Baltimore

riotgrl

I think the wealth disparities evident in this map speak volumes about the heart of the problem not only in Baltimore but most likely throughout the entire country.

The Juggler

brianlux said:

hedonist said:

Shut down a whole city? Keep power out, fires burning without communication about how to put them out, idiots doing their thing despite organization because assholes are always around, 911 service disabled for those who legitimately need it, hospitals unable to keep their patients safe, help an accident victim, and on.

Doesn't seem like a good idea, unless I'm missing something.

Good point- would not want essential services shut down- but that would not likely happen anyway. But some form of disruption that is well planned, minimize danger and maximize results and would get attention would be the goal. Something like this would not work like a few lines tossed off on a forum somewhere. It would probably not even happen. Today it would have to be more symbolic than anything.

Ideas?

Yeah, something like this simply would not work on planet earth. What planet were you thinking of though?

muskydan

badbrains said:

muskydan said:

Hope and Change has involved a lot more rioting and looting than I expected

No shit? Really? Nah, you're just used to seeing the rioting done in the streets of bagdad and other brown people countries when your buddy georgie was in office. You see, your Not used to seeing the rioting at home.

Ya I Am, we just contain it better in my shitty so the tax paying civilized people of our society do not have to see it . Out of sight out of mind, we also let Osmosis do its thing so no one of substance get's hurt.

The Juggler

muskydan said:

Hope and Change has involved a lot more rioting and looting than I expected

Get ready for more of those same promises. Election year is right around the corner.

JimmyV

Halifax2TheMax said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

josevolution said:

rr165892 said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

I did respond to Brian post. I guess since it isn't your view point, it doesn't count. But you're correct, it is a race issue. But my question is why the black youth decided to vandalize, steal, assault police, and commit arson rather than peacefully protest.

If you bothered to care to learn about human behavior from the perspective of a black youth, living in inner-city neighborhoods, constantly at odds with the police with a bad reputation for brutality, poor socio-economic class, you'd maybe comprehend life is so very different for them. But you'd rather classify those of us that can maybe understand that life is different for them, as "apologists" and that we excuse them for their actions. Which is completely false. My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

I've haven't once called you or anyone else an apologist. I'm also not sure why you think I don't understand race relations. I do understand why the black community is upset with the lack of explanation from the police. Probably better than you do. You have no clue what my background is to make such an absurd assumption.

No matter what the lack of explanation is, it doesn't excuse the thug behavior exhibited by the black youth of Baltimore. Period.

Because that's all you're willing to focus on. "Thug behavior" and not Police behavior.

Again, My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

BSL,have you ever heard the term"Comply and Complain"?

I don't know where it started,but it basically is saying "Hey,don't run,comply with the officers requests and if anything is not kosher you will still be alive to complain or file a complaint about how you were treated"
I heard this today and I makes all of this seem so simple.All the recent cases of death that have been publicized have had suspects who have resisted or ran.I know the kid in the cop car was a different story,but you get what I'm saying right?

Well thats good & dandy but its to late for that minorities have lost all trust in the police force , its hard for us the lucky one's to understand this but it's true believe me i work with alot of black folks and they all say the same thing do not trust the police it's gonna take a monumental effort from both parties to come together on this problem in this country .....

"Its to late for that"? Are you kidding me Jose? "And All minorities have lost all trust". Please.

I have plenty of minority friends.A lot of them would have liked a fire hose to be directed at the looters yesterday. Because they are not criminals or they don't put themselves in a position to be at the receiving end of that kind of harassment.Are there isolated incidents of rascism? Of course.Are there bad cops yes there is.
But I bet you can't even count the amount of white cops who risk there life every day to save a minority in trouble.Or Black cops saving a white kid.
This new movement throwing the police under the bus because of the actions of a few is assinine.

I saw a plane with a banner flying over a festival this weekend that said "Always film the police"Really wtf is wrong this this?

No let's just let them continue to create victims daily with impunity...after all, it's only a few victims in the grand scheme of things, it won't happen to me so what do I care?

Courts are witnessed, most government dealings, legal procedings, major business deals, hell, you can't even buy a $200 jjunkercar without a notary witness...but lets let the folks who carry guns and have authority to kill do their work in the dark. Makes a lot of sense. Not.

Point being you can't just throw out all the good 99.9 percent of police do for the .01 percent of bad seeds.You know that Gambsy.And if we are keeping it real,almost every case we have debated did indeed have a victim who was breaking the law in one way or another(not the kid in the park).Maybe a good start to creating a more just system should start with not commiting a crime in the first place?Pretty sure that will eliminate a lot of it(not all granted).

