Donald Trump

ikiT

The omnipresent culture of INTIMIDATION that comes directly from this WH is dangerous. 
Normalizing this behavior, even for a second, no matter the cost, is caving into these fascist demands.   Think Marco Rubio.

I'm am not contending that my answer is the only acceptable one.  However, it is not hyperbole.

cincybearcat

ikiT said:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/holocaust-museum-warning-signs-fascism/

oftenreading

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

mrussel1 said:

ikiT said:

I contend the taxpayer funded "rally" is Fascism.

So communists, socialists, and other political philosophies could not have tax payer funded rallies?  What about when Obama would go to Silicon Valley and speak to business groups or employees at someplace like Cisco?  Fascism?  When does a 'speech' become a rally? Trump certainly has authoritarian tendencies and his worst impulses are likely closest to fascism, vs other political philosophies.  But many of those worst impulses have been checked by the courts, by Congress and even by some of his admin (increasingly few).  A fascist dictator would have none of these impulses checked.  

Hyperbole does not help the case to remove Trump.  He's terrible enough without it.  

When Obama gave speeches in Silicon Valley, were the employees told they would not be paid if they did not attend, and that furthermore they were not permitted to protest in any way? 

My guess is the employees Obama talked to were exempt employees, so it's not an accurate comparison.  But for the sake of argument, are you saying the Trump administration instructed the Shell management to to not pay them if they didn't show?  I have not read that the administration made that call and told Shell to go forth.
Do you pay non-exempt employees when they don't come to work and out of PTO?  I don't.  

"Work" is what you are hired to do, and paid to do. It's deliberately misleading for you to characterize this as "... when they don't come to work...". If you are hired for a specific job with specific hours, and then your company tries to say that you need to participate in a political rally instead of your actual job in order to get paid, then that is nothing more than bullshit. The company didn't have a mechanical issue, a power failure, a natural disaster, or other unexpected event that shut down the plant - they chose to shut down for the rally. Given that, they should have paid the employees who chose not to attend for their time, just as they paid the employees who "chose" to attend for their time, because otherwise they are discriminating on the basis of political views. 

mrussel1

oftenreading said:

mrussel1 said:

oftenreading said:

mrussel1 said:

ikiT said:

I contend the taxpayer funded "rally" is Fascism.

So communists, socialists, and other political philosophies could not have tax payer funded rallies?  What about when Obama would go to Silicon Valley and speak to business groups or employees at someplace like Cisco?  Fascism?  When does a 'speech' become a rally? Trump certainly has authoritarian tendencies and his worst impulses are likely closest to fascism, vs other political philosophies.  But many of those worst impulses have been checked by the courts, by Congress and even by some of his admin (increasingly few).  A fascist dictator would have none of these impulses checked.  

Hyperbole does not help the case to remove Trump.  He's terrible enough without it.  

When Obama gave speeches in Silicon Valley, were the employees told they would not be paid if they did not attend, and that furthermore they were not permitted to protest in any way? 

My guess is the employees Obama talked to were exempt employees, so it's not an accurate comparison.  But for the sake of argument, are you saying the Trump administration instructed the Shell management to to not pay them if they didn't show?  I have not read that the administration made that call and told Shell to go forth.
Do you pay non-exempt employees when they don't come to work and out of PTO?  I don't.  

"Work" is what you are hired to do, and paid to do. It's deliberately misleading for you to characterize this as "... when they don't come to work...". If you are hired for a specific job with specific hours, and then your company tries to say that you need to participate in a political rally instead of your actual job in order to get paid, then that is nothing more than bullshit. The company didn't have a mechanical issue, a power failure, a natural disaster, or other unexpected event that shut down the plant - they chose to shut down for the rally. Given that, they should have paid the employees who chose not to attend for their time, just as they paid the employees who "chose" to attend for their time, because otherwise they are discriminating on the basis of political views. 

