As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
0
brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 42,300
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
"California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?"
That sounds barbaric to me. If I'm off on this, maybe someone can explain why it's OK, although I have a hard time imagining I could be in favor of something like that.
"Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture
support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown
and able to make an informed decision."
That sounds very sensible.
"Pretty cookies, heart squares all around, yeah!" -Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
I can't find anything about such a case beyond some right wing and christian news sources trying to raise controversy over providing gender affirming health care and mental health care for children 12 and older who are foster care or about parents allowing their __ year old child to transition, but not with any physical changes or hormones.
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
I can't find anything about such a case beyond some right wing and christian news sources trying to raise controversy over providing gender affirming health care and mental health care for children 12 and older who are foster care or about parents allowing their __ year old child to transition, but not with any physical changes or hormones.
That was all I could find, too, though I’ll admit I didn’t go beyond about three pages in google.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Or a rumored news story spirals through social media and is regarded as fact? Happens all the time.
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Or a rumored news story spirals through social media and is regarded as fact? Happens all the time.
possible but I think he is more internet savvy than that.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Or a rumored news story spirals through social media and is regarded as fact? Happens all the time.
possible but I think he is more internet savvy than that.
Probably, but we know that controversy sells, so he has an incentive to misrepresent things. I don't know Rogan's work, but I'm stating that broadly.
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Or a rumored news story spirals through social media and is regarded as fact? Happens all the time.
possible but I think he is more internet savvy than that.
Rogan?
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Or a rumored news story spirals through social media and is regarded as fact? Happens all the time.
possible but I think he is more internet savvy than that.
Rogan?
heard any stance on this since this was posted coming up on EIGHT YEARS AGO.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Or a rumored news story spirals through social media and is regarded as fact? Happens all the time.
possible but I think he is more internet savvy than that.
Rogan?
heard any stance on this since this was posted coming up on EIGHT YEARS AGO.
You make a good point, but anyone who makes that statement and their source material is Breitbart, doesn't get a pass from me, unless this was a form of sarcasm. Hard to tell with these types of post and no context around it.
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Or a rumored news story spirals through social media and is regarded as fact? Happens all the time.
possible but I think he is more internet savvy than that.
Rogan?
heard any stance on this since this was posted coming up on EIGHT YEARS AGO.
You make a good point, but anyone who makes that statement and their source material is Breitbart, doesn't get a pass from me, unless this was a form of sarcasm. Hard to tell with these types of post and no context around it.
true. ine fact not mentioned before now here, rogan is a major stoner. his stoned late night surfing may leave him susceptible to conspiracy. but to his credit, he will call himself out for dumb shit he once thought that he evolved from.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Or a rumored news story spirals through social media and is regarded as fact? Happens all the time.
possible but I think he is more internet savvy than that.
Rogan?
heard any stance on this since this was posted coming up on EIGHT YEARS AGO.
You make a good point, but anyone who makes that statement and their source material is Breitbart, doesn't get a pass from me, unless this was a form of sarcasm. Hard to tell with these types of post and no context around it.
true. ine fact not mentioned before now here, rogan is a major stoner. his stoned late night surfing may leave him susceptible to conspiracy. but to his credit, he will call himself out for dumb shit he once thought that he evolved from.
one thing I've noticed since bernie posted that clip is every guest on the podcast since has been mma .......
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
couldnt find it either, so as sometimes happens with rogan he misunderstood the transition and perhaps took it to medical intervention erroneously
Or a rumored news story spirals through social media and is regarded as fact? Happens all the time.
possible but I think he is more internet savvy than that.
Rogan?
heard any stance on this since this was posted coming up on EIGHT YEARS AGO.
You make a good point, but anyone who makes that statement and their source material is Breitbart, doesn't get a pass from me, unless this was a form of sarcasm. Hard to tell with these types of post and no context around it.
true. ine fact not mentioned before now here, rogan is a major stoner. his stoned late night surfing may leave him susceptible to conspiracy. but to his credit, he will call himself out for dumb shit he once thought that he evolved from.
one thing I've noticed since bernie posted that clip is every guest on the podcast since has been mma .......
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Amy The Great #74594
New Orleans LA 7/4/95 reschedule 9/17/95
Chicago IL 1998, 10/9/00, 06/18/03, 05/16/06, 05/17/06
08/23/09, 08/24/09, Lolla 08/05/07
Champaign IL 4/23/03
Grand Rapids MI VFC 10/03/04
Grand Rapids MI 19May06
Noblesville IN 05/07/10 Cleveland OH 05/09/10
PJ 20 2011
Baltimore MD, Charlottesville VA, Seattle WA 2013
St. Louis MO, Milwaukee WI 2014
Tampa FL, Chicago IL, Lexington KY 2016 Missoula MT 2018
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
"hormone replacement in young children"? Is that even legal?
