Really ? See, some things are hard to quantify, like the idea of America abandoning bravery (as Robbie said). Frankly, I'd like to see the empirical evidence on that one - I don't really see it.
But other things are not so hard to verify. And on these things, he is abosutely correct. If you don't think you have less liberty than before, then you are delusional. Of course you do !! In fact, Americans are losing liberty by the month. Been to an airport lately ? Had a debate lately about your phone being tapped or your computer being monitored ? Wake up bud. And its all being couched in terms of "protecting your freedoms" !! HA. What freedoms ? You want to know about freedom in the U.S. ?.....try being Maher Arar, who has been cleared by every court/investigative body in the world, and who still can't get his name wiped off the no-fly list of the U.S.. Its embarrassing foir the U.S. gov't..
What about human rights ? The U.S. has made a mockery of human rights and the rule of law. Through its convenient legal constructs, it has absolutely destroyed the very things it claims to be fighting for. The U.S. is a joke in this dept.. Dude, are you awake for this shit, or what ? Or are you buying the shit that Cheney slings about Iraq going "remarkably well" ? America and integrity have now become mutually exclusive terms - and that's putting it politely.
if you want evidence of America abandoning bravery... talk to anyone that supports the curtailment of our freedoms..... they all have the same excuse... they are certain that these losses of liberty are justified by the opinion that it will make us SAFER. what that means is that they are AFRAID.... too afraid to hold on to civil liberties, and human rights. I still would like ANYONE to explain to me how we are the land of the free and home of the brave, when we are too AFRAID to continue being FREE. the fact that people accept neighbours spying on neighbours, phone tapping, Internet spying, the president deeming himself to interpret any law passed by congress and if it doe or does not apply to him. NOBODY says they want our liberties taken away, they ALL say it is worth it to feel less afraid (safer) what ever happened to GIVE ME LIBERTY OR GIVE ME DEATH. there are large elements of this country that would prefer to live in a police state IF THEY WERE TOLD IT MADE THEM SAFER.... and it might make them safer... but bravery requires maintaining freedom in the face of fear, not being intimidated out of your rights.... to be so afraid that we have abandoned these rights is undeniable proof that we have abandoned bravery. we are cowards, and the GOP know we are cowards, and they are playing on those fears in this AD., if they did not believe we are cowards, if they did not think their terrorist tactics would work, they would not have made the ad.
One of the most laughable and ignorant statements I have seen here in quite some time. Ya, I guess you really were born yesterday
I'm glad you got a good laugh. how am I not more free? my phone hasnt been tapped. I post whatever I want on boards like this. I can say and do anything I want.
I dont support terrorism or any terror state
I dont look at child porn
if the governement wants to tap the phone of some islamic suspect from pakistan, have at it. if they want to browse the net looking for child predators, be my guest.
I am a law abiding citizen with the freedom to do whatever I want.
I think the real problem is that unless you are Arab or Persian you aren't likely to suffer from the effects of these lots liberties. Being that Arabs and Persians are minorities, nothing is being done. Because the masses don't see it affecting them, so they ignore it.
History repeats it's self.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
I'm glad you got a good laugh. how am I not more free? my phone hasnt been tapped. I post whatever I want on boards like this. I can say and do anything I want.
I dont support terrorism or any terror state
I dont look at child porn
if the governement wants to tap the phone of some islamic suspect from pakistan, have at it. if they want to browse the net looking for child predators, be my guest.
I am a law abiding citizen with the freedom to do whatever I want.
See bud, thats where you are wrong - you ARE a law-abiding citizen, AND still having your conversations tapped and your computer monitored. Why ? Because your gov't no longer needs to justify why its doing so. It can do it as it sees fit. Is it likely to do so - no. But that's hardly the point. The real issue is that you, as a law-abiding citizen, are now being scrutinized where/when you never were before. One prominent American (I forget who) bemoaned the new reality when his phoned was mistakenly tapped and his wife's private and sensitive medical details became public.
Looks like Hitler propaganda. Either way, it's designed to convince the german people that some Jews are bad. This ended up being "all jews are bad" which ended up being the holocaust. But you see how it starts anyway.
