The real causes of mass shootings?

jnimhaoileoin

I'm actually more interested in the underlying causes of these incidents. If we set aside the discussion on gun control for a minute, I wonder is it the whole American way of life that's the problem e.g. poor social welfare, ridiculous working hours and a complete lack of a work-life balance for most people. Highly competitive attitudes with kids being raised to think that winning is everything and if you can't be the best well then really you're just a disappointment. Perhaps also a lack of a sense of community and kinship with your fellow Americans?

I fully acknowledge that I'm proposing this as an outsider and it is merely my impression and thus could be wholly inaccurate.

Hence I would welcome opinions, especially from Americans.

rr165892

No,it's sick fucking people with mommy or daddy issues,who want some one to pay attention to them.Dosent matter if it's positive or negative attention,just look at me.We also make it 2 easy for them to get ammo and firearms(and I am a gun owner).Finally in today media overhype world it's sensationalized and over covered.Who wouldn't want to be (in)famous. As I'm typing I get a news blurb on my phone armed suspect on VCU campus.This is getting ridiculous already.

Jason P

Guns have been around and accessible for hundreds of years. Mass school shootings were a rarity before 1995. Something changed.

Jason P

Could the internet be the game changer? Crazy people now have access to other peoples crazy ideologies. And they can access those crazy thoughts while eating cereal in their underpants instead of going to a library.

hedonist

Nice that this question is being asked. Big part of why I mentioned in the gun thread that the concept of looking into the people causing these...don't even know what to call these horrors anymore...should not be stifled. Even if one tiny lesson learned, a warning flag waved and hopefully seen. Maybe acted upon?

Sad to say that this little peon has no answers but I suspect there are a myriad of reasons, many of which rr touched upon - you as well.

callen

Like this thread.

To me it's all about controllables. There will always be sick people. Impossible to identify and taking rights away afforded by law indiscriminately also not going to happen. And with easy access to guns they get guns anyway.

So gun control only solution. How much gun control well that's the rub. Unfortunately if we maintain current distribution of guns these events will continue.

mickeyrat

Lashing out in a violent way is an ingrained response in America. Why this isnt more fully addreszed in out culture? No idea. But guess you cant make money off it so we dont try.

mcgruff10

To me it's about some crazy type of self gratification along with your 15 minutes of "fame". I think social media is definitely a part of the problem as well as the constant churn of sensational 24 hour news. I'm just really glad I'm not a kid in 2015.

mcgruff10

Jason P said:

Could the internet be the game changer? Crazy people now have access to other peoples crazy ideologies. And they can access those crazy thoughts while eating cereal in their underpants instead of going to a library.

I think the internet is a huge part of the problem. Very very nice question op and one I hope we can figure out soon.

callen

mickeyrat said:

Lashing out in a violent way is an ingrained response in America. Why this isnt more fully addreszed in out culture? No idea. But guess you cant make money off it so we dont try.

We as Americans use death regularly in an attempt to solve our problems, DP and wars. Add out thirst for shoot em up shows and no wonder we have culture and it's nasty side affects. But no boobies on TV. Oh god no.

mcgruff10

callen said:

mickeyrat said:

Lashing out in a violent way is an ingrained response in America. Why this isnt more fully addreszed in out culture? No idea. But guess you cant make money off it so we dont try.

We as Americans use death regularly in an attempt to solve our problems, DP and wars. Add out thirst for shoot em up shows and no wonder we have culture and it's nasty side affects. But no boobies on TV. Oh god no.

lol (at the boob part) good point. I also wish the news wouldn't give these guys any sort attention at all. Kind of like how when someone runs onto a field during a sporting event they don't air it.

Cliffy6745

Things like this seem to be a pretty consistent train of thought among many of these shooters

I have noticed that so many people like him are all alone and unknown, yet when they spill a little blood, the whole world knows who they are. A man who was known by no one, is now known by everyone. His face splashed across every screen, his name across the lips of every person on the planet, all in the course of one day. Seems the more people you kill, the more you’re in the limelight.

And I have to say, anyone who knew him could have seen this coming. People like him have nothing left to live for, and the only thing left to do is lash out at a society that has abandoned them.

mcgruff10

Cliffy6745 said:

Things like this seem to be a pretty consistent train of thought among many of these shooters

I have noticed that so many people like him are all alone and unknown, yet when they spill a little blood, the whole world knows who they are. A man who was known by no one, is now known by everyone. His face splashed across every screen, his name across the lips of every person on the planet, all in the course of one day. Seems the more people you kill, the more you’re in the limelight.

And I have to say, anyone who knew him could have seen this coming. People like him have nothing left to live for, and the only thing left to do is lash out at a society that has abandoned them.

scary that you are so spot on.

rr165892

Teach,you got that right about not growing up now.Shit,IPhones and cameras would have buried my group of friends in the 80s.It was sooo much better not being plugged in.imo.
I think J is onto something.That is when things got shitty around early mid 90s.So if the interwebs have added to this then first person violent shooter games have some part to play.I think I read every shoot through SC was a video gamer???

ldent42

Some good points made. I think social welfare (specifically healthcare and mental health stigma) is a huge part of it. The 24 hours news networks too. It's not a popular opinion around here but I do wish the shooters personally wouldnt get so much media attention.

it's hard to deny that there must be some link between the accessibility of information on the internet and social media and the increase in these shootings. I wish I could argue that point because I'm a big fan of the internet but ...

