Only 2 Drummers Get In? RnRHOF. Merged

HughFreakingDillon

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

it doesn't matter if Jack was responsible for keeping them together. the hall has nothing to do with that. if it did, they'd have to induct managers, wives, friends, yoga instructors, psychologists, Metallica's therapist, etc, etc.

My comment was in response to SC who said I romanticized JI's role in the band.

I'm not saying JI deserves to be inducted w/ the band, I'm saying DA's contribution is way overstated as compared to JI.

I'm surprised ANY drummers besides Cameron are getting in.

well, the only role you stated about jack was the spiritual one, which I don't think qualifies as a consideration. Anyway, we might be talking apples and oranges here.

I think Dave's contributions were huge, drumming wise. they played their heaviest shit when they needed to play their heaviest shit. not that this SHOULD matter, but when speaking of the Hall, it seems to: he played on their two biggest commerically successful albums that were not Ten.

I also quoted Brendan O'Brien as saying the band was barely communicating at the time, but seemed to act professional around JI - I don't think that quote should be overlooked or dismissed.

IDK.... read the article I linked if you get the chance. That, and other articles I read not too long ago paint a picture of a band on the verge of imploding, and it seems like JI brought them back together (Jeff didn't even know the band had started sessions on NC, it sound's like a pretty dark time for them - I'll see if I can't dig up the other articles I recall reading a little later)

As someone else mentioned, I feel like VS & Vitalogy were going to happen regardless of whatever drummer they found. After reading the articles I did, it seemed like NC & Yield never would have happened had JI not come along.

Regarding their meteoric rise to fame during DA's tenure - I think that had as much if not more to do with the whole grunge / alternative movement of the time as it did whomever was behind the kit. I feel like it would have happened regardless of who played drums at the time, that's my $0.02.

Peace.

I don't disagree with Jack's influence on the band's communication skills. All I'm saying is that I don't think that should factor in to who gets into the hall, that's all.

I think Matt should be the only drummer inducted. He helped them out before any other drummer, and he's been with them the longest. But if you induct Dave K, you open a can of worms for the others.

Merkin Baller

HughFreakingDillon said:

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

it doesn't matter if Jack was responsible for keeping them together. the hall has nothing to do with that. if it did, they'd have to induct managers, wives, friends, yoga instructors, psychologists, Metallica's therapist, etc, etc.

My comment was in response to SC who said I romanticized JI's role in the band.

I'm not saying JI deserves to be inducted w/ the band, I'm saying DA's contribution is way overstated as compared to JI.

I'm surprised ANY drummers besides Cameron are getting in.

well, the only role you stated about jack was the spiritual one, which I don't think qualifies as a consideration. Anyway, we might be talking apples and oranges here.

I think Dave's contributions were huge, drumming wise. they played their heaviest shit when they needed to play their heaviest shit. not that this SHOULD matter, but when speaking of the Hall, it seems to: he played on their two biggest commerically successful albums that were not Ten.

I also quoted Brendan O'Brien as saying the band was barely communicating at the time, but seemed to act professional around JI - I don't think that quote should be overlooked or dismissed.

IDK.... read the article I linked if you get the chance. That, and other articles I read not too long ago paint a picture of a band on the verge of imploding, and it seems like JI brought them back together (Jeff didn't even know the band had started sessions on NC, it sound's like a pretty dark time for them - I'll see if I can't dig up the other articles I recall reading a little later)

As someone else mentioned, I feel like VS & Vitalogy were going to happen regardless of whatever drummer they found. After reading the articles I did, it seemed like NC & Yield never would have happened had JI not come along.

Regarding their meteoric rise to fame during DA's tenure - I think that had as much if not more to do with the whole grunge / alternative movement of the time as it did whomever was behind the kit. I feel like it would have happened regardless of who played drums at the time, that's my $0.02.

Peace.

I don't disagree with Jack's influence on the band's communication skills. All I'm saying is that I don't think that should factor in to who gets into the hall, that's all.

I think Matt should be the only drummer inducted. He helped them out before any other drummer, and he's been with them the longest. But if you induct Dave K, you open a can of worms for the others.

I agree on both of your points.

I predicted (wrongly) that Matt would be the only drummer inducted w/ the band, and I would have been fine with that. I don't necessarily care that DK gets in, but to me it's an odd inclusion as compared to what DA & JI both brought to the table.

