“PJ Premium” on Ticketmaster?

cmalisze · March 2022

mattcoz said:

JimmyV said:

Your periodic reminder that calling it PJ Premium was dumb.

Yes. I imagine the reaction would have been much different if they were called what they are, Ticketmaster Platinum.

At least they could have hid behind a mirage like RATM and call them Vitalogy Charity Tickets. They are just flat out giving fans the middle finger all while I have 2 tickets I cannot use to Vegas and I am looking to trade but I only need one. Maybe someone has one and needs two. I would do a deal straight up BUT my post gets taken down because that is scalping. LOL

cmalisze · March 2022

JH6056 said:

pjl44 said:

Yeah, issuing fully transferable Ten Club tickets couldn't possibly lead to any undesirable unintended consequences

No one is suggesting fully transferable Ten Club tix. What was said above is, if you're gonna charge me $2,000.00 per ticket, make it transferable.

EXACTLY this. Once I buy something it is mine and I should be able to do with it as I wish. Anytime I hear someone complaining about scalping whether it be merch or tickets I say to them....sell me your house for exactly what you paid then......they shut up real quick. Tickets like anything are a commodity. What teams....bands....events.....fail to realize by controlling the secondary market on goods you are only hurting yourself. I can list tons of examples of negative repercussions to attempting to controlling the market around you. These events at certain prices need a market for people to buy and sell or else they simply wont get sold. The Cali shows are a great example.

cmalisze · March 2022

foriginalsin said:

OceansJenny said:

cmalisze said:

Pearl Jam Fans Furious over Band Charging "Scalper" Ticket Prices (ticketnews.com)

Worth a read.

“the band is once again using Ticketmaster mobile-only ticketing systems to strip their fans of ticket transfer or resale rights for their upcoming tour dates, save in New York and Colorado – states which require consumer choice in ticket format by law. With the transfer and resale restrictions in place, there should be no “scalping” but that’s where Ticketmaster “platinum” tickets come in.

For Pearl Jam, the “platinum” tickets are marked as “PJ Premium,” but it is just a slight variation in name on the same thing: taking tickets that would have been one price, and multiplying that number by a factor of 2-3 all while claiming to protect fans from “scalpers.”

Bingo - transfer restrictions + platinum tickets do no work together. If TM is going to charge a grand for tickets just give me my transfer rights back. You aren’t helping.

This article sounds like it was written by someone in this forum, missing some of the facts and drawing improper conclusions.

What facts are missing? And how can one come to their own improper conclusions if it is their article which they are drawing conclusions. This article actually seemed fair and a took it a bit easy on PJ and the circumstance. That is my conclusion.

Poncier · March 2022

JimmyV said:

Your periodic reminder that calling it PJ Premium was dumb.

I'm glad they called it that. At least a few (apparently very few based on replies in here) folks will come to the realization that the band is all in on it and reaping the profits since they put their name on it.

aisleseats · March 2022

rmwatson said:

aisleseats said:

Poncier said:

JR86440 said:

People who complain about premium have never tried to run a business. There are sooooo many costs that go into running a business that people don’t see. It’s not as simple as multiplying 20k seats by $100 and dividing by 6 band members… counting Boom of course! Benefits for employees, liability insurance, salaries, rent, taxes, travel, crew, etc. Plus they need to Maher a profit. It’s not a non profit organization. $100 for 95% of the crowd for a band of PJ’s caliber is dirt cheap in my mind. And they aren’t the chili peppers who play 18 songs. Either need to accept premium or accept $150 tickets. Add in the fact that they have families to support I feel what they are doing is more than reasonable

Yet they have managed to run their business without doing PJ Premium for 30 years until now. Just moderately increasing ticket prices at a fair and reasonable rate as time has gone on. Are you saying that the business model they used for 3 decades was faulty?

This is the point a lot of ppl keep overlooking. Platinum pricing is something that didn't even really exist until maybe 10 years ago. Prior to that, every band/artist in history successfully toured without it and just charged a fixed price for tickets. Many artists (including some even bigger than PJ) still do. I get that costs associated with touring have increased. But the increase in ticket prices over the years have reflected that.
So those of you who are making excuses for and defending PJ for caving in can go try to sell that BS elsewhere. Because I'm not buying it.