Cliffy6745

mcgruff10 said:

Cliffy6745 said:

Things like this seem to be a pretty consistent train of thought among many of these shooters

I have noticed that so many people like him are all alone and unknown, yet when they spill a little blood, the whole world knows who they are. A man who was known by no one, is now known by everyone. His face splashed across every screen, his name across the lips of every person on the planet, all in the course of one day. Seems the more people you kill, the more you’re in the limelight.

And I have to say, anyone who knew him could have seen this coming. People like him have nothing left to live for, and the only thing left to do is lash out at a society that has abandoned them.

scary that you are so spot on.

Just to be clear, I didn't write that. That came from the guy from yesterday talking about the guy who killed the TV folks in Virginia. But yes, something like this comes from all of them.

callen

rr165892 said:

Teach,you got that right about not growing up now.Shit,IPhones and cameras would have buried my group of friends in the 80s.It was sooo much better not being plugged in.imo.
I think J is onto something.That is when things got shitty around early mid 90s.So if the interwebs have added to this then first person violent shooter games have some part to play.I think I read every shoot through SC was a video gamer???

Have said many times so glad I was able to experience life all analog.

So much more pressure on kids now. The need to be cool and included has been magnified thanks to wonderful platforms such as FB.

Between higher pressured lives filled with images of war and hate adding in some natural gene mutations, trying to minimize these events addressing human psyche won't do much.

We are violent society/species. We are nasty vile creatures. Now we have efficient killing instrument and freely distribute to all that crave them. Emphasis on the word "crave".

mcgruff10

I really think the op has hit upon something big. Prior to 1968 you could go to your local hardware store and buy surplus ww2 weapons like bazookas, flame throwers, etc and you didn't hear about any of these crazy massacres. Imagine if those weapons were legal today?
what has changed? to me the recipe for disaster includes: self gratification, social media, the current state of the "news", the number of guns available, depression, all these crazy prescription drugs that are now available, and the opportunity to become "famous". just a crazy ass world we live in. to me, these people are almost like suicide bombers in the middle east. I just can't wrap my head around it.

callen

Great analogy, "our suicide bombers"

ldent42

mcgruff10 said:

I really think the op has hit upon something big. Prior to 1968 you could go to your local hardware store and buy surplus ww2 weapons like bazookas, flame throwers, etc and you didn't hear about any of these crazy massacres. Imagine if those weapons were legal today?
what has changed? to me the recipe for disaster includes: self gratification, social media, the current state of the "news", the number of guns available, depression, all these crazy prescription drugs that are now available, and the opportunity to become "famous". just a crazy ass world we live in. to me, these people are almost like suicide bombers in the middle east. I just can't wrap my head around it.

Older woman I used to work with used to say all the time "It's a different world now"
I'm sure globalization plays a part in that too.

josevolution

Yeah we can all keep on discussing the whys and how's but no matter what this discussion can give light too it won't change a thing , to me it feels like we're screaming into an empty cave ....

HughFreakingDillon

as many others have said, yes, it is a multitude of things. I once thought all these violent first-person shooter games were not to blame; now I'm not so sure. the glorification of violence, and to the extent that people play these games, HAS to have something to do with it. it almost transfers over, like their reality becomes their fantasy.

so much social pressure, absolutely. with bullying in person, now bullying online, jesus. there has to be a way to stop it. intensive sensitivity classes? workshops? I don't have the answer.

not one of these people is ever known as a popular person in school. all loners, ,"losers". but I think a good first step, absolutely, is to never identify the shooter in the media. maybe first name and last initial, but no picture. take away the famous end-game portion of it. some of the motivation might be lost.

and yes, access to guns and ammo. it isn't the SOLE issue. it is part of it. unfortunately, when you couple that with American culture, it's a powderkeg.

Gern Blansten

Other countries have video games, crazy people, shitty parents....that's not it folks

ldent42

Gern Blansten said:

Other countries have video games, crazy people, shitty parents....that's not it folks

I dont wanna speak for Hugh but I'm pretty sure he means that it's a combination of all those things on top of our gun availability problem.

PJ_Soul

I love Americans, but as a large group they seem pretty angry and scared. Maybe that has something to do with it.

HughFreakingDillon

ldent42 said:

Gern Blansten said:

Other countries have video games, crazy people, shitty parents....that's not it folks

I dont wanna speak for Hugh but I'm pretty sure he means that it's a combination of all those things on top of our gun availability problem.

correct. I wasn't implying it was one of those factors alone or even that my list was in any way exhaustive. it's a complex issue.

callen

PJ_Soul said:

I love Americans, but as a large group they seem pretty angry and scared. Maybe that has something to do with it.

Been to a pj show in US? Not much anger there. Portions of population. Many peace loving chilled folks.

HughFreakingDillon

yeah, the americans I've met on my limited travels have all been pretty nice and pretty happy.

ldent42

Its the problem I was trying to discuss before - "Americans" as a cultural term is just inaccurate. You take a born & bred American from the NE, the PNW, and the Bible Belt & you've got three people from entirely separate cultures, united by an ignorance of the metric system & not much else. Even language is different in some ways by region.

dignin

Gern Blansten said:

Other countries have video games, crazy people, shitty parents....that's not it folks

Yup. We can talk ourselves in circles about the causes but what we do know that separates the states from other comparative countries is easy access to GUNS, lots of them. No way around it.

It's as simple as that.

HughFreakingDillon

ldent42 said:

Its the problem I was trying to discuss before - "Americans" as a cultural term is just inaccurate. You take a born & bred American from the NE, the PNW, and the Bible Belt & you've got three people from entirely separate cultures, united by an ignorance of the metric system & not much else. Even language is different in some ways by region.

true enough.