Bernie Sanders for President

rr165892

Gimme,thats funny.I dont remember that stuff during the Reagan years.

rr165892

Gern,you guys have to quit thinking GOP voters are all right wing wackos.Somehow not as enlightened and wise as the somewhat pompus liberals.
Many of us are Fiscal Conservatives and socially more progressive.And find the right a better fit.
This ignoring of the moderates in the middle will doom the left in this election.

Gern Blansten

rr165892 said:

Gern,you guys have to quit thinking GOP voters are all right wing wackos.Somehow not as enlightened and wise as the somewhat pompus liberals.
Many of us are Fiscal Conservatives and socially more progressive.And find the right a better fit.
This ignoring of the moderates in the middle will doom the left in this election.

Actually it won't. You aren't moderate if you vote republican. You're fooling yourself.

Edit: It makes no sense for you to equate "fiscal conservative" with the current republican party. Bush tax cuts, unfunded wars, etc.....

cincybearcat

Gern Blansten said:

rr165892 said:

Gern,you guys have to quit thinking GOP voters are all right wing wackos.Somehow not as enlightened and wise as the somewhat pompus liberals.
Many of us are Fiscal Conservatives and socially more progressive.And find the right a better fit.
This ignoring of the moderates in the middle will doom the left in this election.

Actually it won't. You aren't moderate if you vote republican. You're fooling yourself.

Edit: It makes no sense for you to equate "fiscal conservative" with the current republican party. Bush tax cuts, unfunded wars, etc.....

Yes you can be moderate and vote republican. Not many on this years list but it's possible.

Your point about GW is pretty solid though. The republicans really screwed up.

Gern Blansten

Yeah they have lost the ability to call themselves fiscally conservative. It doesn't fly anymore.

Now the current crop proposes getting rid of the IRS, cutting taxes and guess what? More unfunded warring and defense spending. Makes no sense.

gimmesometruth27

rr165892 said:

Gimme,thats funny.I dont remember that stuff during the Reagan years.

i am talking about they want to take it back to before reagan for some of it, and to reagan for some of it.

back to a time when:

women stayed in the home and had to have the kids that were accidentally conceived or conceived through rape Repeal Roe V Wade, pre reagan
the (christian) church had greater power over our society see 50s and 60s, pre reagan, moral majority, during reagan
there was less regulation of any sort during reagan and both bushes
there were less environmental protections to interfere with business 1960s and 70s, pre reagan
to when african americans were a subservient minority that had less influence on our culture up until 90s when hip hop culture began to have a significant impact on our culture
to when gays could not be seen together in public, let alone marry, because it is yucky- up until the last 5 years, partially under obama
there was no medicare or social security, or assistance of any kind 1940s, pre reagan
there was no obamacare up until obama
america was the dominant military in the world and nobody questioned our intentions or motives- we still are, but our motives have always been questioned

let's not forget how they want to take the tax levels back to reagan levels and employ more reaganomics, which has destroyed the middle class after just 30 years.

we can continue to go forward and be progressive, but one party wants to be regressive.

they have voted to repeal obamacare 61 times. yes, 61 times. as if the guy whose name is on the legislation (obama) is suddenly going to go "oh yeah, you guys are right, let's just sign that bill nullifying it, my bad...."

they have voted numerous times to defund planned parenthood when numerous investigations have found no wrongdoing.

they have investigated benghazi many times and have concluded zero wrongdoing.

how many jobs bills have they voted on? big, fat, fucking ZERO.

this is your republican party. this election is a choice between doing what i have just listed, or not doing what i listed. it is that simple.

gimmesometruth27

rr165892 said:

Gern,you guys have to quit thinking GOP voters are all right wing wackos.Somehow not as enlightened and wise as the somewhat pompus liberals.
Many of us are Fiscal Conservatives and socially more progressive.And find the right a better fit.
This ignoring of the moderates in the middle will doom the left in this election.

there are no moderates anymore. the tea party has seen to that.

it is either throw your lot in with the crazies, or get run over by the crazies.

it is a sad state of affairs in our country now.

rr165892

As a moderate Independant I agree.Choices suck.But they suck less on the right.At least this election.
And I was agreeing with most of what you stated above until you held up Obama care as a good thing.I know,I know your in the field And reform of some kind was needed.But they missed with Obama care.At least in the world I live in.

rr165892

Oh and Benghazi the issue for me is always the word of those who were there vs the word of the politicians.Im siding with the dudes who were in the shit.

brianlux

rr, cincybearcat, if you guys want the Republican Party to be anything but history, you have your work cut out for you. Your front runners are highly invested in the corporate scene, at least indirectly supportive of "more for fewer/less for more", frequently tied to a religious belief system that is out of touch with reality, in general is not very supportive of women, and has a host of candidates that many see as wackadoos. This does not register well with the average American. It's up to you and people like you to save your party, bail or watch it become history. I've been watching presidential elections unfold since JFK and have never seen anything like this.

cincybearcat

I understand what you are saying Brian, but I don't think it'll happen anytime soon if at all. I could easily see the 2party system becoming a 4-5 party systems down the line. These marriages of convienience are no longer working

brianlux

cincybearcat said:

I understand what you are saying Brian, but I don't think it'll happen anytime soon if at all. I could easily see the 2party system becoming a 4-5 party systems down the line. These marriages of convienience are no longer working

Most advanced civilizations DO have more that two parties!

rr165892

Brian,who did you vote for in FDRs first election.lol

I'm an Independant Bri,but I do usually vote with the right.My big hang up is always the fundamentalist bullshit.That wal mart pandering nonsense.I can't stand it.But I have to deal with it.