Do you believe that Ticketmaster sits there at the negotiation and says "Sure Pearl Jam management, have all these fan club seat allocations, and also, have non-transferable tickets so that bots cant gobble them up, oh, and also, let us run a verified fan for you to limit the market even more to your direct fan base and hopefully not scalpers, AND we are going to do all of this for nothing in return, we will even sell the regular tickets at a cheap cost for all" It is not how that business, or the world, works. Business contracts and about give and take - the business of Pearl Jam takes A LOT for the 10Club, and for the verified fan - the give is ultimately the Premium seats and that system. I mean, they explicitly state as much in their tour announcement. I really don't get what people don't understand about it. And if they werent dealing with Ticketmaster and LiveNation, we wouldn' be seeing them live at all - so please don't argue that.

Do I need to remind you that the vast majority of these were rescheduled shows and the contracts had been negotiated long ago? They didn't need this shit then and they didn't need to cave to it now.

Poncier · March 2022

droptheleash9 said:

I get everything that people have complained about but we should be careful what we wish for. The band could very easily say "enough of everyone's complaining...no more ten club tickets...you can deal with fighting for tickets on ticketmaster or the secondary market." I think that we can't lose track of the fact that 10c members are still pretty fortunate all things considered with the chance to get tickets at low prices in some of the best seats in the house.

True, they can at any point eliminate 10 club ticket privileges. they would also lose how much money annually in dues? You know the vast majority of members would stop renewing and paying $20 or $40 every year if the tickets were deducted from the equation.

JimmyV · March 2022

Without the fanclub, their merchandise operation would crumble.

Poncier · March 2022

mattcoz said:

bbiggs said:

pjl44 said:

bbiggs said:

cmalisze said:

Pearl Jam Fans Furious over Band Charging "Scalper" Ticket Prices (ticketnews.com)

Worth a read.

"In its recent earnings report Live Nation cited the increased use of platinum pricing as a key driver of its record-breaking revenue."

Interesting.

Isn't that obvious? The entire point is pulling money out of the secondary market into the primary.

Of course it is obvious. Some are suggesting the windfall of cash is all about snagging a bunch of fan club tickets and keeping those prices low though. That is a part of it, but the bottom line is about making more money. And that's fine. Just call it what it is.

It's about Ticketmaster making money, yes. It's the deal that the band needs to make to keep Ticketmaster happy so that they agree to provide as many low priced tickets to the fan club as possible. It can be both things. In the end, does the band make more money? Honestly, I don't know, maybe. But, that extra money is what would have gone to the ticket resellers instead. Why is that better? If the band makes some extra money, which they can use to pay their employees well and to offset their carbon emissions, and we get to keep our low priced fan club tickets, that seems like a win-win.

So, you think Pearl jam is making no extra scratch off PJ Premium tickets?
Want to buy this bridge I own in Brooklyn?

cmalisze · March 2022

Poncier said:

droptheleash9 said:

I get everything that people have complained about but we should be careful what we wish for. The band could very easily say "enough of everyone's complaining...no more ten club tickets...you can deal with fighting for tickets on ticketmaster or the secondary market." I think that we can't lose track of the fact that 10c members are still pretty fortunate all things considered with the chance to get tickets at low prices in some of the best seats in the house.

True, they can at any point eliminate 10 club ticket privileges. they would also lose how much money annually in dues? You know the vast majority of members would stop renewing and paying $20 or $40 every year if the tickets were deducted from the equation.

Exactly this. Oh wait there are thousands of members paying dues for a chance to get tickets for tours that rarely have occurred as of late (pandemic or not) OR for the chance to buy "exclusive" merch only to have it pop up at Target a week later. I assume they will take the dues and keep providing a chance. Oh not to mention the late 45s.....Deep magazines etc.......

Again do not get me wrong....I LOVE this band and their music. Always have, always will. I just recognize who they have become less nowadays.

foriginalsin · March 2022

Again show me a band who is doing it better.

cmalisze · March 2022

foriginalsin said:

Again show me a band who is doing it better.

Define better......

mattcoz · March 2022

Poncier said:

mattcoz said:

bbiggs said:

pjl44 said:

bbiggs said:

cmalisze said:

Pearl Jam Fans Furious over Band Charging "Scalper" Ticket Prices (ticketnews.com)

Worth a read.

"In its recent earnings report Live Nation cited the increased use of platinum pricing as a key driver of its record-breaking revenue."

Interesting.

