ANOTHER High School shooting

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  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    NMyTree wrote:
    People of the anti-gun crowd will never understand.

    I was anti-gun my whole life until this year. I learned some things that changed my mind.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • Collin
    Collin Posts: 4,931
    FreeMind wrote:
    americans have always had guns as with many other countries, although i do not condone violence i would protect my family with a gun if necessary (i have to admit i would probably aim for a non-fatal area)...people kill people, not guns...the problem is much larger than a simple fix of a gun control law taking away the guns of honest citizens who would abide...do you really think criminals are going to say "oh geez i need to turn my gun in, it isn't registered, i'm not allowed to have it" it is similar to alcohol (by the way i enjoy my rum and wine just as much as the next) alcohol kills thousands directly and indirectly every year...are we also "fuckheads" because we allow people to drink?

    Not a good comparison, imo. Unless you force people to drink alcohol, it's a personal choice. I don't think the gun shot victim chose to be shot, somebody else made that choice for him/her.
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    Collin wrote:
    Oh please.

    The anti-gun crowd thinks, if there are less guns or if guns are harder to get there will be less deaths by guns.
    No one thinks murder would cease to exist. I do think however if you cannot own a gun legally, children of law abiding citizens wouldn't be able to shoot themselves in the face because they wouldn't have access to a gun...

    The real problem is the pro-gun people, not the anti-gun people, they are afraid that tightened restrictions, waiting periods and other measures would somehow mean restrictions on their freedoms, which is of course ridiculous.

    Unless you want to stop hunting kids are still going to point shotguns and rifles at each other. When I was a kid a friend pulled a shotgun on me. I also pushed my friend down a hill that was 60 degrees and lead to a river flowing into a dam. Kids do stupid things.

    I don't usually buy too many statistics. This one however is about deaths and is probably pretty accurate.

    Firearm Assault: 1 in 314
    Falling: 1 in 216
    Suicide: 1 in 119
    Motor Vehicle Accident: 1 in 84
    http://www.nsc.org/lrs/statinfo/odds.htm

    These are the odds of dying if faced with those situations, of course.

    Murder Demographics
    Murder occurrences vary wildly among different countries and societies. In the Western world, murder rates in most countries have declined significantly during the 20th century and are now between 1-4 cases per 100,000 people per year. Murder rates in Japan and Iceland are among the lowest in the world, around 0.5; the rate of the United States is among the highest among all developed countries, around 5.5 (2004, [1]), with rates in major cities sometimes over 50 per 100,000[2]. Developing countries often have rates of 10-100 murders per 100,000 people per year.[citation needed]
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder#Murder_demographics

    So that's a 0.0055% chance of being murdered. That includes all other kinds of murder that don't include firearms.

    Here is a sample from http://www.kentuckystatepolice.org/pdf/cr2.pdf

    Circumstances
    Arguement: 80
    Felony Involved: 39
    Lover's Quarrel: 12
    Gangland: 5
    Other: 73
    Unkown: 62

    Weapons
    Firearms 171 (Handgun: 113, Shotgun: 20, Rifle: 18, Unknown: 20)
    Personal: 24
    Knife: 26
    Other: 43
    Unkown: 7

    Well, all I have to say is the kentucky police can't spell or solve crimes. I'm guessing personal means by shit kicking. I think guns are just convenient.
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • Ahnimus
    Ahnimus Posts: 10,560
    So yea, that puts the chances of being shot by a gun in kentucky at approximately 0.004%
    I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
  • Collin
    Collin Posts: 4,931
    Ahnimus wrote:
    Unless you want to stop hunting kids are still going to point shotguns and rifles at each other. When I was a kid a friend pulled a shotgun on me. I also pushed my friend down a hill that was 60 degrees and lead to a river flowing into a dam. Kids do stupid things.

    Kids are not going to point shotguns or rifles at each other if they can't get their hands on them.
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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  • Collin
    Collin Posts: 4,931
    Ahnimus wrote:
    I think guns are just convenient.

    What for?
    THANK YOU, LOSTDAWG!


