becos they were heated and emotional. a friend was assaulted by a crazy man and they wanted to offer their support and they were insulted by your insensitive and ego-stroking proselytizing.
Is that how you classify it? Your not such a nice guy Soulsinging.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
just figuring that out now? im an asshole, most people round here know that.
Not always. You aren't always an asshole.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
The problem I had with Jeanie is that she asserted that statistically men are more violent than women, and men are the cause of most domestic violence. I respectfully posted statistics from Statistics Canada, as we were in-fact discussing the Ontario Provincial Police. But never-the-less this didn't budge Jeanie from her pre-convictions and she chose to defend her beliefs by suggesting the statistics are wrong without providing other data. Now, I have a real problem when someone uses "no reason" to retain their prejudice views. Would you expect Jeanie to remain quiet and not rebuttal if I suggested that all women are bad drivers, or even that women are the majority of mentally ill people? Absolutely not, she would come at me with the force of a train wreck. She wouldn't be the only one to do so. Why is some prejudice acceptable, while others are not? Why is some "bad behavior" justified if coerced by opinions contrary to normal social prejudice?
In most cases you will find that I merely post my opinion followed by empirical data. I do post rebuttals to arguments that are contrary to mine. But you will see in most cases that the initiation of personal attacks is not on my hands. Take the thread about the 7-year old unruly child
Swan; if you don't have kids then shut the fuck up.
Catefrances: you have NO idea what it is like to be a parent.
Redrock: it is a well know fact/stereotype that generally women will use communication rather than force (and are better at communication than men).
Austin: Common sense exists. I find the people who have the least amount of common sense are the ones who learn their life lessons in books.
Are not all of these statements intended to condescend my opinion as a male without kids? They intend to say that I can not possibly have the knowledge these individuals have because I'm not privledged as them? It's absolutely absurd when you consider Redrock's statement, then look at the other statements. If women are so good at communication, why do they sometimes make such meaningless statements? I can spend days posting comments similar to these directed at me and my posts. I'm not congregating with other members to chastize these people. At this point I could really care less what the herd thinks or says about me, with these kinds of statements, they've lost my respect as mature debaters.
"There aint no point in talking when there's nobody listening"
"Young hearts be free tonight, time is on your side, don't let em put you down, don't let em push you round, don't let em ever change your point of view"
"There aint no point in talking when there's nobody listening"
If someone did listen to me, and actually agreed with me, it would take a lot of courage for them to say so. With the hordes of clones on here that pounce all over me. It's on record that gue_barium and Angelica do not share your perceptions in entirety and have had the courage to speak against the mob.
"Young hearts be free tonight, time is on your side, don't let em put you down, don't let em push you round, don't let em ever change your point of view"
That's the intention. I would rephrase the last part though, I'm not going to 'let' someone change my point of view, but they are more than welcome to influence it.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
If someone did listen to me, and actually agreed with me, it would take a lot of courage for them to say so. With the hordes of clones on here that pounce all over me. It's on record that gue_barium and Angelica do not share your perceptions in entirety and have had the courage to speak against the mob.
nobody knows what gue feels, he likes to post yoda-like sayings that nobody understands. angelica, as far as i have noticed, strongly disagrees with most of what you most most of the time. she's just more patient than the rest of us about it. i also somewhat agree with many of the things you say from time to time and understand the validity of some of it. however, 1) you speak about it with a narrow ideological verve similar to that of a pentecostal minister preaching fire and brimstone which makes me challenge you becos you don't know as much as you think you do and your views are not as ironclad as you present them to be and 2) you come off condescending and arrogant and that's annoying so i enjoy taking you down a few pegs when you hop on your high horse. in addition, your social skills need some work, there is a time and a place for everything and you seem utterly oblivious to what is appropriate or how to convince people rather than talk down to them.
nobody knows what gue feels, he likes to post yoda-like sayings that nobody understands. angelica, as far as i have noticed, strongly disagrees with most of what you most most of the time. she's just more patient than the rest of us about it. i also somewhat agree with many of the things you say from time to time and understand the validity of some of it. however, 1) you speak about it with a narrow ideological verve similar to that of a pentecostal minister preaching fire and brimstone which makes me challenge you becos you don't know as much as you think you do and your views are not as ironclad as you present them to be and 2) you come off condescending and arrogant and that's annoying so i enjoy taking you down a few pegs when you hop on your high horse. in addition, your social skills need some work, there is a time and a place for everything and you seem utterly oblivious to what is appropriate or how to convince people rather than talk down to them.
It's all in the interpretation Soulsinging. If I told you that I suffered brain damage as a kid, would that matter to you? My guess is probably not, since that's what I've stressed the most as a factor in decision making. It also affects social skills. Maybe I am psychopathic because I didn't cry when my grandmother died, I didn't flinch when my father had a heart-attack. When my father had a seizure, I didn't freak out, I calmly contacted 911 and took steps to apply first-aid. By choice? No. Do I feel fear or regret? Not really. By choice? No. We've talked a lot on her about how feelings are subjective, well, if we could apply it to a scale, if you are a 10, I'd be a one for most emotions. By choice? No. Does it bother me? No. I accept it and I accept that others subjective experiences are not identical to my own. Do I feel strong compassion for Earthgirl? not anymore than for her stalker, unfortunately, I can't. On the other hand, it enables me to view the situation from a non-bias perspective. I don't like the pessimist/optimist paradigm, but I'd definitely be an optimist. I like to find the advantage to my faults, I may not be good at comforting Earthgirl, but I am good at understanding the stalker. Maybe this is difficult for people to accept and understand, but I've felt what it feels like to want to kill someone without remorse, I've crossed over to the mental set of a psychopath and stepped back. I'm not trying to be condescending, I just come from a different point of view.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
nobody knows what gue feels, he likes to post yoda-like sayings that nobody understands. angelica, as far as i have noticed, strongly disagrees with most of what you most most of the time. she's just more patient than the rest of us about it. i also somewhat agree with many of the things you say from time to time and understand the validity of some of it. however, 1) you speak about it with a narrow ideological verve similar to that of a pentecostal minister preaching fire and brimstone which makes me challenge you becos you don't know as much as you think you do and your views are not as ironclad as you present them to be and 2) you come off condescending and arrogant and that's annoying so i enjoy taking you down a few pegs when you hop on your high horse. in addition, your social skills need some work, there is a time and a place for everything and you seem utterly oblivious to what is appropriate or how to convince people rather than talk down to them.
You might notice that Ahnimus and I have made a certain peace in the past few weeks. That being after talking on the phone and recognizing that our communication issues on the board are a complete illusion. Ahnimus was awesome on the phone, and for 5 hours and 10 minutes of continuous talking, I didn't hear one hint of condescension, ego, disrespect or anything. The contrary. He was completely calm and reasonable. I think Ahnimus is very misunderstood. I have a lot of respect for him. He can only communicate on the board the way he knows how...that comes naturally to him. Although his communication style seems detached, on the phone he seemed very balanced, and particularly intuitive and sensitive in terms of being very aware.
