The "N" Word

Ledbetterman10

tempo_n_groove said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

Go Beavers said:

I’m not sure if it’s worked since John Lennon did it 40+ years ago. 

It worked because that’s a great song. It’s worked on South Park too. Worked on Chappele’s Show as well with “The Niggar Family.” If it’s a part of art, and it’s used cleverly, it can work. But there haven’t been too many other instances of it working. 

All art references shouldn't be brought up.  They seem to get a free pass.

I've never heard that Lennon song before and reading the lyrics sung by a white guy would be pretty brazen in todays climate and wouldn't fly.

Not all art should get a pass. If you’re saying “The "N" Word” for no other reason than to say it, that shouldn’t fly. 

As for Lennon, don’t just read lyrics. Listen to the song. And check out his explanation for the song (and a performance of it) in the video below as well. If it was an artist of such renown (Springsteen maybe?) made this song today, I think it could work. There’d be some backlash (there’s backlash for everything these days it seems). But there was backlash for Lennon as well. 

https://youtu.be/S5lMxWWK218

tempo_n_groove

Ledbetterman10 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

Go Beavers said:

I’m not sure if it’s worked since John Lennon did it 40+ years ago. 

It worked because that’s a great song. It’s worked on South Park too. Worked on Chappele’s Show as well with “The Niggar Family.” If it’s a part of art, and it’s used cleverly, it can work. But there haven’t been too many other instances of it working. 

All art references shouldn't be brought up.  They seem to get a free pass.

I've never heard that Lennon song before and reading the lyrics sung by a white guy would be pretty brazen in todays climate and wouldn't fly.

Not all art should get a pass. If you’re saying “The "N" Word” for no other reason than to say it, that shouldn’t fly. 

As for Lennon, don’t just read lyrics. Listen to the song. And check out his explanation for the song (and a performance of it) in the video below as well. If it was an artist of such renown (Springsteen maybe?) made this song today, I think it could work. There’d be some backlash (there’s backlash for everything these days it seems). But there was backlash for Lennon as well. 

https://youtu.be/S5lMxWWK218

Springsteen has enough smarts to not use the word.  Vedder in my opinion wouldn't use it either.  They are both very much on top of current PC things.

I do agree that there is backlash for everything nowadays and even though there is a difference in using it with an A or the R at the end the word the Cedrick bit rings true, you may be able to use it w your close friends but not everyone else will agree.

I still don't see that Lennon song getting a pass today, no way.

tempo_n_groove

No one has actually commented on whether Cuomo was wrong or not for him repeating a quote.

pjhawks

Obviously it should never be used as a description or as a put down on a personal level.  Personally I don't like that rappers use it so often. using it in songs like that normalizes the word to the buying public. and when that buying public often times are white teens and young white adults you are letting them hear the word on a daily basis. while i understand the artist's artistic expression using it for that audience normalizes it to some extent. you can't argue the word is bad then allow people to hear it on a daily basis in my opinion. 

movies are a harder case. i think if the word is essential to the story then there is no reason it can't be used.  if it is just being used for gratuitous shock value or an insult though then i don't see the reason to use it in a movie.

Ledbetterman10

tempo_n_groove said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

Go Beavers said:

I’m not sure if it’s worked since John Lennon did it 40+ years ago. 

It worked because that’s a great song. It’s worked on South Park too. Worked on Chappele’s Show as well with “The Niggar Family.” If it’s a part of art, and it’s used cleverly, it can work. But there haven’t been too many other instances of it working. 

All art references shouldn't be brought up.  They seem to get a free pass.

I've never heard that Lennon song before and reading the lyrics sung by a white guy would be pretty brazen in todays climate and wouldn't fly.

Not all art should get a pass. If you’re saying “The "N" Word” for no other reason than to say it, that shouldn’t fly. 

As for Lennon, don’t just read lyrics. Listen to the song. And check out his explanation for the song (and a performance of it) in the video below as well. If it was an artist of such renown (Springsteen maybe?) made this song today, I think it could work. There’d be some backlash (there’s backlash for everything these days it seems). But there was backlash for Lennon as well. 

https://youtu.be/S5lMxWWK218

Springsteen has enough smarts to not use the word.  Vedder in my opinion wouldn't use it either.  They are both very much on top of current PC things.

I do agree that there is backlash for everything nowadays and even though there is a difference in using it with an A or the R at the end the word the Cedrick bit rings true, you may be able to use it w your close friends but not everyone else will agree.

I still don't see that Lennon song getting a pass today, no way.

But it’s basically a song that criticizes poor treatment of women. Wouldn’t the liberals of today love that? Or would the use of “The "N" Word” just make that null and void? Like you, I’m thinking the latter...and that’s a fucking shame. 

F Me In The Brain

Not my place to say, being a Wop-Mick-Spic myself.    Feel like I can really only comment on those three.

My place is not to use the N word.

pjhawks

i am surprised people in this thread are spelling the word out.  you know this can be googled right?