It's no different with these videos the GOP releases. Getting people to hate muslims and fear their arab and persian neighbours. When they start making arabs wear arm bands or something to that effect. Hopefully people will realize the nature of this stuff.
This particular video actually provides an almost complete history of the Rothschilds up to Hitler's rise to power. Wether it's all true or not, well, that's debatable. But you can see how people would have been deceived.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
Maher Arar (Arabic: ماهر عرار; born 1970 in Syria) is a Canadian software engineer. On September 26, 2002, during a stopover in New York en route from Tunis to Montreal, Arar was detained by the United States Immigration and Naturalization Service who were acting upon false and misleading information supplied by the Royal Canadian Mounted Police[1]. Despite carrying a Canadian passport, he was deported to Syria in accordance with a U.S. policy known as "extraordinary rendition." Arar was then held in solitary confinement in a Syrian prison where, according to a Commission of Inquiry headed by Justice Dennis O'Connor, he was regularly tortured until his eventual release and return to Canada in October 2003. The episode strained Canada-U.S. relations and resulted in the creation of a public inquiry in Canada "into the actions of Canadian officials dealing with the deportation and detention"[2] of Arar. The commission's final report cleared Arar's name and was sharply critical of the RCMP and other Canadian government departments.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
The real issue is that you, as a law-abiding citizen, are now being scrutinized where/when you never were before. ...
wait, I thought it was very unlikely. but lets say I lost my shit and wanted to plant a bomb somewhere. I hope they would catch me.
I see the point you are trying to make but for me, its much ado about nothing. since I dont break any laws, the government has no interest in me. if my freedoms are comprimsed and damage is done, I am free to get an attorney and fight them in court. would I win? I dont know. but I just dont ever see it happening. I just dont. and I'm not going to live my life worrying about it. american values are too strong for this country ever to fall into a "hilter-like" environment, which everone here likes to claim it is.
there are large elements of this country that would prefer to live in a police state IF THEY WERE TOLD IT MADE THEM SAFER.... and it might make them safer... but bravery requires maintaining freedom in the face of fear, not being intimidated out of your rights....
It's ironic, isn't it? Iraqis used to live in a police state .... and they were safer. The same people who think it was such a good idea to go over there and set them "free" have no problem giving up their freedoms at home and getting us closer and closer to living in a police state ourselves. Round and round we go ...
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
ok so what are you getting so excited about. they are looking for the bad guys, not me.
No, it's because you aren't Arab or Persian. If you were you would be worried about it. There are plenty of people of those ethnicities that won't fly anymore because they are afraid of being deported. They are the ones living in fear of the U.S. and Canadian governments, even if they are as innocent as you are.
I necessarily have the passion for writing this, and you have the passion for condemning me; both of us are equally fools, equally the toys of destiny. Your nature is to do harm, mine is to love truth, and to make it public in spite of you. - Voltaire
actually, i am doing more than that.... I have organized a Voter Celebration Party here in Olympia, featuring Live music from 2 bands that are donating their time, a pre and between sets drum and acoustic instrument jam session open to everyone that brings an instrument, and free giveaways all night long from local businesses that have donated hundreds of dollars to this event. there will also be a stand up comic performing.... and the event is FREE to all registered voters. anyone in the western Washington area that considers yourself or your band to be extremely talented and want to perform for free, we can make time for you......Saturday November 4th @ the Clipper 8:00 Olympia washington.......Im still waiting on a response from the 10c on donating items for 10c members attending this event...... im not telling people HOW to vote... I AM DEFENATELY NOT THREATENING PEOPLE WITH TERRORIST ATTACKS IF THEY DO NOT VOTE MY WAY!!!!!!!!! but yes, I am angry enough to do something about it.
well there ya go....nice to see someone doing something rather then just complaining!
ok so what are you getting so excited about. they are looking for the bad guys, not me.
wait, i thought that was the point.
wait, I thought it was very unlikely. but lets say I lost my shit and wanted to plant a bomb somewhere. I hope they would catch me.
