Donald Trump

mrussel1

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

my2hands said:

Cincy is NO Trumper, he's on the right team and I have his back! Long time poster that is a good dude, and a fair dude 

Halifax, you're my hero, keep up the good fight!

Thirty, you might be the funniest anti-trumper ever. Golden Corral and shootin' shit!

MRussell... that dude needs to be POTUS, hes fucking smarter than all of us! (Except maybe Benjis, he might just be a damn genius!)

Scruffy... I'm worried you're going to vote Trump in 2020, so pop on Riot Act and have a few IPA's (thanks for being a teacher, we need more good ones like you!)

PJ_Soul... I think i'm in love lol

BS... are you wake and baking again??? lol

Unsung............. well........... I have to admit, his crazy ass is growing on me and I want to hang out with him, drink about 20 beers, talk politics, and turn him into a liberal LOL. I think he is really just a big softy

Brian...... who doesn't love Brian? He is wise, he is kind, and his eyes are always on the big picture. We could all learn from Brian

Jose......... Jose is what this country is all about. An immigrant who came to this country, who loves this country, and who has made this country a better place just by coming here. He works hard, he is a family man, and he believes in a better way.  I love me some Jose, and will ALWAYS have his back! Jose is the most American motherfucker up in here

There's the cast of characters. Now we just need the screen play. 

We need a meet up... Seattle, Missoula, Boston...???

I’m in the cast...does this mean I get to come? Or will I get red henned? My vote is Missoula btw. I’ll bring the weed.

Are you in the missoula pit?  

mrussel1

BS44325 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

So... then.. you being pro-choice - it's laughable if you believe something to be evil in this world or cry over how kids are being treated?

If you're pro-choice you do not have the right to criticize anything being evil or care for kids?

You absolutely have the right. I’m making a different point though. I think it is absolutely wrong for pro-life people to characterize pro-choice people as “evil”. Nobody who chooses to have an abortion is “evil”. It is a terrible choice a women has to make filled with complexity. Characterizing her or the provider as “evil” is evil in and of itself. The same goes with child separation during the course of illegal immigration. It is a complex issue. A child is brought across with a “parent”...it could 100% be a parent but it could also be a sex trafficer, a drug smuggler, criminal etc. Border patrol does not know and has to figure it out. It is not a decision that anybody wants to make but it has to be made. Does anybody on here want a child smuggled into sex-trafficking and/or slavery? Are the odds of that remote? Of course but it’s real. People need to stop labeling difficult yet necessary decisions as “evil”.

I'm not sure it's necessary.  I believe Stephen Miller, in particular, sees this as a feature of the policy, not an unfortunate consequence.  

Edit - maybe that's not fair.  He might also be stupid and lacks foresight of any kind.  I guess that would be the charitable assessment. 

cincybearcat

my2hands said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

my2hands said:

Cincy is NO Trumper, he's on the right team and I have his back! Long time poster that is a good dude, and a fair dude 

Halifax, you're my hero, keep up the good fight!

Thirty, you might be the funniest anti-trumper ever. Golden Corral and shootin' shit!

MRussell... that dude needs to be POTUS, hes fucking smarter than all of us! (Except maybe Benjis, he might just be a damn genius!)

Scruffy... I'm worried you're going to vote Trump in 2020, so pop on Riot Act and have a few IPA's (thanks for being a teacher, we need more good ones like you!)

PJ_Soul... I think i'm in love lol

BS... are you wake and baking again??? lol

Unsung............. well........... I have to admit, his crazy ass is growing on me and I want to hang out with him, drink about 20 beers, talk politics, and turn him into a liberal LOL. I think he is really just a big softy

Brian...... who doesn't love Brian? He is wise, he is kind, and his eyes are always on the big picture. We could all learn from Brian

Jose......... Jose is what this country is all about. An immigrant who came to this country, who loves this country, and who has made this country a better place just by coming here. He works hard, he is a family man, and he believes in a better way.  I love me some Jose, and will ALWAYS have his back! Jose is the most American motherfucker up in here

There's the cast of characters. Now we just need the screen play. 

We need a meet up... Seattle, Missoula, Boston...???

I’m in the cast...does this mean I get to come? Or will I get red henned? My vote is Missoula btw. I’ll bring the weed.

Of course you get to come... we're gonna need a lot of weed...  I'm gonna turn you into a liberal too!

Unsung & BS will be commy hippies before you know it!

