Canadian Politics Redux

Meltdown99

oftenreading said:

Meltdown99 said:

Black market for pot growing despite legalization in Colorado
http://www.cbc.ca/news/thenational/black-market-for-pot-growing-despite-legalization-in-colorado-1.4675640

And it will continue to thrive in Canada unless the price point is adjusted...

Cigarettes ae a legal product.  The Black market cigarette market cigarette industry is booming.  

But people will have a legal alternative, and those who don’t want to put their money toward organized crime don’t have to. 

Also, the “booming” black market cigarette industry applies to very few smokers overall, compared to the legal cigarette industry (and personally I would rather see both of those go away). 

Black Market cigarettes in Ontario applies to a lot more smokers than you think ... a billion a year.

PJ_Soul

Meltdown99 said:

oftenreading said:

Meltdown99 said:

Black market for pot growing despite legalization in Colorado
http://www.cbc.ca/news/thenational/black-market-for-pot-growing-despite-legalization-in-colorado-1.4675640

And it will continue to thrive in Canada unless the price point is adjusted...

Cigarettes ae a legal product.  The Black market cigarette market cigarette industry is booming.  

But people will have a legal alternative, and those who don’t want to put their money toward organized crime don’t have to. 

Also, the “booming” black market cigarette industry applies to very few smokers overall, compared to the legal cigarette industry (and personally I would rather see both of those go away). 

Black Market cigarettes in Ontario applies to a lot more smokers than you think ... a billion a year.

I don't think that cigarettes and weed are as comparable as you seem to think they are, and the main reason I don't think so is because of the prices. Cigarettes are WAAAAY more expensive than weed is going to be. Also, cigarettes are extremely addictive, while weed is not. Combine restrictive pricing (which won't be applied to weed) with addiction, and you've got yourself a massive black market for cigs in Ontario. I mean, black market smokes cost only 30% of what legally sold smokes do, and a full 70% of the price of a pack of smokes is taxes!! This is NUTS. I think the government is making a huge mistake taxing the shit out of cigarettes like that - of course there is a crazy black market. In Vancouver a pack of smokes costs $14+ FFS. It's just fucking stupid. But a gram of weed doesn't cost $3 on the black market. And the government has absolutely no intention of taxing weed to that extent. Not even close. Most illicit weed actually costs at least $10/g, which is about what it's going to apparently cost in stores, maybe $12. And you've been talking about some magical dealers who sell it for $7/gram I think? ... but even a $3 - $5 difference isn't going to drive that many people to go to illegal drug dealers when they can just legally walk into a store and buy it for $10... Because they aren't like heroin addicts who need to fix all day everyday like cigarette smokers are.

What you need to do is think of a more comparable market.... That would be the alcohol industry. Is the moonshine business out of control over in Ontario?

Drowned Out

PJ_Soul said:

I know we WILL do a lot better than this though, so I guess that's why I don't care too much. And remember that you and I know WAY more about weed than most of those politicians do, lol. But they'll figure it out... after it's legal.
The positives are that people don't have to go buy weed from drug dealers on the street anymore, the tax revenue, and the fact that this is going to quickly normalize weed and ditch the stupid stigmas about it.

When’s the last time you bought weed ‘on the street’?  Lol
The fact that politicians know less than me is what drives me nuts about them shutting out the people who have dedicated their lives to making this happen.  Anyone with the internet and 15 minutes can determine that it’s less dangerous than alcohol.  So aside from placating the anti-weed people, why are the laws more stringent than for alcohol? Are there limits to the amount of alcohol I can have? .  What about rural families who don’t want to drive to town every week?   They need to bring multiple adults in order to get it home?  Why four plants?  That’s not enough for a continuous grow. You would have one strain and start from scratch every few months.  (All rhetorical questions - I know we’re on the same page...I just don’t understand your patience with the way it’s going).
  I must have a magic dealer.  $100-110/half.  $7-8/gr. 30% adds up.  

DarthMaeglin

Drowned Out said:

PJ_Soul said:

I know we WILL do a lot better than this though, so I guess that's why I don't care too much. And remember that you and I know WAY more about weed than most of those politicians do, lol. But they'll figure it out... after it's legal.
The positives are that people don't have to go buy weed from drug dealers on the street anymore, the tax revenue, and the fact that this is going to quickly normalize weed and ditch the stupid stigmas about it.

When’s the last time you bought weed ‘on the street’?  Lol
The fact that politicians know less than me is what drives me nuts about them shutting out the people who have dedicated their lives to making this happen.  Anyone with the internet and 15 minutes can determine that it’s less dangerous than alcohol.  So aside from placating the anti-weed people, why are the laws more stringent than for alcohol? Are there limits to the amount of alcohol I can have? .  What about rural families who don’t want to drive to town every week?   They need to bring multiple adults in order to get it home?  Why four plants?  That’s not enough for a continuous grow. You would have one strain and start from scratch every few months.  (All rhetorical questions - I know we’re on the same page...I just don’t understand your patience with the way it’s going).
  I must have a magic dealer.  $100-110/half.  $7-8/gr. 30% adds up.  