gimmesometruth27

brianlux said:

rr, cincybearcat, if you guys want the Republican Party to be anything but history, you have your work cut out for you. Your front runners are highly invested in the corporate scene, at least indirectly supportive of "more for fewer/less for more", frequently tied to a religious belief system that is out of touch with reality, in general is not very supportive of women, and has a host of candidates that many see as wackadoos. This does not register well with the average American. It's up to you and people like you to save your party, bail or watch it become history. I've been watching presidential elections unfold since JFK and have never seen anything like this.

i agree. i have always liked and respected rr and cincy. you guys are reasonable. it is unfortunate that your national candidates and national representation in the house and senate reflect so poorly on you guys. i feel like they have failed you guys by being so tied to wall street and the rich and big business. those people work for you guys. they need to be held to account for what you want them to do.

the word conservative used to mean that the party wanted to see change, but see it occur slowly and deliberately. now they want to make change deliberately, immediately, and in the opposite direction. that to me is not conservative. that to me is regressive.

in my opinion, this is a make or break cycle for the traditional republican party. if they do not win the white house, their heads will explode. they will be the obstructionist party for another 4 years. potentially another 8. that would make them the obstructionist party for 12 to 16 consecutive years. the american people will endure them being that way for 8. make it 4 or 8 more years in a row and they will bury what remains of the gop. the people will not wait for them to pull their heads out of their butt and acquiesce and decide to participate in the system. if not for gerrymandering of districts in favor of gop candidates, the dems would hold the house and senate this cycle right now. dems have had millions more voters for dem house and senate candidates the last few cycles, but the gop holds the majority because of the way the districts are set up.

gimmesometruth27

rr165892 said:

As a moderate Independant I agree.Choices suck.But they suck less on the right.At least this election.
And I was agreeing with most of what you stated above until you held up Obama care as a good thing.I know,I know your in the field And reform of some kind was needed.But they missed with Obama care.At least in the world I live in.

i have said from day one that obamacare did not go far enough. it is better than what we had. but still not exactly what we need. the gop wants to repeal it, but they have offered up zero in the way of alternatives. it is completely irresponsible to repeal the law and leave the 15 or so million people who have obamacare hanging out to dry. if you do that, the people are going to burn down the congress. polls show that the people who have obamacare are mostly happy with it and do not want it repealed.

ldent42

I'd be all for a 4-5 party system. I hate the two party system.

Gern Blansten

rr165892 said:

Oh and Benghazi the issue for me is always the word of those who were there vs the word of the politicians.Im siding with the dudes who were in the shit.

More people have died in Flint then Benghazi....update your priorities

Gern Blansten

http://www.vox.com/2016/2/6/10929416/republican-debate-marco-rubio

hilarious....

rr165892

Gern Blansten said:

rr165892 said:

Oh and Benghazi the issue for me is always the word of those who were there vs the word of the politicians.Im siding with the dudes who were in the shit.

More people have died in Flint then Benghazi....update your priorities

Apples and oranges.
Although They are both horrible,they both happened due to neglect descision making.And incompetent leadership.

Gern Blansten

rr165892 said:

Gern Blansten said:

rr165892 said:

Oh and Benghazi the issue for me is always the word of those who were there vs the word of the politicians.Im siding with the dudes who were in the shit.

More people have died in Flint then Benghazi....update your priorities

Apples and oranges.
Although They are both horrible,they both happened due to neglect descision making.And incompetent leadership.

Like all tragedies...hindsight is 20/20

911 was a bad one. Also the bombing of our embassy under Raygun where 17 Americans died.

callen

rr165892 said:

Gern Blansten said:

rr165892 said:

Oh and Benghazi the issue for me is always the word of those who were there vs the word of the politicians.Im siding with the dudes who were in the shit.

More people have died in Flint then Benghazi....update your priorities

Apples and oranges.
Although They are both horrible,they both happened due to neglect descision making.And incompetent leadership.

Not by Clinton or Obama.

It's a red herring RR. Simple as that.

HughFreakingDillon

brianlux said:

cincybearcat said:

I understand what you are saying Brian, but I don't think it'll happen anytime soon if at all. I could easily see the 2party system becoming a 4-5 party systems down the line. These marriages of convienience are no longer working

Most advanced civilizations DO have more that two parties!

careful what you wish for. Canada has too many parties at the table. it gets all muddied and you don't know who stands where and there's so much freaking crossover it's tough to keep it straight.

Free

FEEL. THE BERN NH!!!

brianlux

Free said:

FEEL. THE BERN NH!!!

MayDay10

It's nice, but it was expected.

I'm not getting excited until he takes one of these upcoming states in an upset. Minority votes are coming up which doesn't look good. Hillary could also use the nuclear option and get Obama! to endorse her.

Bernie had a ridiculous favorability/trust rating on the exit polls. Which is nice because these wins get his message seen.

callen

Good for Bernie and nice to see optimism in action.

Gern Blansten

There really isn't any dirt on Bernie. He's just a truly honest politician. Hillary wants to tie him to the pro-gun movement but he still has a D rating with the NRA I believe.

rr165892

I'm pulling for your boy here.If he gets the nom,you are paving the way for a huge Win in the general for the right.But I think he gets smoked both out west and in the south.

dignin

rr165892 said:

I'm pulling for your boy here.If he gets the nom,you are paving the way for a huge Win in the general for the right.But I think he gets smoked both out west and in the south.

I thought you were an independent?

JimmyV

One thing I noticed last night was that Sanders does seem to have only one speech. I felt like I heard pretty much the same thing after Iowa. Hillary's meanwhile was much different and geared for the contests to come.