Viruses / Vaccines 2

Spunkie

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

Meltdown99 said:

Canada's public health doc is projecting 100 to 250 thousand daily cases in the coming weeks.  Looks like the vaccine us not working.  No way Canada has that many unvaccinated.   

The data is pretty locked in now, that the original vaccines don’t really help against this variant.  The booster does, but at some 50 to 80% clip, much lower than against the strains for which it was designed.  

You mean the vaccines don't really help that much in catching the virus. But they still help in preventing more serious illness. 

That's an important distinction. I know you understand this but just putting it out there for some who don't.

This is the graph BC used this week to help people understand this point with a visualization.

lastexitlondon

I still think  we can all help ourselves  No matter  what variant  comes  along
 Loose weight.  Take vitamin d3 especially  during  winter  months and do some form of excersise.  Keep as well as you  can and it does  help with many things.  Constant  jabs isnt the  answer. I agree like flu a jab . But we wont beat this by having boosters 3,4, 5  its not the  answer we can see this.  So many people  have had  2 and 3  still its rampant but health  is key.  Work on yourself as much as you can.

Gern Blansten

lastexitlondon said:

I still think  we can all help ourselves  No matter  what variant  comes  along
 Loose weight.  Take vitamin d3 especially  during  winter  months and do some form of excersise.  Keep as well as you  can and it does  help with many things.  Constant  jabs isnt the  answer. I agree like flu a jab . But we wont beat this by having boosters 3,4, 5  its not the  answer we can see this.  So many people  have had  2 and 3  still its rampant but health  is key.  Work on yourself as much as you can.

I don't understand this response. The jabs do work by keeping people from getting seriously ill.  The data proves this.

Constant jabs are very likely the answer until there is a better solution.

Spunkie

cincybearcat said:

Meltdown99 said:

Canada's public health doc is projecting 100 to 250 thousand daily cases in the coming weeks.  Looks like the vaccine us not working.  No way Canada has that many unvaccinated.   

what the % of vaccinated hospitalized? 

This is the slide where the forecast came from and has the answer if you're incline to do a little math.

lastexitlondon

Ive had 3 so im not anti anything im npt having  another.   But we cant just rely on vaccines the worst outcomes  are clearly co morbidities  so we can do something  ourselves  in the meantime  is all i mean.  Move more. Eat well and take vitamins instead  of don't.  It will help your  outcome  . Because  we are all getting  this no matter how many jabs we have. I do know  vaccines work but we are going  in somewhat blind as its  a totally  unique  situation.  Health is key 
 And we can all do more if we are honest

Spunkie

Let's not forget that age is the greatest factor in a negative outcome.



Stop getting old, people.

Spunkie

tish said:

Let's not forget that age is the greatest factor in a negative outcome.



Stop getting old, people.

Edit: Although recent data is showing those 4 and under are getting hit hard too, right now.

lastexitlondon

tish said:

tish said:

Let's not forget that age is the greatest factor in a negative outcome.



Stop getting old, people.

Edit: Although recent data is showing those 4 and under are getting hit hard too, right now.

That is horrible.  I have a 4 year old and its  fucking eating  me alive 

Gern Blansten

lastexitlondon said:

Ive had 3 so im not anti anything im npt having  another.   But we cant just rely on vaccines the worst outcomes  are clearly co morbidities  so we can do something  ourselves  in the meantime  is all i mean.  Move more. Eat well and take vitamins instead  of don't.  It will help your  outcome  . Because  we are all getting  this no matter how many jabs we have. I do know  vaccines work but we are going  in somewhat blind as its  a totally  unique  situation.  Health is key 
 And we can all do more if we are honest

We can just rely on vaccines....just like we just rely on vaccines for many other diseases that we have all been vaccinated for (measles, mumps, rubella, polio, etc.)

lastexitlondon

I hope one day we can all look back and say wow we lived through the pandemic  with a glance in the rearview mirror 

lastexitlondon

Gern Blansten said:

lastexitlondon said:

Ive had 3 so im not anti anything im npt having  another.   But we cant just rely on vaccines the worst outcomes  are clearly co morbidities  so we can do something  ourselves  in the meantime  is all i mean.  Move more. Eat well and take vitamins instead  of don't.  It will help your  outcome  . Because  we are all getting  this no matter how many jabs we have. I do know  vaccines work but we are going  in somewhat blind as its  a totally  unique  situation.  Health is key 
 And we can all do more if we are honest

We can just rely on vaccines....just like we just rely on vaccines for many other diseases that we have all been vaccinated for (measles, mumps, rubella, polio, etc.)

