The Juggler
Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,361
edited June 2020
Biden
A few of us have been trying to explain this point. Now there is solid polling to back it up. Congratulations on shooting yourselves in your collective foot, liberals:
PHOTO ILLUSTRATION BY FIVETHIRTYEIGHT / GETTY IMAGES
Welcome to Pollapalooza, our weekly polling roundup.
Poll(s) of the week
“Defund the police.” In the last several weeks, this slogan has entered the mainstream amid nationwide protests against police violence.
However, there’s some disagreement about what exactly the slogan means. Some activists actually do want to disband police departments entirely, while others argue that police budgets should be radically decreased, but not brought down to zero. But even among those who want to abolish the police, some say they want to do so over time.
But while the slogan is suddenly everywhere, so far it doesn’t poll well. Four polls conducted in the past two weeks1 found that Americans opposed the “defund the police” movement or “defunding police departments” 58 percent to 31 percent, on average.
Most Americans balk at defunding the police
Recent polls asking people whether they support or oppose the “defund the police” movement or “defunding police departments”
DATES
POLLSTER
SUPPORT
OPPOSE
June 14-16
The Economist/YouGov
24%
53%
June 12-14
Morning Consult/Politico
28
58
June 10-11
ABC News/Ipsos
34
64
June 9-10
Reuters/Ipsos*
39
57
Average
31
58
*Question only asked of those who said they were very or somewhat familiar with the “defund the police” movement.
All polls are of adults, except the Morning Consult/Politico poll, which is of registered voters.
SOURCE: POLLS
The slogan is unpopular with most demographic groups, too, with two notable exceptions: Black Americans and Democrats. In the two polls where results were broken down by race, Black respondents said they supported defunding the police by an average of 45 percent to 28 percent, while white respondents opposed it by an average of 61 percent to 23 percent. This is in line with other polls that have consistently shown that white people mostly see police in a favorable light, while Black people are likelier to have experienced mistreatment at officers’ hands and take the problem of police violence seriously. So what we’re seeing here may be another reflection of Black and white Americans’ different experiences with police.
Similarly, in the three polls with breakdowns by party, Democrats on average supported the “defund the police” movement 50 percent to 34 percent, and Republicans on average opposed it 84 percent to 11 percent. Granted, only about a quarter of Democrats “strongly” supported it, per Morning Consult/Politico and Reuters/Ipsos, but three-quarters of Republicans “strongly” opposed it.
However, “defund the police” is also a simplistic slogan, and the poll results above do not capture public opinion on the movement’s more concrete policy goals. Specifically, defunding the police is only half of its goal; activists also want to reallocate the money spent on policing to other parts of the social safety net. Indeed, in those very same polls, some of these policy ideas enjoy far more backing among the American public than the slogan does — though the level of support does vary pretty widely depending on the details of the proposal.
For instance, when Reuters/Ipsos queried people about “proposals to move some money currently going to police budgets into better officer training, local programs for homelessness, mental health assistance, and domestic violence,” a whopping 76 percent of people who were familiar with those proposals supported them, with only 22 percent opposed. Democrats and independents supported these proposals in huge numbers while Republicans were split, 51 percent in favor to 47 percent opposed.
Meanwhile, Morning Consult/Politico asked respondents whether they supported “redirecting funding for the police department in [their] local community to support community development programs,” and just 43 percent of register voters said they supported it, while 42 percent opposed it. Still, this was a significant increase in support from the pollster’s question about support for the “movement to ‘defund the police’” (which, to reiterate, was 28 percent support vs. 58 percent opposition).
Overall, questions that seemed to emphasize how police departments would be affected found less support. Reuters/Ipsos respondents who were familiar with “proposals to completely dismantle police departments and give more financial support to address homelessness, mental health, and domestic violence” said they opposed those proposals, 58 percent to 39 percent. That was virtually identical to the way respondents broke down in the pollster’s question about the “‘defund the police’ movement.” And finally, per ABC News/Ipsos, 39 percent supported and 60 percent opposed “reducing the budget of the police department in your community, even if that means fewer police officers, if the money is shifted to programs related to mental health, housing, and education.” That made the specific proposal slightly more popular than “the movement to ‘defund the police’” (34 percent support vs. 64 percent opposition), but the difference was well within the pollster’s margin of error.