Merkin Baller

mcgruff10 said:

PJ_Soul said:

I really couldn't care less if Dave A is included... I guess I care a little more about Jack, but meh, whatever. Seems to me that the Hall of Fame has rules, and they are following the rules. Good enough for me, and PJ should respect the rules. I assume that rule is to prevent a dozen people from one band being inducted, even if half of them barely did anything over the years. Makes sense.
I can't fucking believe anyone is suggesting that PJ boycott the HoF for the sake of Dave A, lmao.

yes boycott for Dave A! lol
In fact, please please please don't try to get tickets for the ceremony. And obviously if your fan club number is below 139XXX you should quit the 10c immediately.

Sage advice.

HughFreakingDillon

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

it doesn't matter if Jack was responsible for keeping them together. the hall has nothing to do with that. if it did, they'd have to induct managers, wives, friends, yoga instructors, psychologists, Metallica's therapist, etc, etc.

My comment was in response to SC who said I romanticized JI's role in the band.

I'm not saying JI deserves to be inducted w/ the band, I'm saying DA's contribution is way overstated as compared to JI.

I'm surprised ANY drummers besides Cameron are getting in.

well, the only role you stated about jack was the spiritual one, which I don't think qualifies as a consideration. Anyway, we might be talking apples and oranges here.

I think Dave's contributions were huge, drumming wise. they played their heaviest shit when they needed to play their heaviest shit. not that this SHOULD matter, but when speaking of the Hall, it seems to: he played on their two biggest commerically successful albums that were not Ten.

I also quoted Brendan O'Brien as saying the band was barely communicating at the time, but seemed to act professional around JI - I don't think that quote should be overlooked or dismissed.

IDK.... read the article I linked if you get the chance. That, and other articles I read not too long ago paint a picture of a band on the verge of imploding, and it seems like JI brought them back together (Jeff didn't even know the band had started sessions on NC, it sound's like a pretty dark time for them - I'll see if I can't dig up the other articles I recall reading a little later)

As someone else mentioned, I feel like VS & Vitalogy were going to happen regardless of whatever drummer they found. After reading the articles I did, it seemed like NC & Yield never would have happened had JI not come along.

Regarding their meteoric rise to fame during DA's tenure - I think that had as much if not more to do with the whole grunge / alternative movement of the time as it did whomever was behind the kit. I feel like it would have happened regardless of who played drums at the time, that's my $0.02.

Peace.

I don't disagree with Jack's influence on the band's communication skills. All I'm saying is that I don't think that should factor in to who gets into the hall, that's all.

I think Matt should be the only drummer inducted. He helped them out before any other drummer, and he's been with them the longest. But if you induct Dave K, you open a can of worms for the others.

I agree on both of your points.

I predicted (wrongly) that Matt would be the only drummer inducted w/ the band, and I would have been fine with that. I don't necessarily care that DK gets in, but to me it's an odd inclusion as compared to what DA & JI both brought to the table.

agreed.

Spoken

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

it doesn't matter if Jack was responsible for keeping them together. the hall has nothing to do with that. if it did, they'd have to induct managers, wives, friends, yoga instructors, psychologists, Metallica's therapist, etc, etc.

My comment was in response to SC who said I romanticized JI's role in the band.

I'm not saying JI deserves to be inducted w/ the band, I'm saying DA's contribution is way overstated as compared to JI.

I'm surprised ANY drummers besides Cameron are getting in.

well, the only role you stated about jack was the spiritual one, which I don't think qualifies as a consideration. Anyway, we might be talking apples and oranges here.

I think Dave's contributions were huge, drumming wise. they played their heaviest shit when they needed to play their heaviest shit. not that this SHOULD matter, but when speaking of the Hall, it seems to: he played on their two biggest commerically successful albums that were not Ten.

I also quoted Brendan O'Brien as saying the band was barely communicating at the time, but seemed to act professional around JI - I don't think that quote should be overlooked or dismissed.

IDK.... read the article I linked if you get the chance. That, and other articles I read not too long ago paint a picture of a band on the verge of imploding, and it seems like JI brought them back together (Jeff didn't even know the band had started sessions on NC, it sound's like a pretty dark time for them - I'll see if I can't dig up the other articles I recall reading a little later)

As someone else mentioned, I feel like VS & Vitalogy were going to happen regardless of whatever drummer they found. After reading the articles I did, it seemed like NC & Yield never would have happened had JI not come along.

Regarding their meteoric rise to fame during DA's tenure - I think that had as much if not more to do with the whole grunge / alternative movement of the time as it did whomever was behind the kit. I feel like it would have happened regardless of who played drums at the time, that's my $0.02.

Peace.

Are you saying all drummers are the same?

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

tweedyfanjen said:

Why would you want to sit in the audience and watch a band you were fired from be inducted into the Hall of Fame?

Lol, yeah really. Sounds worse than not being invited!