It's not throwing out the good, it's holding the bad accountable for their actions. Rioters have personal responsibility to be accountable but police dont?

Rekia Boyd, Tamir Rice, John Crawford. All 3 black people killed by police without a crime committed, without resisting arrest, in the last year or so. Only 1 indictment, no convictions. There are more out there that we haven't heard of, you can be sure of that.

Eric Garner sold self-rolled cigarettes and didn't want to be bullied anymore, killed by cops, no indictment.

You forgot the black couple in either Cincy, Cleveland or Columbus, Ohio who were driving around, minding their own business when the car they were in backfired while passing a cop. He or they mistook the backfire as shots fired and made a panicked radio call. A police chase and over a 100 shots later, they both died in the front seat of the car. No weapons, no drugs.

I don't think I heard this story. Terrible, but I'm left wondering why there was a chase? If they had done nothing wrong and had no contraband, why didn't they just pull over when the lights went on behind them? What am I missing?

JimmyV

The Juggler said:

muskydan said:

Hope and Change has involved a lot more rioting and looting than I expected

Get ready for more of those same promises. Election year is right around the corner.

Promises like "Compassionate Conservatism" and "No Child Left Behind"?

Cliffy6745

muskydan said:

Hope and Change has involved a lot more rioting and looting than I expected

Thanks, Obama for making cops murder civilians.

rr165892

JimmyV said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

josevolution said:

rr165892 said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

I did respond to Brian post. I guess since it isn't your view point, it doesn't count. But you're correct, it is a race issue. But my question is why the black youth decided to vandalize, steal, assault police, and commit arson rather than peacefully protest.

If you bothered to care to learn about human behavior from the perspective of a black youth, living in inner-city neighborhoods, constantly at odds with the police with a bad reputation for brutality, poor socio-economic class, you'd maybe comprehend life is so very different for them. But you'd rather classify those of us that can maybe understand that life is different for them, as "apologists" and that we excuse them for their actions. Which is completely false. My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

I've haven't once called you or anyone else an apologist. I'm also not sure why you think I don't understand race relations. I do understand why the black community is upset with the lack of explanation from the police. Probably better than you do. You have no clue what my background is to make such an absurd assumption.

No matter what the lack of explanation is, it doesn't excuse the thug behavior exhibited by the black youth of Baltimore. Period.

Because that's all you're willing to focus on. "Thug behavior" and not Police behavior.

Again, My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

BSL,have you ever heard the term"Comply and Complain"?

I don't know where it started,but it basically is saying "Hey,don't run,comply with the officers requests and if anything is not kosher you will still be alive to complain or file a complaint about how you were treated"
I heard this today and I makes all of this seem so simple.All the recent cases of death that have been publicized have had suspects who have resisted or ran.I know the kid in the cop car was a different story,but you get what I'm saying right?

Well thats good & dandy but its to late for that minorities have lost all trust in the police force , its hard for us the lucky one's to understand this but it's true believe me i work with alot of black folks and they all say the same thing do not trust the police it's gonna take a monumental effort from both parties to come together on this problem in this country .....

"Its to late for that"? Are you kidding me Jose? "And All minorities have lost all trust". Please.

I have plenty of minority friends.A lot of them would have liked a fire hose to be directed at the looters yesterday. Because they are not criminals or they don't put themselves in a position to be at the receiving end of that kind of harassment.Are there isolated incidents of rascism? Of course.Are there bad cops yes there is.
But I bet you can't even count the amount of white cops who risk there life every day to save a minority in trouble.Or Black cops saving a white kid.
This new movement throwing the police under the bus because of the actions of a few is assinine.

I saw a plane with a banner flying over a festival this weekend that said "Always film the police"Really wtf is wrong this this?

No let's just let them continue to create victims daily with impunity...after all, it's only a few victims in the grand scheme of things, it won't happen to me so what do I care?

Courts are witnessed, most government dealings, legal procedings, major business deals, hell, you can't even buy a $200 jjunkercar without a notary witness...but lets let the folks who carry guns and have authority to kill do their work in the dark. Makes a lot of sense. Not.

Point being you can't just throw out all the good 99.9 percent of police do for the .01 percent of bad seeds.You know that Gambsy.And if we are keeping it real,almost every case we have debated did indeed have a victim who was breaking the law in one way or another(not the kid in the park).Maybe a good start to creating a more just system should start with not commiting a crime in the first place?Pretty sure that will eliminate a lot of it(not all granted).

