The Democratic Presidential Debates

ecdanc

cincybearcat said:

mrussel1 said:

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

ecdanc said:

Queers against Pete:

https://www.queersagainstpete.com/letter?fbclid=IwAR2kFvqaVNeR-PTgxy9dLZpWThsubujr5IwDPW0JwCm0R5Cs6GJod0WzdD4

I m no bloodhound but I smell bs. 

What does that even mean?

That it’s not some grassroots level concern.  I agree.  This is coming from Sanders directly or from his supporters.

Wouldn’t Surprise me. Sanders fans are the 2nd worst political group in the USA currently.

Oooh, oooh, give me the full rankings!! Where do suburbanite Trump supporters fall? What about white supremacists? Communists? 

mcgruff10

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

ecdanc said:

Queers against Pete:

https://www.queersagainstpete.com/letter?fbclid=IwAR2kFvqaVNeR-PTgxy9dLZpWThsubujr5IwDPW0JwCm0R5Cs6GJod0WzdD4

I m no bloodhound but I smell bs. 

What does that even mean?

That I think that web site is nothing but bull shit.  It is literally Bernie’s policies.  

Ah, I get what you're saying: you think the positions themselves are bullshit; I thought you were saying the page wasn't real or something. 

No I am saying the web site is bs.  (Although I don’t agree with any of the positions on the web site)

ecdanc

Halifax2TheMax said:

ecdanc said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

ecdanc said:

Queers against Pete:

https://www.queersagainstpete.com/letter?fbclid=IwAR2kFvqaVNeR-PTgxy9dLZpWThsubujr5IwDPW0JwCm0R5Cs6GJod0WzdD4

I’d have more faith in them if there had been a QueersAgainstTrump organization and mobilization drive. Seems more like a Putin on the ritz troll farm operation than a legit politic organization. They registered as a 501c3?

Did you hear all of Team Trump Treason’s comments about all the hot body, good looking dudes who supported him throughout impeachment? I mean it really bordered on getting sexual, breathless as he was in his descriptions. Maybe he should just come out? NTTIAWWT. He’d still be POTUS and first is better than third. And some think Biden is creepy?

Wait, would you trust them more or less if they were 501c3?

More.

You have a highly circumscribed notion of what constitutes politics, it appears. 

ecdanc

mcgruff10 said:

Referring to queers against Pete:
Mayor Pete doesn’t have an alternative for police.   People want to get rid of the police?! What the heck?

I do. 

Spiritual_Chaos

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

Referring to queers against Pete:
Mayor Pete doesn’t have an alternative for police.   People want to get rid of the police?! What the heck?

I do. 

Is your alternative Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young - Ohio?

Halifax2TheMax

ecdanc said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

ecdanc said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

ecdanc said:

Queers against Pete:

https://www.queersagainstpete.com/letter?fbclid=IwAR2kFvqaVNeR-PTgxy9dLZpWThsubujr5IwDPW0JwCm0R5Cs6GJod0WzdD4

I’d have more faith in them if there had been a QueersAgainstTrump organization and mobilization drive. Seems more like a Putin on the ritz troll farm operation than a legit politic organization. They registered as a 501c3?

Did you hear all of Team Trump Treason’s comments about all the hot body, good looking dudes who supported him throughout impeachment? I mean it really bordered on getting sexual, breathless as he was in his descriptions. Maybe he should just come out? NTTIAWWT. He’d still be POTUS and first is better than third. And some think Biden is creepy?

Wait, would you trust them more or less if they were 501c3?

More.

You have a highly circumscribed notion of what constitutes politics, it appears. 

Maybe I should have said are they registered as a PAC or any type of organization that would lend them an ounce of credibility? It seems you may confuse what might be legitimate in this age of troll farms and social media that can’t possibly influence an election, particularly a democratic primary season. Did you register on their site or link for the email blasts?

Berniebrosises not having a queersagainsttrumppence after Team Trump Treason embraced the rainbow flag then basically did an about face on so many LGBTA policies should be a clue, yes?

ecdanc

Spiritual_Chaos said:

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

Referring to queers against Pete:
Mayor Pete doesn’t have an alternative for police.   People want to get rid of the police?! What the heck?

I do. 

Is your alternative Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young - Ohio?