Kat

I can fix that. Ok done. Let's not give the Google Machine ugly words to find here. Thanks all. 

Ledbetterman10

pjhawks said:

i am surprised people in this thread are spelling the word out.  you know this can be googled right?

What would someone say if they googled it?

“Ledbetterman10 (whoever the hell that is) spelled out the word “The "N" Word” in a discussion about the word “The "N" Word.”

I’m using it in proper context of the discussion and putting quotes around it when I type it...so I don’t see what’s so surprising. 

And before someone inevitably asks, yes, if this was a real-life discussion instead of an online message board, or if I was using my real name, I’d likely say “the N-word” because someone would somehow (and stupidity) try to use spelling it out it against me.

Edit: It’s moot now. The mod doesn’t want the google machine finding ugly words like that so she edited it. How considerate. 

pjl44

tempo_n_groove said:

No one has actually commented on whether Cuomo was wrong or not for him repeating a quote.

It seems completely unnecessary to me, so I understand why people would be upset. Then again his brother thinks it's on par with "Fredo," so maybe this family is just a little more comfortable throwing it around than most

tempo_n_groove

pjl44 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

No one has actually commented on whether Cuomo was wrong or not for him repeating a quote.

It seems completely unnecessary to me, so I understand why people would be upset. Then again his brother thinks it's on par with "Fredo," so maybe this family is just a little more comfortable throwing it around than most

And I'll throw this back that Lennon thought a woman was the female version of the N word...

pjl44

tempo_n_groove said:

pjl44 said:

tempo_n_groove said:

No one has actually commented on whether Cuomo was wrong or not for him repeating a quote.

It seems completely unnecessary to me, so I understand why people would be upset. Then again his brother thinks it's on par with "Fredo," so maybe this family is just a little more comfortable throwing it around than most

And I'll throw this back that Lennon thought a woman was the female version of the N word...

Did anyone ask him to reckon with that at the time? Obviously it wouldn't fly today, but the song is almost 50 years old and he is dead.

cincybearcat

tempo_n_groove said:

No one has actually commented on whether Cuomo was wrong or not for him repeating a quote.

I said I would never say it...so I wouldn't quote it either.  I don't think he should have personally.

tempo_n_groove

cincybearcat said:

tempo_n_groove said:

No one has actually commented on whether Cuomo was wrong or not for him repeating a quote.

I said I would never say it...so I wouldn't quote it either.  I don't think he should have personally.

TY.

cutz

Cuomo shouldn't have used it.

Worked with a few young  black   guys over 20 years ago. I had 2 black guys around my age including my Boss. Well, one day the young guys were calling each other the "N"-word when the 2 older guys said to them to STOP calling each other the "N"-word. Their reason was if you do not respect each other how can other people?

tempo_n_groove

cutz said:

Cuomo shouldn't have used it.

Worked with a few young  black   guys over 20 years ago. I had 2 black guys around my age including my Boss. Well, one day the young guys were calling each other the "N"-word when the 2 older guys said to them to STOP calling each other the "N"-word. Their reason was if you do not respect each other how can other people?

Then you have the ICE-T song "Straight up Nga" that says those older guys wouldn't understand.

hedonist

tempo_n_groove said:

No one has actually commented on whether Cuomo was wrong or not for him repeating a quote.

I think if it's being quoted, cited, whatever, then it's fine to use.  It doesn't mean the person doing the quoting subscribes to using it.

Personally, I don't use the word in any form.

PJ_Soul

tempo_n_groove said:

PJ_Soul said:

It is never ever okay for non-black people to use it IMO. I think black people can work out for themselves if or when it's okay for them to use it themselves, but from my perspective, it is a 100% no-go for everyone but them.

It is literally the only word that has been demonized by the american people.

No other racial slur gets this status of "non negotiable" .

Jews have been persecuted the longest in the world and the word Kyke doesn't get a fee pass but it isn't lambasted as much or to get a hyphen and say the K-word.

That isn't the only demonized word in America.

But the status of the N-word compared to other racial slurs obviously comes from the history or slavery and Jim Crow. It's not hard to figure out why that particular slur reached "special status" among American slurs.

cblock4life

Not an expert, but I can tell you how most incarcerated blacks feel about it...

older blacks think it’s disrespectful no matter who or how it’s said, rapped, or sung.

younger blacks see rap versions of the word as an endearment of sorts..and think it’s ok to call each other it whether jokingly or endearing and 
It’s not ok for whites to say it whether talking or rapping.

mickeyrat

context is incredibly important. not having heard his statement in this interview, and having read a good portion of the article. he seemed to be referencing historical record as to how things absolutely were in regards to new immigrants.

yet another glaring example of the difficulty we have in this country in owning our collective history and speaking about it in frank terms.

personally directed at someone no matter their race or ethnicity is wrong and no matter who is using it in that context,  using the word in a conversation about our history, I have no problem with.