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Donald Trump

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    The people “in it” are not the failure.
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    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,631
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
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    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,833
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    benjs said:
    dignin said:
    As far as I can tell ... when you lose a historically winnable election because you ignored the facts of the race...and then you complain about the electoral college and 2 senators per state and talk of changing the system and claiming it’s unfair...

    you come across as a butthurt craybaby.

    But of course trump is worse so none of that matters. 
    Yes, people who want a more representational democracy are a bunch of butthurt crybabys.

    It makes perfect sense that a state that has a population of 1 million has the same power in the senate as a state with the population as 40 million.
    Do any of  you understand the concept of American Government? I think you all need a civics beginner level course.  

    Bicameral legislature - one representative (the House), and one equal by State (Senate) to ensure a single state does not have an overwhelming influence. It's a very good check and balance within the legislature. If you make the Senate representative, you might as well abolish it.

    I won't go into the reasons why this is genius (And it has nothing to do with the fact that Republicans control the Senate as that hasn't always been the case).  But, it is.
    the system is a failure.

    we have a president that has committed crimes and we cannot hold him responsible or punish him. we do not have republic or a democracy. we have the beginning of a monarchy.
    I think it's pre-emptive to say that the system is a failure until a failure to remove him from office. What would be fair to say at this point is that the due process established takes too long to deliver accountability. 

    Bear in mind, the reason that this isn't deemed a constitutional crisis at this point is because there is a due process which is being pursued as we speak. That's impeachment followed by the subsequent vote by the Senate. If and when it fails there, then it's a visible failure.
    the system isnt a failure, its the people working in it that are failing......
    It’s not even that. Please don’t conflate the two 
    It's impossible to separate the members of gov't from the Constitution.  They are completely intertwined and connected.  In this case, the whistleblower did their duty.  As did the staff that testified.  The Dems are doing their diligence as well.  Now the Republican Senators must do their duty for the system to work properly.  Mickey is dead on.  
    No, no he’s not “dead on.”
    Oh, I hadn't thought of it that way.  That's helpful.  
    Sorry Mick, you're wrong.  
    Yea, because you (general you) always throw the baby out with the bath water.
    I think that's how the saying goes.  So because the Republicans are failing in their duties, we should just scrap the Constitution?  
    I think improvements could be put on the table. 


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  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,631
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mickeyrat said:
    benjs said:
    dignin said:
    As far as I can tell ... when you lose a historically winnable election because you ignored the facts of the race...and then you complain about the electoral college and 2 senators per state and talk of changing the system and claiming it’s unfair...

    you come across as a butthurt craybaby.

    But of course trump is worse so none of that matters. 
    Yes, people who want a more representational democracy are a bunch of butthurt crybabys.

    It makes perfect sense that a state that has a population of 1 million has the same power in the senate as a state with the population as 40 million.
    Do any of  you understand the concept of American Government? I think you all need a civics beginner level course.  

    Bicameral legislature - one representative (the House), and one equal by State (Senate) to ensure a single state does not have an overwhelming influence. It's a very good check and balance within the legislature. If you make the Senate representative, you might as well abolish it.

    I won't go into the reasons why this is genius (And it has nothing to do with the fact that Republicans control the Senate as that hasn't always been the case).  But, it is.
    the system is a failure.

    we have a president that has committed crimes and we cannot hold him responsible or punish him. we do not have republic or a democracy. we have the beginning of a monarchy.
    I think it's pre-emptive to say that the system is a failure until a failure to remove him from office. What would be fair to say at this point is that the due process established takes too long to deliver accountability. 

