** KAMALA HARRIS FOR PRESIDENT -PART DEUX **

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Comments

  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,475
    just participated in a poll . the way the questions were framed tells me which party it originated from......
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  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,624
    mickeyrat said:
    just participated in a poll . the way the questions were framed tells me which party it originated from......
    Yeah, push polls.
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,475
    mrussel1 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    just participated in a poll . the way the questions were framed tells me which party it originated from......
    Yeah, push polls.

    using the exact wording and language from pac ads for fucksticks choice for senator in ohio....
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • mickeyratmickeyrat Posts: 38,475
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 48,875
    edited September 9
    If only the media actually spent some time pointing out all the idiotic insane things Trump says daily (the Hannibal Lecter shit, shark/battery nonsense, windmills and dead birds etc etc etc) perhaps the polling would not be as tight as it is. They still go out of their way to make him seem like a normal person. 


    Post edited by The Juggler on
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  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,431
    brianlux said:
    I really wonder sometimes what's up with the NY Times.  They posted an article today with the headline, "Trump and Harris Neck and Neck after Summer Upheaval Times/Siena Poll Finds".  All the other polls show Harris leading.  I'm really getting sick to death of all these media sources posting shit like it's God's truth and yet they so often contradict each other.  And WTF, is NY Times backing Trump these days?

    The other thing that bugs me even more is that I still read about how "close" this race is.  Is that even possibly true and if so, how in the hell can that be?  In Trump's latest rallys, he's showing himself to being on the extreme of mentally incompetent.  Fans of his are walking out of his rallys.  And yet again and again these various new sources report that the race is close.  Am I hallucinating this shit?  How is any of this even possible? 
    The answer to your last question is that Democrats haven't put up a no-shit alternative. Harris did poorly in the 2020 primaries so it was pretty obvious it would be a white knuckle ride. If there were any D voices a year or two ago saying the move was for Biden to not seek a second term and to have an open primary, those are voices worth considering in the future.
  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,431
    Its consistant with every other poll. Every other poll has them neck and neck once you factor in the MOE and its been this way for the month. 

    The best takeaway from the NYT poll, which is one of the best if not THE best pollster, is that there are a lot of voters who could be persuadable to Harris. Again. The rule of thumb is voters don't start paying close attention until after labor day. We are one week out and the first debate is this week. Someone may start pulling away after that.

      
    I don't know if this poll is an outlier but this seems wild to me


  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 48,875
    pjl44 said:
    brianlux said:
    I really wonder sometimes what's up with the NY Times.  They posted an article today with the headline, "Trump and Harris Neck and Neck after Summer Upheaval Times/Siena Poll Finds".  All the other polls show Harris leading.  I'm really getting sick to death of all these media sources posting shit like it's God's truth and yet they so often contradict each other.  And WTF, is NY Times backing Trump these days?

    The other thing that bugs me even more is that I still read about how "close" this race is.  Is that even possibly true and if so, how in the hell can that be?  In Trump's latest rallys, he's showing himself to being on the extreme of mentally incompetent.  Fans of his are walking out of his rallys.  And yet again and again these various new sources report that the race is close.  Am I hallucinating this shit?  How is any of this even possible? 
    The answer to your last question is that Democrats haven't put up a no-shit alternative. Harris did poorly in the 2020 primaries so it was pretty obvious it would be a white knuckle ride. If there were any D voices a year or two ago saying the move was for Biden to not seek a second term and to have an open primary, those are voices worth considering in the future.
    Yeah....however it's more to do with the cult like following Trump has. There is literally nothing he can do or say that will cause his base to sway from him. If any other republican behaved like Trump he or she would have dropped out long ago.