As for his narrow idealogical views. He didn't seem that way at all on the phone. I spoke about my most out there spiritual stuff, and he did not invalidate me in any way, at all. Same thing on the gabbly chat one morning at 6:00 am. To the contrary, he validated my spiritual stuff.
edit: although Ahnimus and I disagree a lot, and vehemently sometimes, on the phone, or in pms, we're very calm and mutually accepting in our style. And we have some very fundamental basics in common.
"The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr
It's all in the interpretation Soulsinging. If I told you that I suffered brain damage as a kid, would that matter to you? My guess is probably not, since that's what I've stressed the most as a factor in decision making. It also affects social skills. Maybe I am psychopathic because I didn't cry when my grandmother died, I didn't flinch when my father had a heart-attack. When my father had a seizure, I didn't freak out, I calmly contacted 911 and took steps to apply first-aid. By choice? No. Do I feel fear or regret? Not really. By choice? No. We've talked a lot on her about how feelings are subjective, well, if we could apply it to a scale, if you are a 10, I'd be a one for most emotions. By choice? No. Does it bother me? No. I accept it and I accept that others subjective experiences are not identical to my own. Do I feel strong compassion for Earthgirl? not anymore than for her stalker, unfortunately, I can't. On the other hand, it enables me to view the situation from a non-bias perspective. I don't like the pessimist/optimist paradigm, but I'd definitely be an optimist. I like to find the advantage to my faults, I may not be good at comforting Earthgirl, but I am good at understanding the stalker. Maybe this is difficult for people to accept and understand, but I've felt what it feels like to want to kill someone without remorse, I've crossed over to the mental set of a psychopath and stepped back. I'm not trying to be condescending, I just come from a different point of view.
actually it does matter to me. i've always suspected it played a large role in your difficulty communicating with people on here. however, i think my issue is that you do NOT accept it, you deny it consistently. you refused to admit that you were being inconsiderate or callous to her feelings. while your views might be valid and your lack of feeling about it quite explicable, surely on a logical level you ought to have been able to understand the anguish and turmoil you caused and stopped out of respect for others at the time. you reap what you sow. the fact that you do not feel emotions as strongly does not give you the right to be disrespectful and trample on those of others, or to invalidate them. i think if you could understand this concept and learn to express your views in more appropriate contexts, you would find people much more appreciative and accepting of your more analytical approach. but becos you do not do this, people feel you are insulting or demeaning them. which is why they lash out at you. it is not that your views are so reprehensible, it is your manner of expressing them that engenders the reactions you receive.
and if the feelings you describe are signs of a psychopath, then i must be one too. becos i didnt shed a tear when any of my grandparents died. nor when 2 friends committed suicide. i didnt even feel sad. but i do feel for earthgirl.
You might notice that Ahnimus and I have made a certain peace in the past few weeks. That being after talking on the phone and recognizing that our communication issues on the board are a complete illusion. Ahnimus was awesome on the phone, and for 5 hours and 10 minutes of continuous talking, I didn't hear one hint of condescension, ego, disrespect or anything. The contrary. He was completely calm and reasonable. I think Ahnimus is very misunderstood. I have a lot of respect for him. He can only communicate on the board the way he knows how...that comes naturally to him. Although his communication style seems detached, on the phone he seemed very balanced, and particularly intuitive and sensitive in terms of being very aware.
As for his narrow idealogical views. He didn't seem that way at all on the phone. I spoke about my most out there spiritual stuff, and he did not invalidate me in any way, at all. Same thing on the gabbly chat one morning at 6:00 am. To the contrary, he validated my spiritual stuff.
edit: although Ahnimus and I disagree a lot, and vehemently sometimes, on the phone, or in pms, we're very calm and mutually accepting in our style. And we have some very fundamental basics in common.
this only goes to further my point. as i said some time ago, instead of blaming us all for misunderstanding him, perhaps he should work more on how he presents himself here in his posts if the reactions he gets are frustrating. becos it is not an uncommon sentiment and is amply supported by his writing style. i dont believe that he can only post the way he knows how. writing is one skill that can be molded quite readily.
this only goes to further my point. as i said some time ago, instead of blaming us all for misunderstanding him, perhaps he should work more on how he presents himself here in his posts if the reactions he gets are frustrating. becos it is not an uncommon sentiment and is amply supported by his writing style. i dont believe that he can only post the way he knows how. writing is one skill that can be molded quite readily.
Oh he definitely owns his own lack of finesse, too. It does take two to tango. And we definitely need to value and seek out the cooperation of our fellow humans in order to accomplish what we want to in life. But seriously, when I talked to him on the phone, I vowed I could not ever get mad at him again.
The tone of his "anal" intellectualizing is completely neutral and innocuous in reality.
He is misunderstood, though. He's made a lot of improvements this past while. He's been staying calm even though people have been so insulting to him. I fully support him expressing his view especially when the mob is basically trying to string him up for expressing something differently. I detest that kind of social ostracization. And even the things he's said to me in the past that incensed me (and there were many), I often considered just totally ignoring him to save myself some trouble. The problem was, I am hyper-intuitive. I could see that he was being honest in his very contrary views, for the most part(besides the occasional meltdown). There is a big difference between being well-intended and not commonly accepted, and some of the distinct malice that has been levelled at him the past few days.
I very much support you, Ahnimus, and for the dignity you have shown throughout the recent onslaughts.
"The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr
actually it does matter to me. i've always suspected it played a large role in your difficulty communicating with people on here. however, i think my issue is that you do NOT accept it, you deny it consistently. you refused to admit that you were being inconsiderate or callous to her feelings. while your views might be valid and your lack of feeling about it quite explicable, surely on a logical level you ought to have been able to understand the anguish and turmoil you caused and stopped out of respect for others at the time. you reap what you sow. the fact that you do not feel emotions as strongly does not give you the right to be disrespectful and trample on those of others, or to invalidate them. i think if you could understand this concept and learn to express your views in more appropriate contexts, you would find people much more appreciative and accepting of your more analytical approach. but becos you do not do this, people feel you are insulting or demeaning them. which is why they lash out at you. it is not that your views are so reprehensible, it is your manner of expressing them that engenders the reactions you receive.
and if the feelings you describe are signs of a psychopath, then i must be one too. becos i didnt shed a tear when any of my grandparents died. nor when 2 friends committed suicide. i didnt even feel sad. but i do feel for earthgirl.
I feel for Earthgirl too and I am very concerned about her situation. It's the reason I posted, there are dozens of posts I can "push my agenda" on, I start several a week myself. However, I just don't view it like a movie. I don't see a completely insane Hannibal Lecter type dude stalking her. That's unrealistic, it happens a lot in movies, but in real life, it's not that common. Most serial killers or mass murders are indescriminate. Most often murder is commited as a crime of passion. The alternatives are organized crime and premeditated murder. There are certain personality characteristics that go with each type of killer. This man does not fit the characteristics of an organized criminal or premeditated murder. Both of those types tend to be more careful, they wouldn't not expose themselves to public awareness and certainly would not allow themselves to be arrested for assaulting her. That leaves murder out of passion, well, the ideal thing to do is understand what acts she performs that will affect his emotions and develop a stratagy for dissolving his obsession with her, without setting him into murder mode. It's a delicate thing, if he has read the board because he knows she posts here, he's seen what others have said about him, the labels they've given him and it's affecting his psyche. Positively? Probably not, because people don't forgive and forget like they should, especially once labeled a stalker, he's pretty much fucked, right? So he's effectively out-casted from society, or at least Earthgirl's society, which he would need to be accepted into to have any part of her life, besides stalking her and hurting her. I intend to be in his head, which is what an investigator would do. I know this person can be a decent human being, anyone can, but he's confused, possibly brain damaged, he needs help. Earthgirl needs help too, but emotional support to me, isn't blowing up this image of Hannibal Lecter, I mean come on? You want to freak the shit out of someone or what? I had a discoloured mole and I went to the doctor, he said "You are going to die from that." and it fucked up my life until I had a biopsy return atypical. The fear she experiences can cause cortisol damage to her brain. She best to remain calm and not constantly hear about how fucked up this guy might be.
I mean, I just think this is the way people have been handling these situations from the beginning. Since they were children. I was afraid of the dark, you know why? Because I didn't think about it. Kids will sit in the dark thinking about how dark it is until it scares the holy hell out of them. But I realized that and got over it, most people do. The underlying lesson is if you obsess over the fear it's gonna get worse, it's gonna totally fuck up your day. I took an anger management class when I was a teenager. They said "Only you can make you angry" and I said "yea right, how many times can I hit you with a hammer till you stop saying that". But I missed their point all together. The experience of anger was completely within my control. I think I fair pretty well most of the time with my anger, which is one emotion I can really feel. I get attacked on her constantly, and some times as bad as this last week and I try to keep my composure. Getting banned isn't fun either :(
I also learned that fear is bad for getting into bad situations. I was harassed by mobs of people growing up, talk about my social skills. Eventually I learned that all I had to do was stand up to them, exhibit strength and they would be intimidated and back down. When I used to smoke out front of my store, young punks wearing crypt or blood colours would give me a hard time and I'd tell them off. Most of them are just playing dress-up with the bandanas, they aren't even part of the notorious gangs. I tell 'em, "dude, if you were a crypt or blood, you wouldn't be stabbing me over $3 bucks, your likely to get yourself stabbed for wearing their colours!" throws them right off-guard, next time you see them around they aren't wearing any colours. I saw four crypt wannabes wearing blue bandanas get fucked up infront of my store by some dude wearing a white bandana claiming to be Looney Tunes. I never heard of them, I think he was just soloing, but hey, they stopped playing dress-up too. Fucking salesmen and people will walk all over you if you let them. Relationships are no different, there are boundaries, people will cross them, you gotta stop it when they do. I don't know how long it's been going on with Earthgirl and this guy, but if it's recent, he hasn't the chemical bonds to her to really make an impact, he's got behavioral problems. But it sounds like it's been happening for a while, now it's a far more delicate situation. Love is a powerful emotion, it plays a huge role in decision making, it's motivating him to do what he does. It never should have developed. Girls gotta say "Fuck off!" at the start. Or use more tact, but get the message across nice and clear.
Anyway, that's just what I think in the best words I could use to describe it at the current state my brain is in. It's pretty long and I don't mean to sound condescending, I just meant to illustrate how I feel about the situation with Earthgirl and these types of things in general. I think everyone can be understood if the effort is there and I don't mean categorizing people either. Like really get a feel for them. Some people I know are going to say something like "That's wrong" "That's ridiculous" I'm going to say that too. And I don't think glorifying Earthgirl's situation is going to help her situation at all. But I don't remember ever saying "That's wrong", I remember posting a theory of action, i.e. telling the guy calmly and clearly that she understands his feelings, but she doesn't share them and wants to stop seeing him around. Then I posted information from http://www.crisiscounselling.com and everyone shit a brick.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I feel for Earthgirl too and I am very concerned about her situation. It's the reason I posted, there are dozens of posts I can "push my agenda" on, I start several a week myself. However, I just don't view it like a movie. I don't see a completely insane Hannibal Lecter type dude stalking her. That's unrealistic, it happens a lot in movies, but in real life, it's not that common. Most serial killers or mass murders are indescriminate. Most often murder is commited as a crime of passion. The alternatives are organized crime and premeditated murder. There are certain personality characteristics that go with each type of killer. This man does not fit the characteristics of an organized criminal or premeditated murder. Both of those types tend to be more careful, they wouldn't not expose themselves to public awareness and certainly would not allow themselves to be arrested for assaulting her. That leaves murder out of passion, well, the ideal thing to do is understand what acts she performs that will affect his emotions and develop a stratagy for dissolving his obsession with her, without setting him into murder mode. It's a delicate thing, if he has read the board because he knows she posts here, he's seen what others have said about him, the labels they've given him and it's affecting his psyche. Positively? Probably not, because people don't forgive and forget like they should, especially once labeled a stalker, he's pretty much fucked, right? So he's effectively out-casted from society, or at least Earthgirl's society, which he would need to be accepted into to have any part of her life, besides stalking her and hurting her. I intend to be in his head, which is what an investigator would do. I know this person can be a decent human being, anyone can, but he's confused, possibly brain damaged, he needs help. Earthgirl needs help too, but emotional support to me, isn't blowing up this image of Hannibal Lecter, I mean come on? You want to freak the shit out of someone or what? I had a discoloured mole and I went to the doctor, he said "You are going to die from that." and it fucked up my life until I had a biopsy return atypical. The fear she experiences can cause cortisol damage to her brain. She best to remain calm and not constantly hear about how fucked up this guy might be.
I mean, I just think this is the way people have been handling these situations from the beginning. Since they were children. I was afraid of the dark, you know why? Because I didn't think about it. Kids will sit in the dark thinking about how dark it is until it scares the holy hell out of them. But I realized that and got over it, most people do. The underlying lesson is if you obsess over the fear it's gonna get worse, it's gonna totally fuck up your day. I took an anger management class when I was a teenager. They said "Only you can make you angry" and I said "yea right, how many times can I hit you with a hammer till you stop saying that". But I missed their point all together. The experience of anger was completely within my control. I think I fair pretty well most of the time with my anger, which is one emotion I can really feel. I get attacked on her constantly, and some times as bad as this last week and I try to keep my composure. Getting banned isn't fun either :(
I also learned that fear is bad for getting into bad situations. I was harassed by mobs of people growing up, talk about my social skills. Eventually I learned that all I had to do was stand up to them, exhibit strength and they would be intimidated and back down. When I used to smoke out front of my store, young punks wearing crypt or blood colours would give me a hard time and I'd tell them off. Most of them are just playing dress-up with the bandanas, they aren't even part of the notorious gangs. I tell 'em, "dude, if you were a crypt or blood, you wouldn't be stabbing me over $3 bucks, your likely to get yourself stabbed for wearing their colours!" throws them right off-guard, next time you see them around they aren't wearing any colours. I saw four crypt wannabes wearing blue bandanas get fucked up infront of my store by some dude wearing a white bandana claiming to be Looney Tunes. I never heard of them, I think he was just soloing, but hey, they stopped playing dress-up too. Fucking salesmen and people will walk all over you if you let them. Relationships are no different, there are boundaries, people will cross them, you gotta stop it when they do. I don't know how long it's been going on with Earthgirl and this guy, but if it's recent, he hasn't the chemical bonds to her to really make an impact, he's got behavioral problems. But it sounds like it's been happening for a while, now it's a far more delicate situation. Love is a powerful emotion, it plays a huge role in decision making, it's motivating him to do what he does. It never should have developed. Girls gotta say "Fuck off!" at the start. Or use more tact, but get the message across nice and clear.
Anyway, that's just what I think in the best words I could use to describe it at the current state my brain is in. It's pretty long and I don't mean to sound condescending, I just meant to illustrate how I feel about the situation with Earthgirl and these types of things in general. I think everyone can be understood if the effort is there and I don't mean categorizing people either. Like really get a feel for them. Some people I know are going to say something like "That's wrong" "That's ridiculous" I'm going to say that too. And I don't think glorifying Earthgirl's situation is going to help her situation at all. But I don't remember ever saying "That's wrong", I remember posting a theory of action, i.e. telling the guy calmly and clearly that she understands his feelings, but she doesn't share them and wants to stop seeing him around. Then I posted information from http://www.crisiscounselling.com and everyone shit a brick.
but he DIDNT love her. he was obsessed with her. there is a difference. she thought she was just being nice to him and was unaware of his interest, just thought he was an acquaintance. he didnt make his feelings clear until the obsession had already gone too far for her to do anything about it. he was not just looking for a platonic relationship, he was unbalanced and needed serious rehabilitation, not a talking to from her. she's not a psychiatrist or behavioral therapist. the guy needed professional help and hearing it from her would not have gotten him that help. lines had already been crossed that could not be uncrossed. you can't reason with a compulsion like that. im guessing she told him she did not share his feelings in that parking lot... and then he beat her for it. the guy was a threat and should have been treated as one. you can work on rehabilitating him once it is certain he is not a threat to anyone. but when her life is potentially at risk, you do not play around with the psyche of that kind of guy. you tell the police and tell her to stock mace and run like hell if he approaches her. protect your person first, save the world second.
Oh he definitely owns his own lack of finesse, too. It does take two to tango. And we definitely need to value and seek out the cooperation of our fellow humans in order to accomplish what we want to in life. But seriously, when I talked to him on the phone, I vowed I could not ever get mad at him again.
The tone of his "anal" intellectualizing is completely neutral and innocuous in reality.
He is misunderstood, though. He's made a lot of improvements this past while. He's been staying calm even though people have been so insulting to him. I fully support him expressing his view especially when the mob is basically trying to string him up for expressing something differently. I detest that kind of social ostracization. And even the things he's said to me in the past that incensed me (and there were many), I often considered just totally ignoring him to save myself some trouble. The problem was, I am hyper-intuitive. I could see that he was being honest in his very contrary views, for the most part(besides the occasional meltdown). There is a big difference between being well-intended and not commonly accepted, and some of the distinct malice that has been levelled at him the past few days.
I very much support you, Ahnimus, and for the dignity you have shown throughout the recent onslaughts.
Maybe if the criticism was more constructive than insulting, progress could be made. I completely see how it's important to be aware of others feelings when communicating on a message board. Everyone here wants to be validated and understood to a certain extent. When people are simply shutting out others and dismissing their views as pointless or silly, it creates so much tension and aggravation (not a healthy environment for learning or opening one's self to new ideas). But at the same time, insulting another for their lack of social skills by ridiculing them is showing the same inability at communication. No one is going to open themselves up to advice when it's filled with negative personal remarks. It winds up being shut out and lost...which makes it just as pointless.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
Maybe if the criticism was more constructive than insulting, progress could be made. I completely see how it's important to be aware of others feelings when communicating on a message board. Everyone here wants to be validated and understood to a certain extent. When people are simply shutting out others and dismissing their views as pointless or silly, it creates so much tension and aggravation (not a healthy environment for learning or opening one's self to new ideas). But at the same time, insulting another for their lack of social skills by ridiculing them is showing the same inability at communication. No one is going to open themselves up to advice when it's filled with negative personal remarks. It winds up being shut out and lost...which makes it just as pointless.
I agree on all these points.
"The opposite of a fact is falsehood, but the opposite of one profound truth may very well be another profound truth." ~ Niels Bohr
Catefrances: you have NO idea what it is like to be a parent.
but until you are in the daily situation of constantly caring and being responsible for a child, you have NO idea what it is like to be a parent.
here is my original quote IN CONTEXT.
if you got your nose out of joint ryan that is not my problem. but you chose to quote me out of context and incompletely. when you defend yourself make sure you quote correctly. and no i dont think my comment was condescending.
hear my name
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
If someone did listen to me, and actually agreed with me, it would take a lot of courage for them to say so. With the hordes of clones on here that pounce all over me. It's on record that gue_barium and Angelica do not share your perceptions in entirety and have had the courage to speak against the mob.
I've listened to you and I've agreed with you plenty of times. Seems you got a bit of selective memory going on there. And I've defended you too.
So perhaps you should cast your mind back to that.
Did it ever occur to you ahnimus that there's a mob mentality because you may be behaving badly? So badly that many people have noticed and are acknowledging that. Even if you did I doubt you'd admit it.
I will not support you when you behave badly. My determination of behaving badly but clearly shared by others here too.
You have choices here and you seem to be refusing to make them.
When you are ready to behave like a human being I may support you again.
Supposing you haven't burned all your bridges by then.
That's the intention. I would rephrase the last part though, I'm not going to 'let' someone change my point of view, but they are more than welcome to influence it.
Nobody seems able to do that ahnimus. You are in your own little world.
Obvious to me, because again, you've made it all about you.
You might notice that Ahnimus and I have made a certain peace in the past few weeks. That being after talking on the phone and recognizing that our communication issues on the board are a complete illusion. Ahnimus was awesome on the phone, and for 5 hours and 10 minutes of continuous talking, I didn't hear one hint of condescension, ego, disrespect or anything. The contrary. He was completely calm and reasonable. I think Ahnimus is very misunderstood. I have a lot of respect for him. He can only communicate on the board the way he knows how...that comes naturally to him. Although his communication style seems detached, on the phone he seemed very balanced, and particularly intuitive and sensitive in terms of being very aware.
As for his narrow idealogical views. He didn't seem that way at all on the phone. I spoke about my most out there spiritual stuff, and he did not invalidate me in any way, at all. Same thing on the gabbly chat one morning at 6:00 am. To the contrary, he validated my spiritual stuff.
edit: although Ahnimus and I disagree a lot, and vehemently sometimes, on the phone, or in pms, we're very calm and mutually accepting in our style. And we have some very fundamental basics in common.
I'm happy that you have made this connection and understanding with ahnimus, angelica. For both of you. It's always wonderful to make powerful and respectful connections.
I'm pleased that he has validated your spirituality and is accepting of your point of view.
It's a shame that ahnimus is unable to recognise and develop this level of communication with others.
It's all in the interpretation Soulsinging. If I told you that I suffered brain damage as a kid, would that matter to you? My guess is probably not, since that's what I've stressed the most as a factor in decision making. It also affects social skills. Maybe I am psychopathic because I didn't cry when my grandmother died, I didn't flinch when my father had a heart-attack. When my father had a seizure, I didn't freak out, I calmly contacted 911 and took steps to apply first-aid. By choice? No. Do I feel fear or regret? Not really. By choice? No. We've talked a lot on her about how feelings are subjective, well, if we could apply it to a scale, if you are a 10, I'd be a one for most emotions. By choice? No. Does it bother me? No. I accept it and I accept that others subjective experiences are not identical to my own. Do I feel strong compassion for Earthgirl? not anymore than for her stalker, unfortunately, I can't. On the other hand, it enables me to view the situation from a non-bias perspective. I don't like the pessimist/optimist paradigm, but I'd definitely be an optimist. I like to find the advantage to my faults, I may not be good at comforting Earthgirl, but I am good at understanding the stalker. Maybe this is difficult for people to accept and understand, but I've felt what it feels like to want to kill someone without remorse, I've crossed over to the mental set of a psychopath and stepped back. I'm not trying to be condescending, I just come from a different point of view.
Ok, so it's ok for you to explain your behavior away because of your brain damage but not ok for others? Because I can think of several occassions recently when you have been downright cruel to other people here on the board who also suffer from brain damage. If we are all to be accepting of your opinions and behaviours because you suffered a brain injury as a child the least you could do is extend the same common courtesy to others in the same position.
Ok, so it's ok for you to explain your behavior away because of your brain damage but not ok for others? Because I can think of several occassions recently when you have been downright cruel to other people here on the board who also suffer from brain damage. If we are all to be accepting of your opinions and behaviours because you suffered a brain injury as a child the least you could do is extend the same common courtesy to others in the same position.
I do. I am not the one attacking people's conditions, occasionally when my barrier breaks down I slip a harsh comment I'm not particularly proud of as a rational entity. I don't attack people personally, I debate their views, if that seems like an attack then I don't know how to debate with you. Best to just ignore my posts because we can't communicate on the same level.
I consider myself somewhat of an academic and I'm putting strong consideration into higher education. Academia is full of arrogance, it's one of the driving factors to scientific discovery. We are cut from a different cloth and that's the issue. I beg you to ignore my posts if you find them offensive to your method of discourse.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Reductionism isn't a big issue. If you think reductionism is a threat to your perception, then maybe something is wrong with your perception. Both the whole and the sum of it's parts should be equivelant. I don't see a problem with that. Perhaps you can elaborate on your distaste for reductionism.
Perhaps we should define reductionism. Is reductionism saying that 2 is the equivelant of 1 plus 1. Or is reductionism saying that 2 is the result of a singularity, reducing the explanation of a whole to none other than the whole, that to me is reductionism. Like suggesting that all the complexity of the universe is reducable to one all-powerful entity. Or maybe that's exterme over-simplification.
Anyway with out the former definition of reductionism, we'd all be dead from an infectious disease. Because all of science is based on reductionism, and science saves lives.
Neither. the reductionsim that I am referring to, is trying to reduce the question, or take it back to the most elementary starting point, eg, like trying to find teh beginnign of a story, when there is always a precedent chapter. If that is the question, that is fone, but in this case, I need to be able to refer to myself, wihout having to argue that I exist.
I'm not saying that reductionism is useless, just that it has it's pplace. For exaple, you can studt phsiology without reducing it to biochemistry, or molocular geneetics or quantum mechanics, which are all possible levels of looking at the same problem.
I'm happy that you have made this connection and understanding with ahnimus, angelica. For both of you. It's always wonderful to make powerful and respectful connections.
I'm pleased that he has validated your spirituality and is accepting of your point of view.
It's a shame that ahnimus is unable to recognise and develop this level of communication with others.
Angelica is wrong on her interpretation of quantum indeterminacy. We do not agree on everything. I do not believe in any ethereal intelligence or cosmic plan. Absolutely no definition of spirituality or God will satisfy me. I use alternate terms to describe functionally the same things. However, Angelica's view is more expansive into unattainable knowledge than mine. I understand Angelica's point of view, as much as I understand yours. I understand they are how you live your lives. They are not for me and in a debate, I will express my viewpoint. Again, I do not communicate well with people of different mind sets. That's the issue.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I do. I am not the one attacking people's conditions, occasionally when my barrier breaks down I slip a harsh comment I'm not particularly proud of as a rational entity. I don't attack people personally, I debate their views, if that seems like an attack then I don't know how to debate with you. Best to just ignore my posts because we can't communicate on the same level.
I consider myself somewhat of an academic and I'm putting strong consideration into higher education. Academia is full of arrogance, it's one of the driving factors to scientific discovery. We are cut from a different cloth and that's the issue. I beg you to ignore my posts if you find them offensive to your method of discourse.
Ok, well that's fine and I understand. But you have attacked me personally and I do think you know how to debate without doing that. I've seen you do it. While it's understandable that you may do that sometimes in the heat of a debate it is not acceptable to assume a position with someone, then continue on with your assumptions incorrectly and then lay the boots in with personal remarks when the going gets tough, just because you are frustrated and maybe have difficulties. And should you do that then the simple thing to do is understand your contribution and rectify it. Please don't tell me that I am incapable of communicating with academics. Because I've done it plenty of times. I've been doing it since I was a kid. They don't seem to have a problem communicating with me. You need to decide if you want to communicate with me or not and if you do then it's in your best interests to learn how to do that. Academia can be full of arrogance, but you are not an academic yet ahnimus, and you have the opportunity here to utilise all of your skills to become a better human being as well as an academic. And I applaud that. However if you feel the need to attack me or if I think that you need to step back from something, I will contribute my opinion.
But saying something is too hard or beneath you is a cop out.
And we both know it.
Neither. the reductionsim that I am referring to, is trying to reduce the question, or take it back to the most elementary starting point, eg, like trying to find teh beginnign of a story, when there is always a precedent chapter. If that is the question, that is fone, but in this case, I need to be able to refer to myself, wihout having to argue that I exist.
I'm not saying that reductionism is useless, just that it has it's pplace. For exaple, you can studt phsiology without reducing it to biochemistry, or molocular geneetics or quantum mechanics, which are all possible levels of looking at the same problem.
I think that's a certain type of reductionism. It's truly unattainable knowledge. But for example if we are discussing physiology, say we are discussing endomorphs and deciphering the cause for their body shape. It would be rational to focus on metabolism and genetics. It would be ridiculous to suggest that theoretically the person doesn't even exist. That kind of reductionism is useless.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Ok, well that's fine and I understand. But you have attacked me personally and I do think you know how to debate without doing that. I've seen you do it. While it's understandable that you may do that sometimes in the heat of a debate it is not acceptable to assume a position with someone, then continue on with your assumptions incorrectly and then lay the boots in with personal remarks when the going gets tough, just because you are frustrated and maybe have difficulties. And should you do that then the simple thing to do is understand your contribution and rectify it. Please don't tell me that I am incapable of communicating with academics. Because I've done it plenty of times. I've been doing it since I was a kid. They don't seem to have a problem communicating with me. You need to decide if you want to communicate with me or not and if you do then it's in your best interests to learn how to do that. Academia can be full of arrogance, but you are not an academic yet ahnimus, and you have the opportunity here to utilise all of your skills to become a better human being as well as an academic. And I applaud that. However if you feel the need to attack me or if I think that you need to step back from something, I will contribute my opinion.
But saying something is too hard or beneath you is a cop out.
And we both know it.
I don't consider you a better human being and I do not wish to be like you. I'm happy with who I am and have no intention of changing. Accept it.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Angelica is wrong on her interpretation of quantum indeterminacy. We do not agree on everything. I do not believe in any ethereal intelligence or cosmic plan. Absolutely no definition of spirituality or God will satisfy me. I use alternate terms to describe functionally the same things. However, Angelica's view is more expansive into unattainable knowledge than mine. I understand Angelica's point of view, as much as I understand yours. I understand they are how you live your lives. They are not for me and in a debate, I will express my viewpoint. Again, I do not communicate well with people of different mind sets. That's the issue.
Well I don't know that I agree that is the issue as both of us understand it, but I understand it is the issue for you. As I see it, if you are capable of the level of understanding of the subjects that you do study then you are also capable of great things when it comes to communication. You just have to decide you want to develop those skills. You will find it an extremely beneficial subject to study.
I think that's a certain type of reductionism. It's truly unattainable knowledge. But for example if we are discussing physiology, say we are discussing endomorphs and deciphering the cause for their body shape. It would be rational to focus on metabolism and genetics. It would be ridiculous to suggest that theoretically the person doesn't even exist. That kind of reductionism is useless.
It's the degree of reductionism that you were pursuing at that point that I was taking issue with. the post is lost about 10 pages back, but I felt that you took the discussion back a bit too far. Not all science is based on reductionism. The trick is to get your level just right for the problem at hand.
For example, while biochemical changes in the brain are present in a person suffering from depression, it is not helpful to focus on that when the cause of depression is usually something more prosaic , like financial trouble, or conflict at work. You need to identify the right level of complexity at which the problem occurs, and direct your interest and intervention there.
It's one thing for science to discover that disease is caused by bacteria, and then you can look at things like encapsulated vs non-encapsulated strains, and the action of different anntibiotics at a molecular level, but infectious disease is really prevented at a public health level of handwashing and correct food handling and storage.
Comments
Is that how you classify it? Your not such a nice guy Soulsinging.
just figuring that out now? im an asshole, most people round here know that.
Not always. You aren't always an asshole.
"There aint no point in talking when there's nobody listening"
"Young hearts be free tonight, time is on your side, don't let em put you down, don't let em push you round, don't let em ever change your point of view"
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
If someone did listen to me, and actually agreed with me, it would take a lot of courage for them to say so. With the hordes of clones on here that pounce all over me. It's on record that gue_barium and Angelica do not share your perceptions in entirety and have had the courage to speak against the mob.
That's the intention. I would rephrase the last part though, I'm not going to 'let' someone change my point of view, but they are more than welcome to influence it.
nobody knows what gue feels, he likes to post yoda-like sayings that nobody understands. angelica, as far as i have noticed, strongly disagrees with most of what you most most of the time. she's just more patient than the rest of us about it. i also somewhat agree with many of the things you say from time to time and understand the validity of some of it. however, 1) you speak about it with a narrow ideological verve similar to that of a pentecostal minister preaching fire and brimstone which makes me challenge you becos you don't know as much as you think you do and your views are not as ironclad as you present them to be and 2) you come off condescending and arrogant and that's annoying so i enjoy taking you down a few pegs when you hop on your high horse. in addition, your social skills need some work, there is a time and a place for everything and you seem utterly oblivious to what is appropriate or how to convince people rather than talk down to them.
yeah, im working on my consistency...
It's all in the interpretation Soulsinging. If I told you that I suffered brain damage as a kid, would that matter to you? My guess is probably not, since that's what I've stressed the most as a factor in decision making. It also affects social skills. Maybe I am psychopathic because I didn't cry when my grandmother died, I didn't flinch when my father had a heart-attack. When my father had a seizure, I didn't freak out, I calmly contacted 911 and took steps to apply first-aid. By choice? No. Do I feel fear or regret? Not really. By choice? No. We've talked a lot on her about how feelings are subjective, well, if we could apply it to a scale, if you are a 10, I'd be a one for most emotions. By choice? No. Does it bother me? No. I accept it and I accept that others subjective experiences are not identical to my own. Do I feel strong compassion for Earthgirl? not anymore than for her stalker, unfortunately, I can't. On the other hand, it enables me to view the situation from a non-bias perspective. I don't like the pessimist/optimist paradigm, but I'd definitely be an optimist. I like to find the advantage to my faults, I may not be good at comforting Earthgirl, but I am good at understanding the stalker. Maybe this is difficult for people to accept and understand, but I've felt what it feels like to want to kill someone without remorse, I've crossed over to the mental set of a psychopath and stepped back. I'm not trying to be condescending, I just come from a different point of view.
As for his narrow idealogical views. He didn't seem that way at all on the phone. I spoke about my most out there spiritual stuff, and he did not invalidate me in any way, at all. Same thing on the gabbly chat one morning at 6:00 am. To the contrary, he validated my spiritual stuff.
edit: although Ahnimus and I disagree a lot, and vehemently sometimes, on the phone, or in pms, we're very calm and mutually accepting in our style. And we have some very fundamental basics in common.
http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta
Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
actually it does matter to me. i've always suspected it played a large role in your difficulty communicating with people on here. however, i think my issue is that you do NOT accept it, you deny it consistently. you refused to admit that you were being inconsiderate or callous to her feelings. while your views might be valid and your lack of feeling about it quite explicable, surely on a logical level you ought to have been able to understand the anguish and turmoil you caused and stopped out of respect for others at the time. you reap what you sow. the fact that you do not feel emotions as strongly does not give you the right to be disrespectful and trample on those of others, or to invalidate them. i think if you could understand this concept and learn to express your views in more appropriate contexts, you would find people much more appreciative and accepting of your more analytical approach. but becos you do not do this, people feel you are insulting or demeaning them. which is why they lash out at you. it is not that your views are so reprehensible, it is your manner of expressing them that engenders the reactions you receive.
and if the feelings you describe are signs of a psychopath, then i must be one too. becos i didnt shed a tear when any of my grandparents died. nor when 2 friends committed suicide. i didnt even feel sad. but i do feel for earthgirl.
this only goes to further my point. as i said some time ago, instead of blaming us all for misunderstanding him, perhaps he should work more on how he presents himself here in his posts if the reactions he gets are frustrating. becos it is not an uncommon sentiment and is amply supported by his writing style. i dont believe that he can only post the way he knows how. writing is one skill that can be molded quite readily.
The tone of his "anal" intellectualizing is completely neutral and innocuous in reality.
He is misunderstood, though. He's made a lot of improvements this past while. He's been staying calm even though people have been so insulting to him. I fully support him expressing his view especially when the mob is basically trying to string him up for expressing something differently. I detest that kind of social ostracization. And even the things he's said to me in the past that incensed me (and there were many), I often considered just totally ignoring him to save myself some trouble. The problem was, I am hyper-intuitive. I could see that he was being honest in his very contrary views, for the most part(besides the occasional meltdown). There is a big difference between being well-intended and not commonly accepted, and some of the distinct malice that has been levelled at him the past few days.
I very much support you, Ahnimus, and for the dignity you have shown throughout the recent onslaughts.
http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta
Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta
Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
I feel for Earthgirl too and I am very concerned about her situation. It's the reason I posted, there are dozens of posts I can "push my agenda" on, I start several a week myself. However, I just don't view it like a movie. I don't see a completely insane Hannibal Lecter type dude stalking her. That's unrealistic, it happens a lot in movies, but in real life, it's not that common. Most serial killers or mass murders are indescriminate. Most often murder is commited as a crime of passion. The alternatives are organized crime and premeditated murder. There are certain personality characteristics that go with each type of killer. This man does not fit the characteristics of an organized criminal or premeditated murder. Both of those types tend to be more careful, they wouldn't not expose themselves to public awareness and certainly would not allow themselves to be arrested for assaulting her. That leaves murder out of passion, well, the ideal thing to do is understand what acts she performs that will affect his emotions and develop a stratagy for dissolving his obsession with her, without setting him into murder mode. It's a delicate thing, if he has read the board because he knows she posts here, he's seen what others have said about him, the labels they've given him and it's affecting his psyche. Positively? Probably not, because people don't forgive and forget like they should, especially once labeled a stalker, he's pretty much fucked, right? So he's effectively out-casted from society, or at least Earthgirl's society, which he would need to be accepted into to have any part of her life, besides stalking her and hurting her. I intend to be in his head, which is what an investigator would do. I know this person can be a decent human being, anyone can, but he's confused, possibly brain damaged, he needs help. Earthgirl needs help too, but emotional support to me, isn't blowing up this image of Hannibal Lecter, I mean come on? You want to freak the shit out of someone or what? I had a discoloured mole and I went to the doctor, he said "You are going to die from that." and it fucked up my life until I had a biopsy return atypical. The fear she experiences can cause cortisol damage to her brain. She best to remain calm and not constantly hear about how fucked up this guy might be.
I mean, I just think this is the way people have been handling these situations from the beginning. Since they were children. I was afraid of the dark, you know why? Because I didn't think about it. Kids will sit in the dark thinking about how dark it is until it scares the holy hell out of them. But I realized that and got over it, most people do. The underlying lesson is if you obsess over the fear it's gonna get worse, it's gonna totally fuck up your day. I took an anger management class when I was a teenager. They said "Only you can make you angry" and I said "yea right, how many times can I hit you with a hammer till you stop saying that". But I missed their point all together. The experience of anger was completely within my control. I think I fair pretty well most of the time with my anger, which is one emotion I can really feel. I get attacked on her constantly, and some times as bad as this last week and I try to keep my composure. Getting banned isn't fun either :(
I also learned that fear is bad for getting into bad situations. I was harassed by mobs of people growing up, talk about my social skills. Eventually I learned that all I had to do was stand up to them, exhibit strength and they would be intimidated and back down. When I used to smoke out front of my store, young punks wearing crypt or blood colours would give me a hard time and I'd tell them off. Most of them are just playing dress-up with the bandanas, they aren't even part of the notorious gangs. I tell 'em, "dude, if you were a crypt or blood, you wouldn't be stabbing me over $3 bucks, your likely to get yourself stabbed for wearing their colours!" throws them right off-guard, next time you see them around they aren't wearing any colours. I saw four crypt wannabes wearing blue bandanas get fucked up infront of my store by some dude wearing a white bandana claiming to be Looney Tunes. I never heard of them, I think he was just soloing, but hey, they stopped playing dress-up too. Fucking salesmen and people will walk all over you if you let them. Relationships are no different, there are boundaries, people will cross them, you gotta stop it when they do. I don't know how long it's been going on with Earthgirl and this guy, but if it's recent, he hasn't the chemical bonds to her to really make an impact, he's got behavioral problems. But it sounds like it's been happening for a while, now it's a far more delicate situation. Love is a powerful emotion, it plays a huge role in decision making, it's motivating him to do what he does. It never should have developed. Girls gotta say "Fuck off!" at the start. Or use more tact, but get the message across nice and clear.
Anyway, that's just what I think in the best words I could use to describe it at the current state my brain is in. It's pretty long and I don't mean to sound condescending, I just meant to illustrate how I feel about the situation with Earthgirl and these types of things in general. I think everyone can be understood if the effort is there and I don't mean categorizing people either. Like really get a feel for them. Some people I know are going to say something like "That's wrong" "That's ridiculous" I'm going to say that too. And I don't think glorifying Earthgirl's situation is going to help her situation at all. But I don't remember ever saying "That's wrong", I remember posting a theory of action, i.e. telling the guy calmly and clearly that she understands his feelings, but she doesn't share them and wants to stop seeing him around. Then I posted information from http://www.crisiscounselling.com and everyone shit a brick.
but he DIDNT love her. he was obsessed with her. there is a difference. she thought she was just being nice to him and was unaware of his interest, just thought he was an acquaintance. he didnt make his feelings clear until the obsession had already gone too far for her to do anything about it. he was not just looking for a platonic relationship, he was unbalanced and needed serious rehabilitation, not a talking to from her. she's not a psychiatrist or behavioral therapist. the guy needed professional help and hearing it from her would not have gotten him that help. lines had already been crossed that could not be uncrossed. you can't reason with a compulsion like that. im guessing she told him she did not share his feelings in that parking lot... and then he beat her for it. the guy was a threat and should have been treated as one. you can work on rehabilitating him once it is certain he is not a threat to anyone. but when her life is potentially at risk, you do not play around with the psyche of that kind of guy. you tell the police and tell her to stock mace and run like hell if he approaches her. protect your person first, save the world second.
Maybe if the criticism was more constructive than insulting, progress could be made. I completely see how it's important to be aware of others feelings when communicating on a message board. Everyone here wants to be validated and understood to a certain extent. When people are simply shutting out others and dismissing their views as pointless or silly, it creates so much tension and aggravation (not a healthy environment for learning or opening one's self to new ideas). But at the same time, insulting another for their lack of social skills by ridiculing them is showing the same inability at communication. No one is going to open themselves up to advice when it's filled with negative personal remarks. It winds up being shut out and lost...which makes it just as pointless.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
http://www.myspace.com/illuminatta
Rhinocerous Surprise '08!!!
but until you are in the daily situation of constantly caring and being responsible for a child, you have NO idea what it is like to be a parent.
here is my original quote IN CONTEXT.
if you got your nose out of joint ryan that is not my problem. but you chose to quote me out of context and incompletely. when you defend yourself make sure you quote correctly.
take a good look
this could be the day
hold my hand
lie beside me
i just need to say
I've listened to you and I've agreed with you plenty of times. Seems you got a bit of selective memory going on there. And I've defended you too.
So perhaps you should cast your mind back to that.
Did it ever occur to you ahnimus that there's a mob mentality because you may be behaving badly? So badly that many people have noticed and are acknowledging that. Even if you did I doubt you'd admit it.
I will not support you when you behave badly. My determination of behaving badly but clearly shared by others here too.
You have choices here and you seem to be refusing to make them.
When you are ready to behave like a human being I may support you again.
Supposing you haven't burned all your bridges by then.
Nobody seems able to do that ahnimus. You are in your own little world.
Obvious to me, because again, you've made it all about you.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
I'm happy that you have made this connection and understanding with ahnimus, angelica. For both of you. It's always wonderful to make powerful and respectful connections.
I'm pleased that he has validated your spirituality and is accepting of your point of view.
It's a shame that ahnimus is unable to recognise and develop this level of communication with others.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
Ok, so it's ok for you to explain your behavior away because of your brain damage but not ok for others? Because I can think of several occassions recently when you have been downright cruel to other people here on the board who also suffer from brain damage. If we are all to be accepting of your opinions and behaviours because you suffered a brain injury as a child the least you could do is extend the same common courtesy to others in the same position.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
I do. I am not the one attacking people's conditions, occasionally when my barrier breaks down I slip a harsh comment I'm not particularly proud of as a rational entity. I don't attack people personally, I debate their views, if that seems like an attack then I don't know how to debate with you. Best to just ignore my posts because we can't communicate on the same level.
I consider myself somewhat of an academic and I'm putting strong consideration into higher education. Academia is full of arrogance, it's one of the driving factors to scientific discovery. We are cut from a different cloth and that's the issue. I beg you to ignore my posts if you find them offensive to your method of discourse.
Neither. the reductionsim that I am referring to, is trying to reduce the question, or take it back to the most elementary starting point, eg, like trying to find teh beginnign of a story, when there is always a precedent chapter. If that is the question, that is fone, but in this case, I need to be able to refer to myself, wihout having to argue that I exist.
I'm not saying that reductionism is useless, just that it has it's pplace. For exaple, you can studt phsiology without reducing it to biochemistry, or molocular geneetics or quantum mechanics, which are all possible levels of looking at the same problem.
Angelica is wrong on her interpretation of quantum indeterminacy. We do not agree on everything. I do not believe in any ethereal intelligence or cosmic plan. Absolutely no definition of spirituality or God will satisfy me. I use alternate terms to describe functionally the same things. However, Angelica's view is more expansive into unattainable knowledge than mine. I understand Angelica's point of view, as much as I understand yours. I understand they are how you live your lives. They are not for me and in a debate, I will express my viewpoint. Again, I do not communicate well with people of different mind sets. That's the issue.
Ok, well that's fine and I understand. But you have attacked me personally and I do think you know how to debate without doing that. I've seen you do it. While it's understandable that you may do that sometimes in the heat of a debate it is not acceptable to assume a position with someone, then continue on with your assumptions incorrectly and then lay the boots in with personal remarks when the going gets tough, just because you are frustrated and maybe have difficulties. And should you do that then the simple thing to do is understand your contribution and rectify it. Please don't tell me that I am incapable of communicating with academics. Because I've done it plenty of times. I've been doing it since I was a kid. They don't seem to have a problem communicating with me. You need to decide if you want to communicate with me or not and if you do then it's in your best interests to learn how to do that. Academia can be full of arrogance, but you are not an academic yet ahnimus, and you have the opportunity here to utilise all of your skills to become a better human being as well as an academic. And I applaud that. However if you feel the need to attack me or if I think that you need to step back from something, I will contribute my opinion.
But saying something is too hard or beneath you is a cop out.
And we both know it.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
I think that's a certain type of reductionism. It's truly unattainable knowledge. But for example if we are discussing physiology, say we are discussing endomorphs and deciphering the cause for their body shape. It would be rational to focus on metabolism and genetics. It would be ridiculous to suggest that theoretically the person doesn't even exist. That kind of reductionism is useless.
I don't consider you a better human being and I do not wish to be like you. I'm happy with who I am and have no intention of changing. Accept it.
Well I don't know that I agree that is the issue as both of us understand it, but I understand it is the issue for you. As I see it, if you are capable of the level of understanding of the subjects that you do study then you are also capable of great things when it comes to communication. You just have to decide you want to develop those skills. You will find it an extremely beneficial subject to study.
*~You're IT Bert!~*
Hold on to the thread
The currents will shift
It's the degree of reductionism that you were pursuing at that point that I was taking issue with. the post is lost about 10 pages back, but I felt that you took the discussion back a bit too far. Not all science is based on reductionism. The trick is to get your level just right for the problem at hand.
For example, while biochemical changes in the brain are present in a person suffering from depression, it is not helpful to focus on that when the cause of depression is usually something more prosaic , like financial trouble, or conflict at work. You need to identify the right level of complexity at which the problem occurs, and direct your interest and intervention there.
It's one thing for science to discover that disease is caused by bacteria, and then you can look at things like encapsulated vs non-encapsulated strains, and the action of different anntibiotics at a molecular level, but infectious disease is really prevented at a public health level of handwashing and correct food handling and storage.