It's not throwing out the good, it's holding the bad accountable for their actions. Rioters have personal responsibility to be accountable but police dont?

Rekia Boyd, Tamir Rice, John Crawford. All 3 black people killed by police without a crime committed, without resisting arrest, in the last year or so. Only 1 indictment, no convictions. There are more out there that we haven't heard of, you can be sure of that.

Eric Garner sold self-rolled cigarettes and didn't want to be bullied anymore, killed by cops, no indictment.

You forgot the black couple in either Cincy, Cleveland or Columbus, Ohio who were driving around, minding their own business when the car they were in backfired while passing a cop. He or they mistook the backfire as shots fired and made a panicked radio call. A police chase and over a 100 shots later, they both died in the front seat of the car. No weapons, no drugs.

I don't think I heard this story. Terrible, but I'm left wondering why there was a chase? If they had done nothing wrong and had no contraband, why didn't they just pull over when the lights went on behind them? What am I missing?

I was thinking the same.

Halifax2TheMax

JimmyV said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

josevolution said:

rr165892 said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

I did respond to Brian post. I guess since it isn't your view point, it doesn't count. But you're correct, it is a race issue. But my question is why the black youth decided to vandalize, steal, assault police, and commit arson rather than peacefully protest.

If you bothered to care to learn about human behavior from the perspective of a black youth, living in inner-city neighborhoods, constantly at odds with the police with a bad reputation for brutality, poor socio-economic class, you'd maybe comprehend life is so very different for them. But you'd rather classify those of us that can maybe understand that life is different for them, as "apologists" and that we excuse them for their actions. Which is completely false. My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

I've haven't once called you or anyone else an apologist. I'm also not sure why you think I don't understand race relations. I do understand why the black community is upset with the lack of explanation from the police. Probably better than you do. You have no clue what my background is to make such an absurd assumption.

No matter what the lack of explanation is, it doesn't excuse the thug behavior exhibited by the black youth of Baltimore. Period.

Because that's all you're willing to focus on. "Thug behavior" and not Police behavior.

Again, My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

BSL,have you ever heard the term"Comply and Complain"?

I don't know where it started,but it basically is saying "Hey,don't run,comply with the officers requests and if anything is not kosher you will still be alive to complain or file a complaint about how you were treated"
I heard this today and I makes all of this seem so simple.All the recent cases of death that have been publicized have had suspects who have resisted or ran.I know the kid in the cop car was a different story,but you get what I'm saying right?

Well thats good & dandy but its to late for that minorities have lost all trust in the police force , its hard for us the lucky one's to understand this but it's true believe me i work with alot of black folks and they all say the same thing do not trust the police it's gonna take a monumental effort from both parties to come together on this problem in this country .....

"Its to late for that"? Are you kidding me Jose? "And All minorities have lost all trust". Please.

I have plenty of minority friends.A lot of them would have liked a fire hose to be directed at the looters yesterday. Because they are not criminals or they don't put themselves in a position to be at the receiving end of that kind of harassment.Are there isolated incidents of rascism? Of course.Are there bad cops yes there is.
But I bet you can't even count the amount of white cops who risk there life every day to save a minority in trouble.Or Black cops saving a white kid.
This new movement throwing the police under the bus because of the actions of a few is assinine.

I saw a plane with a banner flying over a festival this weekend that said "Always film the police"Really wtf is wrong this this?

No let's just let them continue to create victims daily with impunity...after all, it's only a few victims in the grand scheme of things, it won't happen to me so what do I care?

Courts are witnessed, most government dealings, legal procedings, major business deals, hell, you can't even buy a $200 jjunkercar without a notary witness...but lets let the folks who carry guns and have authority to kill do their work in the dark. Makes a lot of sense. Not.

Point being you can't just throw out all the good 99.9 percent of police do for the .01 percent of bad seeds.You know that Gambsy.And if we are keeping it real,almost every case we have debated did indeed have a victim who was breaking the law in one way or another(not the kid in the park).Maybe a good start to creating a more just system should start with not commiting a crime in the first place?Pretty sure that will eliminate a lot of it(not all granted).

It's not throwing out the good, it's holding the bad accountable for their actions. Rioters have personal responsibility to be accountable but police dont?

Rekia Boyd, Tamir Rice, John Crawford. All 3 black people killed by police without a crime committed, without resisting arrest, in the last year or so. Only 1 indictment, no convictions. There are more out there that we haven't heard of, you can be sure of that.

