Virginia Tech : Hindsight 20/20

Vedderlution_Baby

I still argue that if college students were allowed to have firearms that you would see an increase in gun related deaths on college campuses. Although I think there would be an increase in homicides and accidental shootings, I believe the suicide rate would be the biggest increase. College is a huge pressure to a lot of people, who have been told multiple times that if you do not succeed in college, you will not succeed in life, and you will have an miserable existence for how many years you unfortunately have to live. With the pressures of making the grade added to the effects of alcohol, the suicide rate alone would be enough to put a serious flaw on the argument that college campuses should have armed students.

gue_barium

Vedderlution_Baby! wrote:

I still argue that if college students were allowed to have firearms that you would see an increase in gun related deaths on college campuses. Although I think there would be an increase in homicides and accidental shootings, I believe the suicide rate would be the biggest increase. College is a huge pressure to a lot of people, who have been told multiple times that if you do not succeed in college, you will not succeed in life, and you will have an miserable existence for how many years you unfortunately have to live. With the pressures of making the grade added to the effects of alcohol, the suicide rate alone would be enough to put a serious flaw on the argument that college campuses should have armed students.

It's never going to happen. Enrollment would drop off significantly at any University that chooses such a preposterous measure.

Vedderlution_Baby

gue_barium wrote:

It's never going to happen. Enrollment would drop off significantly at any University that chooses such a preposterous measure.

I'm not saying it would. I'm just arguing why it shouldnt happen. I'm killing time before i go to work.

Specifics

upina2001 wrote:

Sure, Cho was a resident alien

he was an Alien? Fuck! there goes my fantasies about aliens having special powers, aliens need to use guns as well? wimps :(

"Bad" people have guns and generally shoot other "bad" people. And if they want to shoot "good" people, they're unlikely to give them a chance to shoot back. Its hard to get a gun in the UK if you dont know "bad" people well, and anyway very few really want one, we're not that scared.

Not having a go at you upina u know, you post fairly chilled and cool, but the bottom line is guns are for the weak.

Gun poofs:
You know why people from the UK post here? its not because they're in AWE of your amazing rights to own a gun...its because we really cant understand how you can be that fearful.

They might not agree but I know it ( forgive me UK )

chopitdown

soulsinging wrote:

. how do you have 2 people dead in a gun-related murder suicide with no gun?

and there is the question that I've been trying to answer as well. I can see from their thought process how they'd think murder suicide...but you'd think they'd check for a gun in that instance. And I'm not sure if they have even connected Cho to the girl yet. From the sound of things he wasn't too well liked so I can't imagine she was an ex-girlfriend.

SPALMA

My son, who was just accepted into UCF and will start in August, received a call last night from UCF stating that they are reviewing security and emergency procedures to assure his safety as a student there.

perhaps some good will come of this?

soulsinging

chopitdown wrote:

and there is the question that I've been trying to answer as well. I can see from their thought process how they'd think murder suicide...but you'd think they'd check for a gun in that instance. And I'm not sure if they have even connected Cho to the girl yet. From the sound of things he wasn't too well liked so I can't imagine she was an ex-girlfriend.

true, but i feel like you'd be able to tell pretty quick there was no gun and then your theory is gone. plus, initially they were saying they thought the perp had fled the campus. bottom line is somebody fucked up here. im not saying i blame them, i dont think ANYONE could have seen this coming and im certain campus cops have never ahd to deal with something like this. they made a bad call under a lot of pressure with horrifying consequences.

hippiemom

SPALMA wrote:

My son, who was just accepted into UCF and will start in August, received a call last night from UCF stating that they are reviewing security and emergency procedures to assure his safety as a student there.

perhaps some good will come of this?

I'm glad they're beefing up security measures, but so sad that they have to. Sad about the loss of life that led to this, of course, but also sad for the kids that have to deal with the aftermath. My daughter is graduating this year and heading to college, and one of the things she was looking forward to was not being subject to the security measures that they have at her high school. We haven't had any incidents in our city, but every year since Columbine they've added some new layer of security. I'm sure they have reason to believe they're all necessary, but it doesn't make for a good atmosphere in the school when there are metal detectors and guards posted everywhere, and she was happy about not having to be in that atmosphere anymore. Now it looks as though colleges will be heading in that same direction. :(

upina2001

inmytree wrote:

and if cho did not have a gun the "farmboy" would not need one...

