelines and shake pompoms cheering for the boys.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Penises are more obvious than clitorises, so maybe/probably.
And possibly because of the obvious or inobvious functionality of these organs we may also have a different relationship with them and identify with them differently?
I remember boys at my primary school always wanting to play kiss chasey which positively repulsed me at the time.
I mean girls don't get obvious until boobies turn up.
I think your aunts and uncles and cousins play quite a pivotal role in your early life, regardless of whether you turn away from tradition or not gue.
It makes sense that siblings would want to spend time together and that their children would spend time together too. But I think as time progresses everybody heads off in their own direction. It is certainly the case in my family. We seem to only see each other now in times of illness or at funerals.
I still don't speak to some of my cousins. Think that's just life maybe?
Sure, yeah.
Jeanie had a weird insight, though, to me. She was 5 or 6 years older, yet she took me seriously in a way. And she was respected for her scholastic aptitude. I think we had some weird recognition of each other's worth.
And possibly because of the obvious or inobvious functionality of these organs we may also have a different relationship with them and identify with them differently?
I remember boys at my primary school always wanting to play kiss chasey which positively repulsed me at the time.
I mean girls don't get obvious until boobies turn up.
I was playing kissy stuff pretty early on. Not with the cousins, they were too religious. lol. but on the playground, in grade school, quite a bit. the girls loved it. they initiated most of it.
you can't imagine how hurt i was when i discovered that girls aren't allowed to play footy. i was consoled with the notion that i could always be a cheerleader. i said screw that you can shove that up your bum. if i cant play footy im not gonna compromise and stand on the sidelines and shake pompoms cheering for the boys.
You know girl? There seems to be no end to the things we share.
I did want to play footy myself. I know I certainly would rather have been viewed by the world as a footy player and not a cheerleader so much.
Most of my dancing enjoyment was eventually ruined because I couldn't stop feeling superfluous and objectified.
Actually we did play footy at Tech a few times, girls v. boys.
We got hammered of course! :rolleyes:
On the other hand, I remember being in 3rd grade and telling my classmates what the function of a penis was, in regards to the female vagina. They wouldn't believe me.
Jeanie had a weird insight, though, to me. She was 5 or 6 years older, yet she took me seriously in a way. And she was respected for her scholastic aptitude. I think we had some weird recognition of each other's worth.
I think that we learn so much about who we are and how we communicate from our cousins. Sorta family, sorta friends. It's a fairly intimate relationship. And I think it's definitely a huge learning curve.
I was playing kissy stuff pretty early on. Not with the cousins, they were too religious. lol. but on the playground, in grade school, quite a bit. the girls loved it. they initiated most of it.
Yeah, sounds like I've always been a bit of a prude. :rolleyes:
really? see, this is something i was educated on by about the time i began kindergarten, and these days that is commonplace, i think. back then, it was a secret for everyone to discover on their own.
really? see, this is something i was educated on by about the time i began kindergarten, and these days that is commonplace, i think. back then, it was a secret for everyone to discover on their own.
I don't think I was uneducated, I can remember Mum and Dad both being fairly liberated around the house. But I do remember some things being secretive and certainly I can be somewhat slow on the uptake when it comes to sex. So perhaps that's it?
I don't think I was uneducated, I can remember Mum and Dad both being fairly liberated around the house. But I do remember some things being secretive and certainly I can be somewhat slow on the uptake when it comes to sex. So perhaps that's it?
I can't speak for you, or even your gender. I found myself improbably lucky when I fumbled upon the clitoris myself one day during some sexual escapade.
I can't speak for you, or even your gender. I found myself improbably lucky when I fumbled upon the clitoris myself one day during some sexual escapade.
now then see? thats an experience both genders can exalt in.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I can't speak for you, or even your gender. I found myself improbably lucky when I fumbled upon the clitoris myself one day during some sexual escapade.
So do you feel like you've always had a regular level of testosterone, or has there been times when you've felt that it "spiked"?
I guess I'm asking are you aware of it? When it's at work in your body?
So do you feel like you've always had a regular level of testosterone, or has there been times when you've felt that it "spiked"?
I guess I'm asking are you aware of it? When it's at work in your body?