Isn't that obvious? The entire point is pulling money out of the secondary market into the primary.

Of course it is obvious. Some are suggesting the windfall of cash is all about snagging a bunch of fan club tickets and keeping those prices low though. That is a part of it, but the bottom line is about making more money. And that's fine. Just call it what it is.

It's about Ticketmaster making money, yes. It's the deal that the band needs to make to keep Ticketmaster happy so that they agree to provide as many low priced tickets to the fan club as possible. It can be both things. In the end, does the band make more money? Honestly, I don't know, maybe. But, that extra money is what would have gone to the ticket resellers instead. Why is that better? If the band makes some extra money, which they can use to pay their employees well and to offset their carbon emissions, and we get to keep our low priced fan club tickets, that seems like a win-win.

So, you think Pearl jam is making no extra scratch off PJ Premium tickets?
Want to buy this bridge I own in Brooklyn?

Try reading past my first sentence.

JimmyV · March 2022

Better is always going to be subjective. I think DMB does it pretty well with their consistent and lengthy U.S. summer tours. They have dynamic pricing as well, but there are so many more shows and opportunities to get regular and reasonably priced tickets. They have also had a multi-year collaboration with the Nature Conservancy.

uglybabo · March 2022

I’ve seen it mentioned but I think the one adjustment needed is that the PJ premium seats need to be transferable.

If I buy a fan club ticket for $125-150, and I can sell it for face if I can’t go, there’s a good chance it’ll sell and at worst I’m out $150.

But if I buy a premium seat for $2000+ and my only recourse is to list at $2000+ There’s a good chance it won’t sell, and I’ll lose $2000+.

Ticketmaster/the band has their $2000, that they consider market value, so what I do with that ticket shouldn’t matter to them.

Poncier · March 2022

mattcoz said:

Poncier said:

mattcoz said:

bbiggs said:

pjl44 said:

bbiggs said:

cmalisze said:

Pearl Jam Fans Furious over Band Charging "Scalper" Ticket Prices (ticketnews.com)

Worth a read.

"In its recent earnings report Live Nation cited the increased use of platinum pricing as a key driver of its record-breaking revenue."

Interesting.

Isn't that obvious? The entire point is pulling money out of the secondary market into the primary.

Of course it is obvious. Some are suggesting the windfall of cash is all about snagging a bunch of fan club tickets and keeping those prices low though. That is a part of it, but the bottom line is about making more money. And that's fine. Just call it what it is.

It's about Ticketmaster making money, yes. It's the deal that the band needs to make to keep Ticketmaster happy so that they agree to provide as many low priced tickets to the fan club as possible. It can be both things. In the end, does the band make more money? Honestly, I don't know, maybe. But, that extra money is what would have gone to the ticket resellers instead. Why is that better? If the band makes some extra money, which they can use to pay their employees well and to offset their carbon emissions, and we get to keep our low priced fan club tickets, that seems like a win-win.

So, you think Pearl jam is making no extra scratch off PJ Premium tickets?
Want to buy this bridge I own in Brooklyn?

Try reading past my first sentence.

You said you don't know if the band is making more money off PJ Premium.
Simply put: They are.

cmalisze · March 2022

JimmyV said:

Better is always going to be subjective. I think DMB does it pretty well with their consistent and lengthy U.S. summer tours. They have dynamic pricing as well, but there are so many more shows and opportunities to get regular and reasonably priced tickets. They have also had a multi-year collaboration with the Nature Conservancy.

They also provide Warehouse paper tickets! This is BETTER!

Zod · March 2022

Poncier said:

mattcoz said:

Poncier said:

mattcoz said:

bbiggs said:

pjl44 said:

bbiggs said:

cmalisze said:

Pearl Jam Fans Furious over Band Charging "Scalper" Ticket Prices (ticketnews.com)

Worth a read.

"In its recent earnings report Live Nation cited the increased use of platinum pricing as a key driver of its record-breaking revenue."

Interesting.

Isn't that obvious? The entire point is pulling money out of the secondary market into the primary.

Of course it is obvious. Some are suggesting the windfall of cash is all about snagging a bunch of fan club tickets and keeping those prices low though. That is a part of it, but the bottom line is about making more money. And that's fine. Just call it what it is.

