I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
Makes sense. Don’t know how much he would care about any of that except for the assets.
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
Makes sense. Don’t know how much he would care about any of that except for the assets.
Not being able to go to Davos, the UN, Olympics, anywhere, makes you pretty impotent as a world leader.
Get ready for public executions as they capture cities any dissenting supporters will be executed in public!
Well that is very clearly a war crime and would make it quite easy for the UN and the Hague to declare them as such.
Right - randomly blowing up buildings they can argue is a consequence of war. But if they go around just blatantly executing people now you're talking about a completely different issue.
Also, so far it hasn't seemed like any Russian soldiers have had the stomach to do so.
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
Makes sense. Don’t know how much he would care about any of that except for the assets.
Not being able to go to Davos, the UN, Olympics, anywhere, makes you pretty impotent as a world leader.
He had to have known all these sort of sanctions were coming though. He seems okay with isolating Russia from the rest of the world. And between so much dependency on Russian oil, and Russia's quasi-alliance with China, he probably thinks he has cards to play in response to the sanctions.
Wonder how badly the sanctions are hurting Trump for him to come out so strongly against Russia. A sign of Putin truly losing all power is what I take it as, or at least what I hope. Trump is truly throwing Putin under the bus here (similar to other oligarchs distancing from Putin). What do you all make of it?
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
Makes sense. Don’t know how much he would care about any of that except for the assets.
Not being able to go to Davos, the UN, Olympics, anywhere, makes you pretty impotent as a world leader.
He had to have known all these sort of sanctions were coming though. He seems okay with isolating Russia from the rest of the world. And between so much dependency on Russian oil, and Russia's quasi-alliance with China, he probably thinks he has cards to play in response to the sanctions.
I don't know man. I think he thought he'd be in and out in a day, and would have a pro-Russian regime running the show the second they were done.
Wonder how badly the sanctions are hurting Trump for him to come out so strongly against Russia. A sign of Putin truly losing all power is what I take it as, or at least what I hope. Trump is truly throwing Putin under the bus here (similar to other oligarchs distancing from Putin). What do you all make of it?
He’s full of shit I don’t care how much he condemned Putin! Fuck him who was president when he tried to get dirt on Biden!
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
Makes sense. Don’t know how much he would care about any of that except for the assets.
Not being able to go to Davos, the UN, Olympics, anywhere, makes you pretty impotent as a world leader.
He had to have known all these sort of sanctions were coming though. He seems okay with isolating Russia from the rest of the world. And between so much dependency on Russian oil, and Russia's quasi-alliance with China, he probably thinks he has cards to play in response to the sanctions.
I don't know man. I think he thought he'd be in and out in a day, and would have a pro-Russian regime running the show the second they were done.
I agree with this, but I don't think it's something that would cause him to backtrack or second-guess the invasion. In fact, I think it could make him go even more rouge and do something catastrophic.
Wonder how badly the sanctions are hurting Trump for him to come out so strongly against Russia. A sign of Putin truly losing all power is what I take it as, or at least what I hope. Trump is truly throwing Putin under the bus here (similar to other oligarchs distancing from Putin). What do you all make of it?
Sounds like he doesn't have a P tape to be worried about
Wonder how badly the sanctions are hurting Trump for him to come out so strongly against Russia. A sign of Putin truly losing all power is what I take it as, or at least what I hope. Trump is truly throwing Putin under the bus here (similar to other oligarchs distancing from Putin). What do you all make of it?
this is politically motivated. he knows this is his opportunity to undermine biden here, which is what he is doing.
"But they don't respect the United States and the United States is like, I don't know, they're not doing anything about it. This is a — this is a holocaust. This is a horrible thing that's happening. You're witnessing and you're seeing it on television every night."
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
Makes sense. Don’t know how much he would care about any of that except for the assets.
Not being able to go to Davos, the UN, Olympics, anywhere, makes you pretty impotent as a world leader.