I vote for Seattle, Montana, or Boston cause I’ll only be in Chicago.

BS44325

my2hands said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

my2hands said:

Cincy is NO Trumper, he's on the right team and I have his back! Long time poster that is a good dude, and a fair dude 

Halifax, you're my hero, keep up the good fight!

Thirty, you might be the funniest anti-trumper ever. Golden Corral and shootin' shit!

MRussell... that dude needs to be POTUS, hes fucking smarter than all of us! (Except maybe Benjis, he might just be a damn genius!)

Scruffy... I'm worried you're going to vote Trump in 2020, so pop on Riot Act and have a few IPA's (thanks for being a teacher, we need more good ones like you!)

PJ_Soul... I think i'm in love lol

BS... are you wake and baking again??? lol

Unsung............. well........... I have to admit, his crazy ass is growing on me and I want to hang out with him, drink about 20 beers, talk politics, and turn him into a liberal LOL. I think he is really just a big softy

Brian...... who doesn't love Brian? He is wise, he is kind, and his eyes are always on the big picture. We could all learn from Brian

Jose......... Jose is what this country is all about. An immigrant who came to this country, who loves this country, and who has made this country a better place just by coming here. He works hard, he is a family man, and he believes in a better way.  I love me some Jose, and will ALWAYS have his back! Jose is the most American motherfucker up in here

There's the cast of characters. Now we just need the screen play. 

We need a meet up... Seattle, Missoula, Boston...???

I’m in the cast...does this mean I get to come? Or will I get red henned? My vote is Missoula btw. I’ll bring the weed.

Of course you get to come... we're gonna need a lot of weed...  I'm gonna turn you into a liberal too!

Unsung & BS will be commy hippies before you know it!

Thanks...I previously was a commy hippy though...hard to go back.

benjs

cincybearcat said:

my2hands said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

my2hands said:

Cincy is NO Trumper, he's on the right team and I have his back! Long time poster that is a good dude, and a fair dude 

Halifax, you're my hero, keep up the good fight!

Thirty, you might be the funniest anti-trumper ever. Golden Corral and shootin' shit!

MRussell... that dude needs to be POTUS, hes fucking smarter than all of us! (Except maybe Benjis, he might just be a damn genius!)

Scruffy... I'm worried you're going to vote Trump in 2020, so pop on Riot Act and have a few IPA's (thanks for being a teacher, we need more good ones like you!)

PJ_Soul... I think i'm in love lol

BS... are you wake and baking again??? lol

Unsung............. well........... I have to admit, his crazy ass is growing on me and I want to hang out with him, drink about 20 beers, talk politics, and turn him into a liberal LOL. I think he is really just a big softy

Brian...... who doesn't love Brian? He is wise, he is kind, and his eyes are always on the big picture. We could all learn from Brian

Jose......... Jose is what this country is all about. An immigrant who came to this country, who loves this country, and who has made this country a better place just by coming here. He works hard, he is a family man, and he believes in a better way.  I love me some Jose, and will ALWAYS have his back! Jose is the most American motherfucker up in here

There's the cast of characters. Now we just need the screen play. 

We need a meet up... Seattle, Missoula, Boston...???

I’m in the cast...does this mean I get to come? Or will I get red henned? My vote is Missoula btw. I’ll bring the weed.

Of course you get to come... we're gonna need a lot of weed...  I'm gonna turn you into a liberal too!

Unsung & BS will be commy hippies before you know it!

I vote for Seattle, Montana, or Boston cause I’ll only be in Chicago.

Can I request a green-legal zone? I want to hear people say the things that most of us would have to be high to say, then I want to get them high and see what gets said.

BS44325

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

So... then.. you being pro-choice - it's laughable if you believe something to be evil in this world or cry over how kids are being treated?

If you're pro-choice you do not have the right to criticize anything being evil or care for kids?

You absolutely have the right. I’m making a different point though. I think it is absolutely wrong for pro-life people to characterize pro-choice people as “evil”. Nobody who chooses to have an abortion is “evil”. It is a terrible choice a women has to make filled with complexity. Characterizing her or the provider as “evil” is evil in and of itself. The same goes with child separation during the course of illegal immigration. It is a complex issue. A child is brought across with a “parent”...it could 100% be a parent but it could also be a sex trafficer, a drug smuggler, criminal etc. Border patrol does not know and has to figure it out. It is not a decision that anybody wants to make but it has to be made. Does anybody on here want a child smuggled into sex-trafficking and/or slavery? Are the odds of that remote? Of course but it’s real. People need to stop labeling difficult yet necessary decisions as “evil”.