Those  diseases  don't  discriminate.  But this one has clear markers for bad outcomes.  Age yes.  And co morbidities  and all i am saying  is take responsibility  also for those. It can be done by  each one of us
 Nothing  more to see or read into

Gern Blansten

lastexitlondon said:

Gern Blansten said:

lastexitlondon said:

Ive had 3 so im not anti anything im npt having  another.   But we cant just rely on vaccines the worst outcomes  are clearly co morbidities  so we can do something  ourselves  in the meantime  is all i mean.  Move more. Eat well and take vitamins instead  of don't.  It will help your  outcome  . Because  we are all getting  this no matter how many jabs we have. I do know  vaccines work but we are going  in somewhat blind as its  a totally  unique  situation.  Health is key 
 And we can all do more if we are honest

We can just rely on vaccines....just like we just rely on vaccines for many other diseases that we have all been vaccinated for (measles, mumps, rubella, polio, etc.)

Those  diseases  don't  discriminate.  But this one has clear markers for bad outcomes.  Age yes.  And co morbidities  and all i am saying  is take responsibility  also for those. It can be done by  each one of us
 Nothing  more to see or read into

I'm guessing they do discriminate....but there probably aren't many studies about that since we have all been vaccinated against them

Meltdown99

If those projections for Canada are even remotely accurate the health care system will collapse...according to some it's on the brink of collapse now...

mickeyrat

mrussel1 said:

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

Meltdown99 said:

Canada's public health doc is projecting 100 to 250 thousand daily cases in the coming weeks.  Looks like the vaccine us not working.  No way Canada has that many unvaccinated.   

The data is pretty locked in now, that the original vaccines don’t really help against this variant.  The booster does, but at some 50 to 80% clip, much lower than against the strains for which it was designed.  

You mean the vaccines don't really help that much in catching the virus. But they still help in preventing more serious illness. 

That's an important distinction. I know you understand this but just putting it out there for some who don't.

Yes absolutely. It's less effective against prevention,  highly effective against severe disease.  

It does bring up an interesting debate on the OSHA mandate though.  When it was 90+% effective at prevention,  then I was a heavy advocate for the mandate.  If it is not effective at prevention,  does it get closer to personal at that point vs public health?  In other words if it's not stopping spread does the federal govt have a right or interest in mandating it? People who refuse the vax may have severe disease and death,  but that outcome is not communicable.  

Now some may bring up seat belts or helmet laws, there is a difference.  Those went through legislative processes.  The SCOTUS did not rule that vax mandates were not constitutional, rather whether the OHS could unilaterally require. 

should I as a fully vaxxed and boostered employee who wears a mask when appropriate at work, be forced to burn pto then unscheduled vacation while being forced off for contact from the individualist coworkers who thinks this is all bullshit? doesnt distance, mask up etc?

imo I should be paid and not using my time for policy decisions in the company.  who claims to follow cdc guidelines BUT relies on the employee to adhere with no oversight or consequence....

Meltdown99

Repeated Covid boosters not viable strategy against new variants, WHO experts warn | Coronavirus | The Guardian

mrussel1

mickeyrat said:

mrussel1 said:

dignin said:

mrussel1 said:

Meltdown99 said:

Canada's public health doc is projecting 100 to 250 thousand daily cases in the coming weeks.  Looks like the vaccine us not working.  No way Canada has that many unvaccinated.   

The data is pretty locked in now, that the original vaccines don’t really help against this variant.  The booster does, but at some 50 to 80% clip, much lower than against the strains for which it was designed.  

You mean the vaccines don't really help that much in catching the virus. But they still help in preventing more serious illness. 

That's an important distinction. I know you understand this but just putting it out there for some who don't.

Yes absolutely. It's less effective against prevention,  highly effective against severe disease.  