The idea of redirecting funding from police departments is a new one to most Americans, so the contours of the debate are still being defined — and so is public opinion. While the “defund the police” slogan itself is quite unpopular, there does appear to be some support for rethinking police departments’ role in local budgets and the community, so public opinion on this issue could very well lead to policy change.
So if I am up to date Klobuchar backed out of the VP stakes saying it should be a woman of color and Biden separately said campaigning in the primaries is critical experience to be considered?
I haven’t looked into her record much as a Police Chief, but as a casual observer, I would think Demings is best choice at this point.
Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022
So if I am up to date Klobuchar backed out of the VP stakes saying it should be a woman of color and Biden separately said campaigning in the primaries is critical experience to be considered?
So leaves us with Kamala? Or Warren? Uh oh.
My guess is Amy backed out because she's a footnote in the Derek Chauvin story and she knows she'd get the wrong kind of attention. But she doesn't get to tell Biden who to pick.
1995 Milwaukee 1998 Alpine, Alpine 2003 Albany, Boston, Boston, Boston 2004 Boston, Boston 2006 Hartford, St. Paul (Petty), St. Paul (Petty) 2011 Alpine, Alpine 2013 Wrigley 2014 St. Paul 2016 Fenway, Fenway, Wrigley, Wrigley 2018 Missoula, Wrigley, Wrigley 2021 Asbury Park 2022 St Louis 2023 Austin, Austin
Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022
Instead of digging in on the slogan, why not amend it? When conservatives talk about defunding Planned Parenthood or NPR they mean exactly that - pull all public funding.
Instead of digging in on the slogan, why not amend it? When conservatives talk about defunding Planned Parenthood or NPR they mean exactly that - pull all public funding.
Well the call to defund planned parenthood hood has certainly helped galvanize the R base, seems like a good political move to galvanize the “left” party
Instead of digging in on the slogan, why not amend it? When conservatives talk about defunding Planned Parenthood or NPR they mean exactly that - pull all public funding.
Well the call to defund planned parenthood hood has certainly helped galvanize the R base, seems like a good political move to galvanize the “left” party
The difference is that "defund the police" polls poorly with the left
0
Options
The Juggler
Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,361
Instead of digging in on the slogan, why not amend it? When conservatives talk about defunding Planned Parenthood or NPR they mean exactly that - pull all public funding.
Well the call to defund planned parenthood hood has certainly helped galvanize the R base, seems like a good political move to galvanize the “left” party
The difference is that "defund the police" polls poorly with the left
Democrats are morons for referring to this as "defunding" police. They handed Trump a political gift at a time they should have been stomping on his throat. All you have to do is call it "Police Reform." Politics really isn't that difficult.
Instead of digging in on the slogan, why not amend it? When conservatives talk about defunding Planned Parenthood or NPR they mean exactly that - pull all public funding.
Well the call to defund planned parenthood hood has certainly helped galvanize the R base, seems like a good political move to galvanize the “left” party
The difference is that "defund the police" polls poorly with the left
Democrats are morons for referring to this as "defunding" police. They handed Trump a political gift at a time they should have been stomping on his throat. All you have to do is call it "Police Reform." Politics really isn't that difficult.
I honestly don't get it. Whenever I've read an explanation of what someone means by "defund the police" I usually come away with two thoughts:
1. I'm in favor of most or all of the reforms mentioned and I think you could get majority support for a lot of them
2. What's being proposed is not accurately described as defunding
The stubbornness on this thing blows my mind. I often say too many people have abandoned trying to persuade and choose to bludgeon. This is taking that to an insane level.
0
Options
The Juggler
Behind that bush over there. Posts: 47,361
edited June 2020
Biden
Biden our raised Trump last month. Still way behind on cash, though. But his number was more than double what HRC raised in May ‘16.
Very encouraging. But I won't feel confident until deputy dipshit has someone pack his bags and haul them away from DC. I truly hope he is quite miserable on a routine basis.