    Conversely....if the republicans would have nominated a normal human being they'd likely be cruising to victory right now .
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  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,431
    pjl44 said:
    brianlux said:
    I really wonder sometimes what's up with the NY Times.  They posted an article today with the headline, "Trump and Harris Neck and Neck after Summer Upheaval Times/Siena Poll Finds".  All the other polls show Harris leading.  I'm really getting sick to death of all these media sources posting shit like it's God's truth and yet they so often contradict each other.  And WTF, is NY Times backing Trump these days?

    The other thing that bugs me even more is that I still read about how "close" this race is.  Is that even possibly true and if so, how in the hell can that be?  In Trump's latest rallys, he's showing himself to being on the extreme of mentally incompetent.  Fans of his are walking out of his rallys.  And yet again and again these various new sources report that the race is close.  Am I hallucinating this shit?  How is any of this even possible? 
    The answer to your last question is that Democrats haven't put up a no-shit alternative. Harris did poorly in the 2020 primaries so it was pretty obvious it would be a white knuckle ride. If there were any D voices a year or two ago saying the move was for Biden to not seek a second term and to have an open primary, those are voices worth considering in the future.
    Yeah....however it's more to do with the cult like following Trump has. There is literally nothing he can do or say that will cause his base to sway from him. If any other republican behaved like Trump he or she would have dropped out long ago.

    Conversely....if the republicans would have nominated a normal human being they'd likely be cruising to victory right now .
    Yeah, totally agree. This is that closed primary problem. He has enough of a base to knock out the primary but nowhere near enough for a general election.

    I think Haley or Shapiro would each be relatively coasting right now, although I could probably only really back up the former. We have two soft general election candidates racing to see who can fuck it up worse.
  • Go BeaversGo Beavers Posts: 9,062
    pjl44 said:
    Its consistant with every other poll. Every other poll has them neck and neck once you factor in the MOE and its been this way for the month. 

    The best takeaway from the NYT poll, which is one of the best if not THE best pollster, is that there are a lot of voters who could be persuadable to Harris. Again. The rule of thumb is voters don't start paying close attention until after labor day. We are one week out and the first debate is this week. Someone may start pulling away after that.

      
    I don't know if this poll is an outlier but this seems wild to me


    Seems likely. Don’t confuse independent with swing. Most in that age bracket who will be voting will vote Dem. 
  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 38,953
    Can’t say she doesn’t have any policies.

    https://kamalaharris.com/issues/
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  • Tim SimmonsTim Simmons Posts: 8,027
    edited September 9
    pjl44 said:
    brianlux said:
    I really wonder sometimes what's up with the NY Times.  They posted an article today with the headline, "Trump and Harris Neck and Neck after Summer Upheaval Times/Siena Poll Finds".  All the other polls show Harris leading.  I'm really getting sick to death of all these media sources posting shit like it's God's truth and yet they so often contradict each other.  And WTF, is NY Times backing Trump these days?

    The other thing that bugs me even more is that I still read about how "close" this race is.  Is that even possibly true and if so, how in the hell can that be?  In Trump's latest rallys, he's showing himself to being on the extreme of mentally incompetent.  Fans of his are walking out of his rallys.  And yet again and again these various new sources report that the race is close.  Am I hallucinating this shit?  How is any of this even possible? 
    The answer to your last question is that Democrats haven't put up a no-shit alternative. Harris did poorly in the 2020 primaries so it was pretty obvious it would be a white knuckle ride. If there were any D voices a year or two ago saying the move was for Biden to not seek a second term and to have an open primary, those are voices worth considering in the future.
    I think it’s less that Harris isn’t that good. IMO, she’s actually very good. If you think she’s malleable on positions, well I think that’s an asset. Times change. Things change. We need leaders to change too. Rigidity in politics demonstrates close mindedness. I do agree, until this summer Dems tried to keep to The Norms. That's the old way of thinking. Biden is the president, so support him. Trump proved ‘fuck the norms, be nasty’. Dems are slowly catching on to that being the new Norm. 