I gather he just wants to be acknowledged. maybe he wouldn't care so much if they didn't brush it off so stupidly in PJ20.

frisbiec

Where's the outrage for the omission of Matt Chamberlain? I mean he was in the Alive video and he suggested the band check out Dave I can't pronounce his name.

Sea

A lot of cross posting on duplicate threads. Merged discussions
http://community.pearljam.com/discussion/228366/forum-posting-guidelines

KC138045

Sea said:

A lot of cross posting on duplicate threads. Merged discussions
http://community.pearljam.com/discussion/228366/forum-posting-guidelines

Thanks Sea

rssesq

con Dave
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zn2hyf2fsIc

rssesq

sin Dave
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rV9tCZ8u8VM

rssesq

not even close, sorry

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

I really couldn't care less if Dave A is included... I guess I care a little more about Jack, but meh, whatever. Seems to me that the Hall of Fame has rules, and they are following the rules. Good enough for me, and PJ should respect the rules. I assume that rule is to prevent a dozen people from one band being inducted, even if half of them barely did anything over the years. Makes sense.
I can't fucking believe anyone is suggesting that PJ boycott the HoF for the sake of Dave A, lmao.

that's the thing, though. both Dave A and Jack fit the criteria (either being a founding member or being on 2 or more albums). besides that, the hall just inducts whoever the fuck they want, with no input from the band themselves.

The Rolling Stones have 8 members inducted.
The Yardbirds have 7, as do Sly and the Family Stone
Grateful Dead have 12.
Parliament Funkadelic have 16.
Fleetwood Mac have 8.
Earth Wind and Fire have 9.
Skynyrd have 9.

and the list goes on.

To me just induct Matt, not Dave K, or induct them all (not Matt Chamberlain).

drummerboy_73

Spoken said:

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

Merkin Baller said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

it doesn't matter if Jack was responsible for keeping them together. the hall has nothing to do with that. if it did, they'd have to induct managers, wives, friends, yoga instructors, psychologists, Metallica's therapist, etc, etc.

My comment was in response to SC who said I romanticized JI's role in the band.

I'm not saying JI deserves to be inducted w/ the band, I'm saying DA's contribution is way overstated as compared to JI.

I'm surprised ANY drummers besides Cameron are getting in.

well, the only role you stated about jack was the spiritual one, which I don't think qualifies as a consideration. Anyway, we might be talking apples and oranges here.

I think Dave's contributions were huge, drumming wise. they played their heaviest shit when they needed to play their heaviest shit. not that this SHOULD matter, but when speaking of the Hall, it seems to: he played on their two biggest commerically successful albums that were not Ten.

I also quoted Brendan O'Brien as saying the band was barely communicating at the time, but seemed to act professional around JI - I don't think that quote should be overlooked or dismissed.

IDK.... read the article I linked if you get the chance. That, and other articles I read not too long ago paint a picture of a band on the verge of imploding, and it seems like JI brought them back together (Jeff didn't even know the band had started sessions on NC, it sound's like a pretty dark time for them - I'll see if I can't dig up the other articles I recall reading a little later)

As someone else mentioned, I feel like VS & Vitalogy were going to happen regardless of whatever drummer they found. After reading the articles I did, it seemed like NC & Yield never would have happened had JI not come along.

Regarding their meteoric rise to fame during DA's tenure - I think that had as much if not more to do with the whole grunge / alternative movement of the time as it did whomever was behind the kit. I feel like it would have happened regardless of who played drums at the time, that's my $0.02.

Peace.

Are you saying all drummers are the same?

I think they're saying there's a difference between the influence the different drummers had on the band, musically/personally, and what the band experienced in terms of fame. The latter was more inevitable due to a wider array of circumstances than who was drumming at the time.

jp307677

mcgruff10 said:

Is Pearl Jam a better (and I know completely different) live band now or 1994?

NOW. No question whatsoever

jp307677

MP188882 said:

jambayleaf said:

I think it's poor taste for Dave A. to make a comment the day of the list of POSSIBLE inductees, like he wants his due NOW! Let the chips fall dude. See what happens. Great drummer, but in the history of this band, he was a splash in the pan. My three cents. They need to Hit Em' With The Hein.

http://www.alternativenation.net/dave-abbruzzese-responds-pearl-jam-rock-hall-fame-snub/

For those looking for Dave's comments. He's also on FB.

What a loser.

PJ_Soul

frisbiec said:

Where's the outrage for the omission of Matt Chamberlain? I mean he was in the Alive video and he suggested the band check out Dave I can't pronounce his name.

It's his punishment for suggesting Dave.

