Ahhh Captalism

JamMastaE

jlew24asu wrote:

abu, I'm just glad I dont have your outlook on life and the markets. this place is depressing.

then you are really in for a rude awakening!

jlew24asu

JamMastaE wrote:

then you are really in for a rude awakening!

I really wish you would short the market. do you know what that means? put your money where your mouth is tough guy.

Abuskedti

jlew24asu wrote:

abu, I'm just glad I dont have your outlook on life and the markets. this place is depressing.

Why is it depressing. We need direction - a change. there is a challange before us. When we start looking at it realistically, and stop covering it up with repeated false representation on the television news and by our politicians.. once we understand.. we are fully capable of making it better.

JamMastaE

jlew24asu wrote:

I really wish you would short the market. do you know what that means? put your money where your mouth is tough guy.

sorry,to invest into suffering is evil.blood money.typical wall street.not for me.

jlew24asu

JamMastaE wrote:

sorry,to invest into suffering is evil.blood money.typical wall street.not for me.

Fuck dude, ignorance is bliss I guess. its amazing how you have no idea what you are talking about but since you read some article, from god knows where by god knows who. you suck it right up.

learn what short selling is. then maybe we can have an intelligent conversation about the market. but I doubt it. you are really making yourself looks bad. hell, maybe its the look you are going for.

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/shortselling.asp

JamMastaE

jlew24asu wrote:

Fuck dude, ignorance is bliss I guess. its amazing how you have no idea what you are talking about but since you read some article, from god knows where by god knows who. you suck it right up.

learn what short selling is. then maybe we can have an intelligent conversation about the market. but I doubt it. you are really making yourself looks bad. hell, maybe its the look you are going for.

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/shortselling.asp

OK oh guru of finance,we'll see how fucking smart you are when your dollar is worth less than a peso.
and why aren't you rich if you know the market so well?

jlew24asu

JamMastaE wrote:

OK oh guru of finance,we'll see how fucking smart you are when your dollar is worth less than a peso.
and why aren't you rich if you know the market so well?

I didnt. you did. I just happen to be smart enough to know something simple as short selling.

you are the one who claims to know what the market is going to do.. answer me this.

will the stock market collapse in the near future?

Abuskedti

jlew24asu wrote:

Fuck dude, ignorance is bliss I guess. its amazing how you have no idea what you are talking about but since you read some article, from god knows where by god knows who. you suck it right up.

learn what short selling is. then maybe we can have an intelligent conversation about the market. but I doubt it. you are really making yourself looks bad. hell, maybe its the look you are going for.

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/shortselling.asp

PS Stock Brokers are a great drain on productivity and growth. The also manufacture misinformation - motivated by the greatest possible number of sales of stock.

The business sells the stock but once to generate capital.. after that - it is bought and sold by people with little concern or understanding of the business it represents.

Not to mention they take from the pool of capital without producing a damn thing.

Abuskedti

jlew24asu wrote:

I didnt. you did. I just happen to be smart enough to know something simple as short selling.

you are the one who claims to know what the market is going to do.. answer me this.

will the stock market collapse in the near future?

He he, you keep bragging about your knowlege of sales.... We know you understand the business of peddling stocks to gamblers.

lucylespian

Abuskedti wrote:

ok, I can agree that capitalism is not illogical. I was more trying to say that as a nation we often let the marketplace decide significant things. There are many things that are of no interest to the market.

Declining resources, polution and long term preservation of things like water and air.. are of little interest to the marketplace.

in addition, starving and oppressed people are of no interest to the marketplace. and granted these things are of little interest to many people who are not oppressed or hungry...

basically individuals are of no interest to the marketplace.. the market place left unchecked will lead to something very much like a dictatorship. Once the majority of wealth is accumulated by one person - we have a dictator.

So yes, i agree that capitalism has some wonderful advantages. However, without some responsibility in areas that are not a priority of the marketplace - democracy will fall.