    But to Brian’s Q, I think there’s 2 reasons it’s close. One, people feel let down by the system. Sure politics and politicians, but more to the point, it’s the system as a whole. Some of it is entitlement, but some are true systemic failures. Neither party seems keen to fully address it. I think Dems have better in roads and have made solid gains (ACA, and the parts of BBB that have been enacted). But due to cynicism, bad actors in the media, and intangible gains, they don’t feel like things are better. 

    The other reason is a solid portion of Americans are truly dummies. I’m not trying to be a dick here, but there are some who truly don’t fucking get it. And there’s lots of reasons for it. Bad or lack of education. Lack of experience and world view. Bad media or religion. Whatever’s held them back, makes them dummies. It’s sad. But the world is complex and hard and like I said earlier the system has failed them at points. So they look at Trump or Jill stein or who ever, proxies for their anger and frustration, and they misplace their hope. It’s sad in so many ways. 

    I’m not saying Harris is a savior or the next great hope. But she’s the sanest one for moving forward.
    Post edited by Tim Simmons on
  • OnWis97OnWis97 Posts: 5,092
    mrussel1 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    just participated in a poll . the way the questions were framed tells me which party it originated from......
    Yeah, push polls.
    If you found out that Kamala Harris was actually born a female, transitioned to a man, transitioned to a dolphin, and finally transitioned back to a woman over the same period of time during which she shot 39 people coming out of 39 different churches  and wrote 309 anti-police rap songs, would you be more likely or less likely to vote for her?

    (or more accurately, I believe the W. campaign did one about McCain during the 2000 primary asking something like "if you found out John McCain had a mixed-race child out of wedlock, would that impact your vote?")
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  • mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 29,624
    Can’t say she doesn’t have any policies.

    https://kamalaharris.com/issues/
    Yeah but why didn't she have those a year ago? 

    Hang on while I continue to move the goal posts.  

    Also,  she is against Capitol- storming.  I'm a single issue voter in that regard.
  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,431
    pjl44 said:
    Its consistant with every other poll. Every other poll has them neck and neck once you factor in the MOE and its been this way for the month. 

    The best takeaway from the NYT poll, which is one of the best if not THE best pollster, is that there are a lot of voters who could be persuadable to Harris. Again. The rule of thumb is voters don't start paying close attention until after labor day. We are one week out and the first debate is this week. Someone may start pulling away after that.

      
    I don't know if this poll is an outlier but this seems wild to me


    Seems likely. Don’t confuse independent with swing. Most in that age bracket who will be voting will vote Dem. 
    That tracks. Although man that is tight for the youths. 


  • njhaley1njhaley1 Posts: 780
    pjl44 said:
    brianlux said:
    I really wonder sometimes what's up with the NY Times.  They posted an article today with the headline, "Trump and Harris Neck and Neck after Summer Upheaval Times/Siena Poll Finds".  All the other polls show Harris leading.  I'm really getting sick to death of all these media sources posting shit like it's God's truth and yet they so often contradict each other.  And WTF, is NY Times backing Trump these days?

    The other thing that bugs me even more is that I still read about how "close" this race is.  Is that even possibly true and if so, how in the hell can that be?  In Trump's latest rallys, he's showing himself to being on the extreme of mentally incompetent.  Fans of his are walking out of his rallys.  And yet again and again these various new sources report that the race is close.  Am I hallucinating this shit?  How is any of this even possible? 
    The answer to your last question is that Democrats haven't put up a no-shit alternative. Harris did poorly in the 2020 primaries so it was pretty obvious it would be a white knuckle ride. If there were any D voices a year or two ago saying the move was for Biden to not seek a second term and to have an open primary, those are voices worth considering in the future.

    The other reason is a solid portion of Americans are truly dummies. I’m not trying to be a dick here, but there are some who truly don’t fucking get it. And there’s lots of reasons for it. Bad or lack of education. Lack of experience and world view. Bad media or religion. Whatever’s held them back, makes them dummies. It’s sad. But the world is complex and hard and like I said earlier the system has failed them at points. So they look at Trump or Jill stein or who ever, proxies for their anger and frustration, and they misplace their hope. It’s sad in so many ways. 