I'm not sure it's necessary.  I belieive Stephen Miller, in particular, sees this as a feature of the policy, not an unfortunate consequence.  

You could be right on Miller but it doesn’t make the policy any less necessary in some ways. There is a reason why a version of this policy existed under Obama.

BS44325

josevolution said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

I’m pro choice , you think it’s ok to have kids separated and left to fend for them selves at this early age to just let them sit their and cry go ahead tell that’s ok ? Enjoy your breakfast what will you have steak & eggs what will your kids have ? Cheerios or fruity pebbles? 

Again we are conflating “ok” with “necessary “...there are a lot of things we do that we deem not “ok” but “necessary “.

Separating children is not necessary or ok ! 

It is if you care about stopping child trafficking.

BS44325

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

my2hands said:

Cincy is NO Trumper, he's on the right team and I have his back! Long time poster that is a good dude, and a fair dude 

Halifax, you're my hero, keep up the good fight!

Thirty, you might be the funniest anti-trumper ever. Golden Corral and shootin' shit!

MRussell... that dude needs to be POTUS, hes fucking smarter than all of us! (Except maybe Benjis, he might just be a damn genius!)

Scruffy... I'm worried you're going to vote Trump in 2020, so pop on Riot Act and have a few IPA's (thanks for being a teacher, we need more good ones like you!)

PJ_Soul... I think i'm in love lol

BS... are you wake and baking again??? lol

Unsung............. well........... I have to admit, his crazy ass is growing on me and I want to hang out with him, drink about 20 beers, talk politics, and turn him into a liberal LOL. I think he is really just a big softy

Brian...... who doesn't love Brian? He is wise, he is kind, and his eyes are always on the big picture. We could all learn from Brian

Jose......... Jose is what this country is all about. An immigrant who came to this country, who loves this country, and who has made this country a better place just by coming here. He works hard, he is a family man, and he believes in a better way.  I love me some Jose, and will ALWAYS have his back! Jose is the most American motherfucker up in here

There's the cast of characters. Now we just need the screen play. 

We need a meet up... Seattle, Missoula, Boston...???

I’m in the cast...does this mean I get to come? Or will I get red henned? My vote is Missoula btw. I’ll bring the weed.

Are you in the missoula pit?  

Yes and I think I have an extra ticket

mrussel1

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

So... then.. you being pro-choice - it's laughable if you believe something to be evil in this world or cry over how kids are being treated?

If you're pro-choice you do not have the right to criticize anything being evil or care for kids?

You absolutely have the right. I’m making a different point though. I think it is absolutely wrong for pro-life people to characterize pro-choice people as “evil”. Nobody who chooses to have an abortion is “evil”. It is a terrible choice a women has to make filled with complexity. Characterizing her or the provider as “evil” is evil in and of itself. The same goes with child separation during the course of illegal immigration. It is a complex issue. A child is brought across with a “parent”...it could 100% be a parent but it could also be a sex trafficer, a drug smuggler, criminal etc. Border patrol does not know and has to figure it out. It is not a decision that anybody wants to make but it has to be made. Does anybody on here want a child smuggled into sex-trafficking and/or slavery? Are the odds of that remote? Of course but it’s real. People need to stop labeling difficult yet necessary decisions as “evil”.

I'm not sure it's necessary.  I belieive Stephen Miller, in particular, sees this as a feature of the policy, not an unfortunate consequence.  

You could be right on Miller but it doesn’t make the policy any less necessary in some ways. There is a reason why a version of this policy existed under Obama.

My understanding is that under Obama, the separations only took place when there was reason to believe the child was in danger OR that he/she wasn't really the child of the person (using as mules).  There was no distinction under Trump's policy until this week.  

BS44325

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

So... then.. you being pro-choice - it's laughable if you believe something to be evil in this world or cry over how kids are being treated?

If you're pro-choice you do not have the right to criticize anything being evil or care for kids?

