Carter and Hamas

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Comments

  • rebornFixer
    rebornFixer Posts: 4,901
    polaris wrote:
    but you are dismissing Hamas for what essentially is fighting back against their oppressors ... you want to marginalize them strictly as this extremist group ... that won't bring peace into the region ...

    Leaving Hamas to promote violence and terrorism certainly won't bring peace to the region either. Either Hamas is destroyed/disbanded/discredited, or they change their ideology (something that could be possible ... Look at the IRA) ... Something about Hamas and related groups has to change, just like the Israelis have to change.
  • Open
    Open Posts: 792
    GauchoB wrote:
    Israel is choosing survival.


    Seems that's what the palestinians were doing when their land was taken from them or now when their homes are bulldozed by the Israeli army.
  • polaris
    polaris Posts: 3,527
    reborncareerist wrote:
    Leaving Hamas to promote violence and terrorism certainly won't bring peace to the region either. Either Hamas is destroyed/disbanded/discredited, or they change their ideology (something that could be possible ... Look at the IRA) ... Something about Hamas and related groups has to change, just like the Israelis have to change.

    Hamas has essentially taken over from the PLO politically ... they are more then just suicide bombers ... that's the point of this thread/discussion - if you just want to see them as some extremist group - then we'll never get anywhere ...
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    polaris wrote:
    Hamas has essentially taken over from the PLO politically ... they are more then just suicide bombers ... that's the point of this thread/discussion - if you just want to see them as some extremist group - then we'll never get anywhere ...

    they havent done much to show themselves as otherwise.
  • fuck
    fuck Posts: 4,069
    GauchoB wrote:
    Israel is choosing survival.
    classic.
  • polaris
    polaris Posts: 3,527
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    they havent done much to show themselves as otherwise.

    :rolleyes:
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    polaris wrote:
    :rolleyes:

    thats all ya got? I know you can do better.
  • polaris
    polaris Posts: 3,527
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    thats all ya got? I know you can do better.

    ha!

    it doesn't take much to read into what hamas is to palestinians - obviously, you aren't interested in reading about it - so, there really is nothing to say ...
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    polaris wrote:
    ha!

    it doesn't take much to read into what hamas is to palestinians - obviously, you aren't interested in reading about it - so, there really is nothing to say ...

    dude dont give me this bullshit. this is a message board. dont tell me to go read something. I made a statement, I was hoping you can provide some evidence or debate to the contrary.
  • polaris
    polaris Posts: 3,527
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    dude dont give me this bullshit. this is a message board. dont tell me to go read something. I made a statement, I was hoping you can provide some evidence or debate to the contrary.

    if i'm gonna type something - i'm most likely going to post a link for you to read ... so, what's the difference?

    you want my opinion - read the thread ... but posting one line that continues to tow the same PR bs that i've heard a gazillion times isn't going to motivate me to respond with anything significant ...
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    polaris wrote:
    if i'm gonna type something - i'm most likely going to post a link for you to read ... so, what's the difference?

    you want my opinion - read the thread ... but posting one line that continues to tow the same PR bs that i've heard a gazillion times isn't going to motivate me to respond with anything significant ...

    are you paying attention? ok I guess I will just have to ask. what has hamas done in the last 10 years to prove themselves worthy of not being seen as an extremist group?
  • polaris
    polaris Posts: 3,527
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    are you paying attention? ok I guess I will just have to ask. what has hamas done in the last 10 years to prove themselves worthy of not being seen as an extremist group?

    are YOU paying attention?

    your question alone pretty much ignores that Hamas has a social wing that funds school programs, health clinics, educational and cultural programs ... granted - i'm not delusioned to think they aren't using these programs for ulterior motives ... but the fact is they aren't deemed to be corrupt like fatah and they contribute to the every day palestinians lives while the other groups like the palestinian authority are not ...

    and for future reference - any question you ask of hamas - you must ask of israel ... what has israel done to prove themselves worth of not being an oppressor?
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    polaris wrote:
    are YOU paying attention?

    your question alone pretty much ignores that Hamas has a social wing that funds school programs, health clinics, educational and cultural programs ... granted - i'm not delusioned to think they aren't using these programs for ulterior motives ... but the fact is they aren't deemed to be corrupt like fatah and they contribute to the every day palestinians lives while the other groups like the palestinian authority are not ...

    so you are basically admitting their social wing is just smoke and mirrors?
    polaris wrote:
    and for future reference - any question you ask of hamas - you must ask of israel ... what has israel done to prove themselves worth of not being an oppressor?

    this isn't the same question. but to answer it, nothing.
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    polaris wrote:
    are YOU paying attention?

    your question alone pretty much ignores that Hamas has a social wing that funds school programs, health clinics, educational and cultural programs ... granted - i'm not delusioned to think they aren't using these programs for ulterior motives ... but the fact is they aren't deemed to be corrupt like fatah and they contribute to the every day palestinians lives while the other groups like the palestinian authority are not ...

    and for future reference - any question you ask of hamas - you must ask of israel ... what has israel done to prove themselves worth of not being an oppressor?

    Few people realize this
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    Few people realize this

    realize what?
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    realize what?

    what was typed immediately above what I responded to....
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    RolandTD20Kdrummer wrote:
    what was typed immediately above what I responded to....

    what specifically? that hamas has a social wing that is uses to pay suicide bombers families?
  • RolandTD20Kdrummer
    RolandTD20Kdrummer Posts: 13,066
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    what specifically?

    exactly what was there for what it was...
    Progress is not made by everyone joining some new fad,
    and reveling in it's loyalty. It's made by forming coalitions
    over specific principles, goals, and policies.

    http://i36.tinypic.com/66j31x.jpg

    (\__/)
    ( o.O)
    (")_(")
  • polaris
    polaris Posts: 3,527
    lazymoon13 wrote:
    so you are basically admitting their social wing is just smoke and mirrors?



    this isn't the same question. but to answer it, nothing.

    no ... that is not what i'm saying ... what i'm saying is that hamas encompasses a lot more then suicide bombings ... they were born to fight the oppressive israeli regime ... whether one agrees with their tactics is secondary to the fact they represent a great deal of palestinians for a reason - choose to ignore those reasons and you basically further advance the fallout ...
  • lazymoon13
    lazymoon13 Posts: 838
    polaris wrote:
    no ... that is not what i'm saying ... what i'm saying is that hamas encompasses a lot more then suicide bombings ... they were born to fight the oppressive israeli regime ... whether one agrees with their tactics is secondary to the fact they represent a great deal of palestinians for a reason - choose to ignore those reasons and you basically further advance the fallout ...

    I'm sure there is more to them but they can't be respected until they stop funding and encouraging suicide bombings on innocent civilians. and yes Israel should be condemned for doing the same.

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