Black Lives Matter

brianlux

lindamarie73 said:

static111 said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

BLM murals are being defaced.
https://www.fox19.com/2020/07/14/black-lives-mural-vandalized-outside-city-hall/
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/black-lives-matter-mural-in-front-of-trump-tower-defaced-with-red-paint/2513093/

The second one the guy will get caught.  he left his prints on the damn paint can...

Well everything else is getting defaced. If Virgin Mary statues are going to be set on fire, there's no reason BLM murals can't be defaced too...

https://twitter.com/BreakngNewsPhtg/status/1282338453062062086?s=20

Oh no a fictional character was defaced *wrings hands* “let’s discount real oppression happening in our society“

Its a symbol of one of t he biggest  religions in the world. You don’t think that’s sending a message? If painting over BLM is considered a hate crime then this certainly should be too.
But if you’re okay with burning Mart are you okay with vandalizing a mosque or painting over BLM?
The destruction of property has gotten out of control at this point.

I thought this was the Black Lives Matter thread not the property destruction matters thread Or the all property matters thread or the tsk tsk how can we take your movement seriously when graffiti thread..  Maybe we can use another thread to talk about vandalism and use this thread to talk about very real problems that people are finally starting to look at?

So you don’t see the widespread destruction of property as a problem? And you don’t see a connection between that and BLM? Even though the comment that started this conversation was about people vandalizing a BLM mural?

I think BLM and vandalism are two different discussions.  I don’t think BLM is responsible for destruction of property, individuals are.  I’m not sure how widespread this”destruction of property “ is. How big of a percentage of property is being destroyed? How many people are affected by the destruction of property?  Again this is pulling away from the thread topic.  Black Lives Matter.  If you want to talk about widespread property “destruction” I would say start a new thread.  Don’t try to use vandalism as a corollary to BLM. 

Well its pretty hard to not associate BLM w/ vandalism, looting, and destruction when one walks through the streets of Shitcago and sees BLM / ACAB graffiti everywhere  you look downtown.  I had to go into the shitty today to for some business meetings and couldn't not believe how many storefronts are still boarded up from the "Protests" last month.     Even had the opportunity to be WOKE and walked by a small rally to Defund the Police by Trump Tower......Had a laugh watching these nitwits yell at a building while taking selfies for their social media.   

After you get some slamming the damn leftie commie pinkos and freaks maybe slam this (or what ever floats your boat)!

cincybearcat

I think it's pretty disingenuous to think the recent protests along with the looting, spray painting, tearing down statues etc followed by elected officials spray painting their own streets doesn't have an effect on other situations.  It was the catalyst.  And in most cases, it was pure vandalism.  Going far beyond the message of Black Lives Matter.

F Me In The Brain

Some people will do anything they can to distract from the message.  (This is all over the country.)

All lives matter
Look at the looting

Holy Mary, mother may I
Black Beans Matter
Police aren't all bad


This all comes from the same place, to me.  

Defend the white stronghold in America.


Those notes up there are not wrong.  (Well, the Goya line is complete stupidity)
They just don't need to be a part of the discussion to try and address the issues of systemic racism in the US.  To make them so is to deflect and defend.
My opinion - as a mostly white male American, whose minority status is not visible or part of my surname so not negatively impacting on my life in America.

cincybearcat

F Me In The Brain said:

Some people will do anything they can to distract from the message.  (This is all over the country.)

All lives matter
Look at the looting

Holy Mary, mother may I
Black Beans Matter
Police aren't all bad


This all comes from the same place, to me.  

Defend the white stronghold in America.


Those notes up there are not wrong.  (Well, the Goya line is complete stupidity)
They just don't need to be a part of the discussion to try and address the issues of systemic racism in the US.  To make them so is to deflect and defend.
My opinion - as a mostly white male American, whose minority status is not visible or part of my surname so not negatively impacting on my life in America.

So I strongly disagree.  There are PLENTY of people doing exactly what you say.  But talking about it doesn't put everyone in that same boat. When did everything become so black and white (no pun intended)?  It doesn't have to be all or none.

tempo_n_groove

JW269453 said:

With all of the pissing going on this somehow was overlooked. Pretty big step
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/07/15/asheville-passes-reparations-black-residents-historic/5441792002/

How you can have money from over a hundred years ago for an event and appropriately dole it out?

I don't see how this is going to work.

Can't believe nobody has touched this yet?

cincybearcat

tempo_n_groove said:

JW269453 said:

With all of the pissing going on this somehow was overlooked. Pretty big step
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/07/15/asheville-passes-reparations-black-residents-historic/5441792002/

How you can have money from over a hundred years ago for an event and appropriately dole it out?