You absolutely have the right. I’m making a different point though. I think it is absolutely wrong for pro-life people to characterize pro-choice people as “evil”. Nobody who chooses to have an abortion is “evil”. It is a terrible choice a women has to make filled with complexity. Characterizing her or the provider as “evil” is evil in and of itself. The same goes with child separation during the course of illegal immigration. It is a complex issue. A child is brought across with a “parent”...it could 100% be a parent but it could also be a sex trafficer, a drug smuggler, criminal etc. Border patrol does not know and has to figure it out. It is not a decision that anybody wants to make but it has to be made. Does anybody on here want a child smuggled into sex-trafficking and/or slavery? Are the odds of that remote? Of course but it’s real. People need to stop labeling difficult yet necessary decisions as “evil”.

I'm not sure it's necessary.  I belieive Stephen Miller, in particular, sees this as a feature of the policy, not an unfortunate consequence.  

You could be right on Miller but it doesn’t make the policy any less necessary in some ways. There is a reason why a version of this policy existed under Obama.

My understanding is that under Obama, the separations only took place when there was reason to believe the child was in danger OR that he/she wasn't really the child of the person (using as mules).  There was no distinction under Trump's policy until this week.  

I think that’s true. There is no question the Trump policy is harsher because under “zero tolerance” the parent is being charged with the crime of crossing illegal which automatically results in separation because alleged “criminals” are always separated from children until their case is adjudicated. This is where the problem lies. In the end though child separation was deemed ok under certain circumstances...it wasn’t evil but it was necessary. It still isn’t evil now...it is just a question as to whether it is necessary. 

mrussel1

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

So... then.. you being pro-choice - it's laughable if you believe something to be evil in this world or cry over how kids are being treated?

If you're pro-choice you do not have the right to criticize anything being evil or care for kids?

You absolutely have the right. I’m making a different point though. I think it is absolutely wrong for pro-life people to characterize pro-choice people as “evil”. Nobody who chooses to have an abortion is “evil”. It is a terrible choice a women has to make filled with complexity. Characterizing her or the provider as “evil” is evil in and of itself. The same goes with child separation during the course of illegal immigration. It is a complex issue. A child is brought across with a “parent”...it could 100% be a parent but it could also be a sex trafficer, a drug smuggler, criminal etc. Border patrol does not know and has to figure it out. It is not a decision that anybody wants to make but it has to be made. Does anybody on here want a child smuggled into sex-trafficking and/or slavery? Are the odds of that remote? Of course but it’s real. People need to stop labeling difficult yet necessary decisions as “evil”.

I'm not sure it's necessary.  I belieive Stephen Miller, in particular, sees this as a feature of the policy, not an unfortunate consequence.  

You could be right on Miller but it doesn’t make the policy any less necessary in some ways. There is a reason why a version of this policy existed under Obama.

My understanding is that under Obama, the separations only took place when there was reason to believe the child was in danger OR that he/she wasn't really the child of the person (using as mules).  There was no distinction under Trump's policy until this week.  

I think that’s true. There is no question the Trump policy is harsher because under “zero tolerance” the parent is being charged with the crime of crossing illegal which automatically results in separation because alleged “criminals” are always separated from children until their case is adjudicated. This is where the problem lies. In the end though child separation was deemed ok under certain circumstances...it wasn’t evil but it was necessary. It still isn’t evil now...it is just a question as to whether it is necessary. 

If it's unnecessary then it's cruel.  There were ways to enforce "zero tolerance" without forcing the separations.  Namely, they could have appointed substantially more judges or magistrates so that they could process the cases more timely without violating the Flores consent.  If they could do that, then they could have kept the families together.  Either they didn't think through that (stupid) or they didn't care (cruel).  

BS44325

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

So... then.. you being pro-choice - it's laughable if you believe something to be evil in this world or cry over how kids are being treated?

If you're pro-choice you do not have the right to criticize anything being evil or care for kids?

You absolutely have the right. I’m making a different point though. I think it is absolutely wrong for pro-life people to characterize pro-choice people as “evil”. Nobody who chooses to have an abortion is “evil”. It is a terrible choice a women has to make filled with complexity. Characterizing her or the provider as “evil” is evil in and of itself. The same goes with child separation during the course of illegal immigration. It is a complex issue. A child is brought across with a “parent”...it could 100% be a parent but it could also be a sex trafficer, a drug smuggler, criminal etc. Border patrol does not know and has to figure it out. It is not a decision that anybody wants to make but it has to be made. Does anybody on here want a child smuggled into sex-trafficking and/or slavery? Are the odds of that remote? Of course but it’s real. People need to stop labeling difficult yet necessary decisions as “evil”.