David Crosby is a Buttigieg supporter!!!

benjs

ecdanc said:

mrussel1 said:

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

ecdanc said:

Queers against Pete:

https://www.queersagainstpete.com/letter?fbclid=IwAR2kFvqaVNeR-PTgxy9dLZpWThsubujr5IwDPW0JwCm0R5Cs6GJod0WzdD4

I m no bloodhound but I smell bs. 

What does that even mean?

That it’s not some grassroots level concern.  I agree.  This is coming from Sanders directly or from his supporters.

Now THIS is some bullshit. You draw a false (convenient, for you) dichotomy between "grassroots" concerns and "Sanders....supporters." Do you people find it somehow surprising that queer leftists agree with the farthest left candidate? 

He said what he didn't think the site was, based on the way the site presents, then he said what he does think it was, based on the way the site presents (i.e. almost a carbon copy of Bernie's stated policies in list form). Then, add in the context of Bernie Bros behaviours from the last election, the fact that Sanders and Buttigieg were neck-in-neck in Iowa, and it's pretty hard to see this site as a sincere call to action.

I also don't think there was any intention to highlight those as opposites or to create a contrast - your response was the first time I even thought about this as an 'either/or' discussion. 

Spiritual_Chaos

Pete being a weasel is working.

Buttigieg Surges, Biden Slips In New NH Polling | Morning Joe | MSNBC

https://youtu.be/P_jgTYFLzG8


"Or as I like to call them,

future

former

republicans"-ing himself all the way to the white house.

Spiritual_Chaos

ecdanc said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

Referring to queers against Pete:
Mayor Pete doesn’t have an alternative for police.   People want to get rid of the police?! What the heck?

I do. 

Is your alternative Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young - Ohio?

David Crosby is a Buttigieg supporter!!!

He only says that to further his conflict with Neil.

You never have been shy about talking politics. Do you have a horse in the presidential race?

Neil: I’m with Bernie [Sanders] all the way. Hillary [Clinton] definitely has experience, but Bernie’s the one I believe. I agree with his message, and my way of thinking is more important to me than whether the media thinks Bernie Sanders has a chance at winning. So many people love him. There’s a lot of people like me who are really concerned about the issues — Bernie’s the guy for that.

benjs

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Pete being a weasel is working.

Buttigieg Surges, Biden Slips In New NH Polling | Morning Joe | MSNBC

https://youtu.be/P_jgTYFLzG8


"Or as I like to call them,

future

former

republicans"-ing himself all the way to the white house.

As is Bernie being obnoxious and unrealistic, if we're lobbing cheap shots over the wall. BTW, your guy also jumped on the Buttigieg train, and followed his lead to announce a premature win. Looking forward to finding out why Pete's a weasel when he does it, but why Sanders is a person for the people when he does.

Ledbetterman10

Biden's starting to look like this year's Jeb. Still early though. 

mrussel1

ecdanc said:

mrussel1 said:

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

ecdanc said:

Queers against Pete:

https://www.queersagainstpete.com/letter?fbclid=IwAR2kFvqaVNeR-PTgxy9dLZpWThsubujr5IwDPW0JwCm0R5Cs6GJod0WzdD4

I m no bloodhound but I smell bs. 

What does that even mean?

That it’s not some grassroots level concern.  I agree.  This is coming from Sanders directly or from his supporters.

Now THIS is some bullshit. You draw a false (convenient, for you) dichotomy between "grassroots" concerns and "Sanders....supporters." Do you people find it somehow surprising that queer leftists agree with the farthest left candidate? 

No, it's that the positions look so perfectly aligned, they appear to be Sanders supporters who are running what is essentially a negative ad against Pete.  I don't find it unusual that queer leftists support Sandes, nor would I expect homogeneous support of Pete just because he's gay.  At the same time, when the pattern of 'complaints' against Pete so perfectly tie into Sanders campaign promises, then I think it's dirty pool.  If you want to advocate for Bernie, that's great.  I love it.  But don't do it in this way, designed to specifically damage Pete's support in the community, without making it clear that you're really pro-Bernie.  

Spiritual_Chaos

benjs said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

Pete being a weasel is working.

Buttigieg Surges, Biden Slips In New NH Polling | Morning Joe | MSNBC

https://youtu.be/P_jgTYFLzG8


"Or as I like to call them,

future

former

republicans"-ing himself all the way to the white house.

As is Bernie being obnoxious and unrealistic, if we're lobbing cheap shots over the wall. BTW, your guy also jumped on the Buttigieg train, and followed his lead to announce a premature win. Looking forward to finding out why Pete's a weasel when he does it, but why Sanders is a person for the people when he does.