"A smart monkey doesn't monkey around with another monkey's monkey" - Darwin's Theory
Instead of digging in on the slogan, why not amend it? When conservatives talk about defunding Planned Parenthood or NPR they mean exactly that - pull all public funding.
Yeah I don’t get it. Instead of recognizing how stupid they were with using it, they double down and hand a gift to Trump.
It’s like the confederate flag, it doesn’t matter what it means to you, it’s what it means to others that see it. You may think it stands for southern pride, but it really stands for slavery and black oppression
6,200 people according to the fire marshall. Hahaha
That's FAKE NEWS from the DO NOTHING DEMOCRATS! It was the most requested ticket in, like, ever! In fact many people are saying it was the greatest rally in the history of rallies. This was bigger and more beautiful than the million man march!!! Looters and thugs were out in full force preventing many many more Trumpers from being in attendance. Even Abe Lincoln would tell ya this speech was far better than the Gettysburg Address. And all while proving the Chiiiiina virus is yet another HOAX from the RADICAL LIBERALS!!!
"A smart monkey doesn't monkey around with another monkey's monkey" - Darwin's Theory
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Instead of digging in on the slogan, why not amend it? When conservatives talk about defunding Planned Parenthood or NPR they mean exactly that - pull all public funding.
Well the call to defund planned parenthood hood has certainly helped galvanize the R base, seems like a good political move to galvanize the “left” party
The difference is that "defund the police" polls poorly with the left
It polls great with the left, just not with the center right 80’s Republicans posing as progressive Democrats. We literally have a center right party and a fascist far right party right now. Regardless I’m still voting for Biden but let’s call it what it is.
Scio me nihil scire
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
0
Options
mickeyrat
up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 36,015
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Instead of digging in on the slogan, why not amend it? When conservatives talk about defunding Planned Parenthood or NPR they mean exactly that - pull all public funding.
Well the call to defund planned parenthood hood has certainly helped galvanize the R base, seems like a good political move to galvanize the “left” party
The difference is that "defund the police" polls poorly with the left
It polls great with the left, just not with the center right 80’s Republicans posing as progressive Democrats. We literally have a center right party and a fascist far right party right now. Regardless I’m still voting for Biden but let’s call it what it is.
You've worked your way down to too small of a pool though. I can tell you about all sorts of stuff that polls great with self-identified libertarians. To advance any of it, quite a few more hands are necessary.
Comments
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/americans-like-the-ideas-behind-defunding-the-police-more-than-the-slogan-itself/
Americans Like The Ideas Behind Defunding The Police More Than The Slogan Itself
By Nathaniel Rakich
Filed under Police
PHOTO ILLUSTRATION BY FIVETHIRTYEIGHT / GETTY IMAGES
Welcome to Pollapalooza, our weekly polling roundup.
Poll(s) of the week
“Defund the police.” In the last several weeks, this slogan has entered the mainstream amid nationwide protests against police violence.
However, there’s some disagreement about what exactly the slogan means. Some activists actually do want to disband police departments entirely, while others argue that police budgets should be radically decreased, but not brought down to zero. But even among those who want to abolish the police, some say they want to do so over time.
But while the slogan is suddenly everywhere, so far it doesn’t poll well. Four polls conducted in the past two weeks1 found that Americans opposed the “defund the police” movement or “defunding police departments” 58 percent to 31 percent, on average.
Most Americans balk at defunding the police
Recent polls asking people whether they support or oppose the “defund the police” movement or “defunding police departments”
*Question only asked of those who said they were very or somewhat familiar with the “defund the police” movement.
All polls are of adults, except the Morning Consult/Politico poll, which is of registered voters.
SOURCE: POLLS
The slogan is unpopular with most demographic groups, too, with two notable exceptions: Black Americans and Democrats. In the two polls where results were broken down by race, Black respondents said they supported defunding the police by an average of 45 percent to 28 percent, while white respondents opposed it by an average of 61 percent to 23 percent. This is in line with other polls that have consistently shown that white people mostly see police in a favorable light, while Black people are likelier to have experienced mistreatment at officers’ hands and take the problem of police violence seriously. So what we’re seeing here may be another reflection of Black and white Americans’ different experiences with police.