I'm not sure it's necessary.  I belieive Stephen Miller, in particular, sees this as a feature of the policy, not an unfortunate consequence.  

You could be right on Miller but it doesn’t make the policy any less necessary in some ways. There is a reason why a version of this policy existed under Obama.

My understanding is that under Obama, the separations only took place when there was reason to believe the child was in danger OR that he/she wasn't really the child of the person (using as mules).  There was no distinction under Trump's policy until this week.  

I think that’s true. There is no question the Trump policy is harsher because under “zero tolerance” the parent is being charged with the crime of crossing illegal which automatically results in separation because alleged “criminals” are always separated from children until their case is adjudicated. This is where the problem lies. In the end though child separation was deemed ok under certain circumstances...it wasn’t evil but it was necessary. It still isn’t evil now...it is just a question as to whether it is necessary. 

If it's unnecessary then it's cruel.  There were ways to enforce "zero tolerance" without forcing the separations.  Namely, they could have appointed substantially more judges or magistrates so that they could process the cases more timely without violating the Flores consent.  If they could do that, then they could have kept the families together.  Either they didn't think through that (stupid) or they didn't care (cruel).  

I think it’s a combination. Necessary, cruel, coupled with standard bureaucratic stupidity. In other words...government at it’s finest.

mrussel1

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

BS44325 said:

Spiritual_Chaos said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

So... then.. you being pro-choice - it's laughable if you believe something to be evil in this world or cry over how kids are being treated?

If you're pro-choice you do not have the right to criticize anything being evil or care for kids?

You absolutely have the right. I’m making a different point though. I think it is absolutely wrong for pro-life people to characterize pro-choice people as “evil”. Nobody who chooses to have an abortion is “evil”. It is a terrible choice a women has to make filled with complexity. Characterizing her or the provider as “evil” is evil in and of itself. The same goes with child separation during the course of illegal immigration. It is a complex issue. A child is brought across with a “parent”...it could 100% be a parent but it could also be a sex trafficer, a drug smuggler, criminal etc. Border patrol does not know and has to figure it out. It is not a decision that anybody wants to make but it has to be made. Does anybody on here want a child smuggled into sex-trafficking and/or slavery? Are the odds of that remote? Of course but it’s real. People need to stop labeling difficult yet necessary decisions as “evil”.

I'm not sure it's necessary.  I belieive Stephen Miller, in particular, sees this as a feature of the policy, not an unfortunate consequence.  

You could be right on Miller but it doesn’t make the policy any less necessary in some ways. There is a reason why a version of this policy existed under Obama.

My understanding is that under Obama, the separations only took place when there was reason to believe the child was in danger OR that he/she wasn't really the child of the person (using as mules).  There was no distinction under Trump's policy until this week.  

I think that’s true. There is no question the Trump policy is harsher because under “zero tolerance” the parent is being charged with the crime of crossing illegal which automatically results in separation because alleged “criminals” are always separated from children until their case is adjudicated. This is where the problem lies. In the end though child separation was deemed ok under certain circumstances...it wasn’t evil but it was necessary. It still isn’t evil now...it is just a question as to whether it is necessary. 

If it's unnecessary then it's cruel.  There were ways to enforce "zero tolerance" without forcing the separations.  Namely, they could have appointed substantially more judges or magistrates so that they could process the cases more timely without violating the Flores consent.  If they could do that, then they could have kept the families together.  Either they didn't think through that (stupid) or they didn't care (cruel).  

I think it’s a combination. Necessary, cruel, coupled with standard bureaucratic stupidity. In other words...government at it’s finest.

I pointed out somewhere else that of the 3 biggest policy blunders of this administration, Miller has led two of them; travel ban and this.  He's a neophyte and an ideologue.  That's not a good combination.  The third was the Obamacare bungle, but that was all on Trump since it wasn't really a "policy".  Miller might be a worse human being than Trump.  

josevolution

Separating children from parents is not necessary I’ll never agree with you on this at all I’m not sure I can come to this party you guys are holding..

Halifax2TheMax

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

How many “militant abortion rights” activists have killed how many “pro-life” activists, Professor? Talk about laughable.

Halifax2TheMax

BS44325 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

BS44325 said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

BS44325 said:

cincybearcat said:

So I guess we should get back on topic....

That trump guy sure is an egotistical asshat isn’t he?