    Bear in mind, the reason that this isn't deemed a constitutional crisis at this point is because there is a due process which is being pursued as we speak. That's impeachment followed by the subsequent vote by the Senate. If and when it fails there, then it's a visible failure.
    the system isnt a failure, its the people working in it that are failing......
    It’s not even that. Please don’t conflate the two 
    It's impossible to separate the members of gov't from the Constitution.  They are completely intertwined and connected.  In this case, the whistleblower did their duty.  As did the staff that testified.  The Dems are doing their diligence as well.  Now the Republican Senators must do their duty for the system to work properly.  Mickey is dead on.  
    No, no he’s not “dead on.”
    Oh, I hadn't thought of it that way.  That's helpful.  
    Sorry Mick, you're wrong.  
    Yea, because you (general you) always throw the baby out with the bath water.
    I think that's how the saying goes.  So because the Republicans are failing in their duties, we should just scrap the Constitution?  
    I think improvements could be put on the table. 


    No argument there.  And we have a process for it.  
  • Options
    gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 22,161
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Options
    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,833
    for one, the impeachment process shouldn't be handled by congress. it's a partisan joke. i know it's not a legal proceeding, so it can't be handled by the courts. but maybe an independent body that doesn't pander to the president or their constituents with the choices they make. 
    Flight Risk out NOW!

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    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,833
    maybe a Deep State Committee. 
    Flight Risk out NOW!

    www.headstonesband.com




  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,631
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    My point is that the Constitution survived much more stress than this moment in history.  I provided examples of those moments.  So by your own point, I agree.  Secession, Nullification, Habeas, etc, were far more dangerous moments in our country's history.  Trump not being convicted by the Senate is despicable, but not fatal.  Trump being convicted but refusing to leave, and the no action being taken would be fatal.  That's why I think this whole argument is hyperbolic.  
  • Options
    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,833
    god I'd love it if he refused to leave and was escorted out in cuffs for trespassing. 
    Flight Risk out NOW!

    www.headstonesband.com




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    mickeyratmickeyrat up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,798
    we're selling it wrong. Trump can be the singular stand alone in his field of president removed from office via impeachment conviction.

    He would be NUMBER 1......... Forever.......
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Options
    gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 22,161
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    My point is that the Constitution survived much more stress than this moment in history.  I provided examples of those moments.  So by your own point, I agree.  Secession, Nullification, Habeas, etc, were far more dangerous moments in our country's history.  Trump not being convicted by the Senate is despicable, but not fatal.  Trump being convicted but refusing to leave, and the no action being taken would be fatal.  That's why I think this whole argument is hyperbolic.  
    it is pretty pointless to argue. i am gonna just sit back and watch it burn.

    we all know how this is going to turn out. impeached in the house. not convicted in the senate. trump will use that to claim innocence. he will go to war on the campaign trail vs the democrats, lose the popular vote worse than he did last time, and be elected by the fucking god damned electoral college again. he will then get 2 more supreme court picks.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Options
    mickeyratmickeyrat up my ass, like Chadwick was up his Posts: 35,798
    edited December 2019
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    My point is that the Constitution survived much more stress than this moment in history.  I provided examples of those moments.  So by your own point, I agree.  Secession, Nullification, Habeas, etc, were far more dangerous moments in our country's history.  Trump not being convicted by the Senate is despicable, but not fatal.  Trump being convicted but refusing to leave, and the no action being taken would be fatal.  That's why I think this whole argument is hyperbolic.  
    it is pretty pointless to argue. i am gonna just sit back and watch it burn.

    we all know how this is going to turn out. impeached in the house. not convicted in the senate. trump will use that to claim innocence. he will go to war on the campaign trail vs the democrats, lose the popular vote worse than he did last time, and be elected by the fucking god damned electoral college again. he will then get 2 more supreme court picks.
      someone will try assassination....
    Post edited by mickeyrat on
    _____________________________________SIGNATURE________________________________________________

    Not today Sir, Probably not tomorrow.............................................. bayfront arena st. pete '94
    you're finally here and I'm a mess................................................... nationwide arena columbus '10
    memories like fingerprints are slowly raising.................................... first niagara center buffalo '13
    another man ..... moved by sleight of hand...................................... joe louis arena detroit '14
  • Options
    gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 22,161
    mickeyrat said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    My point is that the Constitution survived much more stress than this moment in history.  I provided examples of those moments.  So by your own point, I agree.  Secession, Nullification, Habeas, etc, were far more dangerous moments in our country's history.  Trump not being convicted by the Senate is despicable, but not fatal.  Trump being convicted but refusing to leave, and the no action being taken would be fatal.  That's why I think this whole argument is hyperbolic.  
    it is pretty pointless to argue. i am gonna just sit back and watch it burn.