No, not at all. There are times that I'm more attuned to women than others, that might be part of it. I mean, in the sense that our sensitivies are receptive to one another, more than usual. And it has more to do with rhythms other than the ovulation cycle. I can almost smell when that's happening
No, not at all. There are times that I'm more attuned to women than others, that might be part of it. I mean, in the sense that our sensitivies are receptive to one another, more than usual. And it has more to do with rhythms other than the ovulation cycle. I can almost smell when that's happening
i mean that in a good way.
Yes, I can see what you are saying. But do you think that's actually the multitude of hormones at work? I mean I do recall when I was working in offices with a lot of women that our menstrual cycles would generally be around the same time. And I did read something about it once. How the hormones, pheremones would be released into the surrounding air and we would all become attune to each other. I guess that's why I'm asking. I understand that we can become more intune with each other mentally, but I wonder about the other senses. Like hormones or picking up on each other's "scents".
So do you feel like you've always had a regular level of testosterone, or has there been times when you've felt that it "spiked"?
I guess I'm asking are you aware of it? When it's at work in your body?
Actually, on a more day-to-day basis, I do notice a rise when confronting other men...i mean there is competition usually, however sublime, and chemical, even on a message board, sometimes.
Yes, I can see what you are saying. But do you think that's actually the multitude of hormones at work? I mean I do recall when I was working in offices with a lot of women that our menstrual cycles would generally be around the same time. And I did read something about it once. How the hormones, pheremones would be released into the surrounding air and we would all become attune to each other. I guess that's why I'm asking. I understand that we can become more intune with each other mentally, but I wonder about the other senses. Like hormones or picking up on each other's "scents".
absolutely. have you ever seen jeff ament with a really big grin? he's really opening the receptors in the roof of his mouth/nostrils to allow for those scents to enable him to trace the one he's going to bonk on any given night.
Actually, on a more day-to-day basis, I do notice a rise when confronting other men...i mean there is competition usually, however sublime, and chemical, even on a message board, sometimes.
So, yeah, that's probably testosterone.
Yes! I can recall times when it's surged in me, so I wondered about how it effects men on a daily basis. And I do track my hormone levels fairly stringently through my menstrual cycle. Which has proven very helpful.
So this being in the world, when confrontation is required, then testosterone is also in play. Be interesting to know, like to be able to measure.
absolutely. have you ever seen jeff ament with a really big grin? he's really opening the receptors in the roof of his mouth/nostrils to allow for those scents to enable him to trace the one he's going to bonk on any given night.
JUST KIDDING!
Actually!! That is an interesting concept gue!! I mean not so much about Jeff but it could explain the "high" one gets, at a PJ concert. Which seems to me to be a big love in!
Actually!! That is an interesting concept gue!! I mean not so much about Jeff but it could explain the "high" one gets, at a PJ concert. Which seems to me to be a big love in!
its the music jeanie.
i know live music gives me a rush. its like an opening up of every sensory system in the body. it elevates the senses and makes us more attune to everything around us.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
its the music jeanie.
i know live music gives me a rush. its like an opening up of every sensory system in the body. it elevates the senses and makes us more attune to everything around us.
Yes I agree that is a huge factor cate. Music does unite us. But a PJ concert, well that's something else. Complete strangers talk to each other, smile together, laugh, enjoy the music, share looks and seemingly feelings. I've only ever seen that happen with one other band that way and that's JB3. Same deal. A massive love in.
Well, you are calling gender roles, "false". I tend to agree with you, at least in the puritan victorian sense, but, we don't really come from that period.
I'm not sure that I called gender roles false. What I see is that all people live "false" roles in their lives and few people awaken from that to become authentic.
"The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr
Comments
gue, do you think that identification is specific to you or possibly because you are a man? I'm just wondering.
I don't recall being so strongly identifying with my gender until just before puberty when other people, specifically men/boys, seemed to suddenly become aware of me being a girl.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
She's a strange one. An education to me, really. Cousins...your mom and dad's sib's, and their kids provide a lot of insight, if your particular family turns away from tradition, as mine did. I haven't spoken with her in 20 years. I looked up her number about 7 years ago, found it, left a message on her machine. She never called back.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
Penises are more obvious than clitorises, so maybe/probably.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
I think your aunts and uncles and cousins play quite a pivotal role in your early life, regardless of whether you turn away from tradition or not gue.
It makes sense that siblings would want to spend time together and that their children would spend time together too. But I think as time progresses everybody heads off in their own direction. It is certainly the case in my family. We seem to only see each other now in times of illness or at funerals.
I still don't speak to some of my cousins. Think that's just life maybe?