I see the point you are trying to make but for me, its much ado about nothing. since I dont break any laws, the government has no interest in me. if my freedoms are comprimsed and damage is done, I am free to get an attorney and fight them in court. would I win? I dont know. but I just dont ever see it happening. I just dont. and I'm not going to live my life worrying about it. american values are too strong for this country ever to fall into a "hilter-like" environment, which everone here likes to claim it is.
Yes, you're doing just fine right now. You're a law-abiding citizen, and you don't criticize the administration much, if at all, so you have no worries. True enough.
Let's fast forward 5 or 10 or 20 years. There's a different administration, of course, as far to the left as the current one is to the right. You don't agree with anything they're doing, and you're not shy about saying so. A sizeable number of people are beginning to listen to you, and the government thinks you're getting to be a bit of a pest. Under the laws put in place by the Bush administration, they could designate you an "enemy combatant" and whisk you off somewhere without notifying your family, without going in front of a judge, without letting you speak to a lawyer or anyone else.
It's not all about what's likely to happen right now. I trust the current government a whole lot less than you do, and I'm not worried about the FBI showing up at my door. I'm sure Bush wishes the opposition would shut up, but he's obviously not to the point of rounding people up. But times change, administrations change. I don't think this country is somehow immune to despots. Once the laws are there, they are there for whoever might come along, whatever might develop. Surely you can see the danger in that.
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
if my freedoms are comprimsed and damage is done, I am free to get an attorney and fight them in court. would I win? I dont know. but I just dont ever see it happening. I just dont. and I'm not going to live my life worrying about it. american values are too strong for this country ever to fall into a "hilter-like" environment, which everone here likes to claim it is.
Actually, you won't fight them in court. The idea of Habeus Corpus, one of the most fundamental tenets of law, has just been shot down in the U.S.. There no longer needs to be judicial review of military commissions !!! So, if you're deemed to be an enemy combatant, which is happening with alarming regularity, and are lucky enough to even get an appointment with a military tribunal, then you will have to abide by their decision - regardless of how faulty it may be.
Actually, the report was based on information released by the Pentagon.
No, no, no!!! It's because they hate our freedom! Invading and bombing the shit out of their country then leaving it in horrible a condition with no stability for years doesn't have a thing to do with it. Why would people get upset about something like that? :rolleyes:
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
It appears to me that both sides are "drilling for fear". First the GOP with their "vote for us or your family could be beheaded" strategy. Then on the other side it's the liberals with their "if you don't vote for us the GOP will lead us straight into World War 3 and we'll all die" strategy. I'm all for cleaning up Washington and getting the GOP out, but the world is not suddenly going to be great the day this happens. In the end I think it's the GOP who has scared me. They've scared me and a lot of other independents into voting against them and it'll probably cost them big in a few weeks.
I see the point you are trying to make but for me, its much ado about nothing. since I dont break any laws, the government has no interest in me. if my freedoms are comprimsed and damage is done, I am free to get an attorney and fight them in court. would I win? I dont know. but I just dont ever see it happening. I just dont. and I'm not going to live my life worrying about it. american values are too strong for this country ever to fall into a "hilter-like" environment, which everone here likes to claim it is.
Well, the US government is currently holding lots of people of Arab descent who have done nothing wrong, except maybe some minor visa violations. They're being treated very badly and held without representation or opportunities for hearings to challenge their accusers. And this is in the US -- not even Gitmo:
Yeah, these guys won some money, but why did we treat them like this in the first place? Is this America?
And okay, you're not an Arab, and you're not overstaying a visa, and you don't break any laws (except you probably speed, and you probably drank when you were under 21, but other than that . . . ). But why do we only care about what could happen to us? Why don't we look out for the other guy? The ones less fortunate than us?
(Oh, and what hippiemom said about how someday, you could be on the receiving end of this kind of treatment.)
"Things will just get better and better even though it
doesn't feel that way right now. That's the hopeful
idea . . . Hope didn't get much applause . . .
Hope! Hope is the underdog!"
