1. ...Yes, he was elected democratically (let's not forget that other not-so-ideal leaders were also brought into office through legitimate mechanisms... Mr. Adolf anyone?)...
2. ...so that he can satisfy his own ego and thirst for power...
3. ...Increase in Public Expenditure--yay!
Greed, dementia caused by unlimited political power, intolerance to opposition and free speech--NAY!
The above statements I've selected I am still officially calling BULLSHIT.
1. You can't compare President Hugo Chavez to Adolf Hilter. President Chavez never attempted genocide, nor is he promoting imperialism.
2. You assume his motives, when if you look at what he is doing, there is a much more reasonable motive you could derive: He is trying to flush out the power handled by his most powerful opposition (whom will eventually kill him if things continue to not go their way), and he is trying to form a truly socio-democratic society.
3. What evidence do you have of greed on the President's part? I still think the intolerance to opposition lacks serious proof, and is still hearsay.
4. I wish you wouldn't call President Chavez a dictator. You give Washington ammo to invade Venezuela, or promote another coup with a person who could very well be a dictator when you say that.
Chavez closes down radio stations that dissent. He's a dictator and brokendave has no idea what he's talking about. I know people from Venezuela and they don't plan on going back because they have everything to lose and nothing to gain.
Chavez is a socialist totalitarian dictator and he won't relinquish power. Anyone who says otherwise is a dumbass socialist too.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
Chavez closes down radio stations that dissent. He's a dictator and brokendave has no idea what he's talking about. I know people from Venezuela and they don't plan on going back because they have everything to lose and nothing to gain.
Chavez is a socialist totalitarian dictator and he won't relinquish power. Anyone who says otherwise is a dumbass socialist too.
I'll bet you don't even know you're waning ironic.
The above statements I've selected I am still officially calling BULLSHIT.
1. You can't compare President Hugo Chavez to Adolf Hilter. President Chavez never attempted genocide, nor is he promoting imperialism.
2. You assume his motives, when if you look at what he is doing, there is a much more reasonable motive you could derive: He is trying to flush out the power handled by his most powerful opposition (whom will eventually kill him if things continue to not go their way), and he is trying to form a truly socio-democratic society.
3. What evidence do you have of greed on the President's part? I still think the intolerance to opposition lacks serious proof, and is still hearsay.
4. I wish you wouldn't call President Chavez a dictator. You give Washington ammo to invade Venezuela, or promote another coup with a person who could very well be a dictator when you say that.
I'm not saying that Chavez has commited genocide. My point was that getting into government through legitimate mechanisms is no guarantee of a democratic government, that's why even the most democratic regimes consider the possibility of impeachment.
I do think he is promoting imperialism. He is trying to create an alliance with Bolivia, Ecuador and Cuba to push his "new socialist" project. His main diplomatic currency: petrodollars. Those babies are flying out into these other poorer countries fiscal arks.
En Ecuador, suscribirá un protocolo para comenzar la construcción de una refinería destinada a procesar crudo y en Bolivia ya anunció que planea construir una planta de extracción de líquidos para que ese país pueda desarrollar un polo petroquímico..
I really don't think that by calling Chavez a dictator in this forum, or wherever for that matter, I will be giving the U.S. "causa belice" for invading Venezuela. I won't take that statement back but if you want, I can also declare that the U.S. is also spiraling into a vicious cycle of anti-democratic practices: Messed up elections, the Patriot Act, an uneducated and fanatical stronghold that is unable to criticise the president, a dwindling and generally apathetic civil society, an incompetent opposition by the Democratic Party, a political elite that does not tap into its society's main concerns, etc.
As a final reflection I would like to share with you Jürgen Habermas's indication regarding a successful dialogue: Allow yourself to be coerced by the non-coercive coercion of the best argument. Without the play on words, it pretty much states that one should allow themselves to be convinced by the best arguments. And if the nature of this whole thread lies within the dispute between believing that Chavez is the most democratic leader that the western world has seen or recognizing that he is your average populist leader who just happens to be sitting on a gold mine that gives him more political relevance in a oil-hungy world, well then I'll stick to the latter.
