I do get. The gist of the tweet is that greed and ego are more important than human lives.
I think everyone got that. I just don't think that the tweet reflects that at all, for the reasons I already said. The dead person and probably the Nepalese government were the only ones responsible for his death, not the other climbers walking past his body. The dead climber's own ego may have been placed by him before his own life, and certainly the license fee was more important to Nepal.
Its, just a tweet. Jeesh. Big deal. Maybe people need to see visual evidence so things change. You do realize that to climb Everest it is relatively easy to get the permit as opposed to other mountains that demand you prove you have the experience to climb the mountain. Maybe this person tweeted that hoping to enact change. Maybe the person who took the picture is frustrated that inexperienced mountaineers are costing people there lives...
I would never climb Mt. Everest, but if I did, I would want it to be me (team included) and the mountain. This over-crowding would completely diminish the experience to me. My vote doesn’t count, because I’m not a serious climber, but this has reached the point of being ridiculous.
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,727
This was crazy....the people that found Sir Edmund Hillary's body
Conrad Anker, the man who discovered Hillary's body, with the help of first-rate mountaineering author David Roberts, wrote a fascinating account of that discovery along with some really interesting background into Hillary's life. A very fine book:
EDIT: I meant to add this as well- Conrad Anker is one of the three climbers in the mountaineering film document, "Meru". It's still my favorite mountaineering movie (even topping "Free Solo" for me), and one of my very favorite movies of all kinds. Conrad, Jimmy Chin, and Renan Ozturk are amazing. And in one of the DVD extras, John Krakauer gives what for me is the quintessential answer to the question, "What is the meaning of life". (Don't ask me to give it away. You MUST see this film!)
Post edited by brianlux on
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I do get. The gist of the tweet is that greed and ego are more important than human lives.
I think everyone got that. I just don't think that the tweet reflects that at all, for the reasons I already said. The dead person and probably the Nepalese government were the only ones responsible for his death, not the other climbers walking past his body. The dead climber's own ego may have been placed by him before his own life, and certainly the license fee was more important to Nepal.
Its, just a tweet. Jeesh. Big deal. Maybe people need to see visual evidence so things change. You do realize that to climb Everest it is relatively easy to get the permit as opposed to other mountains that demand you prove you have the experience to climb the mountain. Maybe this person tweeted that hoping to enact change. Maybe the person who took the picture is frustrated that inexperienced mountaineers are costing people there lives...
Oh gee, sorry for discussing a post you put on a message board. It's definitely not about your poor choices of problematic memes and tweets you constantly post here.
Post edited by PJ_Soul on
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I would never climb Mt. Everest, but if I did, I would want it to be me (team included) and the mountain. This over-crowding would completely diminish the experience to me. My vote doesn’t count, because I’m not a serious climber, but this has reached the point of being ridiculous.
The over crowding would definitely suck but to say you were 29,029 feet above sea level is a level of badassness I can not comprehend. I would climb it in a heartbeat.
I do get. The gist of the tweet is that greed and ego are more important than human lives.
I think everyone got that. I just don't think that the tweet reflects that at all, for the reasons I already said. The dead person and probably the Nepalese government were the only ones responsible for his death, not the other climbers walking past his body. The dead climber's own ego may have been placed by him before his own life, and certainly the license fee was more important to Nepal.
Its, just a tweet. Jeesh. Big deal. Maybe people need to see visual evidence so things change. You do realize that to climb Everest it is relatively easy to get the permit as opposed to other mountains that demand you prove you have the experience to climb the mountain. Maybe this person tweeted that hoping to enact change. Maybe the person who took the picture is frustrated that inexperienced mountaineers are costing people there lives...
Oh gee, sorry for discussing a post you put on a message board. It's definitely now about your poor choices of problematic memes and tweets to constantly post here.
Way to have a discussion on a discussion board. The nerve of some people, geez.
I would never climb Mt. Everest, but if I did, I would want it to be me (team included) and the mountain. This over-crowding would completely diminish the experience to me. My vote doesn’t count, because I’m not a serious climber, but this has reached the point of being ridiculous.
The over crowding would definitely suck but to say you were 29,029 feet above sea level is a level of badassness I can not comprehend. I would climb it in a heartbeat.
I've been 40,000+ feet above sea level before. It's only okay.
Me, yeah, the number of people on that mountain is an insane turn off. I have ZERO interest in going somewhere that reminds me of how much human fuck everything up and make a beautiful place worse.
With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
I do get. The gist of the tweet is that greed and ego are more important than human lives.
I think everyone got that. I just don't think that the tweet reflects that at all, for the reasons I already said. The dead person and probably the Nepalese government were the only ones responsible for his death, not the other climbers walking past his body. The dead climber's own ego may have been placed by him before his own life, and certainly the license fee was more important to Nepal.