I don't see how this is going to work.

Can't believe nobody has touched this yet?

I thought it said they weren't dolling it out...just investing in certain things/areas....I'll have to read again.  Asheville is awesome.

F Me In The Brain

cincybearcat said:

F Me In The Brain said:

Some people will do anything they can to distract from the message.  (This is all over the country.)

All lives matter
Look at the looting

Holy Mary, mother may I
Black Beans Matter
Police aren't all bad


This all comes from the same place, to me.  

Defend the white stronghold in America.


Those notes up there are not wrong.  (Well, the Goya line is complete stupidity)
They just don't need to be a part of the discussion to try and address the issues of systemic racism in the US.  To make them so is to deflect and defend.
My opinion - as a mostly white male American, whose minority status is not visible or part of my surname so not negatively impacting on my life in America.

So I strongly disagree.  There are PLENTY of people doing exactly what you say.  But talking about it doesn't put everyone in that same boat. When did everything become so black and white (no pun intended)?  It doesn't have to be all or none.

I think it does.  We can disagree, I just feel compelled to share my opinion on this every so often in response to the many posts in this thread taking away from the overall message.
Who knows, perhaps I am wrong.
Perhaps there should be another thread called Systemic Racism In America....but I feel strongly that these posts would find their way to that thread as well.  
Do everything but address the idea that there is a sizeable percentage of people who are positioned to fail in our country of so called equality and justice for all 

lindamarie73

brianlux said:

lindamarie73 said:

static111 said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

BLM murals are being defaced.
https://www.fox19.com/2020/07/14/black-lives-mural-vandalized-outside-city-hall/
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/black-lives-matter-mural-in-front-of-trump-tower-defaced-with-red-paint/2513093/

The second one the guy will get caught.  he left his prints on the damn paint can...

Well everything else is getting defaced. If Virgin Mary statues are going to be set on fire, there's no reason BLM murals can't be defaced too...

https://twitter.com/BreakngNewsPhtg/status/1282338453062062086?s=20

Oh no a fictional character was defaced *wrings hands* “let’s discount real oppression happening in our society“

Its a symbol of one of t he biggest  religions in the world. You don’t think that’s sending a message? If painting over BLM is considered a hate crime then this certainly should be too.
But if you’re okay with burning Mart are you okay with vandalizing a mosque or painting over BLM?
The destruction of property has gotten out of control at this point.

I thought this was the Black Lives Matter thread not the property destruction matters thread Or the all property matters thread or the tsk tsk how can we take your movement seriously when graffiti thread..  Maybe we can use another thread to talk about vandalism and use this thread to talk about very real problems that people are finally starting to look at?

So you don’t see the widespread destruction of property as a problem? And you don’t see a connection between that and BLM? Even though the comment that started this conversation was about people vandalizing a BLM mural?

I think BLM and vandalism are two different discussions.  I don’t think BLM is responsible for destruction of property, individuals are.  I’m not sure how widespread this”destruction of property “ is. How big of a percentage of property is being destroyed? How many people are affected by the destruction of property?  Again this is pulling away from the thread topic.  Black Lives Matter.  If you want to talk about widespread property “destruction” I would say start a new thread.  Don’t try to use vandalism as a corollary to BLM. 

Well its pretty hard to not associate BLM w/ vandalism, looting, and destruction when one walks through the streets of Shitcago and sees BLM / ACAB graffiti everywhere  you look downtown.  I had to go into the shitty today to for some business meetings and couldn't not believe how many storefronts are still boarded up from the "Protests" last month.     Even had the opportunity to be WOKE and walked by a small rally to Defund the Police by Trump Tower......Had a laugh watching these nitwits yell at a building while taking selfies for their social media.   

After you get some slamming the damn leftie commie pinkos and freaks maybe slam this (or what ever floats your boat)!

Don’t you worry, been doing plenty of that during this Pandemic and resurgence of this Farce known as BLM.    Luckily mostly at our summer home on a quiet lake in the Northwoods of Wisconsin.  

F Me In The Brain

Irl everyone I have met when in WI has been very nice.
Many here posting from WI seem to be the people who hate equality and support division and oppression.

Strange.

Maybe I am just lucky.

Bentleyspop

lindamarie73 said:

static111 said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

BLM murals are being defaced.
https://www.fox19.com/2020/07/14/black-lives-mural-vandalized-outside-city-hall/
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/black-lives-matter-mural-in-front-of-trump-tower-defaced-with-red-paint/2513093/

The second one the guy will get caught.  he left his prints on the damn paint can...