Idealizing and praising Chavez does not make Bush look worse, it just makes you look ignorant. Please, never give a politician your unconditional support or praise. Vote and praise when they do good, but never stop being critical. In politics the only political support that benefits the country is constant critical stance.
Chavez closes down radio stations that dissent. He's a dictator and brokendave has no idea what he's talking about. I know people from Venezuela and they don't plan on going back because they have everything to lose and nothing to gain.
Chavez is a socialist totalitarian dictator and he won't relinquish power. Anyone who says otherwise is a dumbass socialist too.
I know two families from Venezuela. One of them still lives there, and they come to the U.S. for business. Even though they are middle class, they don't hate President Chavez. They think he could do some things better, but they like the fact that he is trying to provide social systems for the public.
The other family loves President Chavez, and they live in the U.S.. They have family who still live there, and they visit their Venezuelan family members when they can.
What power should he "relinquish"? All the power he has he was given. I will concede that he is making decisions against the best judgment of his constituency at this point, but I will not concede to the idea that he is a totalitarian dictator because it simply can't be backed up with evidence.
CorporateWhore... I like how you openly admit that you are a "get ahead no matter what", "dog eat dog", "yes man" kinda guy, and that you hold those truths with such pride.
CorporateWhore is exactly what his name indicates... a "get ahead no matter what", "dog eat dog", "yes man" kinda guy!
And you're a socialist who favors a totalitarian dictator. As long as we're tossing out generalizations...
His socialism aside, his impositions on free speech are what really matter. Saying his opponents are puppets of the U.S. is a massive cop out that only a dictator would claim to keep power. Chavez cuts down speech that he doesn't agree with.
I recently spoke to a former foreign exchange student friend of mine from Venezuela and he views Chavez's actions as totalitarian.
The people that you know live in the U.S. for a reason: Venezuela's economy is crumbling because of Chavez's actions. He is making businesses state-owned and ruining their efficiency, making them uncompetitive. Venezuela has much potential, but not with a socialist running the show.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
In 2007, Chavez issued a decree mandating the deportation of any foreign visitors to Venezuela who criticized himself or his administration.[70]
Yeah. What a nice guy.
In 2006, Reporters Without Borders ranked Venezuela 115th out of 168 countries in its global press freedom listing, sharply down from the last year's rating of 90th.[67] Freedom House currently rates Venezuela as "Not Free" according to its latest survey.[68] The U.S. Senate also passed a resolution condemning the closure of RCTV.[69]
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
0
g under p
Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
Not much different than what we do here. As this administration along with Congress's blessings widen listenting into America. A cool dicatorship has arrived here and many choose to have a blind eye to it.
I wonder who will get the CONTRACTS for all the data collecting.....hhhmmm...Haliburton! Guess who is overseeing it's application Roberto Gonzales a real winner.
Peace
Earle
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
Not much different than what we do here. As this administration along with Congress's blessings widen listenting into America. A cool dicatorship has arrived here and many choose to have a blind eye to it.
I wonder who will get the CONTRACTS for all the data collecting.....hhhmmm...Haliburton! Guess who is overseeing it's application Roberto Gonzales a real winner.
Peace
Earle
None of that made any sense whatsoever.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
0
g under p
Surfing The far side of THE Sombrero Galaxy Posts: 18,200
I could say the same about some of the things you've written!
Peace
Earle
*We CAN bomb the World to pieces, but we CAN'T bomb it into PEACE*...Michael Franti
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
I recently spoke to a former foreign exchange student friend of mine from Venezuela and he views Chavez's actions as totalitarian.
The people that you know live in the U.S. for a reason: Venezuela's economy is crumbling because of Chavez's actions. He is making businesses state-owned and ruining their efficiency, making them uncompetitive. Venezuela has much potential, but not with a socialist running the show.