Its, just a tweet. Jeesh. Big deal. Maybe people need to see visual evidence so things change. You do realize that to climb Everest it is relatively easy to get the permit as opposed to other mountains that demand you prove you have the experience to climb the mountain. Maybe this person tweeted that hoping to enact change. Maybe the person who took the picture is frustrated that inexperienced mountaineers are costing people there lives...
What mountains must you prove your experience before obtaining a permit?
I'll ride the wave where it takes me......
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brianlux
Moving through All Kinds of Terrain. Posts: 40,727
I do get. The gist of the tweet is that greed and ego are more important than human lives.
I think everyone got that. I just don't think that the tweet reflects that at all, for the reasons I already said. The dead person and probably the Nepalese government were the only ones responsible for his death, not the other climbers walking past his body. The dead climber's own ego may have been placed by him before his own life, and certainly the license fee was more important to Nepal.
Its, just a tweet. Jeesh. Big deal. Maybe people need to see visual evidence so things change. You do realize that to climb Everest it is relatively easy to get the permit as opposed to other mountains that demand you prove you have the experience to climb the mountain. Maybe this person tweeted that hoping to enact change. Maybe the person who took the picture is frustrated that inexperienced mountaineers are costing people there lives...
What mountains must you prove your experience before obtaining a permit?
Good question.
I think all major mountain expeditions outfits should require proven levels of experience, levels of which would depend on the severity of the climb. Any eight thousander should require a high level of experience. No one should simply be allowed to "buy their way to the top".
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
I do get. The gist of the tweet is that greed and ego are more important than human lives.
I think everyone got that. I just don't think that the tweet reflects that at all, for the reasons I already said. The dead person and probably the Nepalese government were the only ones responsible for his death, not the other climbers walking past his body. The dead climber's own ego may have been placed by him before his own life, and certainly the license fee was more important to Nepal.
Its, just a tweet. Jeesh. Big deal. Maybe people need to see visual evidence so things change. You do realize that to climb Everest it is relatively easy to get the permit as opposed to other mountains that demand you prove you have the experience to climb the mountain. Maybe this person tweeted that hoping to enact change. Maybe the person who took the picture is frustrated that inexperienced mountaineers are costing people there lives...
What mountains must you prove your experience before obtaining a permit?
Good question.
I think all major mountain expeditions outfits should require proven levels of experience, levels of which would depend on the severity of the climb. Any eight thousander should require a high level of experience. No one should simply be allowed to "buy their way to the top".
They likely should, but I'm also interested in whether they actually do. I haven't been able to find anything on this yet. All the mountains I've checked so far require permits and often a deposit, in case rescue is needed, but I haven't found any yet that actually require proof of climbing competence.
my small self... like a book amongst the many on a shelf
I do get. The gist of the tweet is that greed and ego are more important than human lives.
I think everyone got that. I just don't think that the tweet reflects that at all, for the reasons I already said. The dead person and probably the Nepalese government were the only ones responsible for his death, not the other climbers walking past his body. The dead climber's own ego may have been placed by him before his own life, and certainly the license fee was more important to Nepal.
Its, just a tweet. Jeesh. Big deal. Maybe people need to see visual evidence so things change. You do realize that to climb Everest it is relatively easy to get the permit as opposed to other mountains that demand you prove you have the experience to climb the mountain. Maybe this person tweeted that hoping to enact change. Maybe the person who took the picture is frustrated that inexperienced mountaineers are costing people there lives...
What mountains must you prove your experience before obtaining a permit?
Good question.
I think all major mountain expeditions outfits should require proven levels of experience, levels of which would depend on the severity of the climb. Any eight thousander should require a high level of experience. No one should simply be allowed to "buy their way to the top".
They likely should, but I'm also interested in whether they actually do. I haven't been able to find anything on this yet. All the mountains I've checked so far require permits and often a deposit, in case rescue is needed, but I haven't found any yet that actually require proof of climbing competence.
Yeah I have never heard of it but I am far from an expert on the matter. I did a couple 14 ers in Colorado and 4’s in New Hampshire but nothing too technical.
I do get. The gist of the tweet is that greed and ego are more important than human lives.
I think everyone got that. I just don't think that the tweet reflects that at all, for the reasons I already said. The dead person and probably the Nepalese government were the only ones responsible for his death, not the other climbers walking past his body. The dead climber's own ego may have been placed by him before his own life, and certainly the license fee was more important to Nepal.
Its, just a tweet. Jeesh. Big deal. Maybe people need to see visual evidence so things change. You do realize that to climb Everest it is relatively easy to get the permit as opposed to other mountains that demand you prove you have the experience to climb the mountain. Maybe this person tweeted that hoping to enact change. Maybe the person who took the picture is frustrated that inexperienced mountaineers are costing people there lives...