He had to have known all these sort of sanctions were coming though. He seems okay with isolating Russia from the rest of the world. And between so much dependency on Russian oil, and Russia's quasi-alliance with China, he probably thinks he has cards to play in response to the sanctions.
I don't know man. I think he thought he'd be in and out in a day, and would have a pro-Russian regime running the show the second they were done.
I agree with this, but I don't think it's something that would cause him to backtrack or second-guess the invasion. In fact, I think it could make him go even more rouge and do something catastrophic.
Absolutely. But I don't think that means he saw this size of a global backlash coming. He's completely petulant, we know this - the Russian version of Trump if Trump had the authoritarian control of a thirst trap he was/is begging for. He's going to double down and dig his heels in, that's why I don't think absolute worst case scenario is off the table. If Vlad can fucking shoot himself up in Sputnik while the rest of the world burns so that he can come back down to Earth to rule over what's left he absolutely would. We can only hope that there is some seriously internal blacklash and coup/rebellion by the Russian people as a whole - and more importantly to those with a lot of money on the line.
He was on the phone with Macron for 90 minutes and Macron was telling him he's lying to himself lol. And Vlad doubled down that he's taking Ukraine lol. It's insane.
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
Makes sense. Don’t know how much he would care about any of that except for the assets.
Not being able to go to Davos, the UN, Olympics, anywhere, makes you pretty impotent as a world leader.
He had to have known all these sort of sanctions were coming though. He seems okay with isolating Russia from the rest of the world. And between so much dependency on Russian oil, and Russia's quasi-alliance with China, he probably thinks he has cards to play in response to the sanctions.
I don't know man. I think he thought he'd be in and out in a day, and would have a pro-Russian regime running the show the second they were done.
Yes. I agree. Putin probably thought there would be little resistance. Zalensky and the cabinet would flee. He probably had his puppet leader ready to declare that Ukraine was with Russia, and things would settle. He would have to endure some short term sanctions but the world would move on since it would look almost peaceful in nature. This was clearly Trumps read of the situation when he made his comments.
Now that the resistance is massive and worldwide, Trump is trying to get on the other side of history. But the internet doesn’t forget.
Wonder how badly the sanctions are hurting Trump for him to come out so strongly against Russia. A sign of Putin truly losing all power is what I take it as, or at least what I hope. Trump is truly throwing Putin under the bus here (similar to other oligarchs distancing from Putin). What do you all make of it?
this is politically motivated. he knows this is his opportunity to undermine biden here, which is what he is doing.
"But they don't respect the United States and the United States is like, I don't know, they're not doing anything about it. This is a — this is a holocaust. This is a horrible thing that's happening. You're witnessing and you're seeing it on television every night."
I agree. I think everything he does is self-serving. He is not “Putin’s puppet”, but a puppet of his own selfishness. Really reminds me of the oligarchs supporting Putin in everything as long as they are making $.
On the bright side, maybe the people that fully support everything he states will now actively go against Russia too (even if it is just a low blow against Biden).
Wonder how badly the sanctions are hurting Trump for him to come out so strongly against Russia. A sign of Putin truly losing all power is what I take it as, or at least what I hope. Trump is truly throwing Putin under the bus here (similar to other oligarchs distancing from Putin). What do you all make of it?
this is politically motivated. he knows this is his opportunity to undermine biden here, which is what he is doing.
"But they don't respect the United States and the United States is like, I don't know, they're not doing anything about it. This is a — this is a holocaust. This is a horrible thing that's happening. You're witnessing and you're seeing it on television every night."
I agree. I think everything he does is self-serving. He is not “Putin’s puppet”, but a puppet of his own selfishness. Really reminds me of the oligarchs supporting Putin in everything as long as they are making $.
On the bright side, maybe the red necks that fully support everything he states will now actively speak out against Russia too (even if it is just a low blow against Biden).
This week we learned from Bolton that he didn't know where Ukraine was located. And now from that quote, we learned he doesn't know what the Holocaust was. He thinks it's some sort of generic term for killing civilians or something. Maybe he thinks it's a synonym for "genocide". Either way, it's not what he thinks it is.