PJ_Soul

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

I really couldn't care less if Dave A is included... I guess I care a little more about Jack, but meh, whatever. Seems to me that the Hall of Fame has rules, and they are following the rules. Good enough for me, and PJ should respect the rules. I assume that rule is to prevent a dozen people from one band being inducted, even if half of them barely did anything over the years. Makes sense.
I can't fucking believe anyone is suggesting that PJ boycott the HoF for the sake of Dave A, lmao.

that's the thing, though. both Dave A and Jack fit the criteria (either being a founding member or being on 2 or more albums). besides that, the hall just inducts whoever the fuck they want, with no input from the band themselves.

The Rolling Stones have 8 members inducted.
The Yardbirds have 7, as do Sly and the Family Stone
Grateful Dead have 12.
Parliament Funkadelic have 16.
Fleetwood Mac have 8.
Earth Wind and Fire have 9.
Skynyrd have 9.

and the list goes on.

To me just induct Matt, not Dave K, or induct them all (not Matt Chamberlain).

I'm sorry, I must have relied on a bad source then. I thought the rule was the founding member and the current member only? If that's not true, then I dunno, I guess it's arbitrary and that's their rule. Basically, I support whatever the hell the HoH wants to do, since it's their decision. I just looked up their own little blurb about it, which isn't very informative. It just says: "Artists—a group encompassing performers, composers and/or musicians—become eligible for induction 25 years after the release of their first record. Besides demonstrating unquestionable musical excellence and talent, inductees will have had a significant impact on the development, evolution and preservation of rock & roll." So if they have no other rules about it, then perhaps they don't feel that Dave A and Jack Irons had enough impact on the development of the band or something. Maybe not enough song-writing contributions? Whatever it is, I'm sure it's not personal, and therefore, I don't give a shit.

HughFreakingDillon

PJ_Soul said:

HughFreakingDillon said:

PJ_Soul said:

I really couldn't care less if Dave A is included... I guess I care a little more about Jack, but meh, whatever. Seems to me that the Hall of Fame has rules, and they are following the rules. Good enough for me, and PJ should respect the rules. I assume that rule is to prevent a dozen people from one band being inducted, even if half of them barely did anything over the years. Makes sense.
I can't fucking believe anyone is suggesting that PJ boycott the HoF for the sake of Dave A, lmao.

that's the thing, though. both Dave A and Jack fit the criteria (either being a founding member or being on 2 or more albums). besides that, the hall just inducts whoever the fuck they want, with no input from the band themselves.

The Rolling Stones have 8 members inducted.
The Yardbirds have 7, as do Sly and the Family Stone
Grateful Dead have 12.
Parliament Funkadelic have 16.
Fleetwood Mac have 8.
Earth Wind and Fire have 9.
Skynyrd have 9.

and the list goes on.

To me just induct Matt, not Dave K, or induct them all (not Matt Chamberlain).

I'm sorry, I must have relied on a bad source then. I thought the rule was the founding member and the current member only? If that's not true, then I dunno, I guess it's arbitrary and that's their rule. Basically, I support whatever the hell the HoH wants to do, since it's their decision. I just looked up their own little blurb about it, which isn't very informative. It just says: "Artists—a group encompassing performers, composers and/or musicians—become eligible for induction 25 years after the release of their first record. Besides demonstrating unquestionable musical excellence and talent, inductees will have had a significant impact on the development, evolution and preservation of rock & roll." So if they have no other rules about it, then perhaps they don't feel that Dave A and Jack Irons had enough impact on the development of the band or something. Maybe not enough song-writing contributions? Whatever it is, I'm sure it's not personal, and therefore, I don't give a shit.

well, yeah, I'm sure it's not personal. but it's irritating to fans when they give no logical reasons for inducting/not inducting certain former members of a group. or even current members of a group. there's a lot of criticism because it's owned and started by a non-musician and there has been loads of controversy over groups snubbed, and them basically putting one group in over another to create a balance (like inducting a rap act instead of a rock act to make it look more diverse). it's stupid.

HughFreakingDillon

jp307677 said:

MP188882 said:

jambayleaf said:

I think it's poor taste for Dave A. to make a comment the day of the list of POSSIBLE inductees, like he wants his due NOW! Let the chips fall dude. See what happens. Great drummer, but in the history of this band, he was a splash in the pan. My three cents. They need to Hit Em' With The Hein.

http://www.alternativenation.net/dave-abbruzzese-responds-pearl-jam-rock-hall-fame-snub/

For those looking for Dave's comments. He's also on FB.

What a loser.

good thing you waited for all the facts before commenting.