    we all know how this is going to turn out. impeached in the house. not convicted in the senate. trump will use that to claim innocence. he will go to war on the campaign trail vs the democrats, lose the popular vote worse than he did last time, and be elected by the fucking god damned electoral college again. he will then get 2 more supreme court picks.
      someone will try assassination....
    i don't think so. if that happened, THAT might be a deep state conspiracy...
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Options
    gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 22,161
    mickeyrat said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    My point is that the Constitution survived much more stress than this moment in history.  I provided examples of those moments.  So by your own point, I agree.  Secession, Nullification, Habeas, etc, were far more dangerous moments in our country's history.  Trump not being convicted by the Senate is despicable, but not fatal.  Trump being convicted but refusing to leave, and the no action being taken would be fatal.  That's why I think this whole argument is hyperbolic.  
    it is pretty pointless to argue. i am gonna just sit back and watch it burn.

    we all know how this is going to turn out. impeached in the house. not convicted in the senate. trump will use that to claim innocence. he will go to war on the campaign trail vs the democrats, lose the popular vote worse than he did last time, and be elected by the fucking god damned electoral college again. he will then get 2 more supreme court picks.
      someone will try assassination....
    sure, he is hated the world over, but the governments of other countries have pretty much rendered him powerless on the world stage. i think ridicule has been a better weapon against him than anything else.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Options
    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,833
    mickeyrat said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    My point is that the Constitution survived much more stress than this moment in history.  I provided examples of those moments.  So by your own point, I agree.  Secession, Nullification, Habeas, etc, were far more dangerous moments in our country's history.  Trump not being convicted by the Senate is despicable, but not fatal.  Trump being convicted but refusing to leave, and the no action being taken would be fatal.  That's why I think this whole argument is hyperbolic.  
    it is pretty pointless to argue. i am gonna just sit back and watch it burn.

    we all know how this is going to turn out. impeached in the house. not convicted in the senate. trump will use that to claim innocence. he will go to war on the campaign trail vs the democrats, lose the popular vote worse than he did last time, and be elected by the fucking god damned electoral college again. he will then get 2 more supreme court picks.
      someone will try assassination....
    god I honestly hope not. turning that POS into a martyr is the last thing anyone needs. 
    Flight Risk out NOW!

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  • Options
    KatKat There's a lot to be said for nowhere. Posts: 4,772
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    Falling down,...not staying down
  • Options
    gimmesometruth27gimmesometruth27 St. Fuckin Louis Posts: 22,161
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    i think it is an effective add, but i question the timing. why say this in the middle of the dem primary? wouldn't this be better used in the campaign directly vs trump once there is a nominee?

    biden is forgetting the absolutely short attention span and short memory of the average american voter. a lot can happen in the next 11 months before the general election that will make people forget all about this ad.
    There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self.- Hemingway

    "Well, you tell him that I don't talk to suckas."
  • Options
    dignindignin Posts: 9,303
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    i think it is an effective add, but i question the timing. why say this in the middle of the dem primary? wouldn't this be better used in the campaign directly vs trump once there is a nominee?

    biden is forgetting the absolutely short attention span and short memory of the average american voter. a lot can happen in the next 11 months before the general election that will make people forget all about this ad.
    Biden is fighting for his life in the primary, he's got to use everything he has.
  • Options
    Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom's Posts: 17,969
    mickeyrat said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    My point is that the Constitution survived much more stress than this moment in history.  I provided examples of those moments.  So by your own point, I agree.  Secession, Nullification, Habeas, etc, were far more dangerous moments in our country's history.  Trump not being convicted by the Senate is despicable, but not fatal.  Trump being convicted but refusing to leave, and the no action being taken would be fatal.  That's why I think this whole argument is hyperbolic.  
    it is pretty pointless to argue. i am gonna just sit back and watch it burn.

