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  • JC29856
    JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    edited January 2017

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    You mean employers hire illegals? Why isn't this ever a part of the illegal immigration discussion?
    I often wonder this myself... go after the employers. I wonder why they never go after the businesses that hire illegals?? Hmm.
  • Go Beavers
    Go Beavers Posts: 9,537

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    Yep, all the illegal immigrants come over to the USA and pay for health care and school 100% out of pocket.

    We have plenty of poor citizens that need help too and are overlooked.

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    Yep, all the illegal immigrants come over to the USA and pay for health care and school 100% out of pocket.

    We have plenty of poor citizens that need help too and are overlooked.
    No need to get zippy. I was asking to see what info people had.
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,449
    JC29856 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    You mean employers hire illegals? Why isn't this ever a part of the illegal immigration discussion?
    I often wonder this myself... go after the employers. I wonder why they never go after the businesses that hire illegals?? Hmm.
    well it CAN'T be because those we elect to power practice this very thing, can it? NOOOOO, can't be! :smirk:
    Hugh Freaking Dillon is currently out of the office, returning sometime in the fall




  • Go Beavers
    Go Beavers Posts: 9,537
    I wonder how many illegals would be here if no one hired them?
  • JC29856
    JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    edited January 2017

    JC29856 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    You mean employers hire illegals? Why isn't this ever a part of the illegal immigration discussion?
    I often wonder this myself... go after the employers. I wonder why they never go after the businesses that hire illegals?? Hmm.
    well it CAN'T be because those we elect to power practice this very thing, can it? NOOOOO, can't be! :smirk:
    ah ha... "domestic workers"!
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,650
    JC29856 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    They at least pay sales taxes though, and contribute to the economy by spending that cash. They also create the markets that other businesses profit from.
    Except that $25billion earned USD are remitted back to Mexico annually.
    Well, that's a whole lot less that this wall is going to cost. ;)
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,650

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    You mean employers hire illegals? Why isn't this ever a part of the illegal immigration discussion?
    They should lose their businesses. But illegals should also be given a way to work legally before they actually have status (under certain conditions, obviously). It's not like most workers want to be paid less than everyone else. If they could work legitimately, they probably would. The government needs to straighten this chicken/egg issue out.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,650
    JC29856 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    according to the report posted above, they pay in about $14 billion fed state and local, lets assume that the report underestimated the illegal immigrant "inflows" and add $7B to put the total at $21B, if they cost $34B then your still in the hole $13B.
    Is $13B an acceptable amount to subsidize illegal immigration?
    When you take their overall contribution to the US economy, absolutely. Especially considering that Trump's wall will cost many, many times that amount.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499
    JC29856 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    You mean employers hire illegals? Why isn't this ever a part of the illegal immigration discussion?
    I often wonder this myself... go after the employers. I wonder why they never go after the businesses that hire illegals?? Hmm.
    I'm pretty sure this is addressed as part of Trump's immigration plan that someone posted a couple pages ago.
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,650

    JC29856 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    You mean employers hire illegals? Why isn't this ever a part of the illegal immigration discussion?
    I often wonder this myself... go after the employers. I wonder why they never go after the businesses that hire illegals?? Hmm.
    well it CAN'T be because those we elect to power practice this very thing, can it? NOOOOO, can't be! :smirk:
    Definitely not! :tongue: It's absolutely amazing to me that Trump voters just willfully ignore the concrete fact that Trump hiimself has purposefully employed illegal workers, lol. :dizzy:
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • JC29856
    JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    Nationwide, unauthorized immigrants are clustered in a few occupations, notably farming, fishing and forestry (26 percent of the workforce), building and grounds (17 percent), and construction and mining (14 percent). They comprise 24 percent of all groundskeepers, 23 percent of domestic workers and 20 percent of those in clothing manufacture.
  • PJ_Soul
    PJ_Soul Vancouver, BC Posts: 50,650
    JC29856 said:

    Nationwide, unauthorized immigrants are clustered in a few occupations, notably farming, fishing and forestry (26 percent of the workforce), building and grounds (17 percent), and construction and mining (14 percent). They comprise 24 percent of all groundskeepers, 23 percent of domestic workers and 20 percent of those in clothing manufacture.

    Wouldn't it be horrible if all those workers suddenly disappeared? There aren't anywhere near enough Americans willing to fill them.
    With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be careful. Strive to be happy. ~ Desiderata
  • JC29856 said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    here is a nice summary
    http://www.fairus.org/publications/the-fiscal-burden-of-illegal-immigration-on-united-states-taxpayers

    lets for the sake of argument assume that the report is 70% inaccurate or over-estimated....is $34 billion illegal immigration annual costs acceptable?
    Your summary comes from FAIR. This is a group whose leaders work with white supremacy groups and whose founder expressed wishes that america remain a majority white nation. I suggest you get your information elsewhere.
  • Go Beavers
    Go Beavers Posts: 9,537
    PJPOWER said:

    JC29856 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    You mean employers hire illegals? Why isn't this ever a part of the illegal immigration discussion?
    I often wonder this myself... go after the employers. I wonder why they never go after the businesses that hire illegals?? Hmm.
    I'm pretty sure this is addressed as part of Trump's immigration plan that someone posted a couple pages ago.
    I don't remember seeing that. Maybe the 5,000 new federal employees could focus on businesses who hire illegals? I'm sure that's his plan!
  • CM189191
    CM189191 Posts: 6,927
    this man is an embarrassment. By that I mean he is embarrassed about his tiny tiny hands