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  • dunkman
    dunkman Posts: 19,646
    FreeMind wrote:
    americans have always had guns as with many other countries, although i do not condone violence i would protect my family with a gun if necessary (i have to admit i would probably aim for a non-fatal area)...people kill people, not guns...the problem is much larger than a simple fix of a gun control law taking away the guns of honest citizens who would abide...do you really think criminals are going to say "oh geez i need to turn my gun in, it isn't registered, i'm not allowed to have it" it is similar to alcohol (by the way i enjoy my rum and wine just as much as the next) alcohol kills thousands directly and indirectly every year...are we also "fuckheads" because we allow people to drink?

    its your first post on this forum and you wasted it :(

    of course the guy is to blame... he pulled the trigger!!! take away the trigger and the guy would have been shouting BANG!!! and that girl would just have a sore ear rather than be dead!!! so the gun is an integral part of the equation... so that infamous refrain of "guns dont kill people, people kill people" should actually be "people do kill people, but guns help... with no gun the person is just very pissed off"
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • pushmepullme
    pushmepullme Posts: 255
    See, the trouble i see it (Morning Dunkman, back again!) is that the very same gun laws which are allowing you to arm yourself to protect your family, is the very same gun laws which are allowing people to arm themselves to harm your family.

    Am I the only one who thinks this is stupid!
    "I am a doughnut." (live - Berlin, Germany - 11/03/96)

    "Behave like rock stars - not like the President." (live - Noblesville, IN - 8/17/98)

    --Ed

    "Yeah, I was gonna learn to play it (Breath) but somebody slipped me a bottle of viagra and was busy doing something else six times last night" (live - New York, NY - 9/10/98)

    --Ed

  • dunkman
    dunkman Posts: 19,646
    miller8966 wrote:
    Thats why i love this country, because i have the right to own a gun and no hippie activist can take it out of our hands..nor will they ever be able too!

    Its my 2nd amendement right and i love it


    your insane pro-right sheep bleating is becoming annoying... you bring nothing to this debate other than poor soundbites
    Originally Posted by miller8966
    DUnkman and push' arguments are severly flawed...no reason to argue with illogical people



    really.... and what have you had to say in this entire thread

    Originally Posted by miller8966
    hmmm u mean bill clinton?


    Originally Posted by miller8966
    O so its jsut americas fault...ok i see the logic


    Originally Posted by miller8966
    Its not the guns fault you moron. THe gun didnt tell him to shoot kids


    Originally Posted by miller8966
    Explain to me how it is the guns fault? dont listen to everything micahel moore tells you


    Originally Posted by miller8966
    Im not gona lie man i love guns. I own an Ak 47 ( semi) and a winchester rifle, and also an AR 15. What a beauty!

    funny....i havent shotten up a school yet...hmmmm


    Originally Posted by miller8966
    Great post...mayeb we should outlaw freedom of speech just in case someone says somethign offensive


    Originally Posted by miller8966
    according to dunkman when we get rid of guns we will have no one dying.....because you know before the invention fo the gun no one ever died.

    Lol thank god in america we are allowed to keep our guns!





    now unless you want to contribute something worthwhile get the fuck out of the thread and join the 15 year olds on the "what was Eddies best haircut" thread on the Porch

    3 poor posts of inept sarcasm and thats about it... I've defecated better 'arguments' than you have posted on this thread...
    oh scary... 40000 morbidly obese christians wearing fanny packs invading europe is probably the least scariest thing since I watched an edited version of The Care Bears movie in an extremely brightly lit cinema.
  • FreeMind
    FreeMind Posts: 7
    Collin wrote:
    Not a good comparison, imo. Unless you force people to drink alcohol, it's a personal choice. I don't think the gun shot victim chose to be shot, somebody else made that choice for him/her.


    Do you believe that it was a "personal choice" of the family splattered on the road by a drunk driver? Sadly, they are dead by someone's unforced personal choice.
    you must be the change you want to see in the world ~ Mahatma Gandhi
  • even flow?
    even flow? Posts: 8,066
    Did the guy strike out in Utah and decided to relocate to Colorado.
    You've changed your place in this world!
  • FreeMind
    FreeMind Posts: 7
    dunkman1974 wrote:
    its your first post on this forum and you wasted it :(

    of course the guy is to blame... he pulled the trigger!!! take away the trigger and the guy would have been shouting BANG!!! and that girl would just have a sore ear rather than be dead!!! so the gun is an integral part of the equation... so that infamous refrain of "guns dont kill people, people kill people" should actually be "people do kill people, but guns help... with no gun the person is just very pissed off"