We are bacically believers that every individual has an equal vote .. capitalism is creating a democracy where the weight of your vote is directly proportional to your net worth.

Now see that sounds a lot more like thinking, and less like ideology.
I'm in complete agreemen with you that the stockmarket is laargely a parasitic thing. It has no actual productivity in itself, but seems to absorb an obscene amount of wealth.
Having said that, it serves different purposes, but inadvedantly. It is self-interested. Any useful purpose it serves is incidental.
hey, to the stock market guy, jlew, if stock brokers like yourself are so clever, then why were they all jumping out windows in 1987, and why is hostoyr full of stock market busts like the great railroad scam, or the tulip futures scam ?
Easy answer, pure greed is the primary driver, sense has no place.

lucylespian

Abuskedti wrote:

He he, you keep bragging about your knowlege of sales.... We know you understand the business of peddling stocks to gamblers.

It's funny, when I invest my retirement funds in things like horses the auditor frowns a bit sometimes. I just say, man, putting it into stocks is no different to going to the casino with it.
So far, Ive done better out of horses.

spiral out

jlew24asu wrote:

I really wish you would short the market. do you know what that means? put your money where your mouth is tough guy.

Dude you crack me up, i'm not convinced you really know what your talking about. In the markets as a whole that is.

You seem to think everything is rosy, but from what i have read from other people in the money business they are not so convinced there won't be a crash.

And if banks are saying panic then i think it would be naive to think things couldn't get worse.

spiral out

Abuskedti wrote:

ok, I can agree that capitalism is not illogical. I was more trying to say that as a nation we often let the marketplace decide significant things. There are many things that are of no interest to the market.

Declining resources, polution and long term preservation of things like water and air.. are of little interest to the marketplace.

in addition, starving and oppressed people are of no interest to the marketplace. and granted these things are of little interest to many people who are not oppressed or hungry...

basically individuals are of no interest to the marketplace.. the market place left unchecked will lead to something very much like a dictatorship. Once the majority of wealth is accumulated by one person - we have a dictator.

So yes, i agree that capitalism has some wonderful advantages. However, without some responsibility in areas that are not a priority of the marketplace - democracy will fall.

We are bacically believers that every individual has an equal vote .. capitalism is creating a democracy where the weight of your vote is directly proportional to your net worth.

You hit the nail on the head the big problem with capitalism is the fact that there is no real responsibility, they will abuse the system as much as possible to make more profit.

The corporations responsibility first and formost is to the shareholder and making them a bigger profit each year.

Goverments need to stop letting corporations run the country and set down some good rules and regulations for the companies to run by.

Then we may be in a better position.

lucylespian

spiral out wrote:

You hit the nail on the head the big problem with capitalism is the fact that there is no real responsibility, they will abuse the system as much as possible to make more profit.

The corporations responsibility first and formost is to the shareholder and making them a bigger profit each year.

Goverments need to stop letting corporations run the country and set down some good rules and regulations for the companies to run by.

Then we may be in a better position.

Whereas communism just abused everything else, including having a horrendous impact on the environment, and obliterating individual rights.
Art was slaughtered, music barely existed, creative thought would get you shot, tortured or imprisoned.

spiral out

lucylespian wrote:

Whereas communism just abused everything else, including having a horrendous impact on the environment, and obliterating individual rights.
Art was slaughtered, music barely existed, creative thought would get you shot, tortured or imprisoned.

Aha, i'm sure communism did but i'm not really making a case for communism. Just saying that corps need to be bought under control for things to work out better.

At the moment they are gaining more and more control of our lives and i don't agree with it. While we are here sitting pretty the majority of the people in the world are not.

General motors would sooner put a car on sale that they know to be faulty because it will be cheaper to pay out damages than to correct the fault. Now are you telling me that is good practise?