I happen to believe, that everyone should have shut up and waited for the voting (or whatever it is with all these different weird systems to not have normal voting) to be done.

But, in what way is Bernie obnoxious and unrealistic in this context?

mrussel1

Ledbetterman10 said:

Biden's starting to look like this year's Jeb. Still early though. 

I think that the left-center support is starting to coalesce around Pete. There's a feeling he may be real and has a chance, which wasn't the case a few months ago.  As Pete surges, Biden will fall.  The same is happening on the Sander/Warren side.  

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/481972-buttigieg-surges-ahead-of-new-hampshire-primary-poll

ecdanc

benjs said:

ecdanc said:

mrussel1 said:

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

ecdanc said:

Queers against Pete:

https://www.queersagainstpete.com/letter?fbclid=IwAR2kFvqaVNeR-PTgxy9dLZpWThsubujr5IwDPW0JwCm0R5Cs6GJod0WzdD4

I m no bloodhound but I smell bs. 

What does that even mean?

That it’s not some grassroots level concern.  I agree.  This is coming from Sanders directly or from his supporters.

Now THIS is some bullshit. You draw a false (convenient, for you) dichotomy between "grassroots" concerns and "Sanders....supporters." Do you people find it somehow surprising that queer leftists agree with the farthest left candidate? 

He said what he didn't think the site was, based on the way the site presents, then he said what he does think it was, based on the way the site presents (i.e. almost a carbon copy of Bernie's stated policies in list form). Then, add in the context of Bernie Bros behaviours from the last election, the fact that Sanders and Buttigieg were neck-in-neck in Iowa, and it's pretty hard to see this site as a sincere call to action.

I also don't think there was any intention to highlight those as opposites or to create a contrast - your response was the first time I even thought about this as an 'either/or' discussion. 

I can't judge his intent, only what he wrote. Here's my take: this is a group of authentic individuals 1) who are queer, 2) who see a member of the LGBTQIA community who is gaining in popularity and who has political stances with which they don't agree, and 3) whose politics align with Sanders's. Is that grassroots? Are some Sanders supporters part of the "grassroots" and others aren't? Or are they all, by definition, not (which is what mrussel seemed to imply)? Is there some litmus test for what constitutes "a sincere call to action?"

Like, I get disagreeing with the positions--that's expected and part of the political landscape. I don't really get the attempt to invalidate the people (not just their political stances) by drawing a divide between "real" people practicing politics and the implicit "fake" people (Russians even!) posters here seem to be worried about. I don't find it difficult to believe the veracity/authenticity of QueersagainstPete because I know a ton of people like this--they're a huge part of my Facebook feed. Are they Sanders supporters? Yes! Are they sincere in their concern about Buttigieg? Absolutely. What's weird about that?

mrussel1

ecdanc said:

benjs said:

ecdanc said:

mrussel1 said:

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

ecdanc said:

Queers against Pete:

https://www.queersagainstpete.com/letter?fbclid=IwAR2kFvqaVNeR-PTgxy9dLZpWThsubujr5IwDPW0JwCm0R5Cs6GJod0WzdD4

I m no bloodhound but I smell bs. 

What does that even mean?

That it’s not some grassroots level concern.  I agree.  This is coming from Sanders directly or from his supporters.

Now THIS is some bullshit. You draw a false (convenient, for you) dichotomy between "grassroots" concerns and "Sanders....supporters." Do you people find it somehow surprising that queer leftists agree with the farthest left candidate? 

He said what he didn't think the site was, based on the way the site presents, then he said what he does think it was, based on the way the site presents (i.e. almost a carbon copy of Bernie's stated policies in list form). Then, add in the context of Bernie Bros behaviours from the last election, the fact that Sanders and Buttigieg were neck-in-neck in Iowa, and it's pretty hard to see this site as a sincere call to action.

I also don't think there was any intention to highlight those as opposites or to create a contrast - your response was the first time I even thought about this as an 'either/or' discussion. 

I can't judge his intent, only what he wrote. Here's my take: this is a group of authentic individuals 1) who are queer, 2) who see a member of the LGBTQIA community who is gaining in popularity and who has political stances with which they don't agree, and 3) whose politics align with Sanders's. Is that grassroots? Are some Sanders supporters part of the "grassroots" and others aren't? Or are they all, by definition, not (which is what mrussel seemed to imply)? Is there some litmus test for what constitutes "a sincere call to action?"