1. Predictable. I knew you wouldn't see that I was mocking your generalization.
2. Chavez doesn't snuff out any opposing view, he snuffs out the view of people who would conspire against him in an unlawful manner! There is a huge difference! I don't think it is so easy to say you wouldn't do something similar if you were in his shoes.
3. Socialism will work if he isn't murdered. Since you promoted "competition" there, I assume you think capitalism is a fair alternative to socialized systems...
2. Chavez doesn't snuff out any opposing view, he snuffs out the view of people who would conspire against him in an unlawful manner! There is a huge difference! I don't think it is so easy to say you wouldn't do something similar if you were in his shoes.
lol! Conspire against him in an unlawful manner. Define unlawful. Breathing on him incorrectly?
3. Socialism will work if he isn't murdered. Since you promoted "competition" there, I assume you think capitalism is a fair alternative to socialized systems...
Capitalism will result from that socialist experiment. Eventually their economy will come toppling down and Chavez will have no more support. Socialism will always lead to economic depression no matter what you do.
All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
-Enoch Powell
Capitalism will result from that socialist experiment. Eventually their economy will come toppling down and Chavez will have no more support. Socialism will always lead to economic depression no matter what you do.
Exactly. For example see the USSR
Boston 9-28-04, 5-24-06, 5-25-06, 5-17-10, 8-5-16, 8-7-16, 9-2-18, 9-4-18 Ft Worth 9-15-23
Hartford 5-13-06, 6-27-08, 10-25-13
Mansfield, MA 6-30-08, 6-28-08, 7-2-03, 7-3-03, 7-11-03, 8-29-00, 8-30-00, 9-15-98, 9-16-98
Worcester 10-15-13, 10-16-13
lol! Conspire against him in an unlawful manner. Define unlawful. Breathing on him incorrectly?
Capitalism will result from that socialist experiment. Eventually their economy will come toppling down and Chavez will have no more support. Socialism will always lead to economic depression no matter what you do.
1. unlawful manner - coup de ta, assassination, etc.
2. Oh great Corprodamus, thank you for your clairvoyant message to us all. Take heed!
All empires and governments fall eventually. As will our capitalist society in the United States. Alas, I believe it's beginning to crumble from the inside as we speak.
Just because it will crumble doesn't make it evil.
No one except his own people. He's taken their basic liberties away. I'd call that an attack.
Examples please.
What I see from you is that you're taking the media feed that America welcomes from his opposition there. The opposition to Chavez in Venezuela is incredibley wealthy and own most of the media outlets. Their demonization of him is no more or less the same as yours. And they are free demonize at will.
Examples please.
What I see from you is that you're taking the media feed that America welcomes from his opposition there. The opposition to Chavez in Venezuela is incredibley wealthy and own most of the media outlets. Their demonization of him is no more or less the same as yours. And they are free demonize at will.
Uh, get your head out of the sand. Have you read any of the posts in this thread?
"Just when I thought that I was out they pull me back in" . First and foremost, I am Chilean (before somebody pulls the Bush/Republican card), I grew up in Venezuela, and yes I'm very shocked 'cause well it is as unbiased as Powell's statements at the UN General Assembly .
Hmmm, right. I'm guessing you've never heard of Maisanta List and the Tascon List. However, if you don't have the time, I'll brief you in: those lists contain the names of those who registered to vote in favor of the 2003 Referendum. Well, guess what, those persons have lost their jobs, their retirement pensions, health care benefits, can't leave the country and etc, etc. And people working for the government HAVE TO attend every single march, speech and act held by the government and they are obliged to wear the red t-shirt. And yes, if you don't go you can pretty much kiss your job godbye (this happened to a friend of mine)
Did you know that during the beginning of these events in April 2002, 13 people from the opposition that were peacefully marching towards the Palacio de Miraflores (Venezuela's White House) were killed by Chavez' hitmen and that all TV networks were blocked and they couldn't broadcast the shootings?? Still today nobody has been prosecuted for those deaths, regardless of petitions by Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and numerous local human rights organizations
The nerve of the middle class!! How dare they pretend that a President has to rule for all its citizens, even those in the opposition . Seriously, the Referendum petition, which is included in Venezuela's Constitution allows for this procedure, and I'm sorry but this is just simple statistics: when you collect over 3 million signatures it can't just be middle and upper class, sorry, Venezuela's poverty rates make it impossible.