It does bring up an interesting debate on the OSHA mandate though.  When it was 90+% effective at prevention,  then I was a heavy advocate for the mandate.  If it is not effective at prevention,  does it get closer to personal at that point vs public health?  In other words if it's not stopping spread does the federal govt have a right or interest in mandating it? People who refuse the vax may have severe disease and death,  but that outcome is not communicable.  

Now some may bring up seat belts or helmet laws, there is a difference.  Those went through legislative processes.  The SCOTUS did not rule that vax mandates were not constitutional, rather whether the OHS could unilaterally require. 

should I as a fully vaxxed and boostered employee who wears a mask when appropriate at work, be forced to burn pto then unscheduled vacation while being forced off for contact from the individualist coworkers who thinks this is all bullshit? doesnt distance, mask up etc?

imo I should be paid and not using my time for policy decisions in the company.  who claims to follow cdc guidelines BUT relies on the employee to adhere with no oversight or consequence....

I understand but the question is does that PTO risk rise to the level where the OSHA should write the mandate rather than either your employer or your state/ federal legislature. 

mickeyrat

these health orgs need to stop with the fucking speculation. seriously.  people will readily overlook key words like may, might, could etc......

come with something closer to definitive or shut the fuck up.

Meltdown99

Pfizer CEO says Omicron-targeted COVID-19 vaccine is likely | CTV News

The updated version may be available in March, by then omicron may sweep on threw leaving chaos only to see the Russian variant emerge...even more contagious and evade the vaccine...we may never catch up to this virus, or it may be years more...hope someone is working on a plan B...

and we will call the Russian variant putincron.

mrussel1

mickeyrat said:

these health orgs need to stop with the fucking speculation. seriously.  people will readily overlook key words like may, might, could etc......

come with something closer to definitive or shut the fuck up.

For those of us that can read,  I'd prefer to get "may" vs nothing at all.  Some people can actually do nuance and see gray. 

lastexitlondon

Gern Blansten said:

lastexitlondon said:

Gern Blansten said:

lastexitlondon said:

Ive had 3 so im not anti anything im npt having  another.   But we cant just rely on vaccines the worst outcomes  are clearly co morbidities  so we can do something  ourselves  in the meantime  is all i mean.  Move more. Eat well and take vitamins instead  of don't.  It will help your  outcome  . Because  we are all getting  this no matter how many jabs we have. I do know  vaccines work but we are going  in somewhat blind as its  a totally  unique  situation.  Health is key 
 And we can all do more if we are honest

We can just rely on vaccines....just like we just rely on vaccines for many other diseases that we have all been vaccinated for (measles, mumps, rubella, polio, etc.)

Those  diseases  don't  discriminate.  But this one has clear markers for bad outcomes.  Age yes.  And co morbidities  and all i am saying  is take responsibility  also for those. It can be done by  each one of us
 Nothing  more to see or read into

I'm guessing they do discriminate....but there probably aren't many studies about that since we have all been vaccinated against them

You are guessing? Not good

lastexitlondon

Polio killed and maimed any age or co morbidities  or none. Before  a vaccine  came.ask any  dr.  If you keep the best health  possible  when a virus comes  your  body has its best chance to fight. With a vaccine  also

brianlux

tish said:

Let's not forget that age is the greatest factor in a negative outcome.



Stop getting old, people.

Oops!  Too late. 

Gern Blansten

lastexitlondon said:

Polio killed and maimed any age or co morbidities  or none. Before  a vaccine  came.ask any  dr.  If you keep the best health  possible  when a virus comes  your  body has its best chance to fight. With a vaccine  also

you sure....pretty sure it hit young children the hardest

Gern Blansten

lastexitlondon said:

Gern Blansten said:

lastexitlondon said:

Gern Blansten said:

lastexitlondon said:

Ive had 3 so im not anti anything im npt having  another.   But we cant just rely on vaccines the worst outcomes  are clearly co morbidities  so we can do something  ourselves  in the meantime  is all i mean.  Move more. Eat well and take vitamins instead  of don't.  It will help your  outcome  . Because  we are all getting  this no matter how many jabs we have. I do know  vaccines work but we are going  in somewhat blind as its  a totally  unique  situation.  Health is key 
 And we can all do more if we are honest

We can just rely on vaccines....just like we just rely on vaccines for many other diseases that we have all been vaccinated for (measles, mumps, rubella, polio, etc.)