Well everything else is getting defaced. If Virgin Mary statues are going to be set on fire, there's no reason BLM murals can't be defaced too...

https://twitter.com/BreakngNewsPhtg/status/1282338453062062086?s=20

Oh no a fictional character was defaced *wrings hands* “let’s discount real oppression happening in our society“

Its a symbol of one of t he biggest  religions in the world. You don’t think that’s sending a message? If painting over BLM is considered a hate crime then this certainly should be too.
But if you’re okay with burning Mart are you okay with vandalizing a mosque or painting over BLM?
The destruction of property has gotten out of control at this point.

I thought this was the Black Lives Matter thread not the property destruction matters thread Or the all property matters thread or the tsk tsk how can we take your movement seriously when graffiti thread..  Maybe we can use another thread to talk about vandalism and use this thread to talk about very real problems that people are finally starting to look at?

So you don’t see the widespread destruction of property as a problem? And you don’t see a connection between that and BLM? Even though the comment that started this conversation was about people vandalizing a BLM mural?

I think BLM and vandalism are two different discussions.  I don’t think BLM is responsible for destruction of property, individuals are.  I’m not sure how widespread this”destruction of property “ is. How big of a percentage of property is being destroyed? How many people are affected by the destruction of property?  Again this is pulling away from the thread topic.  Black Lives Matter.  If you want to talk about widespread property “destruction” I would say start a new thread.  Don’t try to use vandalism as a corollary to BLM. 

Well its pretty hard to not associate BLM w/ vandalism, looting, and destruction when one walks through the streets of Shitcago and sees BLM / ACAB graffiti everywhere  you look downtown.  I had to go into the shitty today to for some business meetings and couldn't not believe how many storefronts are still boarded up from the "Protests" last month.     Even had the opportunity to be WOKE and walked by a small rally to Defund the Police by Trump Tower......Had a laugh watching these nitwits yell at a building while taking selfies for their social media.   

It's also pretty hard to not associate posts like yours with fear, hate, ignorance, homophobia, racism, and xenophobia.

MASK IT OR CASKET

tempo_n_groove

cincybearcat said:

tempo_n_groove said:

JW269453 said:

With all of the pissing going on this somehow was overlooked. Pretty big step
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/07/15/asheville-passes-reparations-black-residents-historic/5441792002/

How you can have money from over a hundred years ago for an event and appropriately dole it out?

I don't see how this is going to work.

Can't believe nobody has touched this yet?

I thought it said they weren't dolling it out...just investing in certain things/areas....I'll have to read again.  Asheville is awesome.

Yes, exactly.  They want to make it so there is generational wealth passed on.

How and who gets that?

WhatYouTaughtMe

Bentleyspop said:

lindamarie73 said:

static111 said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

mace1229 said:

static111 said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

BLM murals are being defaced.
https://www.fox19.com/2020/07/14/black-lives-mural-vandalized-outside-city-hall/
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/black-lives-matter-mural-in-front-of-trump-tower-defaced-with-red-paint/2513093/

The second one the guy will get caught.  he left his prints on the damn paint can...

Well everything else is getting defaced. If Virgin Mary statues are going to be set on fire, there's no reason BLM murals can't be defaced too...

https://twitter.com/BreakngNewsPhtg/status/1282338453062062086?s=20

Oh no a fictional character was defaced *wrings hands* “let’s discount real oppression happening in our society“

Its a symbol of one of t he biggest  religions in the world. You don’t think that’s sending a message? If painting over BLM is considered a hate crime then this certainly should be too.
But if you’re okay with burning Mart are you okay with vandalizing a mosque or painting over BLM?
The destruction of property has gotten out of control at this point.

I thought this was the Black Lives Matter thread not the property destruction matters thread Or the all property matters thread or the tsk tsk how can we take your movement seriously when graffiti thread..  Maybe we can use another thread to talk about vandalism and use this thread to talk about very real problems that people are finally starting to look at?

So you don’t see the widespread destruction of property as a problem? And you don’t see a connection between that and BLM? Even though the comment that started this conversation was about people vandalizing a BLM mural?

I think BLM and vandalism are two different discussions.  I don’t think BLM is responsible for destruction of property, individuals are.  I’m not sure how widespread this”destruction of property “ is. How big of a percentage of property is being destroyed? How many people are affected by the destruction of property?  Again this is pulling away from the thread topic.  Black Lives Matter.  If you want to talk about widespread property “destruction” I would say start a new thread.  Don’t try to use vandalism as a corollary to BLM. 