    Like this f'ing guy in my neighborhood.  So many things to tear apart in this nonsense. And at the same time, I asked my wife - you think this guy isn't gunning to be in charge of the camps when either Trump wins or he tries to overthrow the government after losing in a few months?


  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,431
    edited September 9
    pjl44 said:
    brianlux said:
    I really wonder sometimes what's up with the NY Times.  They posted an article today with the headline, "Trump and Harris Neck and Neck after Summer Upheaval Times/Siena Poll Finds".  All the other polls show Harris leading.  I'm really getting sick to death of all these media sources posting shit like it's God's truth and yet they so often contradict each other.  And WTF, is NY Times backing Trump these days?

    The other thing that bugs me even more is that I still read about how "close" this race is.  Is that even possibly true and if so, how in the hell can that be?  In Trump's latest rallys, he's showing himself to being on the extreme of mentally incompetent.  Fans of his are walking out of his rallys.  And yet again and again these various new sources report that the race is close.  Am I hallucinating this shit?  How is any of this even possible? 
    The answer to your last question is that Democrats haven't put up a no-shit alternative. Harris did poorly in the 2020 primaries so it was pretty obvious it would be a white knuckle ride. If there were any D voices a year or two ago saying the move was for Biden to not seek a second term and to have an open primary, those are voices worth considering in the future.
    I think it’s less that Harris isn’t that good. IMO, she’s actually very good. If you think she’s malleable on positions, well I think that’s an asset. Times change. Things change. We need leaders to change too. Rigidity in politics demonstrates close mindedness. I do agree, until this summer Dems tried to keep to The Norms. That's the old way of thinking. Biden is the president, so support him. Trump proved ‘fuck the norms, be nasty’. Dems are slowly catching on to that being the new Norm. 


    But to Brian’s Q, I think there’s 2 reasons it’s close. One, people feel let down by the system. Sure politics and politicians, but more to the point, it’s the system as a whole. Some of it is entitlement, but some are true systemic failures. Neither party seems keen to fully address it. I think Dems have better in roads and have made solid gains (ACA, and the parts of BBB that have been enacted). But due to cynicism, bad actors in the media, and intangible gains, they don’t feel like things are better. 

    The other reason is a solid portion of Americans are truly dummies. I’m not trying to be a dick here, but there are some who truly don’t fucking get it. And there’s lots of reasons for it. Bad or lack of education. Lack of experience and world view. Bad media or religion. Whatever’s held them back, makes them dummies. It’s sad. But the world is complex and hard and like I said earlier the system has failed them at points. So they look at Trump or Jill stein or who ever, proxies for their anger and frustration, and they misplace their hope. It’s sad in so many ways. 

    I’m not saying Harris is a savior or the next great hope. But she’s the sanest one for moving forward.
    For the sake of Democrat voters, I truly hope that people running a D Presidential campaign don't come from your position in paragraph 3
  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,431
    My personal opinion is that mindset and anything that flows from it is at least somewhat responsible for the state of this race
  • pjl44pjl44 Posts: 9,431
    The condescension and unearned arrogance embedded in a worldview like that is something that Democrats should try to dispel but I see waaaaay too many state proudly 
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 48,875
    pjl44 said:
    pjl44 said:
    brianlux said:
    I really wonder sometimes what's up with the NY Times.  They posted an article today with the headline, "Trump and Harris Neck and Neck after Summer Upheaval Times/Siena Poll Finds".  All the other polls show Harris leading.  I'm really getting sick to death of all these media sources posting shit like it's God's truth and yet they so often contradict each other.  And WTF, is NY Times backing Trump these days?