What mountains must you prove your experience before obtaining a permit?
Good question.
I think all major mountain expeditions outfits should require proven levels of experience, levels of which would depend on the severity of the climb. Any eight thousander should require a high level of experience. No one should simply be allowed to "buy their way to the top".
They likely should, but I'm also interested in whether they actually do. I haven't been able to find anything on this yet. All the mountains I've checked so far require permits and often a deposit, in case rescue is needed, but I haven't found any yet that actually require proof of climbing competence.
Yeah I have never heard of it but I am far from an expert on the matter. I did a couple 14 ers in Colorado and 4’s in New Hampshire but nothing too technical.
You may find some answers here, towards the end.
From the article I posted this morning...
...Different mountains have different rules. To scale Aconcagua in Argentina, climbers are asked to provide details of winter ascents they have made in the past. Similar experience is recommended for climbing Denali in Alaska and Kilimanjaro in Tanzania. For other peaks, such as Vinson in Antarctica, Elbrus in Russia or Kosciuszko in Australia, it seems there are fewer restrictions.
I do get. The gist of the tweet is that greed and ego are more important than human lives.
I think everyone got that. I just don't think that the tweet reflects that at all, for the reasons I already said. The dead person and probably the Nepalese government were the only ones responsible for his death, not the other climbers walking past his body. The dead climber's own ego may have been placed by him before his own life, and certainly the license fee was more important to Nepal.
Its, just a tweet. Jeesh. Big deal. Maybe people need to see visual evidence so things change. You do realize that to climb Everest it is relatively easy to get the permit as opposed to other mountains that demand you prove you have the experience to climb the mountain. Maybe this person tweeted that hoping to enact change. Maybe the person who took the picture is frustrated that inexperienced mountaineers are costing people there lives...
What mountains must you prove your experience before obtaining a permit?
I do know that I did read that some mountains want proof of experience. Not sure if that are the guide services that require the proof before they take your cash or the permit issuers...either way, all the big mountains should require proof...
I would never climb Mt. Everest, but if I did, I would want it to be me (team included) and the mountain. This over-crowding would completely diminish the experience to me. My vote doesn’t count, because I’m not a serious climber, but this has reached the point of being ridiculous.
The over crowding would definitely suck but to say you were 29,029 feet above sea level is a level of badassness I can not comprehend. I would climb it in a heartbeat.
The problem is, I’m not sure I have that level of badassness!
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
Thank you. I knew I was not imagining it. Still, I could never imagine attempting Everest unless I was very experienced.
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
Thank you. I knew I was not imagining it. Still, I could never imagine attempting Everest unless I was very experienced.
And even then, I can’t imagine doing so, even with my fascination of Mt Everest and those who make successful summits.
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
Thank you. I knew I was not imagining it. Still, I could never imagine attempting Everest unless I was very experienced.
And even then, I can’t imagine doing so, even with my fascination of Mt Everest and those who make successful summits.
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
"
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers. "
That says a lot, doesn't it? I think this illustrates the difference between "experience" and "competence". Yes, some experienced climbers are going to die. But would 11 competent high altitude climbers die on one mountain in one year? I very much doubt it. I can't say this for sure, but I don't believe that has ever happened.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
"
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers. "
That says a lot, doesn't it? I think this illustrates the difference between "experience" and "competence". Yes, some experienced climbers are going to die. But would 11 competent high altitude climbers die on one mountain in one year? I very much doubt it. I can't say this for sure, but I don't believe that has ever happened.
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
" 11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers. "
That says a lot, doesn't it? I think this illustrates the difference between "experience" and "competence". Yes, some experienced climbers are going to die. But would 11 competent high altitude climbers die on one mountain in one year? I very much doubt it. I can't say this for sure, but I don't believe that has ever happened.
Nor have there been this many climbers...
This article highlights those that died. I think they were all competent, some had attained the goal of being in the 7 Summit Club. The article does not discern any difference between experience & competence, using only the word experienced to mean competent as well.
I believe the descent is the most deadly and most of the 11 died after they summited. The toll already taken on the body is well past anything the human body can normally withstand, add in the ‘traffic jams’ that add more time in the Death Zone, where your body shuts down and you essentially begin to die. That extra exposure has to be a contributing factor here for those who were experienced/competent.
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
"
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers. "
That says a lot, doesn't it? I think this illustrates the difference between "experience" and "competence". Yes, some experienced climbers are going to die. But would 11 competent high altitude climbers die on one mountain in one year? I very much doubt it. I can't say this for sure, but I don't believe that has ever happened.
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
" 11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers. "
That says a lot, doesn't it? I think this illustrates the difference between "experience" and "competence". Yes, some experienced climbers are going to die. But would 11 competent high altitude climbers die on one mountain in one year? I very much doubt it. I can't say this for sure, but I don't believe that has ever happened.
