Viruses / Vaccines 2

JeBurkhardt

lastexitlondon said:

I would say hand washing and distance make perfect sense. No brainer

That right there is why there is any controversy. Too many people running around without their brain properly engaged.

OnWis97

I think the statement was that the six feet was not necessarily the silver bullet, i.e., there wasn't a magic distance that made you all the sudden super safe. Staying at home > 20 feet > 10 feet > 6 feet >1 foot.

Unfortunately, people that only read headlines and are looking to be outrage are essentially interpreting it as "all social distancing was worthless."  I can't wait for next time when we have no precautions.

23scidoo

lastexitlondon said:

I would say hand washing and distance make perfect sense. No brainer

What make sense Rob, to get the virus at 1.95m and not at 2.05m??..
you know why I'm asking you..

lastexitlondon

I believe in science and I believe that all viruses that are airborne makes sense to keep your distance. I still feel like during winter or seasons where virus is more rife keep a distance and it may only be me but I'm not comfortable right in anyone's face or space. I know how airborne virus works. I know it's not for everyone but I stay away from close up situations as much as I can. That's me

lastexitlondon

I will add I did this  well before covid. And it's not new to me to think this way

Go Beavers

Poncier said:

Go Beavers said:

OnWis97 said:

I'm sure the 6 feet thing was less-than-precise. I don't necessarily think that means we needed to be breaking fire codes at clubs and packing ourselves into places like sardeans. 

I mean, COVID is airborne so should we walk-back the messages promoting hand-washing?

Fauci lied about the handwashing thing because he’s been to public restrooms and he saw a good opportunity to go after the take a dump but don’t wash my hand crowd. 

josevolution

I can’t believe we are still dealing with this virus! My adult daughter tested positive last night she works at a child care facility and off course no one is being careful no mask no distancing nothing! They just keep spreading it ughhh 

mickeyrat

josevolution said:

I can’t believe we are still dealing with this virus! My adult daughter tested positive last night she works at a child care facility and off course no one is being careful no mask no distancing nothing! They just keep spreading it ughhh 

ummm, still dealing with varients of the spanish flu jose. more than 100 yrs now. will be the same with this , I expect....

mrussel1

mickeyrat said:

josevolution said:

I can’t believe we are still dealing with this virus! My adult daughter tested positive last night she works at a child care facility and off course no one is being careful no mask no distancing nothing! They just keep spreading it ughhh 

ummm, still dealing with varients of the spanish flu jose. more than 100 yrs now. will be the same with this , I expect....

Completely agree. This is milder than the Flu at least.  

23scidoo

But the spanish flu didn't came from a lab..and as far as I know, didn't was funded from US government..
''get the vaccine, dont spread the virus, protect the elders''..the good old days..lol..

mrussel1

23scidoo said:

But the spanish flu didn't came from a lab..and as far as I know, didn't was funded from US government..
''get the vaccine, dont spread the virus, protect the elders''..the good old days..lol..

What's the difference whether it came from a Chinese lab or not?  Are you going to throw away your cell phone and computer to protest the Chinese?  

Go Beavers

23scidoo said:

But the spanish flu didn't came from a lab..and as far as I know, didn't was funded from US government..
''get the vaccine, dont spread the virus, protect the elders''..the good old days..lol..

Your certainty about it coming from a lab is sourced where? 

mickeyrat

Go Beavers said:

23scidoo said:

But the spanish flu didn't came from a lab..and as far as I know, didn't was funded from US government..
''get the vaccine, dont spread the virus, protect the elders''..the good old days..lol..

Your certainty about it coming from a lab is sourced where? 

duh, it cant definitively be disproved so that is the proof.

mickeyrat

its so fucking funny, I mean really. Since this began China's economy is doing very badly. 

So what would have been the point? to create something then not have an effective means of control so as not to devastate your own country? then have the vaccine your country crested to combat this be very ineffective against?

again, what was the point then?

bootlegger10

mickeyrat said:

its so fucking funny, I mean really. Since this began China's economy is doing very badly. 