    The other thing that bugs me even more is that I still read about how "close" this race is.  Is that even possibly true and if so, how in the hell can that be?  In Trump's latest rallys, he's showing himself to being on the extreme of mentally incompetent.  Fans of his are walking out of his rallys.  And yet again and again these various new sources report that the race is close.  Am I hallucinating this shit?  How is any of this even possible? 
    The answer to your last question is that Democrats haven't put up a no-shit alternative. Harris did poorly in the 2020 primaries so it was pretty obvious it would be a white knuckle ride. If there were any D voices a year or two ago saying the move was for Biden to not seek a second term and to have an open primary, those are voices worth considering in the future.
    I think it’s less that Harris isn’t that good. IMO, she’s actually very good. If you think she’s malleable on positions, well I think that’s an asset. Times change. Things change. We need leaders to change too. Rigidity in politics demonstrates close mindedness. I do agree, until this summer Dems tried to keep to The Norms. That's the old way of thinking. Biden is the president, so support him. Trump proved ‘fuck the norms, be nasty’. Dems are slowly catching on to that being the new Norm. 


    But to Brian’s Q, I think there’s 2 reasons it’s close. One, people feel let down by the system. Sure politics and politicians, but more to the point, it’s the system as a whole. Some of it is entitlement, but some are true systemic failures. Neither party seems keen to fully address it. I think Dems have better in roads and have made solid gains (ACA, and the parts of BBB that have been enacted). But due to cynicism, bad actors in the media, and intangible gains, they don’t feel like things are better. 

    The other reason is a solid portion of Americans are truly dummies. I’m not trying to be a dick here, but there are some who truly don’t fucking get it. And there’s lots of reasons for it. Bad or lack of education. Lack of experience and world view. Bad media or religion. Whatever’s held them back, makes them dummies. It’s sad. But the world is complex and hard and like I said earlier the system has failed them at points. So they look at Trump or Jill stein or who ever, proxies for their anger and frustration, and they misplace their hope. It’s sad in so many ways. 

    I’m not saying Harris is a savior or the next great hope. But she’s the sanest one for moving forward.
    For the sake of Democrat voters, I truly hope that people running a D Presidential campaign don't come from your position in paragraph 3
    He is correct. The campaign is smart enough not to treat them like that though. 
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  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 48,875
    edited September 9
    njhaley1 said:
    pjl44 said:
    brianlux said:
    I really wonder sometimes what's up with the NY Times.  They posted an article today with the headline, "Trump and Harris Neck and Neck after Summer Upheaval Times/Siena Poll Finds".  All the other polls show Harris leading.  I'm really getting sick to death of all these media sources posting shit like it's God's truth and yet they so often contradict each other.  And WTF, is NY Times backing Trump these days?

    The other thing that bugs me even more is that I still read about how "close" this race is.  Is that even possibly true and if so, how in the hell can that be?  In Trump's latest rallys, he's showing himself to being on the extreme of mentally incompetent.  Fans of his are walking out of his rallys.  And yet again and again these various new sources report that the race is close.  Am I hallucinating this shit?  How is any of this even possible? 
    The answer to your last question is that Democrats haven't put up a no-shit alternative. Harris did poorly in the 2020 primaries so it was pretty obvious it would be a white knuckle ride. If there were any D voices a year or two ago saying the move was for Biden to not seek a second term and to have an open primary, those are voices worth considering in the future.

    The other reason is a solid portion of Americans are truly dummies. I’m not trying to be a dick here, but there are some who truly don’t fucking get it. And there’s lots of reasons for it. Bad or lack of education. Lack of experience and world view. Bad media or religion. Whatever’s held them back, makes them dummies. It’s sad. But the world is complex and hard and like I said earlier the system has failed them at points. So they look at Trump or Jill stein or who ever, proxies for their anger and frustration, and they misplace their hope. It’s sad in so many ways. 

    Like this f'ing guy in my neighborhood.  So many things to tear apart in this nonsense. And at the same time, I asked my wife - you think this guy isn't gunning to be in charge of the camps when either Trump wins or he tries to overthrow the government after losing in a few months?