Well its pretty hard to not associate BLM w/ vandalism, looting, and destruction when one walks through the streets of Shitcago and sees BLM / ACAB graffiti everywhere  you look downtown.  I had to go into the shitty today to for some business meetings and couldn't not believe how many storefronts are still boarded up from the "Protests" last month.     Even had the opportunity to be WOKE and walked by a small rally to Defund the Police by Trump Tower......Had a laugh watching these nitwits yell at a building while taking selfies for their social media.   

It's also pretty hard to not associate posts like yours with fear, hate, ignorance, homophobia, racism, and xenophobia.

MASK IT OR CASKET

It reads like a post by that musky dude that used to post here all the time. When I read it, I thought he must have been back. 

Parksy

After doing a bit of research it's clear to me that systemic racism and overt racism certainly do exist. 
 
If you're white and your response to "Black Lives Matter" is "All Lives Matter" then you either don't realize that such racism exists, or you yourself may be a tad bit racist. I'm not trying to piss people off, but come on... how can you say things have been fair for black people? Now your intention may be good spirited in that yes of course "All Lives Matter" but it's almost insulting to black people who may perceive that as a clear misunderstanding that black people have not had it as good as white people for many years. 

Associating BLM with vandalism and looting also isn't entirely fair. Generally speaking, anything that causes people to get riled up leads to rioting/looting.  See G20 protests, sporting championship celebrations, etc. 

I think it should be perfectly fine to disagree with the rioting but also understanding what BLM is, why it became a thing, and why black people are distinct from other people.   Any disagreement with BLM is just ignorance in my opinion. And by that I mean, you're being ignorant to many years of oppression not just through slavery hundreds of years ago, but government policy in the 20th century in particular, fear, and straight up blatant racism either from police, businesses, white supremacists, etc. 

Personally I've been asking myself lately as a white guy how I might feel if I was black.  Not just thinking about how my father and grandfather may have been treated when they grew up, but how I would feel knowing that I was stripped of equal opportunity by my government through segregation policies that seem to blatantly be aimed at keeping white people ahead of black people. More often than not, I come to the conclusion that I would be super pissed off. 

static111

Parksy said:

After doing a bit of research it's clear to me that systemic racism and overt racism certainly do exist. 
 
If you're white and your response to "Black Lives Matter" is "All Lives Matter" then you either don't realize that such racism exists, or you yourself may be a tad bit racist. I'm not trying to piss people off, but come on... how can you say things have been fair for black people? Now your intention may be good spirited in that yes of course "All Lives Matter" but it's almost insulting to black people who may perceive that as a clear misunderstanding that black people have not had it as good as white people for many years. 

Associating BLM with vandalism and looting also isn't entirely fair. Generally speaking, anything that causes people to get riled up leads to rioting/looting.  See G20 protests, sporting championship celebrations, etc. 

I think it should be perfectly fine to disagree with the rioting but also understanding what BLM is, why it became a thing, and why black people are distinct from other people.   Any disagreement with BLM is just ignorance in my opinion. And by that I mean, you're being ignorant to many years of oppression not just through slavery hundreds of years ago, but government policy in the 20th century in particular, fear, and straight up blatant racism either from police, businesses, white supremacists, etc. 

Personally I've been asking myself lately as a white guy how I might feel if I was black.  Not just thinking about how my father and grandfather may have been treated when they grew up, but how I would feel knowing that I was stripped of equal opportunity by my government through segregation policies that seem to blatantly be aimed at keeping white people ahead of black people. More often than not, I come to the conclusion that I would be super pissed off. 

Well said and well thought out 👍

Ledbetterman10

Parksy said:

Any disagreement with BLM is just ignorance in my opinion. And by that I mean, you're being ignorant to many years of oppression not just through slavery hundreds of years ago, but government policy in the 20th century in particular, fear, and straight up blatant racism either from police, businesses, white supremacists, etc. 

I wish there was more of a distinction between the phrase "Black Lives Matter" and the group/movement "Black Lives Matter." Because as far as the phrase goes, I'm with it. There is systemic racism and black people are warranted to have a belief that the government doesn't think they "matter."

As for the movement, the initial concept to end police brutality and eradicate systemic racism, I'm with that too.  