So what would have been the point? to create something then not have an effective means of control so as not to devastate your own country? then have the vaccine your country crested to combat this be very ineffective against?

again, what was the point then?

Or, as humanity does from time to time, it gets ahead of itself and starts creating virus strains as part of research and it got leaked.  Called gain of function research.  I think it is more silly to think that it wasn't leaked accidentally, but I don't act condescending to those who think that. 

John Stewart on the Wuhan Coronavirus Lab (youtube.com) 

mickeyrat

bootlegger10 said:

mickeyrat said:

its so fucking funny, I mean really. Since this began China's economy is doing very badly. 

So what would have been the point? to create something then not have an effective means of control so as not to devastate your own country? then have the vaccine your country crested to combat this be very ineffective against?

again, what was the point then?

Or, as humanity does from time to time, it gets ahead of itself and starts creating virus strains as part of research and it got leaked.  Called gain of function research.  I think it is more silly to think that it wasn't leaked accidentally, but I don't act condescending to those who think that. 

John Stewart on the Wuhan Coronavirus Lab (youtube.com) 

while plausible, its equally so that a zooinotic jumped as has happened often enough over time.

so in my view it comes down to whats probable , both could be. given conditions as described, I happen to lean natural over the synthetic , whereas some here seem to infer it was a purposeful release and not accidental as posited above.

given the number of feces related viruses to infect humans, thats where my money is at.

either way, its a thing to now guard against taking neccessary precautions or not as one may see fit.

23scidoo

mrussel1 said:

23scidoo said:

But the spanish flu didn't came from a lab..and as far as I know, didn't was funded from US government..
''get the vaccine, dont spread the virus, protect the elders''..the good old days..lol..

What's the difference whether it came from a Chinese lab or not?  Are you going to throw away your cell phone and computer to protest the Chinese?  

HUGE..

23scidoo

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

josevolution

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

What do you mean fooled? Does it really matter what the origin is at this point? Over a million deaths just here in America even knowing where the virus originated from wouldn’t have prevented the casualties! 

Go Beavers

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

You mean the lies told about the vaccine? 

It is based on an analysis by our team at the Brown School of Public Health, in collaboration with Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Microsoft AI for Health showing that between January 2021 and April 2022, vaccines could have prevented at least 318,000 Covid-19 deaths. This means that at least every second person who died from Covid-19 since vaccines became available might have been saved by getting the shot.
https://globalepidemics.org/vaccinations/

OnWis97

Go Beavers said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

You mean the lies told about the vaccine? 

It is based on an analysis by our team at the Brown School of Public Health, in collaboration with Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Microsoft AI for Health showing that between January 2021 and April 2022, vaccines could have prevented at least 318,000 Covid-19 deaths. This means that at least every second person who died from Covid-19 since vaccines became available might have been saved by getting the shot.
https://globalepidemics.org/vaccinations/

"Might have" is doing some lifting.
I don't even know what to think of the vaccines anymore. I have four shots under my belt. I had covid about a year ago.

Do I regret getting the shots? No; at least not yet. Will I again? Undecided. Probably.

But we were sold:

• It reduces the chance of getting covid  (Unsure; maybe before certain variants)
• You need to get it so it won't spread (preposterous) 
• It's safe (questionable; particularly in younger males)
• It will reduce the severity of your bout with covid (True and seemingly the primary benefit it offers)

"Conspiracy Theories":

• It was shoved down our throats with the threat of people losing their livelihoods (True)
• Societal benefit was marginal (Seems to be true)
• Risky for individuals (True)
• It's currently the vaxxed and not the unvaxed that are getting/spreading covid (Unsure; Never seen anything that will point to or for that)
• Thousands of young male athletes are having cardiac episodes (Exaggerated but seemingly true)

mrussel1

OnWis97 said:

Go Beavers said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

You mean the lies told about the vaccine? 

It is based on an analysis by our team at the Brown School of Public Health, in collaboration with Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Microsoft AI for Health showing that between January 2021 and April 2022, vaccines could have prevented at least 318,000 Covid-19 deaths. This means that at least every second person who died from Covid-19 since vaccines became available might have been saved by getting the shot.
https://globalepidemics.org/vaccinations/

"Might have" is doing some lifting.
I don't even know what to think of the vaccines anymore. I have four shots under my belt. I had covid about a year ago.