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
you can't imagine how hurt i was when i discovered that girls aren't allowed to play footy. i was consoled with the notion that i could always be a cheerleader. i said screw that you can shove that up your bum. if i cant play footy im not gonna compromise and stand on the sidelines and shake pompoms cheering for the boys.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
And possibly because of the obvious or inobvious functionality of these organs we may also have a different relationship with them and identify with them differently?
I remember boys at my primary school always wanting to play kiss chasey which positively repulsed me at the time.
I mean girls don't get obvious until boobies turn up.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
Jeanie had a weird insight, though, to me. She was 5 or 6 years older, yet she took me seriously in a way. And she was respected for her scholastic aptitude. I think we had some weird recognition of each other's worth.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
I was playing kissy stuff pretty early on. Not with the cousins, they were too religious. lol. but on the playground, in grade school, quite a bit. the girls loved it. they initiated most of it.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
You know girl? There seems to be no end to the things we share.
I did want to play footy myself. I know I certainly would rather have been viewed by the world as a footy player and not a cheerleader so much.
Most of my dancing enjoyment was eventually ruined because I couldn't stop feeling superfluous and objectified.
Actually we did play footy at Tech a few times, girls v. boys.
We got hammered of course! :rolleyes:
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
I probably wouldn't have either.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
I think that we learn so much about who we are and how we communicate from our cousins. Sorta family, sorta friends. It's a fairly intimate relationship. And I think it's definitely a huge learning curve.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
Yeah, sounds like I've always been a bit of a prude. :rolleyes:
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
really? see, this is something i was educated on by about the time i began kindergarten, and these days that is commonplace, i think. back then, it was a secret for everyone to discover on their own.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
I don't think I was uneducated, I can remember Mum and Dad both being fairly liberated around the house. But I do remember some things being secretive and certainly I can be somewhat slow on the uptake when it comes to sex. So perhaps that's it?
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
I can't speak for you, or even your gender. I found myself improbably lucky when I fumbled upon the clitoris myself one day during some sexual escapade.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
now then see? thats an experience both genders can exalt in.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
it certainly was.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
So do you feel like you've always had a regular level of testosterone, or has there been times when you've felt that it "spiked"?
I guess I'm asking are you aware of it? When it's at work in your body?
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
No, not at all. There are times that I'm more attuned to women than others, that might be part of it. I mean, in the sense that our sensitivies are receptive to one another, more than usual. And it has more to do with rhythms other than the ovulation cycle. I can almost smell when that's happening
i mean that in a good way.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
nice conversation.
I hope i'm not banned in the morning.
g'night.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
Yes, I can see what you are saying. But do you think that's actually the multitude of hormones at work? I mean I do recall when I was working in offices with a lot of women that our menstrual cycles would generally be around the same time. And I did read something about it once. How the hormones, pheremones would be released into the surrounding air and we would all become attune to each other. I guess that's why I'm asking. I understand that we can become more intune with each other mentally, but I wonder about the other senses. Like hormones or picking up on each other's "scents".
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
g'night gue. Excellent conversation, thank you. Sweet dreams.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
Actually, on a more day-to-day basis, I do notice a rise when confronting other men...i mean there is competition usually, however sublime, and chemical, even on a message board, sometimes.
So, yeah, that's probably testosterone.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
absolutely. have you ever seen jeff ament with a really big grin? he's really opening the receptors in the roof of his mouth/nostrils to allow for those scents to enable him to trace the one he's going to bonk on any given night.
JUST KIDDING!
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
Yes! I can recall times when it's surged in me, so I wondered about how it effects men on a daily basis. And I do track my hormone levels fairly stringently through my menstrual cycle. Which has proven very helpful.
So this being in the world, when confrontation is required, then testosterone is also in play. Be interesting to know, like to be able to measure.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
Actually!! That is an interesting concept gue!! I mean not so much about Jeff but it could explain the "high" one gets, at a PJ concert. Which seems to me to be a big love in!
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
its the music jeanie.
i know live music gives me a rush. its like an opening up of every sensory system in the body. it elevates the senses and makes us more attune to everything around us.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
Yes I agree that is a huge factor cate. Music does unite us. But a PJ concert, well that's something else. Complete strangers talk to each other, smile together, laugh, enjoy the music, share looks and seemingly feelings. I've only ever seen that happen with one other band that way and that's JB3. Same deal. A massive love in.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
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