It's about Ticketmaster making money, yes. It's the deal that the band needs to make to keep Ticketmaster happy so that they agree to provide as many low priced tickets to the fan club as possible. It can be both things. In the end, does the band make more money? Honestly, I don't know, maybe. But, that extra money is what would have gone to the ticket resellers instead. Why is that better? If the band makes some extra money, which they can use to pay their employees well and to offset their carbon emissions, and we get to keep our low priced fan club tickets, that seems like a win-win.

So, you think Pearl jam is making no extra scratch off PJ Premium tickets?
Want to buy this bridge I own in Brooklyn?

Try reading past my first sentence.

You said you don't know if the band is making more money off PJ Premium.
Simply put: They are.

I think the answer is probably more complicated than we think. I'm curious as to how this all works. They would of signed the contract with the promoter a few years ago when the tour was scheduled for 2020. That would of included the amount the promoter agrees to pay the band. Significant work would of already been put in by the promoter, ticket agency, band, and grew to get that tour started.

How does this work with Covid related shows? There would of been costs associated with ticketing then postponing the shows. Costs of everything have increased due to inflation. All the tickets were issues at prices that made sense for 2020.

Does the original contract remain in place, did PJ renegotiate so they could get extra revenue to cover the higher touring costs of 2022, and to recoup $$'s lost when they got postponed. Did the promoter agree to that to recoup whatever money they lost in 2020. Are they trying to make things right by their crew that had to get laid off work at the last second.

Most of the tickets seem to be sold at prices that are pretty low for 2022. So maybe the comments were right, the platinum tickets are covering the extra cost of touring in 2022, and recovering the money lost from cancelling the tour last second?

Could be other things too. Maybe tour cancellation insurance premiums have gone up because of covid.

I'm going to stop. I'm just going to say there's a lot of logistics that could make what they said legitimate. I don't know if they apply, but when you start thinking of all the things that would of been impacted with the delay... it starts adding up.

aisleseats · March 2022

cmalisze said:

JimmyV said:

Better is always going to be subjective. I think DMB does it pretty well with their consistent and lengthy U.S. summer tours. They have dynamic pricing as well, but there are so many more shows and opportunities to get regular and reasonably priced tickets. They have also had a multi-year collaboration with the Nature Conservancy.

They also provide Warehouse paper tickets! This is BETTER!

Well, to be fair, I've been to far more dmb shows than I've been to PJ shows, and I've been a WH member twice as long as I've been a 10c member. I'll say, in spite of my current comments here, PJ is still far better than dmb as far as ticketing. Dmb sold out to platinum a few years ago. And 10c still gives better seats (in far greater numbers) than WH does these days. So, in spite of my comments in this thread, and in spite of how disappointed I am in PJ for caving in, I'll still say they're far better than most bands out there in this regard.

cmalisze · March 2022

Zod said:

Poncier said:

mattcoz said:

Poncier said:

mattcoz said:

bbiggs said:

pjl44 said:

bbiggs said:

cmalisze said:

Pearl Jam Fans Furious over Band Charging "Scalper" Ticket Prices (ticketnews.com)

Worth a read.

"In its recent earnings report Live Nation cited the increased use of platinum pricing as a key driver of its record-breaking revenue."

Interesting.

Isn't that obvious? The entire point is pulling money out of the secondary market into the primary.

Of course it is obvious. Some are suggesting the windfall of cash is all about snagging a bunch of fan club tickets and keeping those prices low though. That is a part of it, but the bottom line is about making more money. And that's fine. Just call it what it is.

It's about Ticketmaster making money, yes. It's the deal that the band needs to make to keep Ticketmaster happy so that they agree to provide as many low priced tickets to the fan club as possible. It can be both things. In the end, does the band make more money? Honestly, I don't know, maybe. But, that extra money is what would have gone to the ticket resellers instead. Why is that better? If the band makes some extra money, which they can use to pay their employees well and to offset their carbon emissions, and we get to keep our low priced fan club tickets, that seems like a win-win.

So, you think Pearl jam is making no extra scratch off PJ Premium tickets?
Want to buy this bridge I own in Brooklyn?

Try reading past my first sentence.

You said you don't know if the band is making more money off PJ Premium.
Simply put: They are.

I think the answer is probably more complicated than we think. I'm curious as to how this all works. They would of signed the contract with the promoter a few years ago when the tour was scheduled for 2020. That would of included the amount the promoter agrees to pay the band. Significant work would of already been put in by the promoter, ticket agency, band, and grew to get that tour started.