    we all know how this is going to turn out. impeached in the house. not convicted in the senate. trump will use that to claim innocence. he will go to war on the campaign trail vs the democrats, lose the popular vote worse than he did last time, and be elected by the fucking god damned electoral college again. he will then get 2 more supreme court picks.
      someone will try assassination....
    no way...if they haven't yet they never will
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
    2020: Oakland, Oakland:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
    2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
    2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
  • Options
    Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom's Posts: 17,969
    dignin said:
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    i think it is an effective add, but i question the timing. why say this in the middle of the dem primary? wouldn't this be better used in the campaign directly vs trump once there is a nominee?

    biden is forgetting the absolutely short attention span and short memory of the average american voter. a lot can happen in the next 11 months before the general election that will make people forget all about this ad.
    Biden is fighting for his life in the primary, he's got to use everything he has.
    polls say otherwise
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
    2020: Oakland, Oakland:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
    2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
    2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
  • Options
    Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom's Posts: 17,969
    edited December 2019
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.


    dignin said:
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    i think it is an effective add, but i question the timing. why say this in the middle of the dem primary? wouldn't this be better used in the campaign directly vs trump once there is a nominee?

    biden is forgetting the absolutely short attention span and short memory of the average american voter. a lot can happen in the next 11 months before the general election that will make people forget all about this ad.
    Biden is fighting for his life in the primary, he's got to use everything he has.
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
    2020: Oakland, Oakland:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
    2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
    2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
  • Options
    Gern BlanstenGern Blansten Your Mom's Posts: 17,969
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    love it....I would hammer tRump with as much humiliating stuff as possible.  The toilet paper on the shoe, the inability to use an unbrella, his hair nest blowing in the wind, pictures of him looking fat, etc.
    Remember the Thomas Nine !! (10/02/2018)

    1998: Noblesville; 2003: Noblesville; 2009: EV Nashville, Chicago, Chicago
    2010: St Louis, Columbus, Noblesville; 2011: EV Chicago, East Troy, East Troy
    2013: London ON, Chicago; 2014: Cincy, St Louis, Moline (NO CODE)
    2016: Lexington, Wrigley #1; 2018: Wrigley, Wrigley, Boston, Boston
    2020: Oakland, Oakland:  2021: EV Ohana, Ohana, Ohana, Ohana
    2022: Oakland, Oakland, Nashville, Louisville; 2023: Chicago, Chicago, Noblesville
    2024: Noblesville, Wrigley, Wrigley, Ohana, Ohana
  • Options
    dignindignin Posts: 9,303
    dignin said:
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    i think it is an effective add, but i question the timing. why say this in the middle of the dem primary? wouldn't this be better used in the campaign directly vs trump once there is a nominee?

    biden is forgetting the absolutely short attention span and short memory of the average american voter. a lot can happen in the next 11 months before the general election that will make people forget all about this ad.
    Biden is fighting for his life in the primary, he's got to use everything he has.
    polls say otherwise
    Look at the fundraising, it's about the money. He was getting crushed but maybe he's doing better now since he's decided to take big money.
  • Options
    jeffbrjeffbr Seattle Posts: 7,177
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    i think it is an effective add, but i question the timing. why say this in the middle of the dem primary? wouldn't this be better used in the campaign directly vs trump once there is a nominee?

