Ukraine
Comments
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What does international law say about maliciously invading a sovereign country?mrussel1 said:
It's a violation of international law to assassinate a head of state.static111 said:
Putin has lost his marbles. Can we just drone him?Spiritual_Chaos said:Scio me nihil scire
There are no kings inside the gates of eden0 -
That it's illegal, hence the sanctions and providing Ukraine with weapons. Russia violating international law doesn't give us the right to do so.static111 said:
What does international law say about maliciously invading a sovereign country?mrussel1 said:
It's a violation of international law to assassinate a head of state.static111 said:
Putin has lost his marbles. Can we just drone him?Spiritual_Chaos said:0 -
Do you really believe trump hasn’t talked to Putin about this very thing happening today? There’s no way they haven’t.HughFreakingDillon said:
k, this went from gern to jose to mace, all of which were discussing the possibility that trump had an active role in this, (or at the very least putin was doing this to get trump back in the WH) and then you responded. so I took that to mean you agreed with gern and jose.The Juggler said:
What? Where did I say he was part of a conspiracy? I'm just saying through Trumps words and actions it's ridiculous to think this could not have happened and been easier to do during the Trump admin....and him doing all the things I mentioned made it easier for Putin to do what he is doing today.HughFreakingDillon said:
trump being a fucking idiot and cozying up to someone who has total power over his people, something trump admires, is far from him being part of a conspiracy to allow putin to take over another country.The Juggler said:mace1229 said:
Of course we can’t be certain on hypotheticals. Just like I’m not certain if Trump was in office Putin would still invade. But I believe that to be true. No one can b certain of that either.josevolution said:
You can’t be certain of that! We don’t know how many talks Trumpolinni has had with Putin we just don’t know! Knowing all you know about our idiot ex-president would you put it past him? To do something as crazy as that?mace1229 said:
That’s also equally ridiculous. Purim’s actions aren’t Biden’s fault. And this isn’t a ploy to get Trump back. He’s power hungry and crazy.Gern Blansten said:Ridiculous to blame Biden for Putin's bullshit. If anything Putin is doing this to hurt Biden in hopes that puppetboy will get back in office.And to suggest Trump has been planning this with Putin seems even crazier than before. For one, Biden’s polls are so low why would be do this now, even if he was up for it?
Thats as crazy as any Qanon theory I’ve heard.
Did Putin help elect Trump?
Did Trump take Putin's side regarding Crimea?
Did Trump take Putin's side regarding interfering in our election?
Did Trump do whatever he could to weaken NATO at every turn?
Did Trump want to invite Russia back into the G7 as recently as 2 years ago?
Did Trump call Putin's absurd reasoning for invading Ukraine "genius"?
The answer is yes to all of the above but if you answered yes for even any of these questions, you'd see how your "hypothetical" scenario is yet another disingenuous argument on your behalf. If anything, it likely would've been easier for Putin to invade with Trump in office as Trump saw him as an ally instead of an adversary. And it makes even more sense for Putin to have Trump weaken NATO and divide the US further for four years. Putin was always going to invade Ukraine.
Stop watching Tucker Carlson.
a useful idiot? entirely possible. a conspiracy? not likely.
Useful idiot--entirely possible? I would say it's an absolute certainty after everything we've learned the last six years.jesus greets me looks just like me ....0 -
Putin wouldn't trust Trump with any info whatsover. All he gets is lies and flattery. And threats if they do have shit on Trump.josevolution said:
Do you really believe trump hasn’t talked to Putin about this very thing happening today? There’s no way they haven’t.HughFreakingDillon said:
k, this went from gern to jose to mace, all of which were discussing the possibility that trump had an active role in this, (or at the very least putin was doing this to get trump back in the WH) and then you responded. so I took that to mean you agreed with gern and jose.The Juggler said:
What? Where did I say he was part of a conspiracy? I'm just saying through Trumps words and actions it's ridiculous to think this could not have happened and been easier to do during the Trump admin....and him doing all the things I mentioned made it easier for Putin to do what he is doing today.HughFreakingDillon said:
trump being a fucking idiot and cozying up to someone who has total power over his people, something trump admires, is far from him being part of a conspiracy to allow putin to take over another country.The Juggler said:mace1229 said:
Of course we can’t be certain on hypotheticals. Just like I’m not certain if Trump was in office Putin would still invade. But I believe that to be true. No one can b certain of that either.josevolution said:
You can’t be certain of that! We don’t know how many talks Trumpolinni has had with Putin we just don’t know! Knowing all you know about our idiot ex-president would you put it past him? To do something as crazy as that?mace1229 said:
That’s also equally ridiculous. Purim’s actions aren’t Biden’s fault. And this isn’t a ploy to get Trump back. He’s power hungry and crazy.Gern Blansten said:Ridiculous to blame Biden for Putin's bullshit. If anything Putin is doing this to hurt Biden in hopes that puppetboy will get back in office.And to suggest Trump has been planning this with Putin seems even crazier than before. For one, Biden’s polls are so low why would be do this now, even if he was up for it?