Similarly, in the three polls with breakdowns by party, Democrats on average supported the “defund the police” movement 50 percent to 34 percent, and Republicans on average opposed it 84 percent to 11 percent. Granted, only about a quarter of Democrats “strongly” supported it, per Morning Consult/Politico and Reuters/Ipsos, but three-quarters of Republicans “strongly” opposed it.
However, “defund the police” is also a simplistic slogan, and the poll results above do not capture public opinion on the movement’s more concrete policy goals. Specifically, defunding the police is only half of its goal; activists also want to reallocate the money spent on policing to other parts of the social safety net. Indeed, in those very same polls, some of these policy ideas enjoy far more backing among the American public than the slogan does — though the level of support does vary pretty widely depending on the details of the proposal.
For instance, when Reuters/Ipsos queried people about “proposals to move some money currently going to police budgets into better officer training, local programs for homelessness, mental health assistance, and domestic violence,” a whopping 76 percent of people who were familiar with those proposals supported them, with only 22 percent opposed. Democrats and independents supported these proposals in huge numbers while Republicans were split, 51 percent in favor to 47 percent opposed.
Meanwhile, Morning Consult/Politico asked respondents whether they supported “redirecting funding for the police department in [their] local community to support community development programs,” and just 43 percent of register voters said they supported it, while 42 percent opposed it. Still, this was a significant increase in support from the pollster’s question about support for the “movement to ‘defund the police’” (which, to reiterate, was 28 percent support vs. 58 percent opposition).
Overall, questions that seemed to emphasize how police departments would be affected found less support. Reuters/Ipsos respondents who were familiar with “proposals to completely dismantle police departments and give more financial support to address homelessness, mental health, and domestic violence” said they opposed those proposals, 58 percent to 39 percent. That was virtually identical to the way respondents broke down in the pollster’s question about the “‘defund the police’ movement.” And finally, per ABC News/Ipsos, 39 percent supported and 60 percent opposed “reducing the budget of the police department in your community, even if that means fewer police officers, if the money is shifted to programs related to mental health, housing, and education.” That made the specific proposal slightly more popular than “the movement to ‘defund the police’” (34 percent support vs. 64 percent opposition), but the difference was well within the pollster’s margin of error.
The idea of redirecting funding from police departments is a new one to most Americans, so the contours of the debate are still being defined — and so is public opinion. While the “defund the police” slogan itself is quite unpopular, there does appear to be some support for rethinking police departments’ role in local budgets and the community, so public opinion on this issue could very well lead to policy change.
And this reply to the tweet above....I can't disagree.
So leaves us with Kamala? Or Warren? Uh oh.
Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022
My guess is Amy backed out because she's a footnote in the Derek Chauvin story and she knows she'd get the wrong kind of attention. But she doesn't get to tell Biden who to pick.
2013 Wrigley 2014 St. Paul 2016 Fenway, Fenway, Wrigley, Wrigley 2018 Missoula, Wrigley, Wrigley 2021 Asbury Park 2022 St Louis 2023 Austin, Austin
Detroit 2000, Detroit 2003 1-2, Grand Rapids VFC 2004, Philly 2005, Grand Rapids 2006, Detroit 2006, Cleveland 2006, Lollapalooza 2007, Detroit Eddie Solo 2011, Detroit 2014, Chicago 2016 1-2, Chicago 2018 1-2, Ohana Encore 2021 1-2, Chicago Eddie/Earthlings 2022 1-2, Nashville 2022, St. Louis 2022
https://twitter.com/benandjerrys/status/1273979072713052161?s=21
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
1. I'm in favor of most or all of the reforms mentioned and I think you could get majority support for a lot of them
2. What's being proposed is not accurately described as defunding
The stubbornness on this thing blows my mind. I often say too many people have abandoned trying to persuade and choose to bludgeon. This is taking that to an insane level.
Libtardaplorable©. And proud of it.
Brilliantati©
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
There are no kings inside the gates of eden
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14