Exactly, however you are failing to realize guns are obtained easily. Since you cant change the problem, & We all know the NRA has too damn much influence & money to be stopped, you better start adapting.

chopitdown

soulsinging wrote:

true, but i feel like you'd be able to tell pretty quick there was no gun and then your theory is gone. plus, initially they were saying they thought the perp had fled the campus. bottom line is somebody fucked up here. im not saying i blame them, i dont think ANYONE could have seen this coming and im certain campus cops have never ahd to deal with something like this. they made a bad call under a lot of pressure with horrifying consequences.

I agree.

On a different note, I'll also add it has been great to see the outreach from the universities around the area toward VT and see people put aside petty rivalries and really support VT.

inmytree

upina2001 wrote:

Exactly, however you are failing to realize guns are obtained easily. Since you cant change the problem, & We all know the NRA has too damn much influence & money to be stopped, you better start adapting.

"can't change" is very different from "won't change"...

if I read your response correctly, you're saying everyone should just shut up and go buy a gun...if you can't beat 'em, join 'em...that may be fine and well for some...but not for me...

the bottom line is this, guns are made for killing...plain and simple...they are made to project a hunk of metal into someone or something...they are used by small, weak people who need a sense of power (excluding cops and such)...it's kind of like the little guys who drive big trucks...

gue_barium

inmytree wrote:

"can't change" is very different from "won't change"...

if I read your response correctly, you're saying everyone should just shut up and go buy a gun...if you can't beat 'em, join 'em...that may be fine and well for some...but not for me...

the bottom line is this, guns are made for killing...plain and simple...they are made to project a hunk of metal into someone or something...they are used by small, weak people who need a sense of power (excluding cops and such)...it's kind of like the little guys who drive big trucks...

and there you go, propogating the same thing the loonies on the right do in their "self-defense" rants: "this is a scary dangerous place to live in!"

well, no, for the most part it isn't.

inmytree

gue_barium wrote:

and there you go, propogating the same thing the loonies on the right do in their "self-defense" rants: "this is a scary dangerous place to live in!"

well, no, for the most part it isn't.

Huh?


I'm still waiting for your definition of "target"...

gue_barium

inmytree wrote:

Huh?


I'm still waiting for your definition of "target"...

target equals target.

what don't you understand?

inmytree

gue_barium wrote:

target equals target.

what don't you understand?

you...

and your posts...

gue_barium

inmytree wrote:

you...

and your posts...

I do my best. Sorry I can't be more accomodating to your reading style. Peace.

Peace=Peace.

inmytree

gue_barium wrote:

I do my best.

do you....?

gue_barium

inmytree wrote:

do you....?

The self-defense argument is a moot one that keeps this issue exactly where it has been at for the past 40 years in America. When both sides are crying fear (with guns/without guns) it is inevitably in the same context of a country that needs protection from it's scary self. It's a silly argument that both sides use.
Well, I don't find this country scary. I really don't. I don't ever expect to be in a situation where people are being gunned down, and wishing I had a gun on me. It could happen, of course, but I don't live in fear of it, and it could happen regardless of what gun laws are passed.

macgyver06

69charger wrote:

When everyone is packing it is a much safer place to be. Criminals have no idea who is carrying and are less likely to comit violent crime.

did you really think hard about this comment or are just saying this because you understand gun control is not only upsurd, but unethical...and radical...and uncomprehensible..

you really think your opinion is a solution?

upina2001

inmytree wrote:

"can't change" is very different from "won't change"...

if I read your response correctly, you're saying everyone should just shut up and go buy a gun...if you can't beat 'em, join 'em...that may be fine and well for some...but not for me...

the bottom line is this, guns are made for killing...plain and simple...they are made to project a hunk of metal into someone or something...they are used by small, weak people who need a sense of power (excluding cops and such)...it's kind of like the little guys who drive big trucks...

How long have we been trying to "change?" i understand what you are saying...let me reiterate, I dont own a gun, dont have a desire to have one. But I am starting to rethink it............

Imagine standing in line at Target, and someone comes in and starts killing people. I would hope someone around me has a gun on them and is ready to use it.
Oh, you have got to be kidding if you think cops & such dont use guns for a sense of power and intimidation.