Thats as crazy as any Qanon theory I’ve heard.
Did Putin help elect Trump?
Did Trump take Putin's side regarding Crimea?
Did Trump take Putin's side regarding interfering in our election?
Did Trump do whatever he could to weaken NATO at every turn?
Did Trump want to invite Russia back into the G7 as recently as 2 years ago?
Did Trump call Putin's absurd reasoning for invading Ukraine "genius"?
The answer is yes to all of the above but if you answered yes for even any of these questions, you'd see how your "hypothetical" scenario is yet another disingenuous argument on your behalf. If anything, it likely would've been easier for Putin to invade with Trump in office as Trump saw him as an ally instead of an adversary. And it makes even more sense for Putin to have Trump weaken NATO and divide the US further for four years. Putin was always going to invade Ukraine.
Stop watching Tucker Carlson.
a useful idiot? entirely possible. a conspiracy? not likely.
Useful idiot--entirely possible? I would say it's an absolute certainty after everything we've learned the last six years.Post edited by Spiritual_Chaos on"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0 -
you mean recently or when he was president? cuz trump recently said "I always knew putin wanted ukraine", so yeah, of course that conversation has occurred. but I don't think trump was actively encouraging him or advising him how to do so.josevolution said:
Do you really believe trump hasn’t talked to Putin about this very thing happening today? There’s no way they haven’t.HughFreakingDillon said:
k, this went from gern to jose to mace, all of which were discussing the possibility that trump had an active role in this, (or at the very least putin was doing this to get trump back in the WH) and then you responded. so I took that to mean you agreed with gern and jose.The Juggler said:
What? Where did I say he was part of a conspiracy? I'm just saying through Trumps words and actions it's ridiculous to think this could not have happened and been easier to do during the Trump admin....and him doing all the things I mentioned made it easier for Putin to do what he is doing today.HughFreakingDillon said:
trump being a fucking idiot and cozying up to someone who has total power over his people, something trump admires, is far from him being part of a conspiracy to allow putin to take over another country.The Juggler said:mace1229 said:
Of course we can’t be certain on hypotheticals. Just like I’m not certain if Trump was in office Putin would still invade. But I believe that to be true. No one can b certain of that either.josevolution said:
You can’t be certain of that! We don’t know how many talks Trumpolinni has had with Putin we just don’t know! Knowing all you know about our idiot ex-president would you put it past him? To do something as crazy as that?mace1229 said:
That’s also equally ridiculous. Purim’s actions aren’t Biden’s fault. And this isn’t a ploy to get Trump back. He’s power hungry and crazy.Gern Blansten said:Ridiculous to blame Biden for Putin's bullshit. If anything Putin is doing this to hurt Biden in hopes that puppetboy will get back in office.And to suggest Trump has been planning this with Putin seems even crazier than before. For one, Biden’s polls are so low why would be do this now, even if he was up for it?
Thats as crazy as any Qanon theory I’ve heard.
Did Putin help elect Trump?
Did Trump take Putin's side regarding Crimea?
Did Trump take Putin's side regarding interfering in our election?
Did Trump do whatever he could to weaken NATO at every turn?
Did Trump want to invite Russia back into the G7 as recently as 2 years ago?
Did Trump call Putin's absurd reasoning for invading Ukraine "genius"?
The answer is yes to all of the above but if you answered yes for even any of these questions, you'd see how your "hypothetical" scenario is yet another disingenuous argument on your behalf. If anything, it likely would've been easier for Putin to invade with Trump in office as Trump saw him as an ally instead of an adversary. And it makes even more sense for Putin to have Trump weaken NATO and divide the US further for four years. Putin was always going to invade Ukraine.
Stop watching Tucker Carlson.
a useful idiot? entirely possible. a conspiracy? not likely.
Useful idiot--entirely possible? I would say it's an absolute certainty after everything we've learned the last six years.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
Hey, so you guys wanna talk about Trump take it to the appropriate spot. Also, if you cannot comprehend that Trump being in office, instead of Biden, would be a benefit to Putin then I don't know what to tell you.
