Ed and God

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  • slightofjeff
    slightofjeff Posts: 7,762
    grazman wrote:
    wasnt Given To Fly written about Mike anyway..........i could be wrong........probably am wrong............taxi for grazman!

    It was written by Mike (musically) ... but I don't see how it could be ABOUT Mike ;)
    everybody wants the most they can possibly get
    for the least they could possibly do
  • vedderfan10
    vedderfan10 Posts: 2,497
    Yeah...I updated my post to include the SoG...please no geography lesson...please no...

    You know, first time I heard GTF I was neither into god/jesus or surfing, but I had a strong feeling it was about surfing and the zen of surfing and how when you're out on the water, the power of the ocean and the respect it deserves, wow...Now that I've spent some time on my own surfboard (although not actually surfing), being on the ocean really changes your perspective on things. I really do believe that the song is pretty straight forward about surfing...that and Ed surfing on the roof of the sound booth at the Gorge (2006) when he sang the song...

    Someone bitchy at work?- no big deal, I can go surfing when I get home and forget all about you...
    Whiny and angry neighbour? Whatever, I can go surfing and forget all about you...
    Annoying threads about Ed vs Jesus? Surfing, man! Wax it up!
    be philanthropic
  • grazman
    grazman Posts: 198
    slightofjeff wrote:
    It was written by Mike (musically) ... but I don't see how it could be ABOUT Mike ;)

    awww right! i'll get my coat!
    It's Evolution, Baby!
  • slightofjeff
    slightofjeff Posts: 7,762
    Vedderfan10 wrote:
    Yeah...I updated my post to include the SoG...please no geography lesson...please no...

    You know, first time I heard GTF I was neither into god/jesus or surfing, but I had a strong feeling it was about surfing and the zen of surfing and how when you're out on the water, the power of the ocean and the respect it deserves, wow...Now that I've spent some time on my own surfboard (although not actually surfing), being on the ocean really changes your perspective on things. I really do believe that the song is pretty straight forward about surfing...that and Ed surfing on the roof of the sound booth at the Gorge (2006) when he sang the song...

    Someone bitchy at work?- no big deal, I can go surfing when I get home and forget all about you...
    Whiny and angry neighbour? Whatever, I can go surfing and forget all about you...
    Annoying threads about Ed vs Jesus? Surfing, man! Wax it up!

    Hey, if it works for you ... I just don't know how you reconcile a "straightforward song about surfing" with lyrics about people getting stripped and stabbed.

    Maybe you do your surfing in rougher neighborhoods than most people ;)
    everybody wants the most they can possibly get
    for the least they could possibly do
  • vedderfan10
    vedderfan10 Posts: 2,497
    ... Stripped and stabbed - falling on the reefs, territorial surfers (they can be mean!). Despite getting knocked about by the tide and the currents, etc, he was still able to stand on the board and surf , even if the strong undertow ripped off his shorts - "Look at me now!" (what? that's never happened to you?)

    However, I will not deny that there's a whole whack of spirituality in being on the water...but spirituality does not necessarily have to do with religion.
    be philanthropic
  • slightofjeff
    slightofjeff Posts: 7,762
    Vedderfan10 wrote:
    ... Stripped and stabbed - falling on the reefs, territorial surfers (they can be mean!).

    I'm imagining some sort of "West Side Story" -- but on surfboards!
    everybody wants the most they can possibly get
    for the least they could possibly do
  • epierce3
    epierce3 Posts: 77
    How do you know there is a god?
    United Center Chicago: 05.16.06, 05.17.06
    Vic Theater Chicago: 08.02.07
    Lollapalooza 2007: 08.05.07
    Auditorium Theater Chicago (EV Solo): 08.22.08
    United Center Chicago: 08.23.09
  • Wilds
    Wilds Posts: 4,329
    epierce3 wrote:
    How do you know there is a god?

    Ok. I'll play Devils Advocate.


    Because the Bible tells them so.
  • epierce3
    epierce3 Posts: 77
    Wilds wrote:
    Ok. I'll play Devils Advocate.