So all these weapons he's been buying lately are a clear effort in this direction. Maybe he'll use the Mirage he'll buy from Sarkozy to throw flowers and peace messages throughout the world.
Did you know that Venezuela's social programs for the poor from Venezuela are facing severe shortcomings these days? In the supermarket Chavez government implemented for the poor which are called MERCAL you can't even find milk these days. You know, instead of funding the poor from the US he sould provide better care for the poor of his country and keep his promises about a massive housing program, 'cause last time I check promoting squatting does not constitute a housing program.
Did you know that this is not true simply because electricity never got to be privatized?? The only private electricy company was Electricidad de Caracas (provided to Venezuela's main city) and it was never public. About the phone, well yeah it's becoming public again, which is great!! I'm guessing you never had to get a phone line in Venezuela during the 80's. In an optimistic scenario you could spend 2 years waiting for a CANTV technician to come by to your house to install a phone line. In those years (man, we spent like 5 years without a phone line) selling a property with a phone line could increase its value like 10%. But what it is really important is that the State controls CANTV, nevermind the quality of the service, right? And banking? I'm sorry, but Venezuela's states always had banking. There's always been both types of banks: public banks and private banks. What's really great and a definite "improvement" is that the upcoming Chavez constitutional reform will remove the Central Bank autonomy, fantastic!! Now he'll print money whenever he feels like it!
Did you know that in concern of the extreme circumstances of the upper 9th ward of New Orleans, Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez offered aid to the victims of Hurricane Katrina?
Uh, get your head out of the sand. Have you read any of the posts in this thread?
Caterina lived in Venezuela.
[/quote]
I know for a fact this is a lie:
Did you know that during the beginning of these events in April 2002, 13 people from the opposition that were peacefully marching towards the Palacio de Miraflores (Venezuela's White House) were killed by Chavez' hitmen and that all TV networks were blocked and they couldn't broadcast the shootings?? Still today nobody has been prosecuted for those deaths, regardless of petitions by Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and numerous local human rights organizations
Caterina is towing the opposition line, and she and I have gone over it before.
Did you know that during the beginning of these events in April 2002, 13 people from the opposition that were peacefully marching towards the Palacio de Miraflores (Venezuela's White House) were killed by Chavez' hitmen and that all TV networks were blocked and they couldn't broadcast the shootings?? Still today nobody has been prosecuted for those deaths, regardless of petitions by Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and numerous local human rights organizations
Caterina is towing the opposition line, and she and I have gone over it before.[/quote]
you KNOW for a FACT that it is a lie... ok....
but what about the TRUCKLOAD of other arguments that she presented!!!!
Or does the dispute of one fact make all of her argument crumble? Very scientific of you
In fact, the whole of that post from Caterina is absolute opposition rhetoric.
Politics as usual. Melodrama.
In other words. Dishonest.
lol! There's no need to argue with you because you've clearly been brainwashed. This is insanity, not argument. Even amnesty international has come out against him. They're as liberal as it gets. You and brokendave are simply brainwashed lunatics - not rational debaters. You have absolutely no evidence in the face of Caterina's claims and yet you say she has no evidence.
The simple fact is: I'm not arguing with a credible, sane individual here. Socialism brings about this incredible poverty of mind that is clearly seen even on this board. When you deny people their basic freedom of speech and assembly, you can control them so deeply that they will refuse to believe facts that are before their very eyes. Brainwashed.