Have they indicated yet if the prices will scale the same when quantity purchased increases? At least during the initial roll-out I’ll be sticking with my current connection for the simple reason that the only announced location is pretty much downtown Toronto (I live in deep Scarberia, lol). I will make a point of sampling the legal option at some point though, for sure, lol.

Meltdown99

I don't know anyone who is going to pay the government prices...

Stats Canada has said the average price on the street is around $7/gram...

Drowned Out

DarthMaeglin said:

Drowned Out said:

PJ_Soul said:

I know we WILL do a lot better than this though, so I guess that's why I don't care too much. And remember that you and I know WAY more about weed than most of those politicians do, lol. But they'll figure it out... after it's legal.
The positives are that people don't have to go buy weed from drug dealers on the street anymore, the tax revenue, and the fact that this is going to quickly normalize weed and ditch the stupid stigmas about it.

When’s the last time you bought weed ‘on the street’?  Lol
The fact that politicians know less than me is what drives me nuts about them shutting out the people who have dedicated their lives to making this happen.  Anyone with the internet and 15 minutes can determine that it’s less dangerous than alcohol.  So aside from placating the anti-weed people, why are the laws more stringent than for alcohol? Are there limits to the amount of alcohol I can have? .  What about rural families who don’t want to drive to town every week?   They need to bring multiple adults in order to get it home?  Why four plants?  That’s not enough for a continuous grow. You would have one strain and start from scratch every few months.  (All rhetorical questions - I know we’re on the same page...I just don’t understand your patience with the way it’s going).
  I must have a magic dealer.  $100-110/half.  $7-8/gr. 30% adds up.  

Have they indicated yet if the prices will scale the same when quantity purchased increases? At least during the initial roll-out I’ll be sticking with my current connection for the simple reason that the only announced location is pretty much downtown Toronto (I live in deep Scarberia, lol). I will make a point of sampling the legal option at some point though, for sure, lol.

I would imagine it will be scaled, it is in the places I’ve purchased legally.  But the scale started well above $10 (it was $15+ in Van and Vegas), and sometimes approached $10 only in bulk. 

These are sample prices from the dispensary I went to in Vegas...in USD.  Of course this doesn’t mean the same models will followed here, but....



Coincidentally, I just finished a $110 CDN half of blue dream.

Meltdown99

Ottawa reaches agreement to start Trans Mountain work this summer: source

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trans-mountain-announcement-coming-1.4681662?cmp=FB_Post_News

Meltdown99

Everybody should just grow their own ...

Drowned Out

Cannabis legalization task force member moves to senior ranks at Canopy

https://ipolitics.ca/2018/05/28/cannabis-legalization-task-force-member-moves-to-senior-ranks-at-canopy/

The vice-chair of the Liberals’ cannabis task force is now a top executive with Canada’s largest cannabis company.  There is a revolving ‘green door’ / we get fucked joke in there somewhere.  

Meltdown99

Senate committee backs amendment giving provinces power to ban home-grown pot

http://nationalpost.com/news/senate-committee-backs-amendment-giving-provinces-power-to-ban-home-grown-pot

LMFAO at this pathetic attempt of legalization...

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Meltdown99 said:

Ottawa reaches agreement to start Trans Mountain work this summer: source

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trans-mountain-announcement-coming-1.4681662?cmp=FB_Post_News

4.5 billion. 

Meltdown99

Canada to spend $4.5 billion to buy Trans Mountain pipeline, terminal

http://business.financialpost.com/commodities/energy/newsalert-canada-to-spend-4-5b-to-buy-trans-mountain-pipeline-b-c-terminal

We now own a pipeline ... LMFAO

Thirty Bills Unpaid

Yesterday, Kinder Morgan had to stop the pipeline flow as a small spill occurred:

http://www.vancourier.com/news/100l-oil-spill-near-kamloops-causes-temporary-closure-of-trans-mountain-pipeline-1.23316058

This fiasco is f**king hilarious.

Drowned Out

Meltdown99 said:

Canada to spend $4.5 billion to buy Trans Mountain pipeline, terminal

http://business.financialpost.com/commodities/energy/newsalert-canada-to-spend-4-5b-to-buy-trans-mountain-pipeline-b-c-terminal

We now own a pipeline ... LMFAO

The smell of cognitive dissonance is heavy in the Alberta air this morning.

dignin

Drowned Out said:

Meltdown99 said:

Canada to spend $4.5 billion to buy Trans Mountain pipeline, terminal

http://business.financialpost.com/commodities/energy/newsalert-canada-to-spend-4-5b-to-buy-trans-mountain-pipeline-b-c-terminal

We now own a pipeline ... LMFAO

The smell of cognitive dissonance is heavy in the Alberta air this morning.