Yes, you're doing just fine right now. You're a law-abiding citizen, and you don't criticize the administration much, if at all, so you have no worries. True enough.
Let's fast forward 5 or 10 or 20 years. There's a different administration, of course, as far to the left as the current one is to the right. You don't agree with anything they're doing, and you're not shy about saying so. A sizeable number of people are beginning to listen to you, and the government thinks you're getting to be a bit of a pest. Under the laws put in place by the Bush administration, they could designate you an "enemy combatant" and whisk you off somewhere without notifying your family, without going in front of a judge, without letting you speak to a lawyer or anyone else.
that is not happening. the laws are designed to get the bad guys. im not one of them, never will be, even if there is a far left government in place.
see people assume im a far right republican. i'm not. im more of a nationalist or traditionalist and try to find the good in any government that is in place. I believe america is inheritly good. I dont dislike democrats or their polices. I try to call it like i see it. everyone seems to HATE the current government, I dont. do I agree with everything bush has done, fuck no.
that is not happening. the laws are designed to get the bad guys. im not one of them, never will be, even if there is a far left government in place.
see people assume im a far right republican. i'm not. im more of a nationalist or traditionalist and try to find the good in any government that is in place. I believe america is inheritly good. I dont dislike democrats or their polices. I try to call it like i see it. everyone seems to HATE the current government, I dont. do I agree with everything bush has done, fuck no.
Who cares what they were designed for? It's what they SAY that matters. Some future administration with sinister motives isn't going to say "oh dear, it wasn't DESIGNED for this, so we cant use it that way!" What the law says is that anyone who is designated an enemy combatant can be indefinitely detained. That designation is entirely up to the president. Do you honestly believe that it's impossible for the U.S. to elect a president who may abuse that kind of power? Do you honestly believe that no U.S. government would abuse the power to spy on it's own citizens? Have you ever heard of J. Edgar Hoover?
It's really hard for me to imagine that you are that naive.
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
Who cares what they were designed for? It's what they SAY that matters. Some future administration with sinister motives isn't going to say "oh dear, it wasn't DESIGNED for this, so we cant use it that way!" What the law says is that anyone who is designated an enemy combatant can be indefinitely detained. That designation is entirely up to the president. Do you honestly believe that it's impossible for the U.S. to elect a president who may abuse that kind of power? Do you honestly believe that no U.S. government would abuse the power to spy on it's own citizens? Have you ever heard of J. Edgar Hoover?
It's really hard for me to imagine that you are that naive.
I dont ever intend on being an enemy combatant. no matter how the president defines it.
that is not happening. the laws are designed to get the bad guys. im not one of them, never will be, even if there is a far left government in place.
see people assume im a far right republican. i'm not. im more of a nationalist or traditionalist and try to find the good in any government that is in place. I believe america is inheritly good. I dont dislike democrats or their polices. I try to call it like i see it. everyone seems to HATE the current government, I dont. do I agree with everything bush has done, fuck no.
The point your missing is those in power like to keep it. They are stripping us of our ability to keep them in check and maintain a balance.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
I dont ever intend on being an enemy combatant. no matter how the president defines it.
So if a president defines an enemy combatant as anyone who incites disloyalty against the United States, and he interprets that to mean anyone who criticizes our military, and our military is doing something that you think is reprehensible, are you just going to shut up?
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." ~ MLK, 1963
So if a president defines an enemy combatant as anyone who incites disloyalty against the United States, and he interprets that to mean anyone who criticizes our military, and our military is doing something that you think is reprehensible, are you just going to shut up?
wont happen. dont tell me it already is. if that was the case, everyone here would be in jail
wont happen. dont tell me it already is. if that was the case, everyone here would be in jail
you ever hear of the sedition act?