Everything since then, I'm pretty much against. I'm against De Blasio pandering by painting on streets. I'm against Pelosi dismissing violence and looting (calm down, it's by white people too. I'm not saying only black people were looting) when she said in response to it "people will do what they do." I'm against influential black members (Stephen Jackson, Nick Cannon, Ice Cube) of the movement excusing anti-Semitism because they agree with Farrakhan that Jews are the enemy of black people. I'm against the patronizing of black people with special national anthems and stuff like censoring Aunt Jemima (yeah, that's what they're fighting for). And most of all, I'm against people like that woman that wrote that "White Fragility" book that basically outlines how white people as a whole are awful and racist (there's people on this board that seem to feel the same way). 

Some people are racist. This includes white people, black people, etc. You don't think black people are racist too? If there's two groups, one was the oppressor, the other was the oppressed, who do you think is going to hate the other more? The difference is, going back to the systemic point, is that black people's racism towards white people doesn't really affect anything other than, I guess, the social fabric. But white people's racism towards black people leads towards landlords refusing to rent to blacks, bosses refusing to hire blacks, and of course, incidents like George Floyd. That all as to go. I'm all for that, but I'm against the rest of the bullshit. So I do disagree with BLM (the movement) while I agree with BLM (the concept). 

PJPOWER

I, for one, fully support black people and recognize the systematic racism that black people have been subjected to throughout the years.  What I do not support or fully agree with is the actual organization or BLM “Chapters” and their goals that are rooted in Marxism, leaders even going as far as saying they are “trained marxists”.  I know a lot of people around here have their own views of Marxism, but I just cannot get on board with it.  

I do not think that anyone that does not support “BLM” should automatically be labeled as racist without further investigation.  

For me, BPM (black people matter).  Black lives do matter.  I am weary of wearing an “#BLM” t-shirt or baseball cap based on what I mentioned above.  It’s the same as certain proclaimed “ANTIFA” chapters that are actually pro-anarcho-communism groups.  If you say that you are anti-“ANTIFA”, you are declared or assumed to be pro-fascism, which may be the furthest thing from the truth.  Some of these “organizations” can almost be compared to the good ol’ Trojan Horse, flying under a flag that supports things well beyond what that flag specifically represents.  The same can be said for racist groups on the other end of the spectrum waiving the American flag...or the NRA just claiming to be a gun rights group.
Maybe I’m just overly cynical, but I am hesitant to buy into many “labels” or #acronyms.

Parksy

@Ledbetterman10

A lot of good points you mentioned.. but why does censoring Aunt Jemima bother you? And what do you mean by special anthems? 

Ledbetterman10

Parksy said:

@Ledbetterman10

A lot of good points you mentioned.. but why does censoring Aunt Jemima bother you? And what do you mean by special anthems? 

I shouldn't have even thrown that in because I should've known it would take away from the rest of my post. 

The special anthem is that before week 1of the NFL games (if they happen), they're going to play a song that's considered the "Black National Anthem" before the real national anthem. I think that’s just patronizing to black people. Same with changing syrup names. It doesn't "bother" me, because what do I care? But I've seen black folks on twitter complaining about these sort of things....that they're getting these little "concessions" that don't even affect them, when they're looking for change in systemic issues that DO affect them. Though, I guess some can argue that changing perceived "racist" things like Aunt Jemima is at least a start.

But yeah, I shouldn't have included this because the other stuff I mentioned in that same paragraph does bother me. This anthem and syrup stuff are things that I, like many black people, simply roll my eyes at. 

FiveBelow

tempo_n_groove said:

cincybearcat said:

tempo_n_groove said:

JW269453 said:

With all of the pissing going on this somehow was overlooked. Pretty big step
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/07/15/asheville-passes-reparations-black-residents-historic/5441792002/

How you can have money from over a hundred years ago for an event and appropriately dole it out?

I don't see how this is going to work.

Can't believe nobody has touched this yet?

I thought it said they weren't dolling it out...just investing in certain things/areas....I'll have to read again.  Asheville is awesome.

Yes, exactly.  They want to make it so there is generational wealth passed on.

How and who gets that?

The resolution calls on the city to create the Community Reparations Commission, inviting community groups and other local governments to join. It will be the commission's job to make concrete recommendations for programs and resources to be used. Who knows where this goes, but it seems they have made a commitment.

Parksy

@Ledbetterman10
This is the first I've heard of the plan to have a different anthem and I agree 100%, that only enhances the divisiveness of the nation.  FWIW, I agree with kneeling in protest, but to have a separate anthem is basically promoting separatism... which leads down a rather ugly road. 

I agree too about the syrup thing. I heard some folks on TV say that throughout the years being called Gemima was a slur so I totally understand re branding but it is in deed a drop in the ocean.  The takeaway being... at least it's something rather than nothing.