    These people are just lost causes. It's so sad. I have a weirdo near me who has an enormous "FJB" lit up in Christmas lights on his roof. Has for three years now. 

    Fucking weirdos. 
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  • Halifax2TheMaxHalifax2TheMax Posts: 38,953
    Isnt it the POOTWH campaign and POOTWH himself that’s patting the voters on the head while proclaiming, “we love the uneducated?” Also, isn’t it the repub party and the likes of faux news that belittle the importance of education, exposure to foreign places and cultures and the ability to speak multiple languages? Nice projection from the “Indy” voter.

    Ignorance has consequences. 
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  • I snapped this pic on Saturday on the way to the carnival. St. Charles, MO.
    "You can tell the greatness of a man by what makes him angry."  - Lincoln

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • tbergstbergs Posts: 9,781
    pjl44 said:
    The condescension and unearned arrogance embedded in a worldview like that is something that Democrats should try to dispel but I see waaaaay too many state proudly 
    I see way too many examples of these people first hand to dispel that assessment as untrue. Not that there aren't similar people on the left, but I've seen many more on the right living in a rural district and having grown up in a farming community. These people have a particular skill set that they are good at so it's not that they're dumb, but when it come to critical thinking and analysis, it's a completely different baseline approach that flies in the face of reality. It's almost like they are proud to not seek truth and only go by the ramblings of a 78 year old pathological liar. It's baffling. 
    It's a hopeless situation...
  • Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Posts: 20,101
    pjl44 said:
    My personal opinion is that mindset and anything that flows from it is at least somewhat responsible for the state of this race
    well yeah...people don't watch real news because it's fake, or they don't have time, or they simply don't care because they can watch a monster truck show on youtube when the nightly news is on. Or they can scroll their TikTok feed and get all the news they need from far right bullshit machines. People are uninformed and ignorant. That's a fact. 

    Magats think that the charges against trump are bullshit because he says they are bullshit. They think the dems created the deficit even though trump added a massive amount to it. They don't care...they will skip right over reality and argue that dems create deficits.
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
    2020: Oakland, Oakland:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
    2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
    2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
  • benjsbenjs Posts: 9,130
    pjl44 said:
    pjl44 said:
    brianlux said:
    I really wonder sometimes what's up with the NY Times.  They posted an article today with the headline, "Trump and Harris Neck and Neck after Summer Upheaval Times/Siena Poll Finds".  All the other polls show Harris leading.  I'm really getting sick to death of all these media sources posting shit like it's God's truth and yet they so often contradict each other.  And WTF, is NY Times backing Trump these days?

    The other thing that bugs me even more is that I still read about how "close" this race is.  Is that even possibly true and if so, how in the hell can that be?  In Trump's latest rallys, he's showing himself to being on the extreme of mentally incompetent.  Fans of his are walking out of his rallys.  And yet again and again these various new sources report that the race is close.  Am I hallucinating this shit?  How is any of this even possible? 
    The answer to your last question is that Democrats haven't put up a no-shit alternative. Harris did poorly in the 2020 primaries so it was pretty obvious it would be a white knuckle ride. If there were any D voices a year or two ago saying the move was for Biden to not seek a second term and to have an open primary, those are voices worth considering in the future.
    I think it’s less that Harris isn’t that good. IMO, she’s actually very good. If you think she’s malleable on positions, well I think that’s an asset. Times change. Things change. We need leaders to change too. Rigidity in politics demonstrates close mindedness. I do agree, until this summer Dems tried to keep to The Norms. That's the old way of thinking. Biden is the president, so support him. Trump proved ‘fuck the norms, be nasty’. Dems are slowly catching on to that being the new Norm. 