Eric Garner sold self-rolled cigarettes and didn't want to be bullied anymore, killed by cops, no indictment.

You forgot the black couple in either Cincy, Cleveland or Columbus, Ohio who were driving around, minding their own business when the car they were in backfired while passing a cop. He or they mistook the backfire as shots fired and made a panicked radio call. A police chase and over a 100 shots later, they both died in the front seat of the car. No weapons, no drugs.

I don't think I heard this story. Terrible, but I'm left wondering why there was a chase? If they had done nothing wrong and had no contraband, why didn't they just pull over when the lights went on behind them? What am I missing?

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/apr/05/cleveland-officer-michael-brelo-137-shots-trial

Okay, so they were initially confronted by "detectives", plainclothes and whether they identified themselves, I don't know. But read the article and the description of what transpired. 60 police vehicles, 137 shots and multiple violations of police department chase policy. Why didn't they just stop and comply? We'll never honestly know. But all you have to do is view the video of the black gentleman pulling over, sticking his hands up and out of his car, seemingly complying with the officers' commands, only to be pulled from his vehicle and brutally beaten, for failing to signal. I don't know if that was also in Cleveland but the Cleveland police have a reputation of being anything less than cool, calm and collected when it comes to their interactions with black citizens. What are the odds that the judge acquits the officer on trial? If you were black and living in Cleveland, would you pull over, particularly if you hadn't violated the law?

My initial description isn't accurate but the end result is the same. It happened in 2012 and I was typing from memory. When it comes to blacks, some cops seem to have more propensity to become judge, jury and executioner and that's a problem. I'm sure there are other news sources from different perspectives. Google, "Cleveland couple shot 137 times."

brianlux

Halifax2TheMax said:

JimmyV said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

josevolution said:

rr165892 said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

I did respond to Brian post. I guess since it isn't your view point, it doesn't count. But you're correct, it is a race issue. But my question is why the black youth decided to vandalize, steal, assault police, and commit arson rather than peacefully protest.

If you bothered to care to learn about human behavior from the perspective of a black youth, living in inner-city neighborhoods, constantly at odds with the police with a bad reputation for brutality, poor socio-economic class, you'd maybe comprehend life is so very different for them. But you'd rather classify those of us that can maybe understand that life is different for them, as "apologists" and that we excuse them for their actions. Which is completely false. My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

I've haven't once called you or anyone else an apologist. I'm also not sure why you think I don't understand race relations. I do understand why the black community is upset with the lack of explanation from the police. Probably better than you do. You have no clue what my background is to make such an absurd assumption.

No matter what the lack of explanation is, it doesn't excuse the thug behavior exhibited by the black youth of Baltimore. Period.

Because that's all you're willing to focus on. "Thug behavior" and not Police behavior.

Again, My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

BSL,have you ever heard the term"Comply and Complain"?

I don't know where it started,but it basically is saying "Hey,don't run,comply with the officers requests and if anything is not kosher you will still be alive to complain or file a complaint about how you were treated"
I heard this today and I makes all of this seem so simple.All the recent cases of death that have been publicized have had suspects who have resisted or ran.I know the kid in the cop car was a different story,but you get what I'm saying right?

Well thats good & dandy but its to late for that minorities have lost all trust in the police force , its hard for us the lucky one's to understand this but it's true believe me i work with alot of black folks and they all say the same thing do not trust the police it's gonna take a monumental effort from both parties to come together on this problem in this country .....

"Its to late for that"? Are you kidding me Jose? "And All minorities have lost all trust". Please.

I have plenty of minority friends.A lot of them would have liked a fire hose to be directed at the looters yesterday. Because they are not criminals or they don't put themselves in a position to be at the receiving end of that kind of harassment.Are there isolated incidents of rascism? Of course.Are there bad cops yes there is.
But I bet you can't even count the amount of white cops who risk there life every day to save a minority in trouble.Or Black cops saving a white kid.
This new movement throwing the police under the bus because of the actions of a few is assinine.

I saw a plane with a banner flying over a festival this weekend that said "Always film the police"Really wtf is wrong this this?

No let's just let them continue to create victims daily with impunity...after all, it's only a few victims in the grand scheme of things, it won't happen to me so what do I care?

Courts are witnessed, most government dealings, legal procedings, major business deals, hell, you can't even buy a $200 jjunkercar without a notary witness...but lets let the folks who carry guns and have authority to kill do their work in the dark. Makes a lot of sense. Not.