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
Makes sense. Don’t know how much he would care about any of that except for the assets.
Not being able to go to Davos, the UN, Olympics, anywhere, makes you pretty impotent as a world leader.
He had to have known all these sort of sanctions were coming though. He seems okay with isolating Russia from the rest of the world. And between so much dependency on Russian oil, and Russia's quasi-alliance with China, he probably thinks he has cards to play in response to the sanctions.
I don't know man. I think he thought he'd be in and out in a day, and would have a pro-Russian regime running the show the second they were done.
I agree with this, but I don't think it's something that would cause him to backtrack or second-guess the invasion. In fact, I think it could make him go even more rouge and do something catastrophic.
Absolutely. But I don't think that means he saw this size of a global backlash coming. He's completely petulant, we know this - the Russian version of Trump if Trump had the authoritarian control of a thirst trap he was/is begging for. He's going to double down and dig his heels in, that's why I don't think absolute worst case scenario is off the table. If Vlad can fucking shoot himself up in Sputnik while the rest of the world burns so that he can come back down to Earth to rule over what's left he absolutely would. We can only hope that there is some seriously internal blacklash and coup/rebellion by the Russian people as a whole - and more importantly to those with a lot of money on the line.
He was on the phone with Macron for 90 minutes and Macron was telling him he's lying to himself lol. And Vlad doubled down that he's taking Ukraine lol. It's insane.
Yeah you might be right. In retrospect it seems obvious that such a backlash would come, but when he was planning this out, he probably thought "Who in the West is going to care about the Ukraine?"
But now, weren't the initial reports that he was going to try and take a section of Ukraine (similar to Crimea in 2014) rather than a complete takeover of the government? I think if he just did that, the backlash wouldn't be near what it is. Frankly, it'd probably be similar to 2014, with Biden's response being similar to Obama's. But invading from various entry points, trying to take the capital, calling for the assassination of the Ukrainian president.....it's become way bigger in scale than at least I expected.
Wonder how badly the sanctions are hurting Trump for him to come out so strongly against Russia. A sign of Putin truly losing all power is what I take it as, or at least what I hope. Trump is truly throwing Putin under the bus here (similar to other oligarchs distancing from Putin). What do you all make of it?
this is politically motivated. he knows this is his opportunity to undermine biden here, which is what he is doing.
"But they don't respect the United States and the United States is like, I don't know, they're not doing anything about it. This is a — this is a holocaust. This is a horrible thing that's happening. You're witnessing and you're seeing it on television every night."
I agree. I think everything he does is self-serving. He is not “Putin’s puppet”, but a puppet of his own selfishness. Really reminds me of the oligarchs supporting Putin in everything as long as they are making $.
On the bright side, maybe the red necks that fully support everything he states will now actively speak out against Russia too (even if it is just a low blow against Biden).
This week we learned from Bolton that he didn't know where Ukraine was located. And now from that quote, we learned he doesn't know what the Holocaust was. He thinks it's some sort of generic term for killing civilians or something. Maybe he thinks it's a synonym for "genocide". Either way, it's not what he thinks it is.
Yes, he is still an uneducated selfish dumbass, ha.
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
It would affect his ability to travel to international conferences for one, or internationally at all (outside of China and maybe a few other rogue states). It would also affect his ability to access his assets long term (or forever). It would also be a serious propaganda victory in Russia. Imagine if your leader is considered an international war criminal.
Makes sense. Don’t know how much he would care about any of that except for the assets.
Not being able to go to Davos, the UN, Olympics, anywhere, makes you pretty impotent as a world leader.
He had to have known all these sort of sanctions were coming though. He seems okay with isolating Russia from the rest of the world. And between so much dependency on Russian oil, and Russia's quasi-alliance with China, he probably thinks he has cards to play in response to the sanctions.