I think it's time to turn talk here to the title of the thread. This is fucking depressing.0 -
Gee, I wonder why?bootlegger10 said:
I would rather we have influence to stop a war rather than to predict one. We don’t have influence anymore.MayDay10 said:I think our administration/intelligence played this one as well as they could have played it. They loudly and accurately called out every Russian move and bullshit before it happened. Were proven right every time. As a result, Putin's attempt at PR and any chance of any flimsy justification of this has been shot to shit.09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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trump is kind of integral piece of this puzzle, so I think it's relevant.
I don't think anyone is denying putin benefits from trump being in office. I just don't think he'd go to war to accomplish that.By The Time They Figure Out What Went Wrong, We'll Be Sitting On A Beach, Earning Twenty Percent.0 -
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No doubt will do!So here is Putin basically stating he’s ready to use all options against anyone interfering! Screw himjesus greets me looks just like me ....0
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So my first instinct with all this is to say that NATO's response needs to be aggressive and tough. I'm a bit surprised the allies haven't threatened military action. As someone else mentioned... sanctions aren't going to do squat. Putin has already invaded Ukraine. Full stop.
That said... and I'm no genius... it seems like Russia and Trump/Fox News wants America engaged in this war. Putin continues to ignore the west and Biden and Fox seems hell bent on painting Biden as 'weak' almost daring him to do something more. And if that's the case... I'm left wondering why and also realizing that it may be the reason allies have not engaged with military force yet.
If I'm somewhat correct, would any of you have a reason as to why Russia wants full scale war with the west?Toronto 2000
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If we are engaged with a rule breaking lunatic the fastest way to end the conflict is to break the rules.I don't think history or the international community will look unfavorably on something like that. If this turns into a protracted conflict and we (US Military) don't put boots on the ground, well then we may as well just give the guy Ukraine. Once he has been emboldened by taking Ukraine where will he stop? I mean what do we do, go into WWIII because we can't assassinate one lunatic? I am pretty sure he doesn't give a shit about sanctions at this point. It sounds like they are trying to take Chernobyl and potentially destabilize it which would likely spread nuclear material all over again. Is there a line that he crosses that will invite a swift and decisive move that would end this quickly?mrussel1 said:
That it's illegal, hence the sanctions and providing Ukraine with weapons. Russia violating international law doesn't give us the right to do so.static111 said:
What does international law say about maliciously invading a sovereign country?mrussel1 said:
It's a violation of international law to assassinate a head of state.static111 said:
Putin has lost his marbles. Can we just drone him?Spiritual_Chaos said:Scio me nihil scire
There are no kings inside the gates of eden0 -
His tactic seems to be working.josevolution said:No doubt will do!So here is Putin basically stating he’s ready to use all options against anyone interfering! Screw him
If he would have used "and if you interfere, I will decide to spare my men, because I don't want blood on my hands and the tanks will roll back to Moscow" that would be kind of stupid in relations to his plan."Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"0 -
Seems like a good time to invade MoscowRemember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
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2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
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This is the scariest part. How far is this guy willing to push this? Why now?static111 said:
If we are engaged with a rule breaking lunatic the fastest way to end the conflict is to break the rules.I don't think history or the international community will look unfavorably on something like that. If this turns into a protracted conflict and we (US Military) don't put boots on the ground, well then we may as well just give the guy Ukraine. Once he has been emboldened by taking Ukraine where will he stop? I mean what do we do, go into WWIII because we can't assassinate one lunatic? I am pretty sure he doesn't give a shit about sanctions at this point. It sounds like they are trying to take Chernobyl and potentially destabilize it which would likely spread nuclear material all over again. Is there a line that he crosses that will invite a swift and decisive move that would end this quickly?mrussel1 said:
That it's illegal, hence the sanctions and providing Ukraine with weapons. Russia violating international law doesn't give us the right to do so.static111 said:
What does international law say about maliciously invading a sovereign country?mrussel1 said:
It's a violation of international law to assassinate a head of state.static111 said:
Putin has lost his marbles. Can we just drone him?Spiritual_Chaos said:
He is going to bankrupt his country even further.Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)
The Golden Age is 2 months away. And guess what….. you’re gonna love it! (teskeinc 11.19.24)
1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
2013: London ON, Wrigley; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
2020: Oakland, Oakland: 2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana; 2025: Pitt1, Pitt20 -