SECTION 3. Whoever, when the United States is at war, shall willfully make or convey false reports or false statements with intent to interfere with the operation or success of the military or naval forces of the United States, or to promote the success of its enemies, or shall willfully make or convey false reports, or false statements, . . . or incite insubordination, disloyalty, mutiny, or refusal of duty, in the military or naval forces of the United States, or shall willfully obstruct . . . the recruiting or enlistment service of the United States, or . . . shall willfully utter, print, write, or publish any disloyal, profane, scurrilous, or abusive language about the form of government of the United States, or the Constitution of the United States, or the military or naval forces of the United States . . . or shall willfully display the flag of any foreign enemy, or shall willfully . . . urge, incite, or advocate any curtailment of production . . . or advocate, teach, defend, or suggest the doing of any of the acts or things in this section enumerated and whoever shall by word or act support or favor the cause of any country with which the United States is at war or by word or act oppose the cause of the United States therein, shall be punished by a fine of not more than $10,000 or imprisonment for not more than twenty years, or both....
so... dont tell me it cannot happen.... IT HAS HAPPENED... only now, if an administration were to inact such a law, the fine would not be limited, and the sentence would not be 20 years, it could be forever, without the right to know why you are in prison, without the right to an attourney, without basic human rights guarding you from torture,
ever heard of internment camps???
american citizens swept off the streets and put into work camps for commiting NO CRIME WHATSOEVER?
please do not tell me it cannot happen... IT HAS HAPPENED, only now, there is no guarentee of getting out, under our new laws you can just be made to dissapear.... no trial, no questions asked, just gone. THESE ARE FACTS!!!!!! not opinions, facts. this is what america has become, im not happy about it either, mabey i should give that anger manegment class a call for being upset by something so trivial as loss of liberty, freedom, human rights, and the complete fear and apathy that encourages this abomination to continue.
SECTION 3. Whoever, when the United States is at war, shall willfully make or convey false reports or false statements with intent to interfere with the operation or success of the military or naval forces of the United States, or to promote the success of its enemies, or shall willfully make or convey false reports, or false statements, . . . or incite insubordination, disloyalty, mutiny, or refusal of duty, in the military or naval forces of the United States, or shall willfully obstruct . . . the recruiting or enlistment service of the United States, or . . . shall willfully utter, print, write, or publish any disloyal, profane, scurrilous, or abusive language about the form of government of the United States, or the Constitution of the United States, or the military or naval forces of the United States . . . or shall willfully display the flag of any foreign enemy, or shall willfully . . . urge, incite, or advocate any curtailment of production . . . or advocate, teach, defend, or suggest the doing of any of the acts or things in this section enumerated and whoever shall by word or act support or favor the cause of any country with which the United States is at war or by word or act oppose the cause of the United States therein, shall be punished by a fine of not more than $10,000 or imprisonment for not more than twenty years, or both....
so... dont tell me it cannot happen.... IT HAS HAPPENED... only now, if an administration were to inact such a law, the fine would not be limited, and the sentence would not be 20 years, it could be forever, without the right to know why you are in prison, without the right to an attourney, without basic human rights guarding you from torture,
ever heard of internment camps???
american citizens swept off the streets and put into work camps for commiting NO CRIME WHATSOEVER?
please do not tell me it cannot happen... IT HAS HAPPENED, only now, there is no guarentee of getting out, under our new laws you can just be made to dissapear.... no trial, no questions asked, just gone. THESE ARE FACTS!!!!!! not opinions, facts. this is what america has become, im not happy about it either, mabey i should give that anger manegment class a call for being upset by something so trivial as loss of liberty, freedom, human rights, and the complete fear and apathy that encourages this abomination to continue.
well you keep up the good fight and i'll go on living my extremely happy successful life ok? great
Comments
One of the most laughable and ignorant statements I have seen here in quite some time. Ya, I guess you really were born yesterday
if you want evidence of America abandoning bravery... talk to anyone that supports the curtailment of our freedoms..... they all have the same excuse... they are certain that these losses of liberty are justified by the opinion that it will make us SAFER. what that means is that they are AFRAID.... too afraid to hold on to civil liberties, and human rights. I still would like ANYONE to explain to me how we are the land of the free and home of the brave, when we are too AFRAID to continue being FREE. the fact that people accept neighbours spying on neighbours, phone tapping, Internet spying, the president deeming himself to interpret any law passed by congress and if it doe or does not apply to him. NOBODY says they want our liberties taken away, they ALL say it is worth it to feel less afraid (safer) what ever happened to GIVE ME LIBERTY OR GIVE ME DEATH. there are large elements of this country that would prefer to live in a police state IF THEY WERE TOLD IT MADE THEM SAFER.... and it might make them safer... but bravery requires maintaining freedom in the face of fear, not being intimidated out of your rights.... to be so afraid that we have abandoned these rights is undeniable proof that we have abandoned bravery. we are cowards, and the GOP know we are cowards, and they are playing on those fears in this AD., if they did not believe we are cowards, if they did not think their terrorist tactics would work, they would not have made the ad.