    Because the Bible tells them so.
    Haha too easy. Also you went to the VH1 Who Show? Holy crap I missed it on TV and I'm kicking myself, was it as amazing as it should have been?
    United Center Chicago: 05.16.06, 05.17.06
    Vic Theater Chicago: 08.02.07
    Lollapalooza 2007: 08.05.07
    Auditorium Theater Chicago (EV Solo): 08.22.08
    United Center Chicago: 08.23.09
  • slightofjeff
    slightofjeff Posts: 7,762
    epierce3 wrote:
    Haha too easy. Also you went to the VH1 Who Show? Holy crap I missed it on TV and I'm kicking myself, was it as amazing as it should have been?

    You didn't miss anything on TV. It airs tomorrow night.
    everybody wants the most they can possibly get
    for the least they could possibly do
  • Wilds
    Wilds Posts: 4,329
    epierce3 wrote:
    Haha too easy. Also you went to the VH1 Who Show? Holy crap I missed it on TV and I'm kicking myself, was it as amazing as it should have been?


    Show was awesome..... Ok how about "Because I have faith". Is that better?
  • epierce3
    epierce3 Posts: 77
    Wilds wrote:
    Show was awesome..... Ok how about "Because I have faith". Is that better?
    Nice, glad I didn't miss it, I'll Tivo it now, glad to hear it rocked, I saw an ad for it in Rolling Stone and I've been really excited for it ever since.

    The faith argument is worse! I want proof!
    United Center Chicago: 05.16.06, 05.17.06
    Vic Theater Chicago: 08.02.07
    Lollapalooza 2007: 08.05.07
    Auditorium Theater Chicago (EV Solo): 08.22.08
    United Center Chicago: 08.23.09
  • slightofjeff
    slightofjeff Posts: 7,762
    Wilds wrote:
    Show was awesome..... Ok how about "Because I have faith". Is that better?

    Was it a Who show? Or a George Michael show?
    everybody wants the most they can possibly get
    for the least they could possibly do
  • Wilds
    Wilds Posts: 4,329
    epierce3 wrote:
    Nice, glad I didn't miss it, I'll Tivo it now, glad to hear it rocked, I saw an ad for it in Rolling Stone and I've been really excited for it ever since.

    The faith argument is worse! I want proof!

    Ok you win. There is no God. On behalf of Organized Religion I would like to apologize for these many centuries of Exaggerated Fairy Tales.



    "Faith, Faith, Faith.... Baby" lol.
  • epierce3
    epierce3 Posts: 77
    Wilds wrote:
    Ok you win. There is no God. On behalf of Organized Religion I would like to apologize for these many centuries of Exaggerated Fairy Tales.
    Apology accepted :p
    United Center Chicago: 05.16.06, 05.17.06
    Vic Theater Chicago: 08.02.07
    Lollapalooza 2007: 08.05.07
    Auditorium Theater Chicago (EV Solo): 08.22.08
    United Center Chicago: 08.23.09
  • supersonicyears
    supersonicyears Posts: 2,619
    epierce3 wrote:
    How do you know there is a god?

    Because there is no way that man and the universe could have come from nothing. We had to have a Creator. I can't imagine going through life thinking there is nothing guiding you. We all have this journey and lessons to learn so that we are ready for the next life. It doesn't make sense that when you die your spirit would just die with your outer shell. There have been people who have set out to prove there is no God and have come back as believers. If you pray you'll see there is a God
    "In the age of darkness
    want to be enlightened"
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    Vedderfan10 wrote:
    Yeah...I updated my post to include the SoG...please no geography lesson...please no...

    You know, first time I heard GTF I was neither into god/jesus or surfing, but I had a strong feeling it was about surfing and the zen of surfing and how when you're out on the water, the power of the ocean and the respect it deserves, wow...Now that I've spent some time on my own surfboard (although not actually surfing), being on the ocean really changes your perspective on things. I really do believe that the song is pretty straight forward about surfing...that and Ed surfing on the roof of the sound booth at the Gorge (2006) when he sang the song...