    But to Brian’s Q, I think there’s 2 reasons it’s close. One, people feel let down by the system. Sure politics and politicians, but more to the point, it’s the system as a whole. Some of it is entitlement, but some are true systemic failures. Neither party seems keen to fully address it. I think Dems have better in roads and have made solid gains (ACA, and the parts of BBB that have been enacted). But due to cynicism, bad actors in the media, and intangible gains, they don’t feel like things are better. 

    The other reason is a solid portion of Americans are truly dummies. I’m not trying to be a dick here, but there are some who truly don’t fucking get it. And there’s lots of reasons for it. Bad or lack of education. Lack of experience and world view. Bad media or religion. Whatever’s held them back, makes them dummies. It’s sad. But the world is complex and hard and like I said earlier the system has failed them at points. So they look at Trump or Jill stein or who ever, proxies for their anger and frustration, and they misplace their hope. It’s sad in so many ways. 

    I’m not saying Harris is a savior or the next great hope. But she’s the sanest one for moving forward.
    For the sake of Democrat voters, I truly hope that people running a D Presidential campaign don't come from your position in paragraph 3
    People have shown themselves to be in some cases dumb, and in other cases misinformed, and in other cases just plain ignorant. Talking to those individuals is not the same as running a campaign around those individuals, but to neglect those folks so that your opponent can be the only one speaking to them, is not what I'd call a strong campaign strategy. This is the country you have, and getting the votes is the only way to gain the power to make change. In a democracy, dumb/misinformed/ignorant voters have the same votes per person as those who are not. 
    '05 - TO, '06 - TO 1, '08 - NYC 1 & 2, '09 - TO, Chi 1 & 2, '10 - Buffalo, NYC 1 & 2, '11 - TO 1 & 2, Hamilton, '13 - Buffalo, Brooklyn 1 & 2, '15 - Global Citizen, '16 - TO 1 & 2, Chi 2

    EV
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  • Tim SimmonsTim Simmons Posts: 8,027
    edited September 9
    Look I was just answering Brian’s question as to why is the race close. No candidate should say about 45% of the country is a bunch of dopes. I outlined some of the various ways people have been shortchanged, and every human being has value. It is about reaching those people. 

    pjl44 said:
    My personal opinion is that mindset and anything that flows from it is at least somewhat responsible for the state of this race
    I’ll do you one better, CLOSEMINDEDNESS is responsible for the state of the country and thus, this campaign. 
    Post edited by Tim Simmons on
  • The JugglerThe Juggler Posts: 48,875
    tbergs said:
    pjl44 said:
    The condescension and unearned arrogance embedded in a worldview like that is something that Democrats should try to dispel but I see waaaaay too many state proudly 
    I see way too many examples of these people first hand to dispel that assessment as untrue. Not that there aren't similar people on the left, but I've seen many more on the right living in a rural district and having grown up in a farming community. These people have a particular skill set that they are good at so it's not that they're dumb, but when it come to critical thinking and analysis, it's a completely different baseline approach that flies in the face of reality. It's almost like they are proud to not seek truth and only go by the ramblings of a 78 year old pathological liar. It's baffling. 
    And some examples are on display in this very forum/thread. 
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  • Tim SimmonsTim Simmons Posts: 8,027
    For every person who may have the arrogance of writing off low info Americans, there’s another (possibly 2-3 more) who write off illegals, women, people of color, LGBTQ+, those with physical and mental challenges. 

    So there’s blame to go around everywhere. 
  • tbergstbergs Posts: 9,781
    Look I was just answering Brian’s question as to why is the race close. No candidate should say about 45% of the country is a bunch of dopes. I outlined some of the various ways people have been shortchanged, and every human being has value. It is about reaching those people. 

    pjl44 said:
    My personal opinion is that mindset and anything that flows from it is at least somewhat responsible for the state of this race
    I’ll do you one better, CLOSEMINDEDNESS is responsible for the state of the country and thus, this campaign. 
    And fear of the "other".
    It's a hopeless situation...
This discussion has been closed.