A necessary egotistical asshat

As necessary as tapped wires, disappearing headlines, Repube sweeps in the midterms and re-election.

Hmmm. All these things are moving far closer to reality and not further away.

Based upon what? What are you using as facts to make those claims? Are you holding out hope that the IG will report the "wires were tapped," without the appropriate FISA law being applied and followed, Team Trump Treason and Russian collusion headlines haven't been prominent, no progression of Team Mueller's investigation and the repubes are well positioned to gain seats in the house and senate leading to Team Trump Treason's re-election? What have you got to back that up, professor. Go ahead school me.

Holding out hope? I am neither hoping or not hoping. As I have said let the evidence come forward and let the chips fall where they may. So far it seems pretty clear where the chips are leaning. We’ll have the origin report on Crossfire Hurricane soon enough.

The answers are a blowin’ in the wind.

BS44325

Halifax2TheMax said:

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

unsung said:

A high majority of it is being a sore loser from the election.

Laughable yeah he’s such a great American what a joke as long as he sticks up for your weapons who cares how many other fucked things he’s responsible for fucking up ! While you & I were sleeping last night there are toddlers & children crying themselves to sleep wth no one to comfort them just to let them know someone is there for them instead staff is told not to pick little kids up & conste them it’s evil and if you support it I’m throwing you in the same boat as this evil Baffoon !!

I’m pro choice but listening to militant abortion rights supporters cry over kids and throw around the word “evil” is far more laughable. 

How many “militant abortion rights” activists have killed how many “pro-life” activists, Professor? Talk about laughable.

One tried to take out a few at a baseball game

BS44325

josevolution said:

Separating children from parents is not necessary I’ll never agree with you on this at all I’m not sure I can come to this party you guys are holding..

It’s done everyday throughout both of our countries. A parent commits a crime and a child goes into the system. Nobody likes it but it doesn’t keep that parent out of jail.

cincybearcat

benjs said:

cincybearcat said:

my2hands said:

BS44325 said:

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

my2hands said:

Cincy is NO Trumper, he's on the right team and I have his back! Long time poster that is a good dude, and a fair dude 

Halifax, you're my hero, keep up the good fight!

Thirty, you might be the funniest anti-trumper ever. Golden Corral and shootin' shit!

MRussell... that dude needs to be POTUS, hes fucking smarter than all of us! (Except maybe Benjis, he might just be a damn genius!)

Scruffy... I'm worried you're going to vote Trump in 2020, so pop on Riot Act and have a few IPA's (thanks for being a teacher, we need more good ones like you!)

PJ_Soul... I think i'm in love lol

BS... are you wake and baking again??? lol

Unsung............. well........... I have to admit, his crazy ass is growing on me and I want to hang out with him, drink about 20 beers, talk politics, and turn him into a liberal LOL. I think he is really just a big softy

Brian...... who doesn't love Brian? He is wise, he is kind, and his eyes are always on the big picture. We could all learn from Brian

Jose......... Jose is what this country is all about. An immigrant who came to this country, who loves this country, and who has made this country a better place just by coming here. He works hard, he is a family man, and he believes in a better way.  I love me some Jose, and will ALWAYS have his back! Jose is the most American motherfucker up in here

There's the cast of characters. Now we just need the screen play. 

We need a meet up... Seattle, Missoula, Boston...???

I’m in the cast...does this mean I get to come? Or will I get red henned? My vote is Missoula btw. I’ll bring the weed.

Of course you get to come... we're gonna need a lot of weed...  I'm gonna turn you into a liberal too!

Unsung & BS will be commy hippies before you know it!

I vote for Seattle, Montana, or Boston cause I’ll only be in Chicago.

 Can I request a green-legal zone? I want to hear people say the things that most of us would have to be high to say, then I want to get them high and see what gets said.

Not for me yet. I got a job I want to keep. Meet ya in 2031 or maybe a few years later and I’m in.

mrussel1

BS44325 said:

josevolution said:

Separating children from parents is not necessary I’ll never agree with you on this at all I’m not sure I can come to this party you guys are holding..

It’s done everyday throughout both of our countries. A parent commits a crime and a child goes into the system. Nobody likes it but it doesn’t keep that parent out of jail.

People rarely go to jail for misdemeanors.  This is a bad analogy. 

Are you arguing that you would prefer the child gets separated and stays in the US while the parent is deported vs keeping them together and deporting together?