I'm glad you got a good laugh. how am I not more free? my phone hasnt been tapped. I post whatever I want on boards like this. I can say and do anything I want.
I dont support terrorism or any terror state
I dont look at child porn
if the governement wants to tap the phone of some islamic suspect from pakistan, have at it. if they want to browse the net looking for child predators, be my guest.
I am a law abiding citizen with the freedom to do whatever I want.
History repeats it's self.
See bud, thats where you are wrong - you ARE a law-abiding citizen, AND still having your conversations tapped and your computer monitored. Why ? Because your gov't no longer needs to justify why its doing so. It can do it as it sees fit. Is it likely to do so - no. But that's hardly the point. The real issue is that you, as a law-abiding citizen, are now being scrutinized where/when you never were before. One prominent American (I forget who) bemoaned the new reality when his phoned was mistakenly tapped and his wife's private and sensitive medical details became public.
This video http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=866698994176100608&q=rothschild
Looks like Hitler propaganda. Either way, it's designed to convince the german people that some Jews are bad. This ended up being "all jews are bad" which ended up being the holocaust. But you see how it starts anyway.
It's no different with these videos the GOP releases. Getting people to hate muslims and fear their arab and persian neighbours. When they start making arabs wear arm bands or something to that effect. Hopefully people will realize the nature of this stuff.
This particular video actually provides an almost complete history of the Rothschilds up to Hitler's rise to power. Wether it's all true or not, well, that's debatable. But you can see how people would have been deceived.
no im not.
ok so what are you getting so excited about. they are looking for the bad guys, not me.
wait, i thought that was the point.
wait, I thought it was very unlikely. but lets say I lost my shit and wanted to plant a bomb somewhere. I hope they would catch me.
I see the point you are trying to make but for me, its much ado about nothing. since I dont break any laws, the government has no interest in me. if my freedoms are comprimsed and damage is done, I am free to get an attorney and fight them in court. would I win? I dont know. but I just dont ever see it happening. I just dont. and I'm not going to live my life worrying about it. american values are too strong for this country ever to fall into a "hilter-like" environment, which everone here likes to claim it is.
I dont think we are close at all. not in the least bit.
No, it's because you aren't Arab or Persian. If you were you would be worried about it. There are plenty of people of those ethnicities that won't fly anymore because they are afraid of being deported. They are the ones living in fear of the U.S. and Canadian governments, even if they are as innocent as you are.
What a gigantic pile of crap!
well there ya go....nice to see someone doing something rather then just complaining!
Let's fast forward 5 or 10 or 20 years. There's a different administration, of course, as far to the left as the current one is to the right. You don't agree with anything they're doing, and you're not shy about saying so. A sizeable number of people are beginning to listen to you, and the government thinks you're getting to be a bit of a pest. Under the laws put in place by the Bush administration, they could designate you an "enemy combatant" and whisk you off somewhere without notifying your family, without going in front of a judge, without letting you speak to a lawyer or anyone else.
It's not all about what's likely to happen right now. I trust the current government a whole lot less than you do, and I'm not worried about the FBI showing up at my door. I'm sure Bush wishes the opposition would shut up, but he's obviously not to the point of rounding people up. But times change, administrations change. I don't think this country is somehow immune to despots. Once the laws are there, they are there for whoever might come along, whatever might develop. Surely you can see the danger in that.