Those  diseases  don't  discriminate.  But this one has clear markers for bad outcomes.  Age yes.  And co morbidities  and all i am saying  is take responsibility  also for those. It can be done by  each one of us
 Nothing  more to see or read into

I'm guessing they do discriminate....but there probably aren't many studies about that since we have all been vaccinated against them

You are guessing? Not good

whether I'm guessing or not doesn't mean shit...the vast majority of us have been vaxxed against those and we don't have to worry it.

I mean clearly the measles would affect someone who is 90 much differently than someone who is 15

Meltdown99

brianlux said:

tish said:

Let's not forget that age is the greatest factor in a negative outcome.



Stop getting old, people.

Oops!  Too late. 

They've yet to cure old age, unfortunately.  So I will leave you with what everyone says when they are getting old "you are only as old as you feel."  lol.  I know it doesn't make me feel any better...

brianlux

Meltdown99 said:

brianlux said:

tish said:

Let's not forget that age is the greatest factor in a negative outcome.



Stop getting old, people.

Oops!  Too late. 

They've yet to cure old age, unfortunately.  So I will leave you with what everyone says when they are getting old "you are only as old as you feel."  lol.  I know it doesn't make me feel any better...

If that is true, I am a LOT older in the morning than I am in the afternoon and into the evening. 

mickeyrat

mrussel1 said:

mickeyrat said:

these health orgs need to stop with the fucking speculation. seriously.  people will readily overlook key words like may, might, could etc......

come with something closer to definitive or shut the fuck up.

For those of us that can read,  I'd prefer to get "may" vs nothing at all.  Some people can actually do nuance and see gray. 

not enough do imo. willfull or naturally ignorant and easily led by the nose....

of course soundbite news gathering and just read the gotcha headlines don't help

mrussel1

mickeyrat said:

mrussel1 said:

mickeyrat said:

these health orgs need to stop with the fucking speculation. seriously.  people will readily overlook key words like may, might, could etc......

come with something closer to definitive or shut the fuck up.

For those of us that can read,  I'd prefer to get "may" vs nothing at all.  Some people can actually do nuance and see gray. 

not enough do imo. willfull or naturally ignorant and easily led by the nose....

Yeah I don't argue that.  I'm just saying I don't want the flow of information to stop because there's a piece of our population that are idiots.  Even if they are a majority.  

lastexitlondon

Gern Blansten said:

lastexitlondon said:

Gern Blansten said:

lastexitlondon said:

Gern Blansten said:

lastexitlondon said:

Ive had 3 so im not anti anything im npt having  another.   But we cant just rely on vaccines the worst outcomes  are clearly co morbidities  so we can do something  ourselves  in the meantime  is all i mean.  Move more. Eat well and take vitamins instead  of don't.  It will help your  outcome  . Because  we are all getting  this no matter how many jabs we have. I do know  vaccines work but we are going  in somewhat blind as its  a totally  unique  situation.  Health is key 
 And we can all do more if we are honest

We can just rely on vaccines....just like we just rely on vaccines for many other diseases that we have all been vaccinated for (measles, mumps, rubella, polio, etc.)

Those  diseases  don't  discriminate.  But this one has clear markers for bad outcomes.  Age yes.  And co morbidities  and all i am saying  is take responsibility  also for those. It can be done by  each one of us
 Nothing  more to see or read into

I'm guessing they do discriminate....but there probably aren't many studies about that since we have all been vaccinated against them

You are guessing? Not good

whether I'm guessing or not doesn't mean shit...the vast majority of us have been vaxxed against those and we don't have to worry it.

I mean clearly the measles would affect someone who is 90 much differently than someone who is 15

True story i just found  out Last year  i had measles as a child  and so did  my mum.

Meltdown99

brianlux said:

Meltdown99 said:

brianlux said:

tish said:

Let's not forget that age is the greatest factor in a negative outcome.



Stop getting old, people.

Oops!  Too late. 

They've yet to cure old age, unfortunately.  So I will leave you with what everyone says when they are getting old "you are only as old as you feel."  lol.  I know it doesn't make me feel any better...

If that is true, I am a LOT older in the morning than I am in the afternoon and into the evening. 

Your like me, an old car…we just need to get warmed up…lol