Point being you can't just throw out all the good 99.9 percent of police do for the .01 percent of bad seeds.You know that Gambsy.And if we are keeping it real,almost every case we have debated did indeed have a victim who was breaking the law in one way or another(not the kid in the park).Maybe a good start to creating a more just system should start with not commiting a crime in the first place?Pretty sure that will eliminate a lot of it(not all granted).

It's not throwing out the good, it's holding the bad accountable for their actions. Rioters have personal responsibility to be accountable but police dont?

Rekia Boyd, Tamir Rice, John Crawford. All 3 black people killed by police without a crime committed, without resisting arrest, in the last year or so. Only 1 indictment, no convictions. There are more out there that we haven't heard of, you can be sure of that.

Eric Garner sold self-rolled cigarettes and didn't want to be bullied anymore, killed by cops, no indictment.

You forgot the black couple in either Cincy, Cleveland or Columbus, Ohio who were driving around, minding their own business when the car they were in backfired while passing a cop. He or they mistook the backfire as shots fired and made a panicked radio call. A police chase and over a 100 shots later, they both died in the front seat of the car. No weapons, no drugs.

I don't think I heard this story. Terrible, but I'm left wondering why there was a chase? If they had done nothing wrong and had no contraband, why didn't they just pull over when the lights went on behind them? What am I missing?

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/apr/05/cleveland-officer-michael-brelo-137-shots-trial

Okay, so they were initially confronted by "detectives", plainclothes and whether they identified themselves, I don't know. But read the article and the description of what transpired. 60 police vehicles, 137 shots and multiple violations of police department chase policy. Why didn't they just stop and comply? We'll never honestly know. But all you have to do is view the video of the black gentleman pulling over, sticking his hands up and out of his car, seemingly complying with the officers' commands, only to be pulled from his vehicle and brutally beaten, for failing to signal. I don't know if that was also in Cleveland but the Cleveland police have a reputation of being anything less than cool, calm and collected when it comes to their interactions with black citizens. What are the odds that the judge acquits the officer on trial? If you were black and living in Cleveland, would you pull over, particularly if you hadn't violated the law?

My initial description isn't accurate but the end result is the same. It happened in 2012 and I was typing from memory. When it comes to blacks, some cops seem to have more propensity to become judge, jury and executioner and that's a problem. I'm sure there are other news sources from different perspectives. Google, "Cleveland couple shot 137 times."

That surely seems to be the case H2M.

Racism in general is still a major problem in the US. I just received and email from a friend who said he is SO tired of racial profiling against him. And this guy is an Hispanic Franciscan Monk type- about as gentle a soul as you'll meet and this is "liberal" California we're talking about.

Racism has to end.

JimmyV

EDIT: For some reason I was unable to quote H2M's post above. This is in response to that, with the italicized text coming from the link posted therein.

The chase started with a failed traffic stop on the edge of downtown by a plainclothes detective who never reported to dispatchers that he had lost sight of the vehicle. Russell then sped past Cleveland police headquarters, where his car backfired. Officers and witnesses standing outside were certain they had heard gunshots and a police radio call for shots fired triggered an adrenaline-fueled rush by officers to join the chase.

Brelo and his partner were two of the first officers to join the pursuit that ultimately included more than 60 police cars, 104 officers and reached at least 100mph.

After driving into a school parking lot more than 20 minutes after the chase began, Russell turned the car around and tried to flee again – sideswiping a cruiser before coming to a stop. Another officer, who said he feared for his life, opened fire, prompting others, including Brelo, to do the same.

I don't know...this story sounds strange to say the least. I understand being suspicious and fearful of police, but leading them on a 20 minute chase at speeds up to 100mph? Sideswiping a cruiser? We know there are far too many examples of police gunning down an innocent man. Not sure this is another one.

rgambs

JimmyV said:

EDIT: For some reason I was unable to quote H2M's post above. This is in response to that, with the italicized text coming from the link posted therein.

The chase started with a failed traffic stop on the edge of downtown by a plainclothes detective who never reported to dispatchers that he had lost sight of the vehicle. Russell then sped past Cleveland police headquarters, where his car backfired. Officers and witnesses standing outside were certain they had heard gunshots and a police radio call for shots fired triggered an adrenaline-fueled rush by officers to join the chase.

Brelo and his partner were two of the first officers to join the pursuit that ultimately included more than 60 police cars, 104 officers and reached at least 100mph.