In fact, if I didn't know better, I would say you're being satirically brainwashed.
What do you think about Kim Jong-Il?? He's a good guy right??
Haha, here's some "factual" biographical information on him from his website! You want to support him too?
lol! There's no need to argue with you because you've clearly been brainwashed. This is insanity, not argument. Even amnesty international has come out against him. They're as liberal as it gets. You and brokendave are simply brainwashed lunatics - not rational debaters. You have absolutely no evidence in the face of Caterina's claims and yet you say she has no evidence.
The simple fact is: I'm not arguing with a credible, sane individual here. Socialism brings about this incredible poverty of mind that is clearly seen even on this board. When you deny people their basic freedom of speech and assembly, you can control them so deeply that they will refuse to believe facts that are before their very eyes. Brainwashed.
What do you think about Kim Jong-Il?? He's a good guy right??
Haha, here's some "factual" biographical information on him from his website! You want to support him too?
Good god, you get yourself hung up on a word. I don't understand that. I won't call you insane, as you have me, because I know better.
What I can say is that you are among a large population of folks that hate for the sake of hating, and it really gets tiresome.
I don't hate Dubya, but I bet you think I do.
Look at it this way: the "communism" of the USSR, back in the day, sought to distribute currency in a different way. A new way. It was neither Communist, or Socialist or Capitalist in the way that you choose to believe those words to mean. It was just different. There are a billion different ways to distribute currency.
Comments
The above statements I've selected I am still officially calling BULLSHIT.
1. You can't compare President Hugo Chavez to Adolf Hilter. President Chavez never attempted genocide, nor is he promoting imperialism.
2. You assume his motives, when if you look at what he is doing, there is a much more reasonable motive you could derive: He is trying to flush out the power handled by his most powerful opposition (whom will eventually kill him if things continue to not go their way), and he is trying to form a truly socio-democratic society.
3. What evidence do you have of greed on the President's part? I still think the intolerance to opposition lacks serious proof, and is still hearsay.
4. I wish you wouldn't call President Chavez a dictator. You give Washington ammo to invade Venezuela, or promote another coup with a person who could very well be a dictator when you say that.
Chavez is a socialist totalitarian dictator and he won't relinquish power. Anyone who says otherwise is a dumbass socialist too.
-Enoch Powell
I'll bet you don't even know you're waning ironic.
And I'm not talking bush.
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except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
I'm not saying that Chavez has commited genocide. My point was that getting into government through legitimate mechanisms is no guarantee of a democratic government, that's why even the most democratic regimes consider the possibility of impeachment.
I do think he is promoting imperialism. He is trying to create an alliance with Bolivia, Ecuador and Cuba to push his "new socialist" project. His main diplomatic currency: petrodollars. Those babies are flying out into these other poorer countries fiscal arks.
I really don't think that by calling Chavez a dictator in this forum, or wherever for that matter, I will be giving the U.S. "causa belice" for invading Venezuela. I won't take that statement back but if you want, I can also declare that the U.S. is also spiraling into a vicious cycle of anti-democratic practices: Messed up elections, the Patriot Act, an uneducated and fanatical stronghold that is unable to criticise the president, a dwindling and generally apathetic civil society, an incompetent opposition by the Democratic Party, a political elite that does not tap into its society's main concerns, etc.
As a final reflection I would like to share with you Jürgen Habermas's indication regarding a successful dialogue: Allow yourself to be coerced by the non-coercive coercion of the best argument. Without the play on words, it pretty much states that one should allow themselves to be convinced by the best arguments. And if the nature of this whole thread lies within the dispute between believing that Chavez is the most democratic leader that the western world has seen or recognizing that he is your average populist leader who just happens to be sitting on a gold mine that gives him more political relevance in a oil-hungy world, well then I'll stick to the latter.