I don't entirely disagree with you.. to be honest I don't know enough of the inner workings of Russia... however... killing Putin sounds great.. but the blow back from that could be equally catastrophic. People loyal to Putin will condemn the west even more and make Putin a martyr.static111 said:
If we are engaged with a rule breaking lunatic the fastest way to end the conflict is to break the rules.I don't think history or the international community will look unfavorably on something like that. If this turns into a protracted conflict and we (US Military) don't put boots on the ground, well then we may as well just give the guy Ukraine. Once he has been emboldened by taking Ukraine where will he stop? I mean what do we do, go into WWIII because we can't assassinate one lunatic? I am pretty sure he doesn't give a shit about sanctions at this point. It sounds like they are trying to take Chernobyl and potentially destabilize it which would likely spread nuclear material all over again. Is there a line that he crosses that will invite a swift and decisive move that would end this quickly?mrussel1 said:
That it's illegal, hence the sanctions and providing Ukraine with weapons. Russia violating international law doesn't give us the right to do so.static111 said:
What does international law say about maliciously invading a sovereign country?mrussel1 said:
It's a violation of international law to assassinate a head of state.static111 said:
Putin has lost his marbles. Can we just drone him?Spiritual_Chaos said:Toronto 2000
Buffalo, Phoenix, Toronto 2003
Boston I&II 2004
Kitchener, Hamilton, London, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto 2005
Toronto I&II, Las Vegas 2006
Chicago Lollapalooza 2007
Toronto, Seattle I&II, Vancouver, Philly I,II,III,IV 2009
Cleveland, Buffalo 2010
Toronto I&II 2011
Buffalo 2013
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The line is invading a NATO country. Unfortunately for Ukraine, they aren't in NATO. I think the greater fear is that Putin does not want to stop here and will, eventually, try to push further west into NATO countries. But I don't see how any of this ends quickly.static111 said:
If we are engaged with a rule breaking lunatic the fastest way to end the conflict is to break the rules.I don't think history or the international community will look unfavorably on something like that. If this turns into a protracted conflict and we (US Military) don't put boots on the ground, well then we may as well just give the guy Ukraine. Once he has been emboldened by taking Ukraine where will he stop? I mean what do we do, go into WWIII because we can't assassinate one lunatic? I am pretty sure he doesn't give a shit about sanctions at this point. It sounds like they are trying to take Chernobyl and potentially destabilize it which would likely spread nuclear material all over again. Is there a line that he crosses that will invite a swift and decisive move that would end this quickly?mrussel1 said:
That it's illegal, hence the sanctions and providing Ukraine with weapons. Russia violating international law doesn't give us the right to do so.static111 said:
What does international law say about maliciously invading a sovereign country?mrussel1 said:
It's a violation of international law to assassinate a head of state.static111 said:
Putin has lost his marbles. Can we just drone him?Spiritual_Chaos said:Post edited by The Juggler onwww.myspace.com0 -
Or Hillary. It’ll be years before we fully realize the damage POOTWH did to this nation with all of his brilliant brilliance of brilliancy 4D chess playing.Jearlpam0925 said:Hey, so you guys wanna talk about Trump take it to the appropriate spot. Also, if you cannot comprehend that Trump being in office, instead of Biden, would be a benefit to Putin then I don't know what to tell you.
I think it's time to turn talk here to the title of the thread. This is fucking depressing.09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN; 05/04/2024 & 05/06/2024, Vancouver, BC; 05/10/2024, Portland, OR;
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Outside of completely dropping the hammer - which should definitely not be ruled out here - they just have to make haste with making Russia an isolated country.The Juggler said:
The line is invading a NATO country. Unfortunately for Ukraine, they aren't in NATO. I think the greater fear is that Putin does not want to stop here and will, eventually, try to push further west into NATO countries. But I don't see how any of this ends quickly.static111 said:
If we are engaged with a rule breaking lunatic the fastest way to end the conflict is to break the rules.I don't think history or the international community will look unfavorably on something like that. If this turns into a protracted conflict and we (US Military) don't put boots on the ground, well then we may as well just give the guy Ukraine. Once he has been emboldened by taking Ukraine where will he stop? I mean what do we do, go into WWIII because we can't assassinate one lunatic? I am pretty sure he doesn't give a shit about sanctions at this point. It sounds like they are trying to take Chernobyl and potentially destabilize it which would likely spread nuclear material all over again. Is there a line that he crosses that will invite a swift and decisive move that would end this quickly?mrussel1 said:
That it's illegal, hence the sanctions and providing Ukraine with weapons. Russia violating international law doesn't give us the right to do so.static111 said:
What does international law say about maliciously invading a sovereign country?mrussel1 said:
It's a violation of international law to assassinate a head of state.static111 said:
Putin has lost his marbles. Can we just drone him?Spiritual_Chaos said:0 -
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