    biden is forgetting the absolutely short attention span and short memory of the average american voter. a lot can happen in the next 11 months before the general election that will make people forget all about this ad.
    He can certainly run the ad again during the generals, but I for one am happy to see him use this now. I have questioned whether Joe still had any fight in him. I've loved the ads Bloomberg and Steyer have been running, directly calling out Trump and calling him a fraud and a failure. I'm happy to see Biden join the fray. I think every Dem should be running these kinds of ads. Show us that you have what it takes to go against Trump head-on.
    "I'll use the magic word - let's just shut the fuck up, please." EV, 04/13/08
  • Options
    cincybearcatcincybearcat Posts: 16,108
    mickeyrat said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    My point is that the Constitution survived much more stress than this moment in history.  I provided examples of those moments.  So by your own point, I agree.  Secession, Nullification, Habeas, etc, were far more dangerous moments in our country's history.  Trump not being convicted by the Senate is despicable, but not fatal.  Trump being convicted but refusing to leave, and the no action being taken would be fatal.  That's why I think this whole argument is hyperbolic.  
    it is pretty pointless to argue. i am gonna just sit back and watch it burn.

    we all know how this is going to turn out. impeached in the house. not convicted in the senate. trump will use that to claim innocence. he will go to war on the campaign trail vs the democrats, lose the popular vote worse than he did last time, and be elected by the fucking god damned electoral college again. he will then get 2 more supreme court picks.
      someone will try assassination....
    no way...if they haven't yet they never will
    Was talking a bit about this with a friend recently.  We decided the Secret Service is the top organization in our country.  There were no close attempts on the first black president or the racist one that followed him.  Amazing job.  Glad to, that can only make everything worse.
    hippiemom = goodness
  • Options
    mrussel1mrussel1 Posts: 28,631
    mickeyrat said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    mrussel1 said:
    Please... calling it a failure because it's under stress is total hyperbole.  It's the longest running Constitution.  That's hardly a failure.  
    the longest running anything eventually fails. it is not hyperbole. it is a fact.
    It hasn't failed.
    it is in the process of failing now!! open your eyes. the checks and balances are not fucking checking or balancing.
    Failed and failing are different tenses.  It hasn't failed.  If Trump isn't removed from office, it still hasn't failed because the process followed the Constitution.  I would argue the Republicans have failed in their duties for sure.  And a pox on them for it.  Until elections are cancelled or the military overtakes the civilian the government, or something like that, it hasn't failed.  The Constitution didn't fail when Lincoln suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus and I would argue that was far, far more dangerous to the Republic than the good Senator from Nebraska voting no on the impeachment articles.  I'm fully awake, but my eyes have a long historical lens.  
    when did secession and outright open rebellion against the united states and what the president has done- breaching of the emoluments clause/soliciting help from a foreign goverment to win and election, and extorting an ally all become equated? that is apples to oranges. the southern states bolted on their fear of what lincoln would do to infringe on their rights. in this case the president committed crimes. the people agree, and the republicans in government are doing nothing about it. you are comparing two entirely different historical scenarios.

    we are nowhere near a civil war here, but if trump walks from this, the country will take a generation to recover.
    My point is that the Constitution survived much more stress than this moment in history.  I provided examples of those moments.  So by your own point, I agree.  Secession, Nullification, Habeas, etc, were far more dangerous moments in our country's history.  Trump not being convicted by the Senate is despicable, but not fatal.  Trump being convicted but refusing to leave, and the no action being taken would be fatal.  That's why I think this whole argument is hyperbolic.  
    it is pretty pointless to argue. i am gonna just sit back and watch it burn.

    we all know how this is going to turn out. impeached in the house. not convicted in the senate. trump will use that to claim innocence. he will go to war on the campaign trail vs the democrats, lose the popular vote worse than he did last time, and be elected by the fucking god damned electoral college again. he will then get 2 more supreme court picks.
      someone will try assassination....
    no way...if they haven't yet they never will
    Was talking a bit about this with a friend recently.  We decided the Secret Service is the top organization in our country.  There were no close attempts on the first black president or the racist one that followed him.  Amazing job.  Glad to, that can only make everything worse.
    Shockingly, Trump hasn't politicized them yet. 
  • Options
    stuckinlinestuckinline Posts: 3,359
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    love it....I would hammer tRump with as much humiliating stuff as possible.  The toilet paper on the shoe, the inability to use an unbrella, his hair nest blowing in the wind, pictures of him looking fat, etc.
    Don't forgot Melania pushing his hand away. 
  • Options
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    love it....I would hammer tRump with as much humiliating stuff as possible.  The toilet paper on the shoe, the inability to use an unbrella, his hair nest blowing in the wind, pictures of him looking fat, etc.
    Don't forgot Melania pushing his hand away. 
    Or sharts alive.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN;