    Trump has picture hanging in the white house photoshopped to make his hand bigger
  • JC29856
    JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    PJ_Soul said:

    JC29856 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    You mean employers hire illegals? Why isn't this ever a part of the illegal immigration discussion?
    I often wonder this myself... go after the employers. I wonder why they never go after the businesses that hire illegals?? Hmm.
    well it CAN'T be because those we elect to power practice this very thing, can it? NOOOOO, can't be! :smirk:
    Definitely not! :tongue: It's absolutely amazing to me that Trump voters just willfully ignore the concrete fact that Trump hiimself has purposefully employed illegal workers, lol. :dizzy:
    Ive heard this argument before and I guess you could argue hypocrisy but for profit businesses are for profit, government not so much.
    If a requirement for being president was that you could have never hired an illegal immigrant then most couldn't become president.
    Presidential Application Questions
    Who cleans your homes? US citizen?
    Who cuts your lawns? US citizen?
    Who cleans your pools? US citizen?

  • JC29856
    JC29856 Posts: 9,617

    JC29856 said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    here is a nice summary
    http://www.fairus.org/publications/the-fiscal-burden-of-illegal-immigration-on-united-states-taxpayers

    lets for the sake of argument assume that the report is 70% inaccurate or over-estimated....is $34 billion illegal immigration annual costs acceptable?
    Your summary comes from FAIR. This is a group whose leaders work with white supremacy groups and whose founder expressed wishes that america remain a majority white nation. I suggest you get your information elsewhere.
    Ive already factored in the white supremacist margin of error of 70%? I thought I was being generous at 70%. You have any other data that may have a smaller margin of error?
  • HughFreakingDillon
    HughFreakingDillon Winnipeg Posts: 39,449
    PJ_Soul said:

    JC29856 said:

    Nationwide, unauthorized immigrants are clustered in a few occupations, notably farming, fishing and forestry (26 percent of the workforce), building and grounds (17 percent), and construction and mining (14 percent). They comprise 24 percent of all groundskeepers, 23 percent of domestic workers and 20 percent of those in clothing manufacture.

    Wouldn't it be horrible if all those workers suddenly disappeared? There aren't anywhere near enough Americans willing to fill them.
    this was going to be my next point. the economy will grind to a halt, if not ignite a monster recession. the main reason all these illegals are employed in the first place is because it is simply not worth it for americans to work those jobs for the wages they pay. if these employers are forced to pay wages that are along legal guidelines, either prices skyrocket, or the business cease to operate; probably both. either way, everyday americans simply will not be able to afford the new prices on housing, clothing, etc, etc. how is trump going to deal with this?

    probably blame obama.
    Hugh Freaking Dillon is currently out of the office, returning sometime in the fall




  • PJPOWER
    PJPOWER Posts: 6,499

    PJPOWER said:

    JC29856 said:

    PJ_Soul said:

    Shocking to see that ignoring immigration laws has led to unrest and infighting in the country, and even helped elect Donald Trump.

    Better money be spent on a wall or security and funding agencies helping speed up the legal immigration process, than just letting anyone come in the country and paying their expenses.

    The left failed to compute that the total disregard of laws like in sanctuary cities would eventually piss some people off.

    The USA would be a lot better off if the laws on the books were followed and if they need changing, Congress changed them instead of some executive order that gets reversed every 4 to 8 years.

    What expenses for illegal immigrants are taxpayers paying for?
    I dunno, since they also pay taxes. The fact is, illegal immigrants ultimately help the US economy, and getting rid of them would be absolutely disastrous for the US economy. Funny how that never seems to be a topic of conversation.
    I am sure they are all paying their taxes and not getting paid in cash.
    You mean employers hire illegals? Why isn't this ever a part of the illegal immigration discussion?
    I often wonder this myself... go after the employers. I wonder why they never go after the businesses that hire illegals?? Hmm.
    I'm pretty sure this is addressed as part of Trump's immigration plan that someone posted a couple pages ago.
    I don't remember seeing that. Maybe the 5,000 new federal employees could focus on businesses who hire illegals? I'm sure that's his plan!


    "9. Turn off the jobs and benefits magnet. Many immigrants come to the U.S. illegally in search of jobs, even though federal law prohibits the employment of illegal immigrants."
    https://www.donaldjtrump.com/policies/immigration/
  • JC29856
    JC29856 Posts: 9,617
    edited January 2017

    PJ_Soul said:

    JC29856 said:

    Nationwide, unauthorized immigrants are clustered in a few occupations, notably farming, fishing and forestry (26 percent of the workforce), building and grounds (17 percent), and construction and mining (14 percent). They comprise 24 percent of all groundskeepers, 23 percent of domestic workers and 20 percent of those in clothing manufacture.

    Wouldn't it be horrible if all those workers suddenly disappeared? There aren't anywhere near enough Americans willing to fill them.
    this was going to be my next point. the economy will grind to a halt, if not ignite a monster recession. the main reason all these illegals are employed in the first place is because it is simply not worth it for americans to work those jobs for the wages they pay. if these employers are forced to pay wages that are along legal guidelines, either prices skyrocket, or the business cease to operate; probably both. either way, everyday americans simply will not be able to afford the new prices on housing, clothing, etc, etc. how is trump going to deal with this?

    probably blame obama.
    one sided argument ignoring the hire paying wage effect
    or maybe the economy will become buoyant, with real wage increases...were all better off when were all better off.
    Post edited by JC29856 on
This discussion has been closed.