After driving into a school parking lot more than 20 minutes after the chase began, Russell turned the car around and tried to flee again – sideswiping a cruiser before coming to a stop. Another officer, who said he feared for his life, opened fire, prompting others, including Brelo, to do the same.

I don't know...this story sounds strange to say the least. I understand being suspicious and fearful of police, but leading them on a 20 minute chase at speeds up to 100mph? Sideswiping a cruiser? We know there are far too many examples of police gunning down an innocent man. Not sure this is another one.

It's definitely a strange case... The part where it gets extreme is the final officer who, after more than a hundred shots had been fired into the car, jumps onto the hood to empty his clip into the windshield. It comes off as an execution, not as a defense of his life. It seems like he was pissed and wanted to see them die.
It reminds me of the "horsechase" where the fatass cops (ok not all fat, but there were some chubbos in the vid) are pissed they had to run so they stomp, punch, and knee a man who is flying flat on his stomach not resisting. The knees to the groin were pretty extreme, those officers should be ashamed of themselves, but I fucking guarantee the only remorse they have is for being caught.

JimmyV

rgambs said:

JimmyV said:

EDIT: For some reason I was unable to quote H2M's post above. This is in response to that, with the italicized text coming from the link posted therein.

The chase started with a failed traffic stop on the edge of downtown by a plainclothes detective who never reported to dispatchers that he had lost sight of the vehicle. Russell then sped past Cleveland police headquarters, where his car backfired. Officers and witnesses standing outside were certain they had heard gunshots and a police radio call for shots fired triggered an adrenaline-fueled rush by officers to join the chase.

Brelo and his partner were two of the first officers to join the pursuit that ultimately included more than 60 police cars, 104 officers and reached at least 100mph.

After driving into a school parking lot more than 20 minutes after the chase began, Russell turned the car around and tried to flee again – sideswiping a cruiser before coming to a stop. Another officer, who said he feared for his life, opened fire, prompting others, including Brelo, to do the same.

I don't know...this story sounds strange to say the least. I understand being suspicious and fearful of police, but leading them on a 20 minute chase at speeds up to 100mph? Sideswiping a cruiser? We know there are far too many examples of police gunning down an innocent man. Not sure this is another one.

It's definitely a strange case... The part where it gets extreme is the final officer who, after more than a hundred shots had been fired into the car, jumps onto the hood to empty his clip into the windshield. It comes off as an execution, not as a defense of his life. It seems like he was pissed and wanted to see them die.
It reminds me of the "horsechase" where the fatass cops (ok not all fat, but there were some chubbos in the vid) are pissed they had to run so they stomp, punch, and knee a man who is flying flat on his stomach not resisting. The knees to the groin were pretty extreme, those officers should be ashamed of themselves, but I fucking guarantee the only remorse they have is for being caught.

Absolutely extreme. Elsewhere in the article it describes his defense which is essentially "I don't remember doing that." Alrighty then.

backseatLover12

backseatLover12 said:

JimmyV said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

Yeah, as Jimmy mentioned - poverty, lack of education (which has so many ripple-effects), lack of parent(s) and good parenting. Pretty sure there are more but that's a good start, I think.

How about talking about racism though, it is the biggest part of the entire police brutality epidemic going on in this country, and is a HUGE part of these riots.

Racism is brought up over and over again, and racism is discussed over and over again. What we saw last night wasn't the result of racism or even police brutality. Unemployment, poverty, a malfunctioning school system, gang culture...all of these things create a powder keg of a situation. Its too easy and too common to focus just on racism.

Please show me where there is a discussion on these boards about racism.

What happened last night is a result of continuous break down between the police force and the inner city neighborhood youth of Baltimore. Unemployment and poverty just goes hand in hand with life in the inner city for minorities. It's not a result and it's not the cause of riots that are really about a man who died in police custody, whom the police refuse to release details of.

Still looking for all that discussion and threads on here on racism...

JimmyV

backseatLover12 said:

backseatLover12 said:

JimmyV said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

Yeah, as Jimmy mentioned - poverty, lack of education (which has so many ripple-effects), lack of parent(s) and good parenting. Pretty sure there are more but that's a good start, I think.

How about talking about racism though, it is the biggest part of the entire police brutality epidemic going on in this country, and is a HUGE part of these riots.

Racism is brought up over and over again, and racism is discussed over and over again. What we saw last night wasn't the result of racism or even police brutality. Unemployment, poverty, a malfunctioning school system, gang culture...all of these things create a powder keg of a situation. Its too easy and too common to focus just on racism.