How does this work with Covid related shows? There would of been costs associated with ticketing then postponing the shows. Costs of everything have increased due to inflation. All the tickets were issues at prices that made sense for 2020.

Does the original contract remain in place, did PJ renegotiate so they could get extra revenue to cover the higher touring costs of 2022, and to recoup $$'s lost when they got postponed. Did the promoter agree to that to recoup whatever money they lost in 2020. Are they trying to make things right by their crew that had to get laid off work at the last second.

Most of the tickets seem to be sold at prices that are pretty low for 2022. So maybe the comments were right, the platinum tickets are covering the extra cost of touring in 2022, and recovering the money lost from cancelling the tour last second?

Could be other things too. Maybe tour cancellation insurance premiums have gone up because of covid.

I'm going to stop. I'm just going to say there's a lot of logistics that could make what they said legitimate. I don't know if they apply, but when you start thinking of all the things that would of been impacted with the delay... it starts adding up.

Then charge EVERYONE more opposed to the "elite" mentality in PJ Platinum which has been fought so hard against for decades by this band....until they became that themselves.....it is ok...we all wish to be elite......it is the American way....let's just come by it honestly.

Lifted · March 2022

It seems to me that the majority of people who are getting bent out of shape over the pj premium (platinum) tickets being sold, are misplacing their frustration...which should be directed solely toward ticketmaster. No one in the band is making extra money from platinum ticket sales. Ticketmaster is, and it's the cost of being forced to do business with them.

The same people who weren't able to secure face value tickets to their targeted show, would have failed with or without platinum tickets. The only reason why these tickets are still available at otherwise sold out shows is because they are so expensive.

The resentment toward ticketmaster in regard to platinum ticket sales is warranted. I just dont see Pearl Jam as the problem, or even a problem, as I don't believe they are contributing to it, or benefitting in any way from platinum ticket sales. They're essentially backed into a corner, as they either have to work with ticketmaster, stop touring, or play shows at small venues that virtually no one would be able to acquire tickets for anyway.

Ticketmaster's business practices are indeed complete bullshit, and a major threat to the future of live music if something isn't done to stop them. They are as close as they can get to having a monopoly over the primary ticketing industry for live events. They've already been caught scalping their own tickets, and now they are essentially doing the same thing in plain site with their platinum ticket offers. Anyone who is trying to excuse it with terms like 'market value', spare me the bullshit. Market value for who?

There are only two criticisms I can make against Pearl Jam in this situation. 1. That they agreed to call the "platinum" tickets "pj premium". And 2. The way in which they suggested that this practice is being employed as a means to limit ticket scalping on the secondary market.

In regard to the second criticism, I suspect the language they used was in an effort to not ruffle any feathers with ticketmaster, who they've had to partner with.

Take MSG and Denver out of the conversation, and Pearl Jam has already created the perfect system to eliminate secondary ticket market price gouging. Non transferable tickets with fan to fan resales. I'd love for anyone who defends platinum tickets to try and explain to me how the practice is benefitting fans at any of the venues outside of CO and NY. It's not. None of the other shows even have a secondary market if you haven't noticed.

And there lies the conflict of interest. Pearl Jam wants to control their ticket costs and make them attainable to their fans. Ticketmaster actively participates and profits from the secondary ticket market. As previously mentioned, Pearl Jam has devised the perfect anti scalping ticketing system. The only way a company like ticketmaster would allow them to put this practice in motion is if they were given 100% of the secondary market profits. That is what has happened here, and its the best Pearl Jam could do.

Pearl Jam was able to acquire a larger portion of seats for their fan club than they have in the past. Seats that would've otherwise been gobbled up by bots and internal partners of ticketmaster, and then resold on the secondary market at inflated prices. The cost of this acquisition to Pearl Jam was to allow ticketmaster to openly price gouge a small percentage of seats themselves via "pj premium". Until if and when someone is able to take down ticketmaster in court, I think this was the right move by PJ, and in the best interest of all of us.

To all of my fellow PJ fans, I urge you not to buy any pj premium tickets until if and when the prices fall in line with the standard ticket costs. Even if you can afford it, out of respect for us all, don't do it. This isn't live saving medicine we're talking about. If people don't buy them, they can't sell them.

“PJ Premium” on Ticketmaster?

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