California case.... 3 yr old I think? as of last year?
Rogans point is, if these kids are in fact trans. great. love nuture support. let them grow first. they can decide for themselves once grown and able to make an informed decision.
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
I can't find anything about such a case beyond some right wing and christian news sources trying to raise controversy over providing gender affirming health care and mental health care for children 12 and older who are foster care or about parents allowing their __ year old child to transition, but not with any physical changes or hormones.
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Should we make sure they keep their tonsils, appendix, and wisdom teeth until they're 18 (or 25)?
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Should we make sure they keep their tonsils, appendix, and wisdom teeth until they're 18 (or 25)?
Interesting point. Is the a clear medical way to determine gender?
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Should we make sure they keep their tonsils, appendix, and wisdom teeth until they're 18 (or 25)?
Interesting point. Is the a clear medical way to determine gender?
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Should we make sure they keep their tonsils, appendix, and wisdom teeth until they're 18 (or 25)?
Interesting point. Is the a clear medical way to determine gender?
Gender is not a scientific area, so no.
Right so comparing it to things that are is probably not a fair comparison?
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Should we make sure they keep their tonsils, appendix, and wisdom teeth until they're 18 (or 25)?
Interesting point. Is the a clear medical way to determine gender?
Gender is not a scientific area, so no.
Right so comparing it to things that are is probably not a fair comparison?
I was merely poking some gentle fun at we should “accept the human body.” Bodies are flawed in many ways.
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Should we make sure they keep their tonsils, appendix, and wisdom teeth until they're 18 (or 25)?
Unless there is something medically wrong with the appendix (as it being dangerous to keep), wouldn't it be kept?
Removing an appendix isn't a sure-fire procedure and can cause complications. So it's not something that, to my knowledge, is removed on a kid on their initiative?
"Mostly I think that people react sensitively because they know you’ve got a point"
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Should we make sure they keep their tonsils, appendix, and wisdom teeth until they're 18 (or 25)?
unless they pose a significant problem. I don't feel tonsils should be removed unless there is a problem. Many people never need their wisdom teeth removed, I think that's a poor analogy, no one uses their tonsils to help they identify who they are. Back in the 60's, if one child had a tonsil problem and had siblings, they typically brought them all in and had them all removed at once. that was the best the doctors knew.
to me, a sexual organ is just that, doesn't matter what form it comes in. Male, female orgasm the same thing is going to happen in your head and body. It's our society that puts a "picture" of what any person "should look like" to have a certain type of experience. I disagree.
Amy The Great #74594
New Orleans LA 7/4/95 reschedule 9/17/95
Chicago IL 1998, 10/9/00, 06/18/03, 05/16/06, 05/17/06
08/23/09, 08/24/09, Lolla 08/05/07
Champaign IL 4/23/03
Grand Rapids MI VFC 10/03/04
Grand Rapids MI 19May06
Noblesville IN 05/07/10 Cleveland OH 05/09/10
PJ 20 2011
Baltimore MD, Charlottesville VA, Seattle WA 2013
St. Louis MO, Milwaukee WI 2014
Tampa FL, Chicago IL, Lexington KY 2016 Missoula MT 2018
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Should we make sure they keep their tonsils, appendix, and wisdom teeth until they're 18 (or 25)?
Interesting point. Is the a clear medical way to determine gender?
Gender is not a scientific area, so no.
Right so comparing it to things that are is probably not a fair comparison?
Also, I’m not a dentist, but I think the wisdom teeth comparison may be apt.
I wish I had the time to get further into this discussion. I'm slammed at work and have lots going on in my personal life, so I can't put the time in that some people somehow manage to, but it's an interesting discussion.
A few points. First, talking about the fact that the "human brain and body do not fully mature until 25" displays a lack of understanding of the nuance of that. Competency to make decisions is on a continuum, from little to no competency in young children to gradually increasing competency as once gets into the teens and twenties and beyond. 25 is not a magic number - people continue to mature over time, to a greater or lesser extent. Being 18 does not automatically make one more competent than 16 or 15, or even younger.