Please show me where there is a discussion on these boards about racism.

What happened last night is a result of continuous break down between the police force and the inner city neighborhood youth of Baltimore. Unemployment and poverty just goes hand in hand with life in the inner city for minorities. It's not a result and it's not the cause of riots that are really about a man who died in police custody, whom the police refuse to release details of.

Still looking for all that discussion and threads on here on racism...

Race plays a part in every discussion of the police and every discussion of guns on this board and has the entire time I've been here. You yourself started a thread recently specifically about the topic.

g under p

brianlux said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

JimmyV said:

Halifax2TheMax said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

rgambs said:

rr165892 said:

josevolution said:

rr165892 said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

backseatLover12 said:

Last-12-Exit said:

I did respond to Brian post. I guess since it isn't your view point, it doesn't count. But you're correct, it is a race issue. But my question is why the black youth decided to vandalize, steal, assault police, and commit arson rather than peacefully protest.

If you bothered to care to learn about human behavior from the perspective of a black youth, living in inner-city neighborhoods, constantly at odds with the police with a bad reputation for brutality, poor socio-economic class, you'd maybe comprehend life is so very different for them. But you'd rather classify those of us that can maybe understand that life is different for them, as "apologists" and that we excuse them for their actions. Which is completely false. My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

Because that's all you're willing to focus on. "Thug behavior" and not Police behavior.

Again, My question to you, is why there is such a huge problem with police and minorities in the first place.

BSL,have you ever heard the term"Comply and Complain"?

I don't know where it started,but it basically is saying "Hey,don't run,comply with the officers requests and if anything is not kosher you will still be alive to complain or file a complaint about how you were treated"
I heard this today and I makes all of this seem so simple.All the recent cases of death that have been publicized have had suspects who have resisted or ran.I know the kid in the cop car was a different story,but you get what I'm saying right?

Well thats good & dandy but its to late for that minorities have lost all trust in the police force , its hard for us the lucky one's to understand this but it's true believe me i work with alot of black folks and they all say the same thing do not trust the police it's gonna take a monumental effort from both parties to come together on this problem in this country .....

"Its to late for that"? Are you kidding me Jose? "And All minorities have lost all trust". Please.

I have plenty of minority friends.A lot of them would have liked a fire hose to be directed at the looters yesterday. Because they are not criminals or they don't put themselves in a position to be at the receiving end of that kind of harassment.Are there isolated incidents of rascism? Of course.Are there bad cops yes there is.
But I bet you can't even count the amount of white cops who risk there life every day to save a minority in trouble.Or Black cops saving a white kid.
This new movement throwing the police under the bus because of the actions of a few is assinine.

I saw a plane with a banner flying over a festival this weekend that said "Always film the police"Really wtf is wrong this this?

No let's just let them continue to create victims daily with impunity...after all, it's only a few victims in the grand scheme of things, it won't happen to me so what do I care?

Courts are witnessed, most government dealings, legal procedings, major business deals, hell, you can't even buy a $200 jjunkercar without a notary witness...but lets let the folks who carry guns and have authority to kill do their work in the dark. Makes a lot of sense. Not.

Point being you can't just throw out all the good 99.9 percent of police do for the .01 percent of bad seeds.You know that Gambsy.And if we are keeping it real,almost every case we have debated did indeed have a victim who was breaking the law in one way or another(not the kid in the park).Maybe a good start to creating a more just system should start with not commiting a crime in the first place?Pretty sure that will eliminate a lot of it(not all granted).

It's not throwing out the good, it's holding the bad accountable for their actions. Rioters have personal responsibility to be accountable but police dont?

Rekia Boyd, Tamir Rice, John Crawford. All 3 black people killed by police without a crime committed, without resisting arrest, in the last year or so. Only 1 indictment, no convictions. There are more out there that we haven't heard of, you can be sure of that.

Eric Garner sold self-rolled cigarettes and didn't want to be bullied anymore, killed by cops, no indictment.

You forgot the black couple in either Cincy, Cleveland or Columbus, Ohio who were driving around, minding their own business when the car they were in backfired while passing a cop. He or they mistook the backfire as shots fired and made a panicked radio call. A police chase and over a 100 shots later, they both died in the front seat of the car. No weapons, no drugs.

I don't think I heard this story. Terrible, but I'm left wondering why there was a chase? If they had done nothing wrong and had no contraband, why didn't they just pull over when the lights went on behind them? What am I missing?