I don't know man. I think he thought he'd be in and out in a day, and would have a pro-Russian regime running the show the second they were done.
I agree with this, but I don't think it's something that would cause him to backtrack or second-guess the invasion. In fact, I think it could make him go even more rouge and do something catastrophic.
Absolutely. But I don't think that means he saw this size of a global backlash coming. He's completely petulant, we know this - the Russian version of Trump if Trump had the authoritarian control of a thirst trap he was/is begging for. He's going to double down and dig his heels in, that's why I don't think absolute worst case scenario is off the table. If Vlad can fucking shoot himself up in Sputnik while the rest of the world burns so that he can come back down to Earth to rule over what's left he absolutely would. We can only hope that there is some seriously internal blacklash and coup/rebellion by the Russian people as a whole - and more importantly to those with a lot of money on the line.
He was on the phone with Macron for 90 minutes and Macron was telling him he's lying to himself lol. And Vlad doubled down that he's taking Ukraine lol. It's insane.
Yeah you might be right. In retrospect it seems obvious that such a backlash would come, but when he was planning this out, he probably thought "Who in the West is going to care about the Ukraine?"
But now, weren't the initial reports that he was going to try and take a section of Ukraine (similar to Crimea in 2014) rather than a complete takeover of the government? I think if he just did that, the backlash wouldn't be near what it is. Frankly, it'd probably be similar to 2014, with Biden's response being similar to Obama's. But invading from various entry points, trying to take the capital, calling for the assassination of the Ukrainian president.....it's become way bigger in scale than at least I expected.
I mean he wanted to at least take Kharkiv and Donbas because he believes these are Russia sympathizers, like Crimea. But he also said he wanted to take Kyiv and install a Pro-Russian regime. And if you're saying you want to take the nation's capital I think you're basically saying you want to take the country.
The most underrated thing done here to push Putin into a bad spot - and I'm not trying to be a bootlicking party hack for the Dems here - was for Biden to pre-empt any of Putin's actions with showing the US's hand and detailing all of their intel. Because it made Putin pivot from this "oh we'll just do this real quickly ho hum no big deal" into some nonsensical speech he gave about unifying Russia because Ukraine is actually Russia, blah blah blah. And it turned out that Biden/the U.S. was absolutely right.
But the thing is, also, and absolutely the leading driving force here is the way Zelensky has played all of this. The man has turned into a fucking legend. There's no shot Putin takes Ukraine because even if Zelensky is decapitated he'll be martyred at that point. The dude will have a statue in the middle of Kyiv bigger than the Motherland Monument.
I keep hearing people and countries want to classify Russia and Putin as war criminals. But what is the point of that? Is it just a label? Would it give reason for more aide and support to Ukraine? Do they expect Outin to turn himself in? What would the realistic outcome be for doing that?
It seems like it would be just a label. But hoping it means more?
IN the short run, labeling Putin as a war criminal probably, like you say, only results in more support and aide, which is surely better than nothing. But I do wish it were more.
I think we really need to avoid implicating Russia as a country though. There is a huge number of Russian citizens who are against this war. Those people- though not nearly as victimized as Ukrainians- will also suffer. Imagine how horrible it must be for them right now knowing their country is going to become more isolated and hated and knowing their economy is shot to hell.
Possible consequence of sanctions, too, and I'm sure what Putin is hoping for - that the Russian citizenry as a whole buy into whatever propaganda is being spewed at them while sanctions are in place that it's actually the world's fault, and not Vlad's, for the current state of affairs in their country.
I'm sure it has been discussed, but why isn't Ukraine going on offense and attacking this dumb 40 mile Russian convoy? They've been stalled for three days or so? Ukraine has some aircrafts and drones, why aren't they using them now? This is really confusing to me.
I'm sure it has been discussed, but why isn't Ukraine going on offense and attacking this dumb 40 mile Russian convoy? They've been stalled for three days or so? Ukraine has some aircrafts and drones, why aren't they using them now? This is really confusing to me.