Actually, you won't fight them in court. The idea of Habeus Corpus, one of the most fundamental tenets of law, has just been shot down in the U.S.. There no longer needs to be judicial review of military commissions !!! So, if you're deemed to be an enemy combatant, which is happening with alarming regularity, and are lucky enough to even get an appointment with a military tribunal, then you will have to abide by their decision - regardless of how faulty it may be.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/10/19/AR2006101901692_pf.html
Actually, the report was based on information released by the Pentagon.
No, no, no!!! It's because they hate our freedom! Invading and bombing the shit out of their country then leaving it in horrible a condition with no stability for years doesn't have a thing to do with it. Why would people get upset about something like that? :rolleyes:
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/28/nyregion/28detain.html?ei=5088&en=07cc350db15a4010&ex=1298782800&partner=rssnyt&pagewanted=print
Yeah, these guys won some money, but why did we treat them like this in the first place? Is this America?
And okay, you're not an Arab, and you're not overstaying a visa, and you don't break any laws (except you probably speed, and you probably drank when you were under 21, but other than that . . . ). But why do we only care about what could happen to us? Why don't we look out for the other guy? The ones less fortunate than us?
(Oh, and what hippiemom said about how someday, you could be on the receiving end of this kind of treatment.)
doesn't feel that way right now. That's the hopeful
idea . . . Hope didn't get much applause . . .
Hope! Hope is the underdog!"
-- EV, Live at the Showbox
that is not happening. the laws are designed to get the bad guys. im not one of them, never will be, even if there is a far left government in place.
see people assume im a far right republican. i'm not. im more of a nationalist or traditionalist and try to find the good in any government that is in place. I believe america is inheritly good. I dont dislike democrats or their polices. I try to call it like i see it. everyone seems to HATE the current government, I dont. do I agree with everything bush has done, fuck no.
no its not.
It's really hard for me to imagine that you are that naive.
I dont ever intend on being an enemy combatant. no matter how the president defines it.
The point your missing is those in power like to keep it. They are stripping us of our ability to keep them in check and maintain a balance.
Man is least himself when he talks in his own person. Give him a mask, and he will tell you the truth.
-Oscar Wilde
wont happen. dont tell me it already is. if that was the case, everyone here would be in jail
you ever hear of the sedition act?
SECTION 3. Whoever, when the United States is at war, shall willfully make or convey false reports or false statements with intent to interfere with the operation or success of the military or naval forces of the United States, or to promote the success of its enemies, or shall willfully make or convey false reports, or false statements, . . . or incite insubordination, disloyalty, mutiny, or refusal of duty, in the military or naval forces of the United States, or shall willfully obstruct . . . the recruiting or enlistment service of the United States, or . . . shall willfully utter, print, write, or publish any disloyal, profane, scurrilous, or abusive language about the form of government of the United States, or the Constitution of the United States, or the military or naval forces of the United States . . . or shall willfully display the flag of any foreign enemy, or shall willfully . . . urge, incite, or advocate any curtailment of production . . . or advocate, teach, defend, or suggest the doing of any of the acts or things in this section enumerated and whoever shall by word or act support or favor the cause of any country with which the United States is at war or by word or act oppose the cause of the United States therein, shall be punished by a fine of not more than $10,000 or imprisonment for not more than twenty years, or both....
so... dont tell me it cannot happen.... IT HAS HAPPENED... only now, if an administration were to inact such a law, the fine would not be limited, and the sentence would not be 20 years, it could be forever, without the right to know why you are in prison, without the right to an attourney, without basic human rights guarding you from torture,
ever heard of internment camps???
american citizens swept off the streets and put into work camps for commiting NO CRIME WHATSOEVER?
please do not tell me it cannot happen... IT HAS HAPPENED, only now, there is no guarentee of getting out, under our new laws you can just be made to dissapear.... no trial, no questions asked, just gone. THESE ARE FACTS!!!!!! not opinions, facts. this is what america has become, im not happy about it either, mabey i should give that anger manegment class a call for being upset by something so trivial as loss of liberty, freedom, human rights, and the complete fear and apathy that encourages this abomination to continue.
well you keep up the good fight and i'll go on living my extremely happy successful life ok? great