Haha, amongst certain circles, very much so.

oftenreading

Pipeline for sale on Craigslist 

http://vancouversun.com/business/energy/trans-mountain-pipeline-for-sale-on-craigslist

PJ_Soul

Drowned Out said:

PJ_Soul said:

I know we WILL do a lot better than this though, so I guess that's why I don't care too much. And remember that you and I know WAY more about weed than most of those politicians do, lol. But they'll figure it out... after it's legal.
The positives are that people don't have to go buy weed from drug dealers on the street anymore, the tax revenue, and the fact that this is going to quickly normalize weed and ditch the stupid stigmas about it.

When’s the last time you bought weed ‘on the street’?  Lol
The fact that politicians know less than me is what drives me nuts about them shutting out the people who have dedicated their lives to making this happen.  Anyone with the internet and 15 minutes can determine that it’s less dangerous than alcohol.  So aside from placating the anti-weed people, why are the laws more stringent than for alcohol? Are there limits to the amount of alcohol I can have? .  What about rural families who don’t want to drive to town every week?   They need to bring multiple adults in order to get it home?  Why four plants?  That’s not enough for a continuous grow. You would have one strain and start from scratch every few months.  (All rhetorical questions - I know we’re on the same page...I just don’t understand your patience with the way it’s going).
  I must have a magic dealer.  $100-110/half.  $7-8/gr. 30% adds up.  

The last time I bought weed on the street was right before I got a dispensary card, probably about 3 years ago.
But I'm not sure why you're saying they are shutting out those people. I totally agree they shouldn't be, and I've said that since the idea of legalization came about. But that hasn't at all even been determined in BC, so I have nothing to be bent out of shape about (yet... we're still waiting to see how that is all handled, but the BC government is certainly aware it's an issue). Is the Alberta government doing something that is shutting them out?
The laws are more stringent than for alcohol because it's brand new. That's it. Simple. That is why I am completely confident that, after some time has passed and the whole industry has a chance to figure shit out, such laws will change and become much more reasonable. This is the real world, not a world where everything we think ought to happen happens immediately. That is why I've got patience. I know it will all work out in the end. Why wouldn't I have some patience for that, when in the meantime I can still go buy affordable weed in a store? And you know, wtf is the point in being mad? Easier access to weed for everyone without any legal risk. Talk about a good first step. More like a huge leap! Sure, the powers that be could chill (maybe smoke a bowl), but Jesus, considering the history behind all this, I think we should count ourselves fucking lucky that this is happening at all. That's a realistic and non-spoiled attitude IMO.
Rural families have to drive to town every week? Huh? Are you saying that a family with only one adult needs more than 30 grams a week?? Sorry, the possession limit is completely reasonable to me. So does the 4 plant limit, because remember, growing lots of weed actually does affect communities, not just the people growing it. Have you ever smelled the venting of a residential grow-op? And I'm not even talking a big one. It absolutely reeks up the entire neighborhood.
I buy 1/8 at a medical dispensary for $30. My old dispensary was $25 (but the shatter was $10 more expensive to it evens out).

PJ_Soul

Meltdown99 said:

Everybody should just grow their own ...

I wouldn't want to grow my own. What a pain in the ass, and I don't get enough sunlight on my balcony anyhow, and even if I did, since I'm only the second floor I'd be worried about someone climbing up a stealing it. And there is no way in hell I'd do it inside. It really is a mold hazard.
So grow your own - aren't going to be able to?

PJ_Soul

Meltdown99 said:

Canada to spend $4.5 billion to buy Trans Mountain pipeline, terminal

http://business.financialpost.com/commodities/energy/newsalert-canada-to-spend-4-5b-to-buy-trans-mountain-pipeline-b-c-terminal

We now own a pipeline ... LMFAO

And that's just for the old, falling apart one. They still will have to spend about $20 billion more to build the new one!
I hope anyone who loves the idea of this pipeline remembers this when they need to turn to some woefully underfunded government agency!

Meltdown99

PJ_Soul said:

Meltdown99 said:

Canada to spend $4.5 billion to buy Trans Mountain pipeline, terminal

http://business.financialpost.com/commodities/energy/newsalert-canada-to-spend-4-5b-to-buy-trans-mountain-pipeline-b-c-terminal

We now own a pipeline ... LMFAO

And that's just for the old, falling apart one. They still will have to spend about $20 billion more to build the new one!
I hope anyone who loves the idea of this pipeline remembers this when they need to turn to some woefully underfunded government agency!

I just find it hard to believe that there is not a better option to get the oil to tidewater...