Second, the argument against allowing any biological treatments (like medication or surgery) prior to a specific age like 18 assumes that "doing nothing" is without risk, and we know that isn't true. Everything in medicine, like everything in life, has pros and cons, and you have to weigh them to make a decision. There is evidence of clear harms when trans individuals are not given the opportunities to express their gender in ways that are congruent for them, including a high rate of suicide attempts as well as other mental and physical health conditions. Dying with a body "intact" doesn't do anyone any good.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
As parents, you have to make decisions for your children. Formula or breast milk, meat or no meat, TV or music, etc it goes on for years before children make their own conscious choices. as long as you give children love, support and acceptance, maybe a bit of how to overcome potential obstacles they will most likey be okay with what they choose.
i think by default a parent that has overcome the social boxes they were brought up in, will naturally elimate those same boxes for their own children.
i never appreciated gender roles much, but they are a big part of any society.
i think it's ironic for a person that does not want to be gender labeled, dress in an attire that is clearly gender based, that is confusing to me.
do you think such parental choices should include medical intervention i.e. hormone replacement in young children?
to reference kinda what started all this here from the dem thread and joe rogans supposed endorsement bernie put up on his site.
no on the medical intervention. it would be "if you still feel strongly and you want to do that when you are 18". The human brain and body do not reach full maturity until the age of 25. I encourage the child to use what they have and dress the way they want, but accept their human body. Maybe it would work, maybe it would not work, once a child is an adult they will do what they want.
Should we make sure they keep their tonsils, appendix, and wisdom teeth until they're 18 (or 25)?
unless they pose a significant problem. I don't feel tonsils should be removed unless there is a problem. Many people never need their wisdom teeth removed, I think that's a poor analogy, no one uses their tonsils to help they identify who they are. Back in the 60's, if one child had a tonsil problem and had siblings, they typically brought them all in and had them all removed at once. that was the best the doctors knew.
to me, a sexual organ is just that, doesn't matter what form it comes in. Male, female orgasm the same thing is going to happen in your head and body. It's our society that puts a "picture" of what any person "should look like" to have a certain type of experience. I disagree.
But you disagreeing doesn’t eliminate their trauma.
Comments
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
-Eddie Vedder, "Smile"
But at the same time: Lets mutilate and cut off a bit of a young child's genitals!
Link to that please? Because using hormone therapy in a child that young is both contrary to the existing treatment guidelines, which specify the child being old enough to provide informed consent and which is typically considered 16, and also pretty much pointless, as the influence of sex hormones in children that young is minimal in their development. There are of course effects on in utero development, and then significant effects once puberty starts rolling, but in between gonadal hormonal levels are very low.
I'm guessing that you're actually referring to "social transitioning", not medical.
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
New Orleans LA 7/4/95 reschedule 9/17/95
Chicago IL 1998, 10/9/00, 06/18/03, 05/16/06, 05/17/06
08/23/09, 08/24/09, Lolla 08/05/07
Champaign IL 4/23/03
Grand Rapids MI VFC 10/03/04
Grand Rapids MI 19May06
Noblesville IN 05/07/10 Cleveland OH 05/09/10
PJ 20 2011
Baltimore MD, Charlottesville VA, Seattle WA 2013
St. Louis MO, Milwaukee WI 2014
Tampa FL, Chicago IL, Lexington KY 2016
Missoula MT 2018
"Claims that a transgender child would receive surgical or irreversible hormonal treatment do not reflect the reality of medical practice."
Removing an appendix isn't a sure-fire procedure and can cause complications. So it's not something that, to my knowledge, is removed on a kid on their initiative?
to me, a sexual organ is just that, doesn't matter what form it comes in. Male, female orgasm the same thing is going to happen in your head and body. It's our society that puts a "picture" of what any person "should look like" to have a certain type of experience. I disagree.
New Orleans LA 7/4/95 reschedule 9/17/95
Chicago IL 1998, 10/9/00, 06/18/03, 05/16/06, 05/17/06
08/23/09, 08/24/09, Lolla 08/05/07
Champaign IL 4/23/03
Grand Rapids MI VFC 10/03/04
Grand Rapids MI 19May06
Noblesville IN 05/07/10 Cleveland OH 05/09/10
PJ 20 2011
Baltimore MD, Charlottesville VA, Seattle WA 2013
St. Louis MO, Milwaukee WI 2014
Tampa FL, Chicago IL, Lexington KY 2016
Missoula MT 2018
A few points. First, talking about the fact that the "human brain and body do not fully mature until 25" displays a lack of understanding of the nuance of that. Competency to make decisions is on a continuum, from little to no competency in young children to gradually increasing competency as once gets into the teens and twenties and beyond. 25 is not a magic number - people continue to mature over time, to a greater or lesser extent. Being 18 does not automatically make one more competent than 16 or 15, or even younger.
Second, the argument against allowing any biological treatments (like medication or surgery) prior to a specific age like 18 assumes that "doing nothing" is without risk, and we know that isn't true. Everything in medicine, like everything in life, has pros and cons, and you have to weigh them to make a decision. There is evidence of clear harms when trans individuals are not given the opportunities to express their gender in ways that are congruent for them, including a high rate of suicide attempts as well as other mental and physical health conditions. Dying with a body "intact" doesn't do anyone any good.