Nor have there been this many climbers...
This article highlights those that died. I think they were all competent, some had attained the goal of being in the 7 Summit Club. The article does not discern any difference between experience & competence, using only the word experienced to mean competent as well.
I believe the descent is the most deadly and most of the 11 died after they summited. The toll already taken on the body is well past anything the human body can normally withstand, add in the ‘traffic jams’ that add more time in the Death Zone, where your body shuts down and you essentially begin to die. That extra exposure has to be a contributing factor here for those who were experienced/competent.
Climbers/mountaineers will often tell you that the easy part is getting to the top. Its getting back down safely, and alive, that's the hard part.
Not really a permit issue, but the time I did the Knife Edge on Katahdin, there was a ranger at the start to assess those who wished to make that hike/climb. If the ranger determined that a hiker was in no shape to hike the Knife Edge, that hiker was rerouted.
This was years ago, so I don't know if they still do this. I take the saner trails up to the summit these days.
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
"
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers. "
That says a lot, doesn't it? I think this illustrates the difference between "experience" and "competence". Yes, some experienced climbers are going to die. But would 11 competent high altitude climbers die on one mountain in one year? I very much doubt it. I can't say this for sure, but I don't believe that has ever happened.
Nor have there been this many climbers...
This article highlights those that died. I think they were all competent, some had attained the goal of being in the 7 Summit Club. The article does not discern any difference between experience & competence, using only the word experienced to mean competent as well.
I believe the descent is the most deadly and most of the 11 died after they summited. The toll already taken on the body is well past anything the human body can normally withstand, add in the ‘traffic jams’ that add more time in the Death Zone, where your body shuts down and you essentially begin to die. That extra exposure has to be a contributing factor here for those who were experienced/competent.
I guess my point is I don't believe a competent climber would join that circus train of fools.
“The fear of death follows from the fear of life. A man [or woman] who lives fully is prepared to die at any time.”
So in this article, it states that climbers are vetted. So there must be a way to show proof. I know I read online that some mountains require proof...just not sure if its the guide companies or the permit issuers...and of course the article I cannot find and with all the news on Everest there are plenty of articles. I think maybe they need to vet better for Everest climbs. Far too many inexperienced climbers on the mountain.
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers.
Requirements for Aconcagua:
Climbers must submit a document detailing previous winter ascents they have made, which proves they have relevant experience and sufficient knowledge to attempt the climb.
Climbers must submit an affidavit to the Administration where they assume all responsibility for the risks of the expedition, releasing from responsibility the Mendoza Government and all relevant institutions.
Climbers must submit a list of the specific technical equipment they will be using for a winter ascent.
Climbers must show a valid insurance policy to the Administration which guarantees cover in case of a rescue or evacuation or for emergency medical care.
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11 deaths on Everest this year and they were believed to be experienced trekkers. "
That says a lot, doesn't it? I think this illustrates the difference between "experience" and "competence". Yes, some experienced climbers are going to die. But would 11 competent high altitude climbers die on one mountain in one year? I very much doubt it. I can't say this for sure, but I don't believe that has ever happened.
Nor have there been this many climbers...
This article highlights those that died. I think they were all competent, some had attained the goal of being in the 7 Summit Club. The article does not discern any difference between experience & competence, using only the word experienced to mean competent as well.
I believe the descent is the most deadly and most of the 11 died after they summited. The toll already taken on the body is well past anything the human body can normally withstand, add in the ‘traffic jams’ that add more time in the Death Zone, where your body shuts down and you essentially begin to die. That extra exposure has to be a contributing factor here for those who were experienced/competent.
I guess my point is I don't believe a competent climber would join that circus train of fools.
You do have a good point. I did read that more and more expedition companies are relocating to the Chinese side since that route is less used because China issues far fewer permits. But experienced climbers want to be on top of the world...that would be the ultimate.
Comments
They likely should, but I'm also interested in whether they actually do. I haven't been able to find anything on this yet. All the mountains I've checked so far require permits and often a deposit, in case rescue is needed, but I haven't found any yet that actually require proof of climbing competence.
Nepal blames amateur climbers and trekking companies for Mount Everest deaths
https://nationalpost.com/news/world/nepal-marks-1st-everest-summit-amid-debate-over-permits
Expedition operators said they do vet climbers’ experience and ability before signing up them up and that even seasoned mountaineers sometimes lose their lives on Everest.
This was years ago, so I don't know if they still do this. I take the saner trails up to the summit these days.
1 killed, 2 injured by falling rocks while climbing Mount Rainier
https://www.yahoo.com/gma/1-killed-2-injured-falling-rocks-while-climbing-084400550--abc-news-topstories.html