Idealizing and praising Chavez does not make Bush look worse, it just makes you look ignorant. Please, never give a politician your unconditional support or praise. Vote and praise when they do good, but never stop being critical. In politics the only political support that benefits the country is constant critical stance.
I know two families from Venezuela. One of them still lives there, and they come to the U.S. for business. Even though they are middle class, they don't hate President Chavez. They think he could do some things better, but they like the fact that he is trying to provide social systems for the public.
The other family loves President Chavez, and they live in the U.S.. They have family who still live there, and they visit their Venezuelan family members when they can.
What power should he "relinquish"? All the power he has he was given. I will concede that he is making decisions against the best judgment of his constituency at this point, but I will not concede to the idea that he is a totalitarian dictator because it simply can't be backed up with evidence.
CorporateWhore... I like how you openly admit that you are a "get ahead no matter what", "dog eat dog", "yes man" kinda guy, and that you hold those truths with such pride.
And you're a socialist who favors a totalitarian dictator. As long as we're tossing out generalizations...
His socialism aside, his impositions on free speech are what really matter. Saying his opponents are puppets of the U.S. is a massive cop out that only a dictator would claim to keep power. Chavez cuts down speech that he doesn't agree with.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Hugo_Ch%C3%A1vez#Free_speech
I recently spoke to a former foreign exchange student friend of mine from Venezuela and he views Chavez's actions as totalitarian.
The people that you know live in the U.S. for a reason: Venezuela's economy is crumbling because of Chavez's actions. He is making businesses state-owned and ruining their efficiency, making them uncompetitive. Venezuela has much potential, but not with a socialist running the show.
-Enoch Powell
Yeah. What a nice guy.
In 2006, Reporters Without Borders ranked Venezuela 115th out of 168 countries in its global press freedom listing, sharply down from the last year's rating of 90th.[67] Freedom House currently rates Venezuela as "Not Free" according to its latest survey.[68] The U.S. Senate also passed a resolution condemning the closure of RCTV.[69]
-Enoch Powell
I wonder who will get the CONTRACTS for all the data collecting.....hhhmmm...Haliburton! Guess who is overseeing it's application Roberto Gonzales a real winner.
Peace
Earle
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
None of that made any sense whatsoever.
-Enoch Powell
Peace
Earle
*MUSIC IS the expression of EMOTION.....and that POLITICS IS merely the DECOY of PERCEPTION*
.....song_Music & Politics....Michael Franti
*The scientists of today think deeply instead of clearly. One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite INSANE*....Nikola Tesla(a man who shaped our world of electricity with his futuristic inventions)
1. Predictable. I knew you wouldn't see that I was mocking your generalization.
2. Chavez doesn't snuff out any opposing view, he snuffs out the view of people who would conspire against him in an unlawful manner! There is a huge difference! I don't think it is so easy to say you wouldn't do something similar if you were in his shoes.
3. Socialism will work if he isn't murdered. Since you promoted "competition" there, I assume you think capitalism is a fair alternative to socialized systems...
lol! Conspire against him in an unlawful manner. Define unlawful. Breathing on him incorrectly?
Capitalism will result from that socialist experiment. Eventually their economy will come toppling down and Chavez will have no more support. Socialism will always lead to economic depression no matter what you do.
-Enoch Powell
Exactly. For example see the USSR
Ft Worth 9-15-23
Hartford 5-13-06, 6-27-08, 10-25-13
Mansfield, MA 6-30-08, 6-28-08, 7-2-03, 7-3-03, 7-11-03, 8-29-00, 8-30-00, 9-15-98, 9-16-98
Worcester 10-15-13, 10-16-13
1. unlawful manner - coup de ta, assassination, etc.
2. Oh great Corprodamus, thank you for your clairvoyant message to us all. Take heed!
All empires and governments fall eventually. As will our capitalist society in the United States. Alas, I believe it's beginning to crumble from the inside as we speak.
Just because it will crumble doesn't make it evil.