Do I regret getting the shots? No; at least not yet. Will I again? Undecided. Probably.

But we were sold:

• It reduces the chance of getting covid  (Unsure; maybe before certain variants)
• You need to get it so it won't spread (preposterous) 
• It's safe (questionable; particularly in younger males)
• It will reduce the severity of your bout with covid (True and seemingly the primary benefit it offers)

"Conspiracy Theories":

• It was shoved down our throats with the threat of people losing their livelihoods (True)
• Societal benefit was marginal (Seems to be true)
• Risky for individuals (True)
• It's currently the vaxxed and not the unvaxed that are getting/spreading covid (Unsure; Never seen anything that will point to or for that)
• Thousands of young male athletes are having cardiac episodes (Exaggerated but seemingly true)

How is it preposterous that the vaccine reduced the spread.  You can't know whether it did or not because not everyone got the shot and there was no controlled test to determine if it did or not.  We know from other viruses that severity of your symptoms has a direct correlation with your viral load, and therefore the level of contagiousness.  So if you agree that it reduces severity, doesn't it stand to reason that it would reduce the contagion?

Second, if 'thousands' of young males are having more episodes (do you have that data?), how do you know that is from the vaccine and not the virus itself?  Is the data locked in that people without the vaccine have a normal rate of incidence compared to those with the vaccine?

Merkin Baller

OnWis97 said:

Go Beavers said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

You mean the lies told about the vaccine? 

It is based on an analysis by our team at the Brown School of Public Health, in collaboration with Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Microsoft AI for Health showing that between January 2021 and April 2022, vaccines could have prevented at least 318,000 Covid-19 deaths. This means that at least every second person who died from Covid-19 since vaccines became available might have been saved by getting the shot.
https://globalepidemics.org/vaccinations/

"Might have" is doing some lifting.
I don't even know what to think of the vaccines anymore. I have four shots under my belt. I had covid about a year ago.

Do I regret getting the shots? No; at least not yet. Will I again? Undecided. Probably.

But we were sold:

• It reduces the chance of getting covid  (Unsure; maybe before certain variants)
• You need to get it so it won't spread (preposterous) 
• It's safe (questionable; particularly in younger males)
• It will reduce the severity of your bout with covid (True and seemingly the primary benefit it offers)

"Conspiracy Theories":

• It was shoved down our throats with the threat of people losing their livelihoods (True)
• Societal benefit was marginal (Seems to be true)
• Risky for individuals (True)
• It's currently the vaxxed and not the unvaxed that are getting/spreading covid (Unsure; Never seen anything that will point to or for that)
• Thousands of young male athletes are having cardiac episodes (Exaggerated but seemingly true)

What if I told you covid was causing heart problems in young male athletes long before the vaccine was available? Because it was… 

https://bdc2020.o0bc.com/sports/boston-red-sox/2020/11/19/eduardo-rodriguez-myocarditis-red-sox-pitcher/

Merkin Baller

Merkin Baller said:

OnWis97 said:

Go Beavers said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

You mean the lies told about the vaccine? 

It is based on an analysis by our team at the Brown School of Public Health, in collaboration with Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Microsoft AI for Health showing that between January 2021 and April 2022, vaccines could have prevented at least 318,000 Covid-19 deaths. This means that at least every second person who died from Covid-19 since vaccines became available might have been saved by getting the shot.
https://globalepidemics.org/vaccinations/

"Might have" is doing some lifting.
I don't even know what to think of the vaccines anymore. I have four shots under my belt. I had covid about a year ago.

Do I regret getting the shots? No; at least not yet. Will I again? Undecided. Probably.