I watched a clip on CNN of the former deputy general of NATO talking to Christiane Amanpour and he expressed the same sentiment; he was confused what they were waiting for.
I'm sure it has been discussed, but why isn't Ukraine going on offense and attacking this dumb 40 mile Russian convoy? They've been stalled for three days or so? Ukraine has some aircrafts and drones, why aren't they using them now? This is really confusing to me.
I believe I saw something about this - Ukraine is preparing to go from a defensive position to an offensive one. I'll have to find the source. And is that convoy completely within Ukraine? Might be a matter of not crossing borders and/or some combination of not showing your hand, not trying to antagonize a larger amount of resources to show up.
I'm sure it has been discussed, but why isn't Ukraine going on offense and attacking this dumb 40 mile Russian convoy? They've been stalled for three days or so? Ukraine has some aircrafts and drones, why aren't they using them now? This is really confusing to me.
I watched a clip on CNN of the former deputy general of NATO talking to Christiane Amanpour and he expressed the same sentiment; he was confused what they were waiting for.
Maybe they expect the Russians to do an about-face as a result of all these crippling sanctions being thrown at them.
Obviously that's not the reason. But wouldn't it be ridiculous if it was actually was?
I'm sure it has been discussed, but why isn't Ukraine going on offense and attacking this dumb 40 mile Russian convoy? They've been stalled for three days or so? Ukraine has some aircrafts and drones, why aren't they using them now? This is really confusing to me.
I watched a clip on CNN of the former deputy general of NATO talking to Christiane Amanpour and he expressed the same sentiment; he was confused what they were waiting for.
Maybe they expect the Russians to do an about-face as a result of all these crippling sanctions being thrown at them.
Obviously that's not the reason. But wouldn't it be ridiculous if it was actually was?
It's really strange. I have seen military analysts say competent militaries never travel so closely like that because it makes them sitting ducks.
JP--its less than 20 miles from Kyiv, so I would assume it's all the way in Ukraine?
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Also, so far it hasn't seemed like any Russian soldiers have had the stomach to do so.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-calls-russia-invasion-of-ukraine-holocaust-big-shift-2022-3
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
"But they don't respect the United States and the United States is like, I don't know, they're not doing anything about it. This is a — this is a holocaust. This is a horrible thing that's happening. You're witnessing and you're seeing it on television every night."
www.headstonesband.com
He was on the phone with Macron for 90 minutes and Macron was telling him he's lying to himself lol. And Vlad doubled down that he's taking Ukraine lol. It's insane.
But now, weren't the initial reports that he was going to try and take a section of Ukraine (similar to Crimea in 2014) rather than a complete takeover of the government? I think if he just did that, the backlash wouldn't be near what it is. Frankly, it'd probably be similar to 2014, with Biden's response being similar to Obama's. But invading from various entry points, trying to take the capital, calling for the assassination of the Ukrainian president.....it's become way bigger in scale than at least I expected.
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
The most underrated thing done here to push Putin into a bad spot - and I'm not trying to be a bootlicking party hack for the Dems here - was for Biden to pre-empt any of Putin's actions with showing the US's hand and detailing all of their intel. Because it made Putin pivot from this "oh we'll just do this real quickly ho hum no big deal" into some nonsensical speech he gave about unifying Russia because Ukraine is actually Russia, blah blah blah. And it turned out that Biden/the U.S. was absolutely right.
But the thing is, also, and absolutely the leading driving force here is the way Zelensky has played all of this. The man has turned into a fucking legend. There's no shot Putin takes Ukraine because even if Zelensky is decapitated he'll be martyred at that point. The dude will have a statue in the middle of Kyiv bigger than the Motherland Monument.
www.headstonesband.com
Obviously that's not the reason. But wouldn't it be ridiculous if it was actually was?
Pearl Jam bootlegs:
http://wegotshit.blogspot.com
JP--its less than 20 miles from Kyiv, so I would assume it's all the way in Ukraine?