Like, I get disagreeing with the positions--that's expected and part of the political landscape. I don't really get the attempt to invalidate the people (not just their political stances) by drawing a divide between "real" people practicing politics and the implicit "fake" people (Russians even!) posters here seem to be worried about. I don't find it difficult to believe the veracity/authenticity of QueersagainstPete because I know a ton of people like this--they're a huge part of my Facebook feed. Are they Sanders supporters? Yes! Are they sincere in their concern about Buttigieg? Absolutely. What's weird about that?

I replied to you above. 

ecdanc

mrussel1 said:

ecdanc said:

benjs said:

ecdanc said:

mrussel1 said:

ecdanc said:

mcgruff10 said:

ecdanc said:

Queers against Pete:

https://www.queersagainstpete.com/letter?fbclid=IwAR2kFvqaVNeR-PTgxy9dLZpWThsubujr5IwDPW0JwCm0R5Cs6GJod0WzdD4

I m no bloodhound but I smell bs. 

What does that even mean?

That it’s not some grassroots level concern.  I agree.  This is coming from Sanders directly or from his supporters.

Now THIS is some bullshit. You draw a false (convenient, for you) dichotomy between "grassroots" concerns and "Sanders....supporters." Do you people find it somehow surprising that queer leftists agree with the farthest left candidate? 

He said what he didn't think the site was, based on the way the site presents, then he said what he does think it was, based on the way the site presents (i.e. almost a carbon copy of Bernie's stated policies in list form). Then, add in the context of Bernie Bros behaviours from the last election, the fact that Sanders and Buttigieg were neck-in-neck in Iowa, and it's pretty hard to see this site as a sincere call to action.

I also don't think there was any intention to highlight those as opposites or to create a contrast - your response was the first time I even thought about this as an 'either/or' discussion. 

I can't judge his intent, only what he wrote. Here's my take: this is a group of authentic individuals 1) who are queer, 2) who see a member of the LGBTQIA community who is gaining in popularity and who has political stances with which they don't agree, and 3) whose politics align with Sanders's. Is that grassroots? Are some Sanders supporters part of the "grassroots" and others aren't? Or are they all, by definition, not (which is what mrussel seemed to imply)? Is there some litmus test for what constitutes "a sincere call to action?"

Like, I get disagreeing with the positions--that's expected and part of the political landscape. I don't really get the attempt to invalidate the people (not just their political stances) by drawing a divide between "real" people practicing politics and the implicit "fake" people (Russians even!) posters here seem to be worried about. I don't find it difficult to believe the veracity/authenticity of QueersagainstPete because I know a ton of people like this--they're a huge part of my Facebook feed. Are they Sanders supporters? Yes! Are they sincere in their concern about Buttigieg? Absolutely. What's weird about that?

I replied to you above. 

Came through as I was typing my comment. Thanks. 

Spiritual_Chaos

mrussel1 said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

Biden's starting to look like this year's Jeb. Still early though. 

I think that the left-center support is starting to coalesce around Pete. There's a feeling he may be real and has a chance, which wasn't the case a few months ago.  As Pete surges, Biden will fall.  The same is happening on the Sander/Warren side.  

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/481972-buttigieg-surges-ahead-of-new-hampshire-primary-poll

Also thehill on Pete:

Panel: Did Pete's 'fake' win give him a real bump?

https://youtu.be/RDDYEJXTGoc

Ledbetterman10

mrussel1 said:

Ledbetterman10 said:

Biden's starting to look like this year's Jeb. Still early though. 

I think that the left-center support is starting to coalesce around Pete. There's a feeling he may be real and has a chance, which wasn't the case a few months ago.  As Pete surges, Biden will fall.  The same is happening on the Sander/Warren side.  

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/481972-buttigieg-surges-ahead-of-new-hampshire-primary-poll

The thing for me is that if you take Trump out of the equation and these Dems were the only candidates for president, I'd vote for Pete. I dunno, I just like him (despite the fact that I'm an independent that leans conservative) and particularly like that he's close to me in age. But I truly believe Biden is the only one with a chance in the general against Trump. So if I was registered Dem, I'd vote for Biden in the primary in hopes he'd take on Trump. But I live in Pennsylvania and because the primary system is so stupid, Biden might not even be around (like Jeb, at this rate) when my state gets to vote.