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  • Options
    HughFreakingDillonHughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 35,833
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    love it....I would hammer tRump with as much humiliating stuff as possible.  The toilet paper on the shoe, the inability to use an unbrella, his hair nest blowing in the wind, pictures of him looking fat, etc.
    Don't forgot Melania pushing his hand away. 
    Or sharts alive.
    that was photoshopped, was it not?

    posting tweets of him complaining about obama's golf, then followed by obama's actual golf numbers next to trump's would also be a good visual. 

    or any of his "there's a tweet for anything" hypocrisies. 
    Flight Risk out NOW!

    www.headstonesband.com




  • Options
    Kat said:
    CM189191 said:
    Good to see Joe fighting back hard. That ad takes on things soul-eater ran on last time.

    love it....I would hammer tRump with as much humiliating stuff as possible.  The toilet paper on the shoe, the inability to use an unbrella, his hair nest blowing in the wind, pictures of him looking fat, etc.
    Don't forgot Melania pushing his hand away. 
    Or sharts alive.
    that was photoshopped, was it not?

    posting tweets of him complaining about obama's golf, then followed by obama's actual golf numbers next to trump's would also be a good visual. 

    or any of his "there's a tweet for anything" hypocrisies. 
    No idea but Team Trump Treason is dependable. To play golf.
    09/15/1998 & 09/16/1998, Mansfield, MA; 08/29/00 08/30/00, Mansfield, MA; 07/02/03, 07/03/03, Mansfield, MA; 09/28/04, 09/29/04, Boston, MA; 09/22/05, Halifax, NS; 05/24/06, 05/25/06, Boston, MA; 07/22/06, 07/23/06, Gorge, WA; 06/27/2008, Hartford; 06/28/08, 06/30/08, Mansfield; 08/18/2009, O2, London, UK; 10/30/09, 10/31/09, Philadelphia, PA; 05/15/10, Hartford, CT; 05/17/10, Boston, MA; 05/20/10, 05/21/10, NY, NY; 06/22/10, Dublin, IRE; 06/23/10, Northern Ireland; 09/03/11, 09/04/11, Alpine Valley, WI; 09/11/11, 09/12/11, Toronto, Ont; 09/14/11, Ottawa, Ont; 09/15/11, Hamilton, Ont; 07/02/2012, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/04/2012 & 07/05/2012, Berlin, Germany; 07/07/2012, Stockholm, Sweden; 09/30/2012, Missoula, MT; 07/16/2013, London, Ont; 07/19/2013, Chicago, IL; 10/15/2013 & 10/16/2013, Worcester, MA; 10/21/2013 & 10/22/2013, Philadelphia, PA; 10/25/2013, Hartford, CT; 11/29/2013, Portland, OR; 11/30/2013, Spokane, WA; 12/04/2013, Vancouver, BC; 12/06/2013, Seattle, WA; 10/03/2014, St. Louis. MO; 10/22/2014, Denver, CO; 10/26/2015, New York, NY; 04/23/2016, New Orleans, LA; 04/28/2016 & 04/29/2016, Philadelphia, PA; 05/01/2016 & 05/02/2016, New York, NY; 05/08/2016, Ottawa, Ont.; 05/10/2016 & 05/12/2016, Toronto, Ont.; 08/05/2016 & 08/07/2016, Boston, MA; 08/20/2016 & 08/22/2016, Chicago, IL; 07/01/2018, Prague, Czech Republic; 07/03/2018, Krakow, Poland; 07/05/2018, Berlin, Germany; 09/02/2018 & 09/04/2018, Boston, MA; 09/08/2022, Toronto, Ont; 09/11/2022, New York, NY; 09/14/2022, Camden, NJ; 09/02/2023, St. Paul, MN;

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