But we were sold:

• It reduces the chance of getting covid  (Unsure; maybe before certain variants)
• You need to get it so it won't spread (preposterous) 
• It's safe (questionable; particularly in younger males)
• It will reduce the severity of your bout with covid (True and seemingly the primary benefit it offers)

"Conspiracy Theories":

• It was shoved down our throats with the threat of people losing their livelihoods (True)
• Societal benefit was marginal (Seems to be true)
• Risky for individuals (True)
• It's currently the vaxxed and not the unvaxed that are getting/spreading covid (Unsure; Never seen anything that will point to or for that)
• Thousands of young male athletes are having cardiac episodes (Exaggerated but seemingly true)

What if I told you covid was causing heart problems in young male athletes long before the vaccine was available? Because it was… 

https://bdc2020.o0bc.com/sports/boston-red-sox/2020/11/19/eduardo-rodriguez-myocarditis-red-sox-pitcher/

& not for nothing, but the vaccine significantly reduced the severity of the virus for many people, resulting in fewer hospitalizations & deaths…. Suggesting the societal benefit was only marginal seems to be missing the forest for the trees here. 

I don’t dispute that the vaccine didn’t do everything they told us (hoped?) it would, but that doesn’t mean the rollout wasn’t a net gain for society. 

Go Beavers

OnWis97 said:

Go Beavers said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

You mean the lies told about the vaccine? 

It is based on an analysis by our team at the Brown School of Public Health, in collaboration with Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Microsoft AI for Health showing that between January 2021 and April 2022, vaccines could have prevented at least 318,000 Covid-19 deaths. This means that at least every second person who died from Covid-19 since vaccines became available might have been saved by getting the shot.
https://globalepidemics.org/vaccinations/

"Might have" is doing some lifting.
I don't even know what to think of the vaccines anymore. I have four shots under my belt. I had covid about a year ago.

Do I regret getting the shots? No; at least not yet. Will I again? Undecided. Probably.

But we were sold:

• It reduces the chance of getting covid  (Unsure; maybe before certain variants)
• You need to get it so it won't spread (preposterous) 
• It's safe (questionable; particularly in younger males)
• It will reduce the severity of your bout with covid (True and seemingly the primary benefit it offers)

"Conspiracy Theories":

• It was shoved down our throats with the threat of people losing their livelihoods (True)
• Societal benefit was marginal (Seems to be true)
• Risky for individuals (True)
• It's currently the vaxxed and not the unvaxed that are getting/spreading covid (Unsure; Never seen anything that will point to or for that)
• Thousands of young male athletes are having cardiac episodes (Exaggerated but seemingly true)

None of those 5 things are actual conspiracy theories, and if the vaccine was effective in reducing severity, then it’s also true that unvaccinated people wouldn’t have died from Covid if they were vaccinated. Therefore the people who lied about the Covid vaccine led to people refusing the vaccine and a number of these people died as a result. 

23scidoo

josevolution said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

What do you mean fooled? Does it really matter what the origin is at this point? Over a million deaths just here in America even knowing where the virus originated from wouldn’t have prevented the casualties! 

it's the same thing to talk about a virus that escaped from a laboratory that was in collaboration with the American government and it's the same thing to talk about something natural??..of course not..

23scidoo

Go Beavers said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

You mean the lies told about the vaccine? 

It is based on an analysis by our team at the Brown School of Public Health, in collaboration with Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Microsoft AI for Health showing that between January 2021 and April 2022, vaccines could have prevented at least 318,000 Covid-19 deaths. This means that at least every second person who died from Covid-19 since vaccines became available might have been saved by getting the shot.
https://globalepidemics.org/vaccinations/

Αgain..they told us that is 100% safe??..lie..
they told us, ''get the vaccine so do not spread it??..lie..
they yold us, ''get the vaccine , so dont get the virus??..lie..
and the biggest one about the origin..
how many vaccinated are now in the hospitals??..how many of the ''covid deaths'' are vaccinated and how many not??..

23scidoo

Merkin Baller said:

Merkin Baller said:

OnWis97 said:

Go Beavers said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

You mean the lies told about the vaccine? 