If you go back and read what I wrote, I said the only one to be held 'to blame' in this would be Shell for choosing to shut down the factory for the political event.  That's a valid criticism, but not one that is unique and specific to this administration.  If the Trump admin threatened to pull a gov't contract if Shell didn't do so, then that would be authoritarian coercion.  But I have not seen anything that indicates that is what happened.  But factories shut down lines, eliminate shifts, close down for singular days when there is an overstock or supply chain issue all the time.  So you'll never have a union contract that guarantees that someone gets paid whether the line is open or not.  

ikiT

cincybearcat said:

ikiT said:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/holocaust-museum-warning-signs-fascism/

it's still a valid and truthful "list" no matter where it is, or isn't, for sale.

ikiT

Spiritual_Chaos

cincybearcat said:

ikiT said:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/holocaust-museum-warning-signs-fascism/

What do you wanna point out with your link?

Meltdown99

I do not know of any union that can conduct union activity on an employers property or at the employer-sponsored event.  And the employers have every right to set workplace rules (within reason) if they are paying you.

I'd love to see some of you conduct union activity on your employer's property while being paid...lmfao.

tempo_n_groove

ikiT said:

cincybearcat said:

ikiT said:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/holocaust-museum-warning-signs-fascism/

it's still a truthful "list" no matter where it is, or isn't, for sale.

This could be said about almost every Republican president before Trump more or less.  It's part of their platform so I wonder if the person that made this in 2003 wasn't happy with Dubya?

cincybearcat

ikiT said:

cincybearcat said:

ikiT said:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/holocaust-museum-warning-signs-fascism/

it's still a valid and truthful "list" no matter where it is, or isn't, for sale.

It's a list made up by a guy that ended up being used during GW admin and then sold as a poster.  Just stating the facts. I've seen it a bunch and think people should know where their pictures and memes come from.

tempo_n_groove

cincybearcat said:

ikiT said:

cincybearcat said:

ikiT said:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/holocaust-museum-warning-signs-fascism/

it's still a valid and truthful "list" no matter where it is, or isn't, for sale.

It's a list made up by a guy that ended up being used during GW admin and then sold as a poster.  Just stating the facts. I've seen it a bunch and think people should know where their pictures and memes come from.

This is funny, I wrote the same thing in a question though, lol!

mickeyrat

Spiritual_Chaos said:

cincybearcat said:

ikiT said:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/holocaust-museum-warning-signs-fascism/

What do you wanna point out with your link?

in part, I assume its this.....

The list was originally created by Laurence Britt in 2003, for an article published by Free Inquiry magazine (a publication for secular humanist commentary and analysis).  While subsequent postings of the list often attribute it to “Dr. Laurence Britt,” the author said that he was not actually a doctor (nor did he claim to be). Britt himself said that he could be more accurately described as an amateur historian:

ikiT

Is it FALSE though? 
The CFS is real.

mrussel1

ikiT said:

Is it FALSE though? 
The CFS is real.

You could apply just about everyone of those to stalinist Russia or even Argentina.  Yet communism is the ideological enemy of fascism. 

ikiT

I'm more worried about Trumpistan.

ikiT

carry on

ikiT

the Holocaust Museum poster is not as important as the actual definition.

fascism

 noun

fas·​cism | \ ˈfa-ˌshi-zəm also ˈfa-ˌsi-  \

Definition of fascism

1often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

2: a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control

ikiT

The culture of OVERT INTIMIDATION is BAD.

cincybearcat

ikiT said:

the Holocaust Museum poster is not as important as the actual definition.

fascism

 noun

fas·​cism | \ ˈfa-ˌshi-zəm also ˈfa-ˌsi-  \

Definition of fascism

1often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

2: a tendency toward or actual exercise of strong autocratic or dictatorial control

ikiT

mrussel1 said:

ikiT said:

Is it FALSE though? 
The CFS is real.

You could apply just about everyone of those to stalinist Russia or even Argentina.  Yet communism is the ideological enemy of fascism. 

I'm not that smart. 
Although....now I clearly see why DJT and the repubes are so busy LABELING the Socialists/Communists.