The world is not black and white and communsim or capitalism are not the only answers. And to believe they are is to limit are view.

lucylespian

spiral out wrote:

Aha, i'm sure communism did but i'm not really making a case for communism. Just saying that corps need to be bought under control for things to work out better.

At the moment they are gaining more and more control of our lives and i don't agree with it. While we are here sitting pretty the majority of the people in the world are not.

General motors would sooner put a car on sale that they know to be faulty because it will be cheaper to pay out damages than to correct the fault. Now are you telling me that is good practise?

The world is not black and white and communsim or capitalism are not the only answers. And to believe they are is to limit are view.

Hey, I am just batting for capitalism on principle. In any system that involves humans, ther will be people doing crappy stuff. That does not mean the system is bad. Also, US made stuff is often of dubious quality, so I prefer to buy Asian. It's much more consistent. Your companies get away with murder because of partriotism and over-protection. The Asians don't, and value their rep way too much. I would not buy GM or Ford, I'll take Toyota or Mazda any day.
Except for Gibson, but even tehn, my Japanese Gretsch and ESP guitars are better made. Les PAuls are just the pig's testicles though !!!

spiral out

lucylespian wrote:

Hey, I am just batting for capitalism on principle. In any system that involves humans, ther will be people doing crappy stuff. That does not mean the system is bad. Also, US made stuff is often of dubious quality, so I prefer to buy Asian. It's much more consistent. Your companies get away with murder because of partriotism and over-protection. The Asians don't, and value their rep way too much. I would not buy GM or Ford, I'll take Toyota or Mazda any day.
Except for Gibson, but even tehn, my Japanese Gretsch and ESP guitars are better made. Les PAuls are just the pig's testicles though !!!

On principle i agree with you but in practise it is not working, (well its working for the few) it's just exploiting the majority of people. We need to figure out a way to stop these companies from exploiting everyone, but until then i will not say that capiltalism is a good thing.

I'm from the UK by the way.

Abuskedti

spiral out wrote:

On principle i agree with you but in practise it is not working, (well its working for the few) it's just exploiting the majority of people. We need to figure out a way to stop these companies from exploiting everyone, but until then i will not say that capiltalism is a good thing.

I'm from the UK by the way.

I'm from the US . Ok lets not give it a name. Labeling from models of the past tends to prevent rational thought. We do need to make some changes.

lucylespian

spiral out wrote:

On principle i agree with you but in practise it is not working, (well its working for the few) it's just exploiting the majority of people. We need to figure out a way to stop these companies from exploiting everyone, but until then i will not say that capiltalism is a good thing.

I'm from the UK by the way.

Well, I guess it depends on your perspective. Capitalism is surely working in Australia, for everybody. People either work or a supported by a welfare system which relies on the success of the capitalist economy to be viable.
People die of stupidity and self-abuse here, but not of hunger or cold.

Socialist governments here always reduce overall wealth, and clearly made polarization of wealth much worse.
Wealth levrls will always follow a bell curve, they have to. It's just a matter of where the mean is. For any country to be wealthy, there must be wealthy individuals. I can see that upsets you, but it's true all the same !!

spiral out

lucylespian wrote:

Well, I guess it depends on your perspective. Capitalism is surely working in Australia, for everybody. People either work or a supported by a welfare system which relies on the success of the capitalist economy to be viable.
People die of stupidity and self-abuse here, but not of hunger or cold.

Socialist governments here always reduce overall wealth, and clearly made polarization of wealth much worse.
Wealth levrls will always follow a bell curve, they have to. It's just a matter of where the mean is. For any country to be wealthy, there must be wealthy individuals. I can see that upsets you, but it's true all the same !!

No no wealth doesn't upset me pure greed and steping on people does. I don't mind if someone has more money than me, if i had the desire to earn more i would. But i prefer to take life easy.

I'm surprised you have goverments that actually produce different affects, as far as i can see here they are just puppets lead by the same master and i wouldn't waste my time voting for either.

Tony Blair was nothing more than a tory.