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/apr/05/cleveland-officer-michael-brelo-137-shots-trial

Okay, so they were initially confronted by "detectives", plainclothes and whether they identified themselves, I don't know. But read the article and the description of what transpired. 60 police vehicles, 137 shots and multiple violations of police department chase policy. Why didn't they just stop and comply? We'll never honestly know. But all you have to do is view the video of the black gentleman pulling over, sticking his hands up and out of his car, seemingly complying with the officers' commands, only to be pulled from his vehicle and brutally beaten, for failing to signal. I don't know if that was also in Cleveland but the Cleveland police have a reputation of being anything less than cool, calm and collected when it comes to their interactions with black citizens. What are the odds that the judge acquits the officer on trial? If you were black and living in Cleveland, would you pull over, particularly if you hadn't violated the law?

My initial description isn't accurate but the end result is the same. It happened in 2012 and I was typing from memory. When it comes to blacks, some cops seem to have more propensity to become judge, jury and executioner and that's a problem. I'm sure there are other news sources from different perspectives. Google, "Cleveland couple shot 137 times."

That surely seems to be the case H2M.

Racism in general is still a major problem in the US. I just received and email from a friend who said he is SO tired of racial profiling against him. And this guy is an Hispanic Franciscan Monk type- about as gentle a soul as you'll meet and this is "liberal" California we're talking about.

Racism has to end.

What you hi lighted there is part of the problem. Police officers many times feel when dealing with black people they can just about get away with anything they want.......just as long as nobody is recording them. If the incident in question wasn't recorded in some ways the officers mentality could be "I'm good to go".

Peace

Last-12-Exit

backseatLover12 said:

backseatLover12 said:

JimmyV said:

backseatLover12 said:

hedonist said:

Yeah, as Jimmy mentioned - poverty, lack of education (which has so many ripple-effects), lack of parent(s) and good parenting. Pretty sure there are more but that's a good start, I think.

How about talking about racism though, it is the biggest part of the entire police brutality epidemic going on in this country, and is a HUGE part of these riots.

Racism is brought up over and over again, and racism is discussed over and over again. What we saw last night wasn't the result of racism or even police brutality. Unemployment, poverty, a malfunctioning school system, gang culture...all of these things create a powder keg of a situation. Its too easy and too common to focus just on racism.

Please show me where there is a discussion on these boards about racism.

What happened last night is a result of continuous break down between the police force and the inner city neighborhood youth of Baltimore. Unemployment and poverty just goes hand in hand with life in the inner city for minorities. It's not a result and it's not the cause of riots that are really about a man who died in police custody, whom the police refuse to release details of.

Still looking for all that discussion and threads on here on racism...

Then make a point. All you've done is complain that nobody's talking about race.

Dirtie_Frank

brianlux said:

That surely seems to be the case H2M.

Racism in general is still a major problem in the US. I just received and email from a friend who said he is SO tired of racial profiling against him. And this guy is an Hispanic Franciscan Monk type- about as gentle a soul as you'll meet and this is "liberal" California we're talking about.

Racism has to end.

I said this earlier, but the only way racism will end if all parties admit to their faults. Their are all walks of life that perpetuate racist behavior. White people do not own the patent on racism.

callen

Dirtie_Frank said:

brianlux said:

That surely seems to be the case H2M.

Racism in general is still a major problem in the US. I just received and email from a friend who said he is SO tired of racial profiling against him. And this guy is an Hispanic Franciscan Monk type- about as gentle a soul as you'll meet and this is "liberal" California we're talking about.

Racism has to end.

I said this earlier, but the only way racism will end if all parties admit to their faults. Their are all walks of life that perpetuate racist behavior. White people do not own the patent on racism.

But we own the power.

Dirtie_Frank

callen said:

Dirtie_Frank said:

brianlux said:

That surely seems to be the case H2M.

Racism in general is still a major problem in the US. I just received and email from a friend who said he is SO tired of racial profiling against him. And this guy is an Hispanic Franciscan Monk type- about as gentle a soul as you'll meet and this is "liberal" California we're talking about.

Racism has to end.

I said this earlier, but the only way racism will end if all parties admit to their faults. Their are all walks of life that perpetuate racist behavior. White people do not own the patent on racism.

But we own the power.

Blaming one race will not work. People of all races need to come together. White and black. There are white people who would kill someone because they are black as well as black people who will kill someone because they are white. Until all in each group recognizes life is precious nothing will happen. Racism is not the only reason for problems in the black community. Lack of family is huge issue.