It is based on an analysis by our team at the Brown School of Public Health, in collaboration with Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Microsoft AI for Health showing that between January 2021 and April 2022, vaccines could have prevented at least 318,000 Covid-19 deaths. This means that at least every second person who died from Covid-19 since vaccines became available might have been saved by getting the shot.
https://globalepidemics.org/vaccinations/

"Might have" is doing some lifting.
I don't even know what to think of the vaccines anymore. I have four shots under my belt. I had covid about a year ago.

Do I regret getting the shots? No; at least not yet. Will I again? Undecided. Probably.

But we were sold:

• It reduces the chance of getting covid  (Unsure; maybe before certain variants)
• You need to get it so it won't spread (preposterous) 
• It's safe (questionable; particularly in younger males)
• It will reduce the severity of your bout with covid (True and seemingly the primary benefit it offers)

"Conspiracy Theories":

• It was shoved down our throats with the threat of people losing their livelihoods (True)
• Societal benefit was marginal (Seems to be true)
• Risky for individuals (True)
• It's currently the vaxxed and not the unvaxed that are getting/spreading covid (Unsure; Never seen anything that will point to or for that)
• Thousands of young male athletes are having cardiac episodes (Exaggerated but seemingly true)

What if I told you covid was causing heart problems in young male athletes long before the vaccine was available? Because it was… 

https://bdc2020.o0bc.com/sports/boston-red-sox/2020/11/19/eduardo-rodriguez-myocarditis-red-sox-pitcher/

& not for nothing, but the vaccine significantly reduced the severity of the virus for many people, resulting in fewer hospitalizations & deaths…. Suggesting the societal benefit was only marginal seems to be missing the forest for the trees here. 

I don’t dispute that the vaccine didn’t do everything they told us (hoped?) it would, but that doesn’t mean the rollout wasn’t a net gain for society. 

How much money will the big pharma lose if the vaccine was effective??

23scidoo

Merkin Baller said:

OnWis97 said:

Go Beavers said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

You mean the lies told about the vaccine? 

It is based on an analysis by our team at the Brown School of Public Health, in collaboration with Brigham and Women’s Hospital, Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health, and Microsoft AI for Health showing that between January 2021 and April 2022, vaccines could have prevented at least 318,000 Covid-19 deaths. This means that at least every second person who died from Covid-19 since vaccines became available might have been saved by getting the shot.
https://globalepidemics.org/vaccinations/

"Might have" is doing some lifting.
I don't even know what to think of the vaccines anymore. I have four shots under my belt. I had covid about a year ago.

Do I regret getting the shots? No; at least not yet. Will I again? Undecided. Probably.

But we were sold:

• It reduces the chance of getting covid  (Unsure; maybe before certain variants)
• You need to get it so it won't spread (preposterous) 
• It's safe (questionable; particularly in younger males)
• It will reduce the severity of your bout with covid (True and seemingly the primary benefit it offers)

"Conspiracy Theories":

• It was shoved down our throats with the threat of people losing their livelihoods (True)
• Societal benefit was marginal (Seems to be true)
• Risky for individuals (True)
• It's currently the vaxxed and not the unvaxed that are getting/spreading covid (Unsure; Never seen anything that will point to or for that)
• Thousands of young male athletes are having cardiac episodes (Exaggerated but seemingly true)

What if I told you covid was causing heart problems in young male athletes long before the vaccine was available? Because it was… 

https://bdc2020.o0bc.com/sports/boston-red-sox/2020/11/19/eduardo-rodriguez-myocarditis-red-sox-pitcher/

Really now??..thousands felt down like flies, almost all of them double and triple vaccinated..

benjs

23scidoo said:

josevolution said:

23scidoo said:

Αnd again, why is it so hard for you to admit that we were fooled, that we were told a bunch of lies??

What do you mean fooled? Does it really matter what the origin is at this point? Over a million deaths just here in America even knowing where the virus originated from wouldn’t have prevented the casualties! 

it's the same thing to talk about a virus that escaped from a laboratory that was in collaboration with the American government and it's the same thing to talk about something natural??..of course not..

I would assume that the medical investigation, development of vaccines, distribution of vaccines, societal handling of the disease is the same regardless of lab-grown or organic. Am I wrong?