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except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
Chavez's definition of "unlawful"
Any action or form of speech that opposes his regime. Anyone who speaks against him is a U.S. spy!!
Lol, you people are too much.
-Enoch Powell
And you're too paranoid for your own good.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
I'm definitely not paranoid about Hugo Chavez. If he ever attacked us, I know we could rip him a new asshole.
He's very paranoid about us though.
-Enoch Powell
Chavez for dictator! OLAAAA OYLAAA OLLLAAAA OLLLLLA!!!!
Then why the demonization? He hasn't attacked anyone.
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No one except his own people. He's taken their basic liberties away. I'd call that an attack.
-Enoch Powell
Examples please.
What I see from you is that you're taking the media feed that America welcomes from his opposition there. The opposition to Chavez in Venezuela is incredibley wealthy and own most of the media outlets. Their demonization of him is no more or less the same as yours. And they are free demonize at will.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
All I've been reading is some bickering between three people about how many venezuelan's they know and their definition of a dictatorship.
CaterinaA had some pretty meaningful things to say but it seems like it just went over your heads.
Brokendave, have you ever spent $20+ to buy a Che Guevara shirt? Just asking...
Uh, get your head out of the sand. Have you read any of the posts in this thread?
Caterina lived in Venezuela.
[/quote]
-Enoch Powell
I know for a fact this is a lie:
Did you know that during the beginning of these events in April 2002, 13 people from the opposition that were peacefully marching towards the Palacio de Miraflores (Venezuela's White House) were killed by Chavez' hitmen and that all TV networks were blocked and they couldn't broadcast the shootings?? Still today nobody has been prosecuted for those deaths, regardless of petitions by Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and numerous local human rights organizations
Caterina is towing the opposition line, and she and I have gone over it before.
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.
I know for a fact this is a lie:
Did you know that during the beginning of these events in April 2002, 13 people from the opposition that were peacefully marching towards the Palacio de Miraflores (Venezuela's White House) were killed by Chavez' hitmen and that all TV networks were blocked and they couldn't broadcast the shootings?? Still today nobody has been prosecuted for those deaths, regardless of petitions by Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch and numerous local human rights organizations
Caterina is towing the opposition line, and she and I have gone over it before.[/quote]
you KNOW for a FACT that it is a lie... ok....
but what about the TRUCKLOAD of other arguments that she presented!!!!
Or does the dispute of one fact make all of her argument crumble? Very scientific of you
Politics as usual. Melodrama.
In other words. Dishonest.
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lol! There's no need to argue with you because you've clearly been brainwashed. This is insanity, not argument. Even amnesty international has come out against him. They're as liberal as it gets. You and brokendave are simply brainwashed lunatics - not rational debaters. You have absolutely no evidence in the face of Caterina's claims and yet you say she has no evidence.
The simple fact is: I'm not arguing with a credible, sane individual here. Socialism brings about this incredible poverty of mind that is clearly seen even on this board. When you deny people their basic freedom of speech and assembly, you can control them so deeply that they will refuse to believe facts that are before their very eyes. Brainwashed.
In fact, if I didn't know better, I would say you're being satirically brainwashed.
What do you think about Kim Jong-Il?? He's a good guy right??
Haha, here's some "factual" biographical information on him from his website! You want to support him too?
http://www.korea-dpr.com/articles-ng/biography-kimjongil.htm
-Enoch Powell
What I can say is that you are among a large population of folks that hate for the sake of hating, and it really gets tiresome.
I don't hate Dubya, but I bet you think I do.
Look at it this way: the "communism" of the USSR, back in the day, sought to distribute currency in a different way. A new way. It was neither Communist, or Socialist or Capitalist in the way that you choose to believe those words to mean. It was just different. There are a billion different ways to distribute currency.
Now you tell me. Who decides that?
all posts by ©gue_barium are protected under US copyright law and are not to be reproduced, exchanged or sold
except by express written permission of ©gue_barium, the author.