    Someone bitchy at work?- no big deal, I can go surfing when I get home and forget all about you...
    Whiny and angry neighbour? Whatever, I can go surfing and forget all about you...
    Annoying threads about Ed vs Jesus? Surfing, man! Wax it up!

    at eight in the morning its foggy and cold
    you drag yourself into the ocean and you cant even see the waves through the fog
    the still water is like glass
    it's a good time to think

    :)
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • timsinclair
    timsinclair Posts: 222
    Whether about surfing or not GTF is not a 'straightforward' song, It clearly has more than one theme running through it. Your suggestion that 'first he was stripped, then he was stabbed' refers to 'falling on the reefs' seems a bit silly. I could see how reefs could stab you but how would they strip you? even worse how would they strip you first, then stab you? The lyric is clear on this point 'first he was stripped, then he was stabbed by faceless MEN!!' I would also like to know how your surfer gives away his 'love that is saved' and wants to share the 'key to the locks on the chains he saw everywhere'.
  • catefrances
    catefrances Posts: 29,003
    timsinclair wrote:
    Whether about surfing or not GTF is not a 'straightforward' song, It clearly has more than one theme running through it. Your suggestion that 'first he was stripped, then he was stabbed' refers to 'falling on the reefs' seems a bit silly. I could see how reefs could stab you but how would they strip you? even worse how would they strip you first, then stab you? The lyric is clear on this point 'first he was stripped, then he was stabbed by faceless MEN!!' I would also like to know how your surfer gives away his 'love that is saved' and wants to share the 'key to the locks on the chains he saw everywhere'.

    my take on this is that he was stripped of his privacy and stabbed by the violation of that act. those faceless men - the media & others... FUCKERS!!!
    not to mention that is where he knows nothing else matters. it comes down to him and the ocean. the ocean is his place of thought, reflection and solitude. surfing as an analogy. :)

    personally i always find myself in the ocean. its like im going home.
    hear my name
    take a good look
    this could be the day
    hold my hand
    lie beside me
    i just need to say
  • timsinclair
    timsinclair Posts: 222
    Your post about intelligent Design being 'not science' serves to illustrate Philip Johnson's argument. Your statement is based on the popular definition of science that hold that only naturalistic explanations of the world are scientific. If only naturalistic explanations count as science then Darwinism wins by default because it automatically rules out its only rival (creation by an intelligent designer). If this definition of science is true then Einstein, Newton, and pretty much all the great scientists of history are 'not scientists' as they believed that God is the cause of the universe. When naturalism became the dominant philosophy in science, people thought that the cell was little more than a glob of jelly. They had no idea of the staggering complexity that we now observe inside the cell, the DNA molecule, for example has been called 'the most efficient information bearing system in the universe'. It is time design was back on the table, and it is, but the Darwinian establishment is petrified so they just keep telling everyone that ID is 'not science' hoping that this will be enough to stop anyone considering the arguments. Anyone who has read any of the books published by ID scientists (such as prof Behe's Darwin's Black Box) will know that the arguments are scientific ones, not religious ones as is claimed. I know that ID lost in the Dover trial because the Judge claimed that ID is 'not science' but dont let science be defined by a judge. The biggest mistake we can make is to let something be defined by its critics, if you want to make an informed choice read an ID book and judge for yourself. Science should be a search for truth, wherein, when considering an unobservable event like the beggining of life or the universe, all possible explanations are considered. As the great philosopher Alvin Plantinger said after the Dover ruling:

    ‘If you exclude the supernatural from science, then if the world, or some phenomena within it are supernaturally caused – as most of the worlds people believe – you wont be able to reach that conclusion scientifically. Observing methodological naturalism thus hamstrings science by precluding science from reaching what would be an enormously important truth about the world. It might be that, just as a result of this constraint, even the best science in the long run will wind up with false conclusions.

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