    If you feel I wasted my first post because my beliefs differ from yours...too bad! I won't apologize because this forum wouldn't exist if everyone had the same beliefs. Also, I believe your beliefs are just as valued to you as mine are to me! Guns aren't the only things that help kill people. Should we ban knives of all sorts? Should we cut off the hands of battering partners? Should we stop manufacturing cars and revert back to horse and buggy? The point of my post was the problem is much too large for a "gun control" law. A more realistic solution has yet to be found.
    you must be the change you want to see in the world ~ Mahatma Gandhi
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    FreeMind wrote:
    If you feel I wasted my first post because my beliefs differ from yours...too bad! I won't apologize because this forum wouldn't exist if everyone had the same beliefs. Also, I believe your beliefs are just as valued to you as mine are to me! Guns aren't the only things that help kill people. Should we ban knives of all sorts? Should we cut off the hands of battering partners? Should we stop manufacturing cars and revert back to horse and buggy? The point of my post was the problem is much too large for a "gun control" law. A more realistic solution has yet to be found.

    but you have to admit...guns just make it too damn easy...if we banned hand guns there would be less deaths....there is no other solution....humans are animals..and will use the tools we have.

    ,,,.you didn't waste your first post...glad you joined in.
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • NMyTree
    NMyTree Posts: 2,374
    pushmepullme wrote:
    See, the trouble i see it (Morning Dunkman, back again!) is that the very same gun laws which are allowing you to arm yourself to protect your family, is the very same gun laws which are allowing people to arm themselves to harm your family.

    Am I the only one who thinks this is stupid!

    What's stupid is to believe criminals/murderers acquire firearms through legal channels.


    Criminals commit firearm-related crimes with illegal weapons/firearms.
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    NMyTree wrote:
    People of the anti-gun crowd will never understand.

    They live in an idealistic fantasy world in their mind, which tells them that if all firearms were abolished from being legally owned and carried; then no one would ever shoot each other , again. They think murder would cease to exist.

    Unfortunately, the real world and human behavior clearly dictates that this country would be a much more dangerous place, if this were ever to happen.

    we never said murder will cease to exist...do you even read our posts....it will be a start...guns equal murders...the more guns..the more murders...the less guns..the less murders....we know the world isnt' perfect..yet we also know that we shouldn't be cowering in a corner fully armed cause the boogy man is going to get us.....I'm thinking pro-gun folks are the ones in fantasy land. Look at other civilized countries.....they don't have hand guns..and people aren't getting killed. DUH....
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • callen
    callen Posts: 6,388
    NMyTree wrote:
    What's stupid is to believe criminals/murderers acquire firearms through legal channels.


    Criminals commit firearm-related crimes with illegal weapons/firearms.


    that they steal from legal gun owners...
    10-18-2000 Houston, 04-06-2003 Houston, 6-25-2003 Toronto, 10-8-2004 Kissimmee, 9-4-2005 Calgary, 12-3-05 Sao Paulo, 7-2-2006 Denver, 7-22-06 Gorge, 7-23-2006 Gorge, 9-13-2006 Bern, 6-22-2008 DC, 6-24-2008 MSG, 6-25-2008 MSG
  • NMyTree
    NMyTree Posts: 2,374
    callen wrote:
    but you have to admit...guns just make it too damn easy...if we banned hand guns there would be less deaths.....

    No there would not. Criminals would then be the only people (other than law enforcement) with firearms. Law abidding citizens would be sitting ducks and criminals would fear absolutely no one, other than Law Enforcement.

    The gangs, petty criminals and thugs would run rampant.
  • NMyTree
    NMyTree Posts: 2,374
    callen wrote:
    that they steal from legal gun owners...

    Yeah, that does happen. But more often than not, the guns they have are not stolen from legal gun owners. They are acquired by other means.
  • NMyTree
    NMyTree Posts: 2,374
    callen wrote:
    yet we also know that we shouldn't be cowering in a corner fully armed cause the boogy man is going to get us


    That's just your perception and vision.

    The people who will be cowering are the law-abbiding citizens who would no longer have a firearm to protect themselves.
  • NMyTree
    NMyTree Posts: 2,374
    callen wrote:
    Look at other civilized countries.....they don't have hand guns..and people aren't getting killed. DUH....


    You mean like in the UK when that maniac ran-amok and shot 6-8 people and the only thing they could defend themselves with was a clipboard and pen?

    People aren't